'13 WA TE/OLB Danny Mattingly (Oregon Verbal)

[STLDomer]

That's ridiculous. Give me the best pass rusher in the NFL over the best "lock down" corner any day.

Jaylon is arguably the best pass covering LB however he isn't regarded as one of the top pass rushers (still very good) so the comparison isn't valid.

Either way being at OLB allows him to do both rush the passer or cover someone, being at ILB usually doesn't allow him to do either rather he would be occasionally blitzing (not as often as a OLB) or dropping into a hook zone (waste of talent).

DOGs cover first rush second, CATs rush first cover second

On the other hand ILBs read run first (neither of his best attributes)

 

[Whiskeyjack]

I'm under the impression that both of our OLBs need to be able to pass rush well. That's supposed to be one of the big strengths of the 3-4; the ability to bring unexpected pressure from either edge on any down.

Our lack of a competent DOLB has really limited our defense thus far, both in coverage and in rushing the passer. Jaylon seems like the perfect solution to that problem.

I'm fairly certain that you never put talented pass rushers at ILB in a 3-4. Though I'm sure he could do it, plugging Jaylon in at WILB would really limit his versatility.

 

[Sherm Sticky]

I'm under the impression that both of our OLBs need to be able to pass rush well. That's supposed to be one of the big strengths of the 3-4; the ability to bring unexpected pressure from either edge on any down.

Our lack of a competent DOLB has really limited our defense thus far, both in coverage and in rushing the passer. Jaylon seems like the perfect solution to that problem.

I'm fairly certain that you never put talented pass rushers at ILB in a 3-4. Though I'm sure he could do it, plugging Jaylon in at WILB would really limit his versatility.

Wasn't Manti second on the team in sacks last year?

 

[Whiskeyjack]

Wasn't Manti second on the team in sacks last year?

Yes:
(1) Lynch - 5.5
(2) Te'o - 5
(3) Fleming - 3.5
(4) Shembo - 2
(4) Slaughter - 2
(4) Tuitt - 2
(7) KLM - 1.5
(8) Calabrese - 1
(8) Fox - 1
(10) Nix - 0.5

I'm open to correction, but that's not what the sack distribution of a 3-4 team is supposed to look like. Fleming and Shembo were really unproductive at OLB; part of that is due to Slaughter playing at DOLB so frequently last year, and Diaco's ultra-conservative scheme doesn't help either.

Good on Te'o for stepping up and helping our anemic pass rush in 2011; as a 3-4 LB, he has an easier time getting through the OL untouched than he would in a 4-3. But I think his ranking 2nd in sacks is more indicative of our problems at OLB than it is of anything intentional on Diaco's part.

 

[PANDFAN]

I'm under the impression that both of our OLBs need to be able to pass rush well. That's supposed to be one of the big strengths of the 3-4; the ability to bring unexpected pressure from either edge on any down.

Our lack of a competent DOLB has really limited our defense thus far, both in coverage and in rushing the passer. Jaylon seems like the perfect solution to that problem.

I'm fairly certain that you never put talented pass rushers at ILB in a 3-4. Though I'm sure he could do it, plugging Jaylon in at WILB would really limit his versatility.

CORRECT

Wasn't Manti second on the team in sacks last year?

Manti was only 2nd because
A. there was a complete lack of pass rush-besides AL
B. when there was a collapse of pocket the qb tried going up the middle which is where he was ...rarely did i recall just him coming straight up the middle on a blitz package for him

 

[Sherm Sticky]

Shembo, Tuitt and Ishaq need to step it up this year.

 

[STLDomer]

Manti was only 2nd because
A. there was a complete lack of pass rush-besides AL
B. when there was a collapse of pocket the qb tried going up the middle which is where he was ...rarely did i recall just him coming straight up the middle on a blitz package for him
C. Manti is a boss

Fixed

 

[PANDFAN]

Yes:
(1) Lynch - 5.5
(2) Te'o - 5
(3) Fleming - 3.5
(4) Shembo - 2
(4) Slaughter - 2
(4) Tuitt - 2
(7) KLM - 1.5
(8) Calabrese - 1
(8) Fox - 1
(10) Nix - 0.5

I'm open to correction, but that's not what the sack distribution of a 3-4 team is supposed to look like. Fleming and Shembo were really unproductive at OLB; part of that is due to Slaughter playing at DOLB so frequently last year, and Diaco's ultra-conservative scheme doesn't help either.

Good on Te'o for stepping up and helping our anemic pass rush in 2011; as a 3-4 LB, he has an easier time getting through the OL untouched than he would in a 4-3. But I think his ranking 2nd in sacks is more indicative of our problems at OLB than it is of anything intentional on Diaco's part.

and to think Whitney Mercilus, DE ILL had 16.0 sacks himself...almost as much as our TEAM

 

[Irish Fam]

We have to keep Jaylon on the outside. His speed for a linebacker is what we have been missing for a while now. Let him play in space and just use his athleticism to make plays.

As for Danny, I think he would be a nice fit at Will. He can play in space and has great hands for someone his size, but he can also use that size to take on a blocker and stop the run.

But what do i know...

 

[Bogtrotter07]

jaylon at dog no doubt
Danny at will or dog
Alex at mike they say but I say will

Thanks dude, we are on the same page, dog. I always wanted to say that, and since we are talking about dogs. I see you Alex at mike, man that is a potentially big mike. Interesting with Danny at will. Fair amount of coverage over the middle; quick reads, smart guy. can stuff and cover, so I am good. What are Danny's o/s rush skills? Haven't seen anything on paper or tape. Alex intrigues me becase he seems so long. When do you see him making it official?

 

[Bogtrotter07]

Jaylon is arguably the best pass covering LB however he isn't regarded as one of the top pass rushers (still very good) so the comparison isn't valid.

Either way being at OLB allows him to do both rush the passer or cover someone, being at ILB usually doesn't allow him to do either rather he would be occasionally blitzing (not as often as a OLB) or dropping into a hook zone (waste of talent).

DOGs cover first rush second, CATs rush first cover second

On the other hand ILBs read run first (neither of his best attributes)

Not as of the last three or four camps he was at. They keep saying he is as good at rushing as any down lineman except C Lawson. So he is the best cover and rushing Linebacker out there. That is why some services have him at #1OLB #4 overall.

 

[GBdomer]

Thanks dude, we are on the same page, dog. I always wanted to say that, and since we are talking about dogs. I see you Alex at mike, man that is a potentially big mike. Interesting with Danny at will. Fair amount of coverage over the middle; quick reads, smart guy. can stuff and cover, so I am good. What are Danny's o/s rush skills? Haven't seen anything on paper or tape. Alex intrigues me becase he seems so long. When do you see him making it official?

Alex should decide before he goes to the opening. I haven't seen film on him at all for Danny. Just saying Will for Alex. Jaylon will play DOG. No one on our roster can play the dog. Freaky long arms dude can cover and lockdown Laqoun Treadwell at corner and you guys want him rushing the passer? Ha give me a break. No knock on Shembo but watch him play that position last year and tell me we don't need help there? Danny could play the cat dude needs to bulk up more not the best looking prospect physically. Pauly L will change that. Alex I like at the Will because he can cover and make up ground in the middle. Cat will be filled by maybe Randolph or Ebenzer. I dont care if none of you agree with me but that's how its going to be. Plan B guys for the CAT's if we miss out on those two.

