'13 CA DT Eddie Vanderdoes (UCLA)

[arrowryan]

Jesus I'm not reading all that.

His last two sentences were great though

 

[GoldenIsThyFame]

 

[NDdomer2]

dude you really think their phone conversation was a simple one line answer of get your relase from nd ok have a good day?

 

[AdmiralBackhand]

Anyone who read all of that, did he address how UCLA is more than likely tampering?

 

[arrowryan]

Welcome to the site though Steve. Some of the guys will be a little edgy because of this whole fiasco so don't take anything personally

 

[IrishinTN]

Anyone who read all of that, did he address how UCLA is more than likely tampering?

yes, but only how it has to be documented.

 

[Bruin Steve]

Oh, one more note:

A little earlier in this thread, it came up that UCLA also accepted a transfer by Pitt Running Back Rushel Shell earlier this year...as to imply that UCLA and Coach Mora were somehow establishing a pattern of some sort of "raiding" other team's rosters.

Nothing could be farther from the truth.

In two seasons now, Coach Mora and staff have recruited the high school classes VERY WELL (This year's class, if you base it on Scout's rankings and figured in, for argument's sake, the assumption of shifting Vanderdoes into the UCLA column, would move up to the #2 or #3 class in the country--only a few points short of #1)...No trouble filling the roster with highly ranked high school kids--up to NCAA limits. Shell, IIRC, is the ONLY transfer Mora has taken in.

But, I think EVERY school in the country takes in a transfer here or there...Sort of inevitable. Some kids are unhappy with whatever school they've chosen--either they fall out of favor with the coaches, have their playing time diminished, see themselves being "recruited over", find the schemes not suiting their talents...or just get "homesick". If you think a transfer can help you, and you have the scholarship available to take him, why not?

The Bruins just had the leading rusher in UCLA history, Johnathan Franklin, graduate. We had another star recruit RB, Malcolm Jones, leave school with the intention to transfer (he has since decided to return). We had one RB in the recruiting classm Craig Lee, and he initially hadn't qualified for admission (he since has received a qualifying ACT score). There was apparent opportunity at the RB position. Shell had already announced his intention to transfer. He was not happy about his role at Pitt...and initially had chosen Pitt for some personal reasons--and situations likely evolve. So, HE contacted UCLA.

 

[Pops Freshenmeyer]

Allow me to summarize:

1. This stuff happens all the time and the athletes usually get their release. UCLA had a similar situation with a blue chip bball recruit and granted him his release.

2. Tampering is unlikely based on his knowledge of the staff and athletic department. Eddie does, however, have friends at UCLA and is probably in contact with them and is certainly aware of the obvious fact that UCLA would take him because of their recruiting of him prior to signing hi LOI.

3. It's almost a certainty that Eddie ends up at UCLA one way or another. This has been going on for some time.

 

[Bruin Steve]

Welcome to the site though Steve. Some of the guys will be a little edgy because of this whole fiasco so don't take anything personally

Thanks, arrowryan....
Yeah, I understand...
I've been around the internet many years. Every message board has a wide array of regulars. I try to ignore the ones that only want toss insults (though some are amusing at times) and try to concentrate on having a respectful intelligent conversation with those willing to do so.

Sorry the post was long...Had a lot to say that was sort of pent up while lurking...and then waiting through the lengthy waiting period after registering...

 

[arrowryan]

Oh, one more note:

A little earlier in this thread, it came up that UCLA also accepted a transfer by Pitt Running Back Rushel Shell earlier this year...as to imply that UCLA and Coach Mora were somehow establishing a pattern of some sort of "raiding" other team's rosters.

Nothing could be farther from the truth.

In two seasons now, Coach Mora and staff have recruited the high school classes VERY WELL (This year's class, if you base it on Scout's rankings and figured in, for argument's sake, the assumption of shifting Vanderdoes into the UCLA column, would move up to the #2 or #3 class in the country--only a few points short of #1)...No trouble filling the roster with highly ranked high school kids--up to NCAA limits. Shell, IIRC, is the ONLY transfer Mora has taken in.

But, I think EVERY school in the country takes in a transfer here or there...Sort of inevitable. Some kids are unhappy with whatever school they've chosen--either they fall out of favor with the coaches, have their playing time diminished, see themselves being "recruited over", find the schemes not suiting their talents...or just get "homesick". If you think a transfer can help you, and you have the scholarship available to take him, why not?

