Rumblings from Saturday...

[BobbyMac]

Let me start off by stating, I am not a typical insider. I do not actively look for info on ND football. I'm happy with what you guys provide here on IE. I don't read any other boards like NDNation, II, ESPN and even deleted my BR Irish stream this season.

I've by chance become friends with someone close to the program over the past couple of years and recently, met someone else with an even broader connection to the players and the recruiting staff. On Saturday, some things were shared with me that were really troubling. I thought about swallowing it but since no one knows me or the people I know personally, I'll share it for what it's worth.

Before the game started, I was told that Kelly is dangerously close to losing this team. It seems there IS a rift being caused by the offensive philosophy / player choices of this staff. When I first heard it, I didn't know how to take it but it quickly turned out to be almost prophetic. Most troubling were some of the texts from other people you know very well that were coming in.

As bright as the future SHOULD be, it appears there are some serious clouds hanging over the program. I honestly wish I wouldn't have heard it.

.

 

[Cali_domer]

Thanks for info and it's apparent that Kelly lost this team awhile ago.

 

[GoldenDomer]

Let me start off by stating, I am not a typical insider. I do not actively look for info on ND football. I'm happy with what you guys provide here on IE. I don't read any other boards like NDNation, II, ESPN and even deleted my BR Irish stream this season.

I've by chance become friends with someone close to the program over the past couple of years and recently, met someone else with an even broader connection to the players and the recruiting staff. On Saturday, some things were shared with me that were really troubling. I thought about swallowing it but since no one knows me or the people I know personally, I'll share it for what it's worth.

Before the game started, I was told that Kelly is dangerously close to losing this team. It seems there IS a rift being caused by the offensive philosophy / player choices of this staff. When I first heard it, I didn't know how to take it but it quickly turned out to be almost prophetic. Most troubling were some of the texts from other people you know very well that were coming in.

As bright as the future SHOULD be, it appears there are some serious clouds hanging over the program. I honestly wish I wouldn't have heard it.

.

Almost glad to hear this. Better than this shit happening for no reason at all. Seeya BK, I'd personally like a breath of fresh air.

 

[Wingman Ray]

And who could blame them? I dont know if it involves Golson but to sit the most explosive back as well as your 4/5 star safety for inferior players because they are in your doghouse is just plain stupid. It is a sign of someone who has no fear of losing his job or who knows he has other opportunities at a whim's notice.

I would go as far as to say BK HAS lost the team. There is no way an OL with all 4 star players should be performing this badly. BK has headed a team that has superior ranked players compared to any other team on their schedule yet either barely squeaks by or loses outright. I realize the argument that rankings do not necessarily equal on the field production but there is no way anyone can argue it would be across the board.

This has not been an enjoyable team to watch at all this season past the Michigan game.

 

[Emcee77]

Let me start off by stating, I am not a typical insider. I do not actively look for info on ND football. I'm happy with what you guys provide here on IE. I don't read any other boards like NDNation, II, ESPN and even deleted my BR Irish stream this season.

I've by chance become friends with someone close to the program over the past couple of years and recently, met someone else with an even broader connection to the players and the recruiting staff. On Saturday, some things were shared with me that were really troubling. I thought about swallowing it but since no one knows me or the people I know personally, I'll share it for what it's worth.

Before the game started, I was told that Kelly is dangerously close to losing this team. It seems there IS a rift being caused by the offensive philosophy / player choices of this staff. When I first heard it, I didn't know how to take it but it quickly turned out to be almost prophetic. Most troubling were some of the texts from other people you know very well that were coming in.

As bright as the future SHOULD be, it appears there are some serious clouds hanging over the program. I honestly wish I wouldn't have heard it.

.

Wait, so what did you hear? I mean, do you not know names?

 

[Irishbounty28]

Similar things were being echoed after the 2011 season I believe. I doubt there are many programs that preach winning, go through a season like we just did, and not have some kind of rift in the program. There are a ton of Alpha males on a football team, including the coaches, and when things aren't going well some will question the leader. It probably also has something to do with the age of the team, and not being mature enough to handle punishment or being in the doghouse.

Hopefully nothing much comes of this, and it is nothing more than players being angry at the season that they have had. I do not take this a reason that Kelly would need to go. If there is mass dissension and multiple transfers I may feel differently.

 

[wizards8507]

 

[irishmarine]

its a team that seems to lack internal leadership and players who will band together in times when everyone dislikes or disagrees with the higher levels. people said CW was arrogant but this seems worse. I like BK but I have never seen a team quit and show no heart the way this team did

 

[autry_denson]

everything's amplified when you have a losing streak. just like all the positive vibes were amplified during the early season winning streak, which was driven by bad opponents and extremely fortunate luck in relation to early-season injuries.

this team was always vulnerable b/c of lack of depth and experience on the lines combined w the suspensions. that said, the foundation remains solid. if Kelly can keep guys like Day and Stanley and Golson (yes, Golson) from going pro then this team is going to be formidable next year.

anyone who wants Kelly to leave is ignoring the foundation that he's built.

