Redskins

[Cackalacky]

Ahh, the inanity of historical ethnic sterotyping.

Getting it wrong since forever.

 

[woolybug25]

So the name "Redskins" is racist...but the image of a redskined many isn't?


Go figure.


Again...liberals at work

Your myopic view of the world and your preference for blaming all of the world's problems on liberals shows how ignorant you are to the world around you. Also, you should check your facts. It's not just Mayor Gray calling for them to change the name, there are plenty of people outside of the democratic party like councilman Gross (Independent) and Rep Tom Cole (Republican-OK) calling for it.

Finally, politicians aren't even the people driving the argument, it's the actual native americans that want it changed. Per the Oneida Indian Nation:

"We are asking the NFL to stop using a racial slur as the name of Washington's football team," said Oneida Indian Nation Representative Ray Halbritter.

 

[irishpat183]

Your myopic view of the world and your preference for blaming all of the world's problems on liberals shows how ignorant you are to the world around you. Also, you should check your facts. It's not just Mayor Gray calling for them to change the name, there are plenty of people outside of the democratic party like councilman Gross (Independent) and Rep Tom Cole (Republican-OK) calling for it.

Finally, politicians aren't even the people driving the argument, it's the actual native americans that want it changed. Per the Oneida Indian Nation:

No, it's the media and policians that want the cameras in front of them to "fight the good fight"


If it were truly about Native Amreicans....they'd ALL be out to get the name changed. But their not.

So what say you about those that call this what it is....BULLSHIT. Just anouther bleeding heart, nobody givbes a crap, movement where some white people think they know what's best.

 

[irishpat183]

Wellpinit (Wash.) High School -- where the student body is 91.2 percent Native American -- that the "Redskins" name they wear proudly across their chests is insulting them. Because they have no idea.

"I've talked to our students, our parents and our community about this and nobody finds any offense at all in it," says Tim Ames, the superintendent of Wellpinit schools. "'Redskins' is not an insult to our kids. 'Wagon burners' is an insult. 'Prairie n-----s' is an insult. Those are very upsetting to our kids. But 'Redskins' is an honorable name we wear with pride. … In fact, I'd like to see somebody come up here and try to change it."

 

[irishpat183]

Kingston (Okla.) High School (57.7 percent Native American) Redskins that the name they've worn on their uniforms for 104 years has been a joke on them this whole time. Because they wear it with honor.

"We have two great tribes here," says Kingston assistant school superintendent Ron Whipkey, "the Chicasaw and the Choctaw. And not one member of those tribes has ever come to me or our school with a complaint. It is a prideful thing to them."

"It's a name that honors the people," says Kingston English teacher Brett Hayes, who is Choctaw. "The word 'Oklahoma' itself is Choctaw for 'red people.' The students here don't want it changed. To them, it seems like it's just people who have no connection with the Native American culture, people out there trying to draw attention to themselves.




BUT IT'S SOOOOOOO OFFENSIVE.

 

[irishpat183]

Annenberg Public Policy Center poll found that 90 percent of Native Americans were not offended by the Redskins name, and even though linguists say the "redskins" word was first used by Native Americans themselves, and even though nobody on the Blackfeet side of my wife's family has ever had someone insult them with the word "redskin," it doesn't matter. There's no stopping a wave of PC-ness when it gets rolling.



I can keep going.....Point is, this entire movement is false. Reilly killed it in this article.

 

[BeauBenken]

Their LB's aren't terrible. Orakpo, Kerrigan and fletcher are good. They have two rookies starting in their secondary and the slime can't stand up so yes they are playing terrible but but there is talent there. At least at lb lol

Stacked at LB. Can't name ya a defensive player outside of that group though!

 

[notredomer23]

Annenberg Public Policy Center poll found that 90 percent of Native Americans were not offended by the Redskins name, and even though linguists say the "redskins" word was first used by Native Americans themselves, and even though nobody on the Blackfeet side of my wife's family has ever had someone insult them with the word "redskin," it doesn't matter. There's no stopping a wave of PC-ness when it gets rolling.



I can keep going.....Point is, this entire movement is false. Reilly killed it in this article.

I hope you know I do agree with you. I just think there is too much pressure from the outside(even if it isn't as big as it is made out to be). Too PC of a society.

 

[irishpat183]

Stacked at LB. Can't name ya a defensive player outside of that group though!

Perry Reily is a stud as well

 

[irishpat183]

I hope you know I do agree with you. I just think there is too much pressure from the outside(even if it isn't as big as it is made out to be). Too PC of a society.

But we both know that Snyder doesn't care about pressure from the outside. LOL

 

[Cackalacky]

I hope you know I do agree with you. I just think there is too much pressure from the outside(even if it isn't as big as it is made out to be). Too PC of a society.

"There is a doubleness about these Indian names, remarking the existence of Native Americans while relegating them to the past, appearing to bestow honor on them while cloaking the destructive deeds of Euro-American society"
—Richard Grounds (2001)

 

[irishpat183]

"There is a doubleness about these Indian names, remarking the existence of Native Americans while relegating them to the past, appearing to bestow honor on them while cloaking the destructive deeds of Euro-American society"
—Richard Grounds (2001)

Again...go talk to those groups that I posted about.


Are you native american? (just wondering) I'ld like to get a sample off all these champions for the cause and see how many of you activists are actually Redskins....errr...Native Americans.