The Bruins just had the leading rusher in UCLA history, Johnathan Franklin, graduate. We had another star recruit RB, Malcolm Jones, leave school with the intention to transfer (he has since decided to return). We had one RB in the recruiting classm Craig Lee, and he initially hadn't qualified for admission (he since has received a qualifying ACT score). There was apparent opportunity at the RB position. Shell had already announced his intention to transfer. He was not happy about his role at Pitt...and initially had chosen Pitt for some personal reasons--and situations likely evolve. So, HE contacted UCLA.

If EV plays the "I want to be closer to home" card, I will laugh just because that is about the farthest school from his house. I hope Notre Dame blocks UCLA and USC. Send him to Cal

 

[dublinirish]

So, HE contacted UCLA.

C'MON!! Are you serious??? No way this happened. Kid committed to Pittsburgh to be close to his newborn infant and then 1 year later hes going "ah flip this ill go play in Los Angeles which is thousands of miles away." I think you are naive to say that he wasn' tampered by UCLA or some middlemen if not the staff themselves.

 

[zemaniak]

Thanks, arrowryan....
Yeah, I understand...
I've been around the internet many years. Every message board has a wide array of regulars. I try to ignore the ones that only want toss insults (though some are amusing at times) and try to concentrate on having a respectful intelligent conversation with those willing to do so.

Sorry the post was long...Had a lot to say that was sort of pent up while lurking...and then waiting through the lengthy waiting period after registering...

Would your last name be Broussard by any chance?

Official Football Roster - UCLA Official Athletic Site

 

[AdmiralBackhand]

U$C and UC£A sheesh.

 

[Irishman77]

Bottom line eddie is reneging on a contract he signed and we will win twice as many games as ucla during the years he is there. Go Irish!

 

[Ndaccountant]

Thanks, arrowryan....
Yeah, I understand...
I've been around the internet many years. Every message board has a wide array of regulars. I try to ignore the ones that only want toss insults (though some are amusing at times) and try to concentrate on having a respectful intelligent conversation with those willing to do so.

Sorry the post was long...Had a lot to say that was sort of pent up while lurking...and then waiting through the lengthy waiting period after registering...

The problem with releasing him is simple.....between EV and the Thomas kid at FSU, kids will start to see the LOI the same way they view a committment. When that can of worms get opened, it will be really bad for college football.

The kid made a choice to sign with ND. If he wants out, fine, but there should be a consequence.

 

[dublinirish]

The problem with releasing him is simple.....between EV and the Thomas kid at FSU, kids will start to see the LOI the same way they view a committment. When that can of worms get opened, it will be really bad for college football.

coaches will actively get on the case of the coaches involved when a situation like EV or Thomas arises to make sure they do not release the kids from their LOI with no stipulations. You know some asshat is gonna mess this up someday though and all hell will break loose.

 

[Pops Freshenmeyer]

The problem with releasing him is simple.....between EV and the Thomas kid at FSU, kids will start to see the LOI the same way they view a committment. When that can of worms get opened, it will be really bad for college football.

The kid made a choice to sign with ND. If he wants out, fine, but there should be a consequence.

I think there is a secondary question of whether that penalty should be greater than the usual transfer penalty.

EDIT: unless I am misunderstanding and the penalty is the same either way.

 

[Emcee77]

So, it is really a case of, if the recruit does not want to attend the school with which he has signed, you have only two options:
1. Release the kid and he plays wherever he wants immediately…with five years to play four; or
2. Don’t release the kid and he MAY have to sit out the coming year and then have three years of eligibility to play thereafter.
There are a lot of posters on this site who seem to be hanging on to the hope that, by denying the request, they can compel Eddie to play at least a year at Notre Dame. I guess that is the one vestige of hope they have…however, it is a bit delusional. IF Eddie intends to attend elsewhere, there really isn’t any advantage to him or, really, to Notre Dame, for him to play one year, then transfer. He’d still end up losing a year to a redshirt…and then it either mean he plays less, losing his likely more productive second year…or that he pushes out his expected entry to the NFL (All blue chip recruits think that’s where they are destined) for another year. For the school, they are investing in developing a player that they don’t think will be there for the future at the expense of developing another young player who will…and they have a player who is likely not happy.
In this case, I don’t think many of you really understand how far along this situation is. Just because it seems to have come up quickly in your consciousness doesn’t mean it has. It has actually been going on for some time now. To my knowledge, a couple of months. Eddie asked for his release some time ago and Notre Dame said no…but, then there is an appeals process…which has also been ongoing. All of this is why the family hired an attorney. At this point, it should be clear to everyone that Eddie will not attend Notre Dame. Forcing the family to go through the lengthy process and the expense of hiring an attorney has not helped their cause.
As was noted by a poster earlier in this thread, out of 700 cases like this last year, ONLY 30 were eventually denied their release. The odds of retaining a player under these circumstances are really not very good at all. And, even if denied the release, it is still likely Eddie goes elsewhere and just sits on the bench and concedes the year of eligibility.