 

[Emcee77]

Alex should decide before he goes to the opening. I haven't seen film on him at all for Danny. Just saying Will for Alex. Jaylon will play DOG. No one on our roster can play the dog. Freaky long arms dude can cover and lockdown Laqoun Treadwell at corner and you guys want him rushing the passer? Ha give me a break. No knock on Shembo but watch him play that position last year and tell me we don't need help there? Danny could play the cat dude needs to bulk up more not the best looking prospect physically. Pauly L will change that. Alex I like at the Will because he can cover and make up ground in the middle. Cat will be filled by maybe Randolph or Ebenzer. I dont care if none of you agree with me but that's how its going to be. Plan B guys for the CAT's if we miss out on those two.

I agree with all this. I bolded the part about Alex at WILL because Sapp has been saying that the staff is telling Anzalone that he will play MIKE for us. I thought of him more as a WILL but then again he is a big, physical guy and I'm sure he'd be effective at either position (or any of the four LB positions, really).

 

[Sherm Sticky]

You guys are wrong. Having a pass rusher is more important than having a guy who can cover.

Example...New York Giants.

 

[GBdomer]

You guys are wrong. Having a pass rusher is more important than having a guy who can cover.

Example...New York Giants.

are you serious clark? Giants have DE that can pass rush. What in gods green earth does that have to do with Dogs and Cats.

 

[IrishLion]

I think Jaylon should play CB just because I want my voice thrown in on this debate. But seriously DOG is the best fit. Lock down WRs/TEs/RBs, surprise rush on occasion, and basically eliminate a whole side of the field from needing extra help from S/CBs. That is the key in a young, unproven secondary, even if B.Jax and (other) turn out to be alright.

 

[Sherm Sticky]

are you serious clark? Giants have DE that can pass rush. What in gods green earth does that have to do with Dogs and Cats.

hmm...Because why wouldn't you want his 4.4 speed coming off the edge rushing on nearly every down. Instead we are going to have him follow a TE every play.

 

[RDU Irish]

Welcome aboard Danny! if in fact this thread is still about you.....

 

[GBdomer]

hmm...Because why wouldn't you want his 4.4 speed coming off the edge rushing on nearly every down. Instead we are going to have him follow a TE every play.

You clearly don't understand the defense. And your buy yourself in this argument looking back at previous posts. I won't fight with you but everybody says Jaylon to DOG even TJ34 who prob. is someone on the coaching staff. But if you want him to play CAT NCCA 13 will work.

 

[NDdomer2]

Welcome aboard Danny! if in fact this thread is still about you.....

How dare you get this thread on topic!

 

[STLDomer]

Orginally u wanted him to play MIKE, then WILL, and now I really don't understand if u want CAT or not.

at CAT he would rush alot and cover too
at DOG he would cover alot and rush too.

at either of the ILBs he would do both less and focus on run stopping

He is the best cover OLB there is so he should and will play DOG.

DOG also offers the quickest PT

 

[GBdomer]

Orginally u wanted him to play MIKE, then WILL, and now I really don't understand if u want CAT or not.

at CAT he would rush alot and cover too
at DOG he would cover alot and rush too.

at either of the ILBs he would do both less and focus on run stopping

He is the best cover OLB there is so he should and will play DOG.

DOG also offers the quickest PT

nailed it Sluh. Btw i always said Jaylon at Dog.

 

[Sherm Sticky]

My opinion is I would prefer him to play any other position, but DOG.

Maybe it's because we have had Neal, Shembo and Niklas playing there with no production. It doesn't seem like a critical position from the two years Diaco has been here. `I would rather see him play a more critical role. But, whatever he clearly will be a DOG when he gets here. Thanks Brian Kelly and Diaco for your input and changing my mind in this thread.

 

[Whiskeyjack]

Maybe it's because we have had Neal, Shembo and Niklas playing there with no production. It doesn't seem like a critical position from the two years Diaco has been here. `I would rather see him play a more critical role. But, whatever he clearly will be a DOG when he gets here. Thanks Brian Kelly and Diaco for your input and changing my mind in this thread.

