Oct 27 | at Oklahoma

[WE ARE OU]

They rank #46 in rushing defense despite playing in the pass happy Big12 and only facing two top 50 rushing teams. They are mediocre at best when it comes to rushing defense.

As mediocre as they are in rushing defense, they are the polar opposite in pass defense. They rank #9 while playing in the pass happy Big12. I would be shocked if we effectively passed against them. They have one of the best secondaries in the country.

They rank #15 in total defense, which is pretty good. Keep in mind though; BYU, scUM and MichSt all are ranked higher. According to today's statistics, they are the fourth best defense that we have faced.

UMMM... your numbers are really not accurate when you take into consideration that a fair amout of the rushing and passing yards were NOT against the first team defense, but happened in the 4th quarter against the SECOND team defense in blow out games. For example, about 70 of the 180 or so rushing yards for Kansas were against the second team and about 50 rushing yards of the 74 or so total and a bit over 100 passing or the 220 or so against Texas also were against the second team. I will not even go into the other blow outs. You also need to know that the defense was learning a new scheme under Mike stoops at the start of the season and if you look at he LINK below you can see the difference as things were figured out by everyone on both sides ofthe ball including Landry Jones basically having an entire new receiving corps at the start of the year that he had to get used to and get the timing down with. So in summary you have to look way beyond the standard statistics you get from the NCAA for total this and total that and see what was really going on during the game. Once again best regards and have a good game saturday...Boomer Sooner.


By the numbers – Oklahoma’s impressive win streak | OU Sports

 

[woolybug25]

Phil Steele has us as 20-point dogs to the Sooners. Not confidence inspiring.



Those vanilla stats can be pretty misleading, Wooly. S&P currently ranks OU at 7th against the run nationally (though you're right to point out that both Michigan State and Stanford are still rated better against the run.) FEI ranks their defense at 6th, and F/+ at 2nd.

They rocketed up the rankings in most of the advanced models by playing a single absolutely perfect game against Texas. To the extent that Texas was overrated at the time, OU may be a little overrated right now. But the stats indicate that this OU team is complete, including on defense.

The advanced metrics indicate that if OU clearly outclasses us anywhere, it's on special teams. FEI ranks OU at 17th, and ND at a pathetic 90th. From Keith Arnold's article on our ST struggles:



And even though our punt coverage unit has performed pretty well, Turk's inconsistency still provides our opponents with great field position frequently. OU's offense is miles better than anything we've faced thus far this year. If we lose the field position battle, you can bet it'll be reflected on the score board.

I'm not seeing much reason to be optimistic about this game.

No one doubts that our special teams are bad. That is clear by any statistic.

What I would argue is that FEI stats have not been very good this year. Here is what they think the top 10 is:

1. KSU
2. OKLAHOMA!!!
3. Bama
4. Oregon
5. Florida
6. ND
7. Oregon State
8. Florida St
9. Stanford
10. Texas Tech

NCAA stats are hard lined. FEI stats are subjective. I don't like subjective stats.

The Fremeau Efficiency Index (FEI) considers each of the nearly 20,000 possessions every season in major college football. All drives are filtered to eliminate first-half clock-kills and end-of-game garbage drives and scores. A scoring rate analysis of the remaining possessions then determines the baseline possession efficiency expectations against which each team is measured. A team is rewarded for playing well against good teams, win or lose, and is punished more severely for playing poorly against bad teams than it is rewarded for playing well against bad teams.

FEI can say whatever they like about OU's running defense, but they are the only ones saying it. I used to get tied up with them, but they are funny numbers. Here is what they see as the 2011 final rankings.

1 LSU 12-1
2 Oklahoma State
3 Alabama
4 Oklahoma
5 Wisconsin
6 Oregon
7 Stanford
8 Boise State
9 Michigan
10 USC

Does that look right to you?

 

[WE ARE OU]

Phil Steele has us as 20-point dogs to the Sooners. Not confidence inspiring.



Those vanilla stats can be pretty misleading, Wooly. S&P currently ranks OU at 7th against the run nationally (though you're right to point out that both Michigan State and Stanford are still rated better against the run.) FEI ranks their defense at 6th, and F/+ at 2nd.