I still disagree with the bolded because odds of making the NFL are so slim that even 5 stars shouldn't count on being able to impress the NFL in only a three year playing career, which could be cut even shorter by injury ...

BUT it's probably a moot point. As we learn more it looks like you are right that Eddie will not attend ND, no matter what happens with the NLI and Eddie's release. Our own insider TP is saying it. I object to the term "delusional," at least based on what's been confirmed at this point, but certainly we should all begin to get used to the idea that EV will probably never suit up for the Irish. I'll certainly be interested to hear the full story of how that happened.

Is there any real advantage to Notre Dame to NOT release the kid?
Probably not. The two most noted are:
1) Vengeance—never a good reason to do anything
2) Setting a precedent. Problem here is that, assuming the odds hold, there will be no precedent set. The player will get his release one way or another and Notre Dame would have spun their wheels and caused a little bad will in some recruiting circles.
How do other schools handle this? They usually just let it go and release the recruit. UCLA did it JUST A FEW WEEKS AGO. One of our signed basketball recruits—a Top 100 ranked guard named Allerick Freeman, star of the #1 high school team in the country, Findlay Prep of Nevada, asked for his release and it was immediately granted. Some might say there is a difference—there was a change in head coaches—but, after the hire, the kid had come out and said he was excited about the new coach and looked forward to the opportunity. It was other factors that led to his asking for the release. UCLA also did it several years back in Football, with a blue chip recruit named Jesse Simms—the grandson of UCLA great Jackie Robinson—asked for a release, it was granted, so he could go to Penn State instead.
It actually happens quite a bit with little fanfare. These are 17-18 year old kids. Luckily, most sign their letters and consider it final…but not always.

I'm very skeptical of this. What of the reports that coaches across the country are calling Brian Kelly and pleading with him not to release EV because it would set a bad precedent? What of the comments of FSU's AD regarding Matthew Thomas? Didn't he say that releasing Thomas would set a bad precedent? Even in your own example of Allerick Freeman, there's an extenuating circumstance, the coaching change. Until we know of such circumstances in EV's case, I can't agree that it would be merely petty and vindictive to deny EV his release. It would set a bad precedent, unless there is good reason for the release. Eddie signed a contract which sets forth the penalty for breaking the contract; now, just like any home-buyer who wants to break his contract at the cost of losing his earnest money, he must pay the penalty if he wants to break the contract.

 

[Rambler09]

Steve, good post. I appreciate your insight. I did not realize how long this process had been going on and that the Vanderdoes family had already hired a lawyer for the appeal process.

While I am not totally convinced that there was no foul play here, I think you have provided an intriguing alternative explanation- i.e. text messages with current players- to account for Vanderdoes's contact with UCLA.

Furthermore, while it is interesting that UCLA granted Freeman his release, that was under very different situation. A head coaching change is much more significant than whatever seems to be going on with EV. The kid saying in an interview that he was excited to play for the new coach doesn't change this. He's a kid being intereviewed about his presumptive new head coach- what do you want him to say? The point is that it was a very different situation and that it's pretty clear that, in that case, the NCAA would have granted it if UCLA had not (on grounds of coaching switch).

You're probably correct that he'll end up at UCLA but it's still unfortunate. Hopefully you understand why we do not support granting his release- especially given the fact that all signs point to it being a more trivial change of heart. The kid signed a contract that we were prepared to honor (even if he were to get injured) and it's only fair that he honor his side of the deal.