I understand your concern about the position given it's recent history: (1) Neal had the learn the position on the fly and was never comfortable there; (2) Shembo, for whatever reason, is simply terrible in space; and (3) Niklas was a massive true freshman who the staff tried to use as a stop gap. In short, we've never had a real DOLB before.

And it has really hurt our defense. As I mentioned previously, one big advantage of the 3-4 is its symmetrical versatility; either of the OLBs can rush or drop on any given down, which makes pre-snap adjustments very difficult. Since we haven't been able to find a DOLB who can cover, Kelly and Diaco have had to make the defense much more predictable by pulling the DOLB in favor of a Nickelback every time they expected a pass.

Unless Diaco is ready to scrap his 3-4 in favor of something more aggressive, we can't give up on the DOLB simply because we haven't had a good fit for it previously. Which is reason to be even more excited about Jaylon; getting a 5 is always a good thing, but plugging in a recruit of his talent at a position which has done more to hold us back over the last 2 years than anything else... it has the potential to take our defense to another level.

 

[House16]

Hmmm. Can someone explain what exactly the different Linebacker roles are? I've never heard the terms Mike, Will, Dog, or Cat before IE haha.

 

[IrishLax]

One thing I'd like to add is that he's a bit of a long strider which probably isn't ideal for a CAT edge rusher and he's also lean... not a bowling ball like a Shembo or James Harrison or really really most 3-4 rush OLBs. Most 3-4 DEs are prototypical DEs that just happen to have elite athleticism... or they're undersized "squat" DEs with tremendous quickness. Jaylon really is the best fit for DOG or WILL.

BUT with all of that being said I think there's a very fair chance he does play CAT. It's really the most important position... but more than that it's that you have to realize that we have taken ZERO CAT prospects so far in the '12 and '13 classes. If we don't land an elite prospect for that position... but do have guys like Mattingly or Anzalone or whoever that can be good players at WILL/DOG... you simply have to play them where they fit and let Jaylon do his thing at CAT. So unless we land someone like Alquadin Muhammed, etc. to play CAT in this class.... yeah, you see where I'm going. That's why I said earlier I expect him to eventually end up at CAT or WILL.

Just my uninformed opinion and no more valid than anyone else who is suggesting something else... it's important to remember that someone with Jaylon's incredible gifts is so flexible that no matter what we think now he could end up at multiple positions.

 

[IrishLax]

Hmmm. Can someone explain what exactly the different Linebacker roles are? I've never heard the terms Mike, Will, Dog, or Cat before IE haha.

CAT = rush OLB. He's the OLB that most often will put his hand in the ground and come after the QB. Needs to be strong as a DE at the point of attack and is the primary sack-getter in a 3-4 defense. Also has to make plays in space like a traditional LB but less often than the other positions.

DOG = drop OLB. Needs to be very good in space and intelligent... responsible for rushing the passer like CAT but will drop in coverage far more often than the CAT linebacker.

MIKE = tackler. Basically the ILB responsible for tackling everything in sight.

WILL = MIKE but will drop in coverage more often. Ideally you would like a guy with similar skillset to the DOG to play this position because the WILL is responsible for making tackles against the run, dropping into coverage, and coming occasionally on the blitz.

 

[House16]

Thanks man. Reps

 

[STLDomer]

I think we land a CAT this year, there's:

- James: unlikely but still possible
- Drennon: don't really know where we stand but we were in his top 3 w/ UK when PSU was an option and then PSU wasn't and he kinda started over
- Randolph: good season = flip
- Muhammad: we should land him IMO
- Ogundeko: UF probably leads but we'll know soon
- Cooper: should have a good shot

Of these only Muhammad and Randolph are "elite" though

So how bout that Mattingly kid....

 

[GBdomer]

Cooper MSU right now
Obenudeko Florida
Randolph i dont feel as good as i previously did
Muhammad i feel really good about
James Wisconsin
Drennon i think grows into a DE

We will get ours. Remember its only July.