They rocketed up the rankings in most of the advanced models by playing a single absolutely perfect game against Texas. To the extent that Texas was overrated at the time, OU may be a little overrated right now. But the stats indicate that this OU team is complete, including on defense.

The advanced metrics indicate that if OU clearly outclasses us anywhere, it's on special teams. FEI ranks OU at 17th, and ND at a pathetic 90th. From Keith Arnold's article on our ST struggles:



And even though our punt coverage unit has performed pretty well, Turk's inconsistency still provides our opponents with great field position frequently. OU's offense is miles better than anything we've faced thus far this year. If we lose the field position battle, you can bet it'll be reflected on the score board.

I'm not seeing much reason to be optimistic about this game.

I agree, i was typing my response when you posted yours and i didn't see it til mine was posted but i agree with what you have said.

 

[ScrantonNDfan]

Landry reminds me of a slightly better QB than Dayne Crist. I'm sorry.

I'm watching the full replay of the UTEP game.

 

[woolybug25]

Yes. Hard to believe given the points we're putting up, but we've gotten a huge SoS boost in that category thus far. It's a reflection of how many tough defenses we've gone against.

C'Mon Whiskey... this should be seen as more evidence that the subjective FEI stats aren't accurate. As somebody that has watched the games, how by any measure could someone say that ND's offense ranks #3 in anything offensively.

 

[WE ARE OU]

Mother **cker.... I told you that it is ridiculous to try to point out first team defense vs second string. If every team did this, the rankings and numbers would all go down as well. You are trying to make some stupid case that doesn't make sense. As I said before, under your logic, Oregon is one of the best defenses in the country and holding teams to about 8 pts. It's a stupid argument by a stupid poster.

Go back to OU boards.

I disagree because of the fact that teams that have played close games have had to keep their first team defense on the field much longer which LOWERS the overall numbers considerably whereas OU's are INFLATED because of the second team has been on the field so much more. Best regards again...Boomer Sooner

 

[Pops Freshenmeyer]

C'Mon Whiskey... this should be seen as more evidence that the subjective FEI stats aren't accurate. As somebody that has watched the games, how by any measure could someone say that ND's offense ranks #3 in anything offensively.

What do you mean by "subjective?"

 

[WE ARE OU]

Landry reminds me of a slightly better QB than Dayne Crist. I'm sorry.

I'm watching the full replay of the UTEP game.

That was the first game with basically all new recievers except for Stills and the first time the O line had played together in a game after all the injuries. Again look at the difference in the last 3 games compared to the first 3. best regards..Boomer Sooner.

 

[OUMallen]

Landry reminds me of a slightly better QB than Dayne Crist. I'm sorry.

I'm watching the full replay of the UTEP game.

That's a waste of time, because that's not the team you have on Saturday.

 

[WE ARE OU]

That's a waste of time, because that's not the team you have on Saturday.

I agree Mallen

 

[woolybug25]

What do you mean by "subjective?"

FEI stats are made like this:

The Fremeau Efficiency Index (FEI) considers each of the nearly 20,000 possessions every season in major college football. All drives are filtered to eliminate first-half clock-kills and end-of-game garbage drives and scores. A scoring rate analysis of the remaining possessions then determines the baseline possession efficiency expectations against which each team is measured. A team is rewarded for playing well against good teams, win or lose, and is punished more severely for playing poorly against bad teams than it is rewarded for playing well against bad teams.

- What is a "end of game garbage drive"
- A team is "rewarded" for playing "good" teams?
- Punished more severely for "playing poorly against bad teams"

Again, look at what they currently see the top 10 being and what they thought the final top 10 should have been at the end of last year. Do you think a statistical measure is accurate when they ranked LSU #1 and Bama #3 for the end of 2011?

I disagree because of the fact that teams that have played close games have had to keep their first team defense on the field much longer which LOWERS the overall numbers considerably whereas OU's are INFLATED because of the second team has been on the field so much more. Best regards again...Boomer Sooner

I have explained this several times but your idiotic mind just wont get it. Fine, we'll do it by your measure. Bama holds teams to less than 1 point per game. I hope you get banned soon.

 

[Whiskeyjack]

NCAA stats are hard lined. FEI stats are subjective. I don't like subjective stats.