 

[gkIrish]

Let me start off by stating, I am not a typical insider. I do not actively look for info on ND football. I'm happy with what you guys provide here on IE. I don't read any other boards like NDNation, II, ESPN and even deleted my BR Irish stream this season.

I've by chance become friends with someone close to the program over the past couple of years and recently, met someone else with an even broader connection to the players and the recruiting staff. On Saturday, some things were shared with me that were really troubling. I thought about swallowing it but since no one knows me or the people I know personally, I'll share it for what it's worth.

Before the game started, I was told that Kelly is dangerously close to losing this team. It seems there IS a rift being caused by the offensive philosophy / player choices of this staff. When I first heard it, I didn't know how to take it but it quickly turned out to be almost prophetic. Most troubling were some of the texts from other people you know very well that were coming in.

As bright as the future SHOULD be, it appears there are some serious clouds hanging over the program. I honestly wish I wouldn't have heard it.

.

I'm not sure what you're specifically alluding to. Transfers? Firing? Your post on its face doesn't reveal anything we didn't already assume/know. Could you elaborate a bit please.

 

[Whiskeyjack]

Before the game started, I was told that Kelly is dangerously close to losing this team. It seems there IS a rift being caused by the offensive philosophy / player choices of this staff.

Not sure what this means.

 

[Sherm Sticky]

its a team that seems to lack internal leadership and players who will band together in times when everyone dislikes or disagrees with the higher levels. people said CW was arrogant but this seems worse. I like BK but I have never seen a team quit and show no heart the way this team did

I really don't get this. T think once Malik was put in this team showed heart on Saturday. Throughout the season this team showed heart.

 

[kmoose]

And who could blame them?

*raises his hand* I'm not saying that being angry about the personnel/scheme decisions is not a realistic emotion, but you put that aside and play your @ss off for your brothers in the locker room. There is no I in team.

And who could blame them? I dont know if it involves Golson but to sit the most explosive back as well as your 4/5 star safety for inferior players because they are in your doghouse is just plain stupid. It is a sign of someone who has no fear of losing his job or who knows he has other opportunities at a whim's notice.

If explosive was the only, or even the most important, quality in a tailback then you might have a point. Folston is a perfectly capable back who is a better all around player than Bryant. So quit moaning about it. You're venturing into irrational koon territory.

I would go as far as to say BK HAS lost the team. There is no way an OL with all 4 star players should be performing this badly. BK has headed a team that has superior ranked players compared to any other team on their schedule yet either barely squeaks by or loses outright. I realize the argument that rankings do not necessarily equal on the field production but there is no way anyone can argue it would be across the board.

1. Maybe the star ratings are more screwed up than BK?

2. USC and Florida State (2 of the teams that you think we have outrecruited) have had higher ranked recruiting classes in every year except one (2013), since 2008.

 

[Emcee77]

I'm not sure what you're specifically alluding to. Transfers? Firing? Your post on its face doesn't reveal anything we didn't already assume/know. Could you elaborate a bit please.

haha right. Crusader, you built the post up by arguing with yourself as to whether you should reveal some privileged information, you concluded that you will share what you know -- and then you posted only vague allegations without including any specific facts. If that's all you know, it probably didn't require that build-up.

 

[wizards8507]

everything's amplified when you have a losing streak. just like all the positive vibes were amplified during the early season winning streak, which was driven by bad opponents and extremely fortunate luck in relation to early-season injuries.

Really? There was plenty of second-guessing and grumbling around here even when we were winning games. People are angrier now that we've started losing, but we've been complaining about perceived problems with the program even when times were good.

• Inconsistent QB play
• Turnovers
• Questionable scheme
• Questionable play calling
• Questionable personnel decisions
• The "frozen five"

 

[Luckylucci]

I haven't listened to the weekend podcast at II yet but Sampson spoke briefly to this on the II board. There is a deep in the program issue with the offensive philosophy. Now he didn't elaborate other than to say thats its apparent what Kelly is envisioning and what he's getting are two different things. He needs to step back and see if what he's doing can even work at ND and if it can is he going about it the right way. They have been incredibly hard on Kelly with some of their pieces recently and rightfully so.

 

[irishtrain]

everything's amplified when you have a losing streak. just like all the positive vibes were amplified during the early season winning streak, which was driven by bad opponents and extremely fortunate luck in relation to early-season injuries.

this team was always vulnerable b/c of lack of depth and experience on the lines combined w the suspensions. that said, the foundation remains solid. if Kelly can keep guys like Day and Stanley and Golson (yes, Golson) from going pro then this team is going to be formidable next year.

anyone who wants Kelly to leave is ignoring the foundation that he's built.

This is a top 3-5 coach in the country, maybe top 3. This team feel apart this year and unless Kelly is doing something behind the scenes very wrong this is on the players/injuries/suspensions. If you blame this man in other way other than he's the coach and the coach stops the buck you are wrong. My goodness if this is true Notre Dame does have a bunch of 'Nancys' on the roster. Run the ball better, play better defense, and you wont have Kelly and Golson having to play flag football to catch up or keep pace with the point a minute defense.