 

[dales5050]

Bottom line here is that we are already actually pretty far along in the process. I’d be 99.9 percent sure Eddie will not be attending Notre Dame…and 90% sure he WILL be at UCLA. And I think it will all come down pretty quickly from here on out. I don’t think it’s my personal bias here…I think it should be pretty well universally acknowledged by those who know at least a bit about the case.
Good luck next season. Beat $C…

Did anyone else read this and want to say hello to Mr. Vanderdoes?


Look, this has been said 1000 times before but....

Unless a signed LOI means something, there is no point in having them. People can try and paint a picture however they want but the reality is a kid does not need to sign is LOI on the first day. That's simply the first day he CAN sign the LOI.

It's kinda funny but does anyone remember how people mocked terrelle pryor for waiting? People called him a prima donna for his actions.

Yet what did he do exactly? He waiting until making a choice and then stuck with that choice.

 

[Luckylucci]

My Irish friends,
I’ve been lurking here…for the same reasons many of us like to visit other schools’ boards—out of curiosity for what fans of those other schools are thinking or talking about regarding situations such as this. I hope you won’t mind my posting here. I figured some of you might want to hear the thoughts of someone outside the Notre Dame family, someone at what is perceived, in this instance, as the “rival” school.
First of all, I have found the thread quite interesting…I think, as fans, we all get somewhat wrapped up in recruiting and invested in individual players. It is only natural that, when something goes “sideways”, as it did here, there is an overly emotional response by the fans. Another issue, aside from the expected bias, is that speculation and misinformation tend to run wild a bit. Perhaps a different viewpoint might add to your collective understanding.
First, I’ll address a couple of minor points:
To Bogtrotter07: Your recollection of the drive from the Sacramento area to Los Angeles may be based on old info—like before the completion of Interstate 5. My younger daughter attended UC Davis and now lives in Sacramento, so I’ve made the drive many times…Using I-5, from my house, as lightly longer distance than from the UCLA campus, I can regularly make the drive in five hours flat…Yeah, that’s driving a bit fast—averaging 80 mph…but, believe it or not, those speeds are common on that road. Also, the trip, by air, is only one hour…and Southwest Airlines regularly runs specials for as low as $39 each way.
As to the issue that keeps coming up questioning whether Alabama wasn’t Eddie’s second choice:
I believe Alabama was actually somewhat of a “Red Herring” in the recruitment. Eddie was originally committed to USC. Then, USC’s season started going downhill and there was a lot of grumbling by their early pledges. With the NCAA sanctioned scholarship limits and all, they started trying to push around some of their early commits--not Eddie, but a couple of others that Eddie had become rather close to during the recruiting process. SC had been pushing kids to graduate high school early and enter SC last year so they could count them against last year’s limits rather than this one. Then they realized they were beyond the limit there as well and started asking kids to defer. Players started decommitting. Two of these other recruits with whom Eddie was close ended up signing with UCLA and actually entered UCLA last Winter and Spring Quarters. Eddie WAS set to join them, then took his visit to Notre Dame and was swayed during the visit. Still, it was a tough decision down the stretch to sign with Notre Dame. But UCLA, not Alabama, was really the other school in close competition.
Now, the main point I wanted to get to: The Options…
People here have laid out what they BELIEVE to be the options…But I think there has been quite a bit of misinformation passed along with it.
The biggest part of that is the notion that a school can restrict where a signed recruit can go with his release. There is a lot of anecdotal stuff around the media over the years about schools granting releases conditioned on the player not being able to go to one school or another. But the truth is, they really can’t do this. There is no legal mechanism for it. At best, it may be part of an informal, yet unenforceable negotiation: “Hey, we’ll grant you that easy and quick release if you agree NOT to sign with some school or another.” But there’s very little “teeth” in this. About the only case where there is a modicum of enforceability is where the target school is the new employer of the first school’s former coach—and the threat there is really to the coach, not the kid…based on some sort of “tampering” logic—or something contractual with the former coach’s release from the first school. But, really, once a kid is released from his Letter of Intent, he’s a “free agent”. Public policy issues would prevent a school from restricting the recruit based on a mere Letter of Intent. And, as noted, if the school doesn’t grant the release, they really have no say in the matter either—only the kid is punished by having to sit out a year and lose a year of eligibility. You cannot compel a kid to attend and play for a school. Personal services contracts are not subject to injunctive relief.
So, it is really a case of, if the recruit does not want to attend the school with which he has signed, you have only two options:
1. Release the kid and he plays wherever he wants immediately…with five years to play four; or
2. Don’t release the kid and he MAY have to sit out the coming year and then have three years of eligibility to play thereafter.
There are a lot of posters on this site who seem to be hanging on to the hope that, by denying the request, they can compel Eddie to play at least a year at Notre Dame. I guess that is the one vestige of hope they have…however, it is a bit delusional. IF Eddie intends to attend elsewhere, there really isn’t any advantage to him or, really, to Notre Dame, for him to play one year, then transfer. He’d still end up losing a year to a redshirt…and then it either mean he plays less, losing his likely more productive second year…or that he pushes out his expected entry to the NFL (All blue chip recruits think that’s where they are destined) for another year. For the school, they are investing in developing a player that they don’t think will be there for the future at the expense of developing another young player who will…and they have a player who is likely not happy.
In this case, I don’t think many of you really understand how far along this situation is. Just because it seems to have come up quickly in your consciousness doesn’t mean it has. It has actually been going on for some time now. To my knowledge, a couple of months. Eddie asked for his release some time ago and Notre Dame said no…but, then there is an appeals process…which has also been ongoing. All of this is why the family hired an attorney. At this point, it should be clear to everyone that Eddie will not attend Notre Dame. Forcing the family to go through the lengthy process and the expense of hiring an attorney has not helped their cause.
As was noted by a poster earlier in this thread, out of 700 cases like this last year, ONLY 30 were eventually denied their release. The odds of retaining a player under these circumstances are really not very good at all. And, even if denied the release, it is still likely Eddie goes elsewhere and just sits on the bench and concedes the year of eligibility.
Is there any real advantage to Notre Dame to NOT release the kid?
Probably not. The two most noted are:
1) Vengeance—never a good reason to do anything
2) Setting a precedent. Problem here is that, assuming the odds hold, there will be no precedent set. The player will get his release one way or another and Notre Dame would have spun their wheels and caused a little bad will in some recruiting circles.
How do other schools handle this? They usually just let it go and release the recruit. UCLA did it JUST A FEW WEEKS AGO. One of our signed basketball recruits—a Top 100 ranked guard named Allerick Freeman, star of the #1 high school team in the country, Findlay Prep of Nevada, asked for his release and it was immediately granted. Some might say there is a difference—there was a change in head coaches—but, after the hire, the kid had come out and said he was excited about the new coach and looked forward to the opportunity. It was other factors that led to his asking for the release. UCLA also did it several years back in Football, with a blue chip recruit named Jesse Simms—the grandson of UCLA great Jackie Robinson—asked for a release, it was granted, so he could go to Penn State instead.
It actually happens quite a bit with little fanfare. These are 17-18 year old kids. Luckily, most sign their letters and consider it final…but not always.
I also wanted to address the question that’s been repeatedly been brought up here of alleged tampering by UCLA. A natural reaction by fans to imagine the worst—since we all expect that, once signed, it should all be smooth sailing. “What went wrong?” Well, sometimes, there have been DOCUMENTED cases of tampering, for example, former coaches trying to pry away their star recruits. But, pretty much MOST schools—though it may be “open season” BEFORE letters of intent are signed—will concede that it’s over once the letters are signed. I personally know a number of the coaches and members of the Athletic Department at UCLA and am pretty certain that there would have been absolutely no contact by them AFTER the letter was signed with Notre Dame. Up until that point, however, they were obviously in constant contact with Eddie—they sent him a letter of intent form to sign, if he had chosen to come to UCLA. They had sent him forms acknowledging his acceptance into school at UCLA, etc. All of this is fairly standard at any school with any recruit. But, once the letter was signed and recruiting over, end of story. They have likely still not spoken with him—unless he called first, in which case, their response would necessarily be “Ask for your release from Notre Dame or from the NCAA and then come back and we will speak to you”.
Of course, for practical sake, he likely has a pretty good idea that if he gets his release or, even if he doesn’t, but wishes to sit out the year, that UCLA will find a scholarship for him and NOT turn him away.
Another point to clear up: Should he come to UCLA, even without a release from Notre Dame or from the NCAA, he CAN be on scholarship. Ineligible to PLAY, but he CAN participate in practice, training, working with the coaches and team and be on an athletic scholarship (which does count against the NCAA limits)—just like any other redshirt.
Another note on contact with UCLA: Though I am fairly certain there is no contact with coaches or athletic department personnel, I am guessing that he DOES have contact with his friends at UCLA. Sort of expected in this age of text messaging, twitter, facebook, e-mail, etc. I’m guessing this goes on nowadays at EVERY program with every athlete…and that the NCAA really doesn’t care. There is no real way to enforce anything against the school. Old friends, former high school team mates, family members, etc. attend and play for different schools. You cannot really restrict them from communicating.
Bottom line here is that we are already actually pretty far along in the process. I’d be 99.9 percent sure Eddie will not be attending Notre Dame…and 90% sure he WILL be at UCLA. And I think it will all come down pretty quickly from here on out. I don’t think it’s my personal bias here…I think it should be pretty well universally acknowledged by those who know at least a bit about the case.
Good luck next season. Beat $C…