The problem with vanilla stats is that they all carry a giant asterisk: "But who have they played!?"

Opponent-adjusted models-- like Steele's and Football Outsider's-- at least remove that asterisk. They're not perfect, but I think they paint a more accurate picture.

 

[WE ARE OU]

The problem with vanilla stats is that they all carry a giant asterisk: "But who have they played!?"

Opponent-adjusted models-- like Steele's and Football Outsider's-- at least remove that asterisk. They're not perfect, but I think they paint a more accurate picture.

I agree with you

 

[ScrantonNDfan]

As Cowherd said today... we are playing Choklahoma!

 

[woolybug25]

The problem with vanilla stats is that they all carry a giant asterisk: "But who have they played!?"

Opponent-adjusted models-- like Steele's and Football Outsider's-- at least remove that asterisk. They're not perfect, but I think they paint a more accurate picture.

Whiskey... that's the thing, they aren't more accurate. I just showed you what they think the top 10 currently is and what they should have been at the end of last year. They aren't even close to reality. They also claim that we are #2 in offensive f/+... do you believe that?

Here is the preseason top 25 from Phil Steele.

1. Florida State
2. Oklahoma
3. LSU
4. USC
5. Alabama
6. Oregon
7. Texas
8. Georgia
9. Wisconsin
10. Florida
11. Ohio State
12. Oklahoma State
13. North Carolina
14. Clemson
15. Central Florida
16. Arkansas
17. Nebraska
18. Stanford
19. Michigan State
20. South Florida
21. Notre Dame
22. Michigan
23. South Carolina
24. Virginia Tech
25. West Virginia

Seven of his top 10 have already lost. 8 of his teams (not including Ohio St) aren't even in the current BCS standings. He based this off of his "statistical research" and are suppose to be representative of where the teams would be at the end of the year, not the start.

Here is the original AP poll:

1 USC
2 Alabama
3 LSU
4 Oklahoma
5 Oregon
6 Georgia
7 Florida State
8 Michigan
9 South Carolina
10 Arkansas
11 West Virginia
12 Wisconsin
13 Michigan State
14 Clemson
15 Texas
16 Virginia Tech
17 Nebraska
18 Ohio State
19 Oklahoma State
20 TCU
21 Stanford
22 Kansas State
23 Florida
24 Boise State
25 Louisville

This is a complete juxtapose to Steele. Instead of 7 of the top 10 already with a loss, the original AP still has 7 of it's top 10 still in the top 10. They only have 6 teams that have been knocked out, and this poll is not based on year end projections, just their preseason projection.

Phil Steele's metrics aren't what everybody makes them out to be if you ask me. They sound good and are fun to look at, but they dont jive with reality.

 

[Black Dynamite]

Hi, I posted this exact same thing on the other big active thread i was reading and i feel it is important enough to post here as well. I am sorry if you read this there but to me it is important.

Hi all i just joined today and one observation i have made as i read throught the posts on here is that some of the people are very rude, inconsiderate, foul mouthed and tend to belittle and demean anything that is said that they don't agree with. I find this quite disturbing and to me it does not seem to follow the mission that we as people who represent Notre Dame should be expressing. I am highly disappointed in these actions and I would hope that many of you do not act like this in the real world, and in fact i would hope that this would not continue here as well. Please take time to look in the mirror next time you type profane and insulting things and ask yourself is this what Notre Dame stands for and would i like to be treated this way. If you have forgotten anything that you have leaned there go back and reread the mission I would hope we would all be following.



Mission Statement // About ND // University of Notre Dame

 

[Kaneyoufeelit]

Hi, I posted this exact same thing on the other big active thread i was reading and i feel it is important enough to post here as well. I am sorry if you read this there but to me it is important.

Hi all i just joined today and one observation i have made as i read throught the posts on here is that some of the people are very rude, inconsiderate, foul mouthed and tend to belittle and demean anything that is said that they don't agree with. I find this quite disturbing and to me it does not seem to follow the mission that we as people who represent Notre Dame should be expressing. I am highly disappointed in these actions and I would hope that many of you do not act like this in the real world, and in fact i would hope that this would not continue here as well. Please take time to look in the mirror next time you type profane and insulting things and ask yourself is this what Notre Dame stands for and would i like to be treated this way. If you have forgotten anything that you have leaned there go back and reread the mission I would hope we would all be following.