 

[BobD]

I hope they change the name just to **** pat off.

 

[Cackalacky]

Again...go talk to those groups that I posted about.


Are you native american? (just wondering) I'ld like to get a sample off all these champions for the cause and see how many of you activists are actually Redskins....errr...Native Americans.

I don't need to go talk to them. For as many as you can quote, it is very easy to find more that don't agree. That does not negate the negative historical connotations and imagery attached to the perjorative use. Native American tribes are very disparate and fractured and always have been. They will never have a consensus on anything so that is a tiresome and belabored point. Further "Redskins" is not like the Blackhawks or Fighting Souix or Seminole by any stretch. One is a derogatory word with a documented history to generalize and demean a group of people and the others are identifiable tribe names who have provided permission to use from the tribes.

For the record I do not consider myself a Native American. I do; however, have genetic descent in my past from the Eastern band of Cherokee who were able to evade capture and transportation to Oklahoma. I also disagree with the use of the name. I have studied their culture and history and the manner in which they were dealt with. Of course I also understand how that means absolutely nothing to most people today.

edit-To be honest I should probably use the proper term "Tsalagi" instead of Cherokee. Or maybe one of these first uses per its Americanized etymology.

"It first appears as Chalaque in the Portuguese narrative of De Soto's expedition, published originally in 1557, while we find Cheraqui in a French document of 1699, and Cherokee as an English form as early, at least, as 1708. The name has thus an authentic [sic] history of 360 years."

 

[BeauBenken]

Perry Reily is a stud as well

I'm not a Skins fan. Only know Fletcher and Orakpo from league notoriety. Know Kerrigan because I know Kerrigan.

 

[irishpat183]

I hope they change the name just to **** pat off.

LOL....

 

[woolybug25]

If it were truly about Native Amreicans....they'd ALL be out to get the name changed. But their not.

So what say you about those that call this what it is....BULLSHIT.

First of all, try taking a chill pill. I can feel your anger through my screen.

Second of all, you found two random stories where high schools were ok with the name. The reality is that most groups are adament about it being removed and they are the ones that are trying to get it removed. They are the ones approaching the politicians and they are the ones that are filing claims. Just because you found two random stories on google, doesn't take away the fact that they are having protests inand synopsiums regarding the issue. Obviously people care.

Finally... you are a raging moron if you think that native americans don't see the term "redskin" as a deragotory term. I had my native american friend compare it to someone using the term "wetback" for a latino person. I think that's fair.

 

[Cackalacky]

First of all, try taking a chill pill. I can feel your anger through my screen.

irishpats rage

 

[ACamp1900]

I actually think the "Washington Warriors" with logo and unis intact is a great idea here....

just me.

 

[irishpat183]

First of all, try taking a chill pill. I can feel your anger through my screen.

Second of all, you found two random stories where high schools were ok with the name. The reality is that most groups are adament about it being removed and they are the ones that are trying to get it removed. They are the ones approaching the politicians and they are the ones that are filing claims. Just because you found two random stories on google, doesn't take away the fact that they are having protests inand synopsiums regarding the issue. Obviously people care.

Finally... you are a raging moron if you think that native americans don't see the term "redskin" as a deragotory term. I had my native american friend compare it to someone using the term "wetback" for a latino person. I think that's fair.

Annenberg Public Policy Center poll found that 90 percent of Native Americans were not offended by the Redskins name, and even though linguists say the "redskins" word was first used by Native Americans themselves, and even though nobody on the Blackfeet side of my wife's family has ever had someone insult them with the word "redskin," it doesn't matter. There's no stopping a wave of PC-ness when it gets rolling.

 

[ACamp1900]

And on that note the makers of The Simpsons need to do something about Grounds Keeper Willie...........

 

[irishpat183]

First of all, try taking a chill pill. I can feel your anger through my screen.

Second of all, you found two random stories where high schools were ok with the name. The reality is that most groups are adament about it being removed and they are the ones that are trying to get it removed. They are the ones approaching the politicians and they are the ones that are filing claims. Just because you found two random stories on google, doesn't take away the fact that they are having protests inand synopsiums regarding the issue. Obviously people care.

Finally... you are a raging moron if you think that native americans don't see the term "redskin" as a deragotory term. I had my native american friend compare it to someone using the term "wetback" for a latino person. I think that's fair.

I'm glad you have a Native American friend...

The only people that care...again...are white liberals and about 10% of native americans

 

[Irish Houstonian]

I seems like changing the name is a good idea if Native Americans are actually offended by it, and the fans don't mind. But it seems like the only people who care are white liberals. What's offensive is being 1-3.

 

[GoIrish41]

I'm glad you have a Native American friend...

The only people that care...again...are white liberals and about 10% of native americans

Only 10 percent of an entire race of people care that a racial slur is team name in a professional sport? That is inconsequential.

 

[Cackalacky]

Only 10 percent of an entire race of people care that a racial slur is team name in a professional sport? That is inconsequential.

To be fair the extant native american population is only about 10% of its size prior to european arrivals.

 

[Cackalacky]

But it seems like the only people who care are white liberals. What's offensive is being 1-3.

Yes... they are offensive. That is one bad team in a horrible division.

 

[50milesSE ND]

GO Irishpat. Don't the amazing people also known as POLITICIANS have more critