Trump awards Lou Holtz with medal of Freedom

phillyirish

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at least the people were considered some of the very best to ever play their sport....i mean other than his run at ND, he was at best an avg coach...

Awful, awful take. He was one of the most successful coaches in the history of Arkansas and NC State’s football programs too.

Presidential Medal of freedom is a joke. It’s basically given as a political reward or given to cultural icons that the incumbent was fond of.

Regardless of the political takes, Trump has given the award to two ND people now in Holtz and Alan Page. Go Irish.
 

notredomer23

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Some facts:

-Lou is a good person, politics aside
-Lou has overcome a ton of adversity in his life and had one of the most successful college coaching careers of the 20th century
-Lou has had to overcome a lot in just the last year, losing his wife and having a rough bout with COVID very recently.

You can argue if he deserves it, but you can see it has brought him a lot of joy so I am happy for him.
 

Cackalacky2.0

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Awful, awful take. He was one of the most successful coaches in the history of Arkansas and NC State’s football programs too.

Presidential Medal of freedom is a joke. It’s basically given as a political reward or given to cultural icons that the incumbent was fond of.

Regardless of the political takes, Trump has given the award to two ND people now in Holtz and Alan Page. Go Irish.

RUSH LIMBAUGH
 

Meatloaf

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I may get kicked out but, there are a bunch of liberal pieces of garbage on this site that are intolerant of anyone not agreeing with their view. Liberals have claimed to be the voices of tolerance. Sorry guys, you are the opposite. Totally intolerant of anyone who had a different point of view. Calling Holtz a religious bigot is horrifying. Your insinuation is disgusting and unacceptable. He is a religious and faithful man. You will wish you have his resume when you reach the pearly gates.

SO BRAVE
 

phillyirish

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I’m actually shocked by the reactions in this thread. We can argue the merits of him deserving the award but I really don’t think the right wingers would be up in roar calling it a Joke if Biden were to hand the award to Holtz in a few weeks. Political extremism is causing you to criticizingly assault one of the icons of ND. Holtz is an old man, let him cling his views that were wildly accepted and not overly controversial for 90% of his life. Hate to break it to you, but Rockne, Leahy and Parsighean would probably all hold similar views to Holtz.

Oh and let me throw in the customary, “I didn’t vote for Trump in either election” comment.
 

TorontoGold

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I’m actually shocked by the reactions in this thread. We can argue the merits of him deserving the award but I really don’t think the right wingers would be up in roar calling it a Joke if Biden were to hand the award to Holtz in a few weeks. Political extremism is causing you to criticizingly assault one of the icons of ND. Holtz is an old man, let him cling his views that were wildly accepted and not overly controversial for 90% of his life. Hate to break it to you, but Rockne, Leahy and Parsighean would probably all hold similar views to Holtz.

Oh and let me throw in the customary, “I didn’t vote for Trump in either election” comment.

...that's because they share his views?

Joe should really test it, give it to Kap and see the reaction lol
 

ulukinatme

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Let’s not devalue Lou Holtz just because YOUR 45th president selected him.

Pussies. I’d beat your asses if I could. :)


giphy.gif


Lou's not wrong, I'm not sure Biden can call himself a Catholic if he supports positions like abortion and homosexual marriage (The church says we must respect and have compassion for homosexuals, but believes holy marriage to remain between a man and woman. Civil unions or similar ceremonies are instead preferred). The church is pretty clear on these things, and claiming you're a practicing Catholic yet opposed to these things cannot go hand in hand.

As far as Lou, I'd be ashamed of anyone attacking his character. He's given back a lot to people, he's a genuine and kind person who puts Christ first. He was a loving husband while his wife was with us, devoted father, a good Christian man. Don't see how some could demonize a man they've never met. While I haven't had the privilege, my family got to meet him in Hawaii before the bowl in '90. He took time out of his busy schedule to sit and talk with my grandpa, it's one of the highlights of his life. He talks often how generous Lou was, how he talked about his faith and family, it really moved him.

Men have been given awards and prizes for far less. Lou's an old man that's led a good life, no sense in poo-pooing this event.
 

phillyirish

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...that's because they share his views?

Joe should really test it, give it to Kap and see the reaction lol

I meant that in the context of this board. Obviously, Biden wouldn’t give it to Holtz. But if he did, there wouldn’t be any hostile reaction seen on this board.

Biden will probably give it to Kap. Obama actually gave it to Biden, and it’ll be amusing to see if Biden gives it right back to him. Not that compared to other recipients it would be out of line, just that it’ll be tic for tac situation.
 

dublinirish

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I may get kicked out but, there are a bunch of liberal pieces of garbage on this site that are intolerant of anyone not agreeing with their view. Liberals have claimed to be the voices of tolerance. Sorry guys, you are the opposite. Totally intolerant of anyone who had a different point of view. Calling Holtz a religious bigot is horrifying. Your insinuation is disgusting and unacceptable. He is a religious and faithful man. You will wish you have his resume when you reach the pearly gates.

Lol WTF is this??
 