Hi all i just joined today and one observation i have made as i read throught the posts on here is that some of the people are very rude, inconsiderate, foul mouthed and tend to belittle and demean anything that is said that they don't agree with. I find this quite disturbing and to me it does not seem to follow the mission that we as people who represent Notre Dame should be expressing. I am highly disappointed in these actions and I would hope that many of you do not act like this in the real world, and in fact i would hope that this would not continue here as well. Please take time to look in the mirror next time you type profane and insulting things and ask yourself is this what Notre Dame stands for and would i like to be treated this way. If you have forgotten anything that you have leaned there go back and reread the mission I would hope we would all be following.

Mission Statement // About ND // University of Notre Dame

Really?

 

[Sherm Sticky]

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[OUMallen]

Hi, I posted this exact same thing on the other big active thread i was reading and i feel it is important enough to post here as well. I am sorry if you read this there but to me it is important.

Hi all i just joined today and one observation i have made as i read throught the posts on here is that some of the people are very rude, inconsiderate, foul mouthed and tend to belittle and demean anything that is said that they don't agree with. I find this quite disturbing and to me it does not seem to follow the mission that we as people who represent Notre Dame should be expressing. I am highly disappointed in these actions and I would hope that many of you do not act like this in the real world, and in fact i would hope that this would not continue here as well. Please take time to look in the mirror next time you type profane and insulting things and ask yourself is this what Notre Dame stands for and would i like to be treated this way. If you have forgotten anything that you have leaned there go back and reread the mission I would hope we would all be following.



Mission Statement // About ND // University of Notre Dame

OMFG spare us.

 

[Jason Pham]

Valid Point. F*ck you.

Settle down.

 

[greyhammer90]

Settle down.

Mea culpa. I hate holier-than-thou posters, plus I figured it was an OU troll trying to mock our "moral superiority" that we all have according to their boards. Regardless I was overzealous. Sorry.

 

[OUMallen]

Mea culpa. I hate holier-than-thou posters, plus I figured it was an OU troll trying to mock our "moral superiority" that we all have according to their boards. Regardless I was overzealous. Sorry.

Prolly was.

 

[Jason Pham]

Mea culpa. I hate holier-than-thou posters, plus I figured it was an OU troll trying to mock our "moral superiority" that we all have according to their boards. Regardless I was overzealous. Sorry.

No problem. Just trying to keep things from spiraling too much. Thanks for understanding.

 

[woolybug25]

No problem. Just trying to keep things from spiraling too much. Thanks for understanding.

I do not envy you dudes come gameday.

 

[Black Dynamite]

No problem. Just trying to keep things from spiraling too much. Thanks for understanding.

Thank you, it gives me some reassurance that there are still decent people posting here

 

[Me2SouthBend]

Hi, I posted this exact same thing on the other big active thread i was reading and i feel it is important enough to post here as well. I am sorry if you read this there but to me it is important.

Hi all i just joined today and one observation i have made as i read throught the posts on here is that some of the people are very rude, inconsiderate, foul mouthed and tend to belittle and demean anything that is said that they don't agree with. I find this quite disturbing and to me it does not seem to follow the mission that we as people who represent Notre Dame should be expressing. I am highly disappointed you type profane and insulting things and ask yourself is this what Notre Dame stands for and would i like to be treated this way. If you have forgotten anything that you have leaned there go back and reread the mission I would hope we would all be following.



Mission Statement // About ND // University of Notre Dame

As long as you are gracing us, please capitalize. Have a nice day. Go Irish.

 

[Sooner]

My fellow sooners have been putting in work I see....
Well done fellas.
BOOMER!

 

[GoldenIsThyFame]

Another one.... I thought only one land thieve was allowed per message board. Isn't that how it is supposed to work?

 

[greyhammer90]

Another one.... I thought only one land thieve was allowed per message board. Isn't that how it is supposed to work?

If I had the power to ban...

<iframe width="420" height="315" src="http://www.youtube.com/embed/_UKvpONl3No" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>

 

[Black Dynamite]

Oh my gosh be tolerant on both sides for petes sake and enjoy the upcoming game