It was Eddie himself that said he was prepared the night before to pick Alabama. That wasn't posters making that up. So if he was prepared to pick Bama, last second chose ND, how does that make UCLA #2? That doesn't make any sense.

 

[greyhammer90]

Something that needs to be added to posting etiquette:. If the post you're responding to is the size of a novel, don't quote it. If you do, delete all but the relative parts in your response.

 

[Luckylucci]

Good point, I didn't think about it until after posting.

 

[BleedBlueGold]

Still doesn't explain what happened that caused the Vanderdoes family to become so upset with ND.

Something happened that caused Eddie to want to change his mind. Why UCLA became "next man in" is understandable. But he picked ND over them for certain reasons. Why all of a sudden did things change AFTER he signed his LOI?

If EV had a change of heart, asked for a release, ND said no...and that's why they're upset? Then ok. And if so, now explain why his dad is making comments saying it's not because of a change of heart. He basically is alluding to the fact that ND screwed this up.

We all just want to know what happened.

 

[no.1IrishFan]

Is this the most viewed thread in IE history?

 

[GoldenIsThyFame]

Something that needs to be added to posting etiquette:. If the post you're responding to is the size of a novel, don't quote it. If you do, delete all but the relative parts in your response.

What did you say?

 

[greyhammer90]

I will neg rep you with my reddest squares.

 

[GreenSox04]

Jesus I'm not reading all that.

^

 

[Irishman77]

Is this the most viewed thread in IE history?

No gunner kiel

 

[Bruin Steve]

Let's talk about what the LOI actually DOES mean...

Interesting thing is that it is NOT to the benefit of the recruit...
Sooner or later, recruits will start catching on to this...

The LOI ONLY guarnatees the recruit a scholarship for ONE year (Most people assume it's for four, but, that is actually incorrect. The school can renew or choose to not renew each year)...
But the kid is penalized for a period that , in a way, exceeds that...After that Freshman year is up, the school can choose, unilaterally, to not renew...BUT, if the kid wants to go elsewhere, he is penalized with loss of eligibility.

There is an alternative. A recruit MAY actually sign a "Grant-in-Aid" agreement and be awarded an athletic scholarship. He would still hjave to deal with NCAA transfer rules once enrolled, but, in situations such as Eddie's, he would be free to NOT enroll and then go wherever he wants and be immediately eligible...

This is one of the main reasons that such releases are usually granted...or that the appeals are usually won...

The NCAA does not want to get into a legal battle over the enforceability of the Letter of Intent system.

Again (since someone again posted saying Notre Dame should "block" UCLA), there is an enforceability issue, legally, with restricting a release...AND there may be an enforceability issue with the LOIs as a whole. (Lots of other issues I won't get into here).

The NCAA does not want controvery on these issues. They want to manage there systems themselves...and that requires keeping themselves out of court--which would set REAL precedent.

In the end, I would not be at all surprised if Notre Dame completely dropped any challenge to the appeal. That would keep everything within the NCAA's purview and out of the judicial system.

As to "other coaches calling and urging Notre Dame to stand firm": I think that is complete bs...Coaches have all sorts of interest in these things--on both sides of the ledger...They WANT transfers AWAY from their rivals--and TO their schools...They DON'T want transfers AWAY from their programs and TO their rivals' schools... There are two sides to every coin...I doubt any coaches really care about calling Notre Dame and offering support one way or another...You think Kelly was calling SC to tell them to hold steady and not release Carlisle?