Cackalacky2.0

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giphy.gif


Lou's not wrong, I'm not sure Biden can call himself a Catholic if he supports positions like abortion and homosexual marriage (The church says we must respect and have compassion for homosexuals, but believes holy marriage to remain between a man and woman. Civil unions or similar ceremonies are instead preferred). The church is pretty clear on these things, and claiming you're a practicing Catholic yet opposed to these things cannot go hand in hand.

As far as Lou, I'd be ashamed of anyone attacking his character. He's given back a lot to people, he's a genuine and kind person who puts Christ first. He was a loving husband while his wife was with us, devoted father, a good Christian man. Don't see how some could demonize a man they've never met. While I haven't had the privilege, my family got to meet him in Hawaii before the bowl in '90. He took time out of his busy schedule to sit and talk with my grandpa, it's one of the highlights of his life. He talks often how generous Lou was, how he talked about his faith and family, it really moved him.

Men have been given awards and prizes for far less. Lou's an old man that's led a good life, no sense in poo-pooing this event.
This is an honest question .... do you think a person can believe those things are immoral but support the secular nature of our republic’s constitution considering there are many citizens who have the same right you do to believe what they believe?

I struggle a lot with this topic. I think Whiskey has posted about this incompatibility as well many ages ago it seems. Its a tough thing that I dont think we can be so quick to pass judgement.
 
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Irishman77

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I’m actually shocked by the reactions in this thread. We can argue the merits of him deserving the award but I really don’t think the right wingers would be up in roar calling it a Joke if Biden were to hand the award to Holtz in a few weeks. Political extremism is causing you to criticizingly assault one of the icons of ND. Holtz is an old man, let him cling his views that were wildly accepted and not overly controversial for 90% of his life. Hate to break it to you, but Rockne, Leahy and Parsighean would probably all hold similar views to Holtz.

Oh and let me throw in the customary, “I didn’t vote for Trump in either election” comment.

Perfectly said. Thank you.
 

johnnycando

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This is an honest question .... do you think a person can believe those things are immoral but support the secular nature of our republic’s constitution considering there are many citizens who have the same right you do to believe what they believe?

I struggle a lot with this topic. I think Whiskey has posted about this incompatibility as well many ages ago it seems. Its a tough thing that I dont think we can be so quick to pass judgement.

Sin is sin in God’s eyes.

There are obviously more repulsive levels to Him.

Man thinks they can attach a coefficient and quality factor.

Let he without sin cast the first stone.
 

yankeehater

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You do know ND had to issue a statement distancing themselves from him because he accused another Catholic of not being sincere in his faith over political reasons right? I missed where Pope Lou got the white smoke and got to pass judgement.

And then Biden proved Lou right by not knowing how to pronounce Psalmist a month later!
 

yankeehater

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And then Biden proved Lou right by not knowing how to pronounce Psalmist a month later!

Kind of like when Obama didn't know how to pronounce Corpsman. You know Barack probably had never met one let alone been one himself.
 

Irishize

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at least the people were considered some of the very best to ever play their sport....i mean other than his run at ND, he was at best an avg coach...

I’m gonna disagree with this take. No other HC in CFB has taken six schools to a bowl game. He is still responsible for the biggest win in Arkansas football history when they upset #2 OU as huge underdogs b/c he suspended his starting backfield for sexual assault. He tuned South Carolina around after one season w/ back-to-back 8-win seasons that both concluded w/ bowl wins over Ohio State.

Now, he wasn’t w/o controversy but what modern day Hall-of-Fame coach is? Even Holtz haters admit the guy is one of the ATGs.
 

ResLife Hero

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Is all the hate towards one of ND’s greats because he supported Trump? If so, this thread is disappointing.

FWIW, my issues with him aren't political. He's taken a number of social stances lately i don't agree with, and I threw in the towel when he used my Alma mater's name and a narrow view of catholicism to attack someone's faith. Politically we disagree, but I admired him above that until recently.

Again, he's a great coach. My concern with this event was I think he was awarded for his RNC performance and not his actual record.
 

ulukinatme

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This is an honest question .... do you think a person can believe those things are immoral but support the secular nature of our republic’s constitution considering there are many citizens who have the same right you do to believe what they believe?

I struggle a lot with this topic. I think Whiskey has posted about this incompatibility as well many ages ago it seems. Its a tough thing that I dont think we can be so quick to pass judgement.

I don't believe you can be selective with your faith. The law says one thing, but God's law is absolute. That's why we say "God, country, Notre Dame." The Lord's will is first, we honor country next, then family. I don't hate the man for his political choices, but I struggle with how one can profess to be a Catholic and not adhere to some of their fundamental beliefs. I'll be the first to admit that I make mistakes, I'm not a saint by any means, but there are some lines you don't cross and that's where it comes to the mortal sins.

Is all the hate towards one of ND’s greats because he supported Trump? If so, this thread is disappointing.

Lou was beloved by many people prior to the RNC, other than some head cases that were part of an opposing team's fan base. Some people may forget that Trump was also pretty popular prior to the birther conspiracy and his Presidential run. He was a figurehead around New York, making appearances on late night as an icon and celebrated around the country. All that changed around 2014 when he started getting serious about politics, half the country turned on him at the drop of a hat. In both cases it has everything to do with political affiliation, and sadly some of the people spewing their hate don't realize they're bigots. It goes both ways, but somewhere along the line people in this country started taking politics very personal and turned away from sense and decency. We should never have a blind hatred here based on party affiliation. We can disagree, but throwing someone under the bus and wishing ill of them for being in one party or the other is just silly.
 