 

[BobbyMac]

I'm not sure what you're specifically alluding to. Transfers? Firing? Your post on its face doesn't reveal anything we didn't already assume/know. Could you elaborate a bit please.

I'm not alluding to anything. I did not hear anyone is leaving or being fired. Maybe this is old news for you guys(?)

.

 

[irishmarine]

I just meant that there seemed to be a void of leadership on the field. in 2012 we had seasoned vets who would snatch up someone mentally emotionally physically when needed. the team is young and I can see that but when a couple guys hang their heads its the leadership on the field both at practice and in games to snap their chinstraps back on and get them motivated again. Manti was EG biggest cheerleader when he needed it and Rees was able to help out also. I just didn't see it this year. maybe I'm looking through an empty bottle of Jameson though

 

[Cali_domer]

This is a top 3-5 coach in the country, maybe top 3. This team feel apart this year and unless Kelly is doing something behind the scenes very wrong this is on the players/injuries/suspensions. If you blame this man in other way other than he's the coach and the coach stops the buck you are wrong. My goodness if this is true Notre Dame does have a bunch of 'Nancys' on the roster. Run the ball better, play better defense, and you wont have Kelly and Golson having to play flag football to catch up or keep pace with the point a minute defense.

You can't be serious? With that attitude we should have kept Weis, because the players failed not Weis. Heck maybe we should have kept Willingham with the coach is perfect and can do know wrong belief.

 

[BobbyMac]

haha right. Crusader, you built the post up by arguing with yourself as to whether you should reveal some privileged information, you concluded that you will share what you know -- and then you posted only vague allegations without including any specific facts. If that's all you know, it probably didn't require that build-up.

You're right.

 

[Emcee77]

I haven't listened to the weekend podcast at II yet but Sampson spoke briefly to this on the II board. There is a deep in the program issue with the offensive philosophy.

Interesting. I wonder who the rift is between. Sounds like there might be staff changes this off-season?

Now he didn't elaborate other than to say thats its apparent what Kelly is envisioning and what he's getting are two different things. He needs to step back and see if what he's doing can even work at ND and if it can is he going about it the right way. They have been incredibly hard on Kelly with some of their pieces recently and rightfully so.

That seems true enough to me. Whatever Kelly wants to be able to do offensively, they should be able to do it by now, 12 games into the season, or they should be closer than they are, at least. The ineptitude on offense on Saturday was inexcusable.

 

[Whiskeyjack]

I haven't listened to the weekend podcast at II yet but Sampson spoke briefly to this on the II board. There is a deep in the program issue with the offensive philosophy. Now he didn't elaborate other than to say thats its apparent what Kelly is envisioning and what he's getting are two different things. He needs to step back and see if what he's doing can even work at ND and if it can is he going about it the right way. They have been incredibly hard on Kelly with some of their pieces recently and rightfully so.

Meaning... that lots of people within the program are resentful of Kelly's pass-first scheme, and the problems it's created this season?

 

[Emcee77]

You're right.

No offense meant, btw. Thanks for sharing all the same.

 

[wizards8507]

This is a top 3-5 coach in the country, maybe top 3.

 

[Cali_domer]

I hope he left off italics

 

[Whiskeyjack]

That seems true enough to me. Whatever Kelly wants to be able to do offensively, they should be able to do it by now, 12 games into the season, or they should be closer than they are, at least. The ineptitude on offense on Saturday was inexcusable.

That's where I'm at. The defense has some legitimate excuses for collapsing, but the offense has none. I'm hoping Kelly consults with Malzahn in the off-season and transitions to a run-first "power" spread which caters to the positions we can recruit well.

 

[Booslum31]

There may be a rift as players (who were spoiled with early successes this year) discuss who should be playing and what kind of offensive scheme we should run. I still think that it would be too embarrassing to go out there and get beat repeatedly by your man, approach tackling like a 10th grader, or ease up on plays that are away from you. Even if you thought your coach was nuts wouldn't you still go out and fight with everything you had for yourself, your teammates, and your school?

 

[Emcee77]

That's where I'm at. The defense has some legitimate excuses for collapsing, but the offense has none. I'm hoping Kelly consults with Malzahn in the off-season and transitions to a run-first "power" spread which caters to the positions we can recruit well.

Exactly. On defense we are in the first year of a new system, and we've been depleted by injuries. I'm familiar with all the arguments about how you have to plan for injuries and suspensions and it just shows how important depth is and it's no excuse, etc. etc., but we were down to our 6th MLB on Saturday, if you count Grace as the first. That's gonna be tough for any program to overcome, I'm sorry.

But on offense? No excuse.

 

[KPENN]

its a team that seems to lack internal leadership and players who will band together in times when everyone dislikes or disagrees with the higher levels. people said CW was arrogant but this seems worse. I like BK but I have never seen a team quit and show no heart the way this team did

How has this team not shown heart? Holy effing cow. They were down 34-3 on the road to a top 10 team and got to within one score. I don't know how you can look at the NW and Louisville game and blame it on "heart". This USC loss has people bridge jumping and its absurd. They got beat, the got taken behind the woodshed and whooped, but that doesn't mean they lack heart.