Legacy

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This is an honest question .... do you think a person can believe those things are immoral but support the secular nature of our republic’s constitution considering there are many citizens who have the same right you do to believe what they believe?

I struggle a lot with this topic. I think Whiskey has posted about this incompatibility as well many ages ago it seems. Its a tough thing that I dont think we can be so quick to pass judgement.

We've become accustomed to regarding the Federal Government to solve our economic problems and resolve social issues with politicians on both sides appealing to voters with promises that would reflect their morality. Yet the basis of our constitutional government is a separation between Church and State. That really obligates a politician to separate his beliefs from governance for the good of all. Further, if you believe like Thomas Jefferson that "The less government there is the better it is." then you believe that less government translates into less intrusion in one's personal beliefs and choices.

I don't expect - and shouldn't - that the 30% of Congress that are Catholic and the six Catholic Supreme Court Justices (or seven if you count Gorsuch who was raised Catholic) to make choices based solely on Church teaching and their beiefs. Scalia once said: "I don't think there's any such thing as a Catholic judge. The only article in faith that plays any part in my judging is the commandment, 'Thou Shalt Not Lie.'"

Perhaps when our (Catholic) President Biden gives the Commencement Address he may speak to those.
 
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johnnycando

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We've become accustomed to regarding the Federal Government to solve our economic problems and resolve social issues with politicians on both sides appealing to voters with promises that would reflect their morality. Yet the basis of our constitutional government is a separation between Church and State. That really obligates a politician to separate his beliefs from governance for the good of all. Further, if you believe like Thomas Jefferson that "The less government there is the better it is." then you believe that less government translates into less intrusion in one's personal beliefs and choices.

I don't expect - and shouldn't - that the 30% of Congress that are Catholic and the six Catholic Supreme Court Justices (or seven if you count Gorsuch who was raised Catholic) to make choices based solely on Church teaching and their beiefs. Scalia once said: "I don't think there's any such thing as a Catholic judge. The only article in faith that plays any part in my judging is the commandment, 'Thou Shalt Not Lie.'"

Perhaps when our (Catholic) President Biden gives the Commencement Address he may speak to those.

When he doesn’t stand up to murdering the unborn, doesn’t say “under God” in the pledge of allegiance, and seeks to alter MY Bill of Rights, I have a problem with his “God” and moreso that lack thereof.
 

DCDomer

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When he doesn’t stand up to murdering the unborn, doesn’t say “under God” in the pledge of allegiance, and seeks to alter MY Bill of Rights, I have a problem with his “God” and moreso that lack thereof.

Can you link the clip where Biden doesn't say, "under God" please?

Thanks :)
 

RDU Irish

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You do know ND had to issue a statement distancing themselves from him because he accused another Catholic of not being sincere in his faith over political reasons right? I missed where Pope Lou got the white smoke and got to pass judgement.

A statement that I bet is hitting the University pocket book. Jenks CHOSE to make that statement - it was totally unnecessary.
 

Irishize

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A statement that I bet is hitting the University pocket book. Jenks CHOSE to make that statement - it was totally unnecessary.

That this is a divisive thread is all you need to know about the state of our country in 2020. The only person that should care about this award is the recipient. Do we really need to list all the celebs & VIPs who have received this for doing no more or even less than Holtz did for the county?

I assume everyone on this thread is an Irish fan and is well aware of former ND player Alan Page? Not only is he in the CFB & NFL HoF as one of the greatest DL of all time... he was an associate justice on the Minnesota Supreme Court. Trump awarded him the same award & I’d be willing to bet Page is not a Trump fan.

Get over it and let the old man enjoy his life.
 

RDU Irish

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This is an honest question .... do you think a person can believe those things are immoral but support the secular nature of our republic’s constitution considering there are many citizens who have the same right you do to believe what they believe?

I struggle a lot with this topic. I think Whiskey has posted about this incompatibility as well many ages ago it seems. Its a tough thing that I dont think we can be so quick to pass judgement.

I prefer a large chasm between what should be between you/me and God and between you/me and Government. Seems so many want the opposite.

Conflating "marriage" as the debate does is ridiculous, what force Catholic churches to preside over a gay marriage when they can gain every (supposed) benefit of marriage through government? Jail 18 year olds for taking the morning after pill? Look down your nose all you want from the pulpit or statehouse but the point at which intervention of government is imposed needs to be a big hurdle.

We are allowed to find other people's behaviors immoral or even abhorrent and choose to disassociate, that does not make their actions illegal. Infidelity is not illegal - but I don't really want to associate with cheaters, does that make me bad? I guess I am not so emotionally fragile that I need to beat up on other people's legal choices or beliefs that have no direct influence on my life.
 
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dublinirish

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Interesting that not a single Notre Dame Football/Athletics web or social media page congratulated Holtz on his medal. That says a lot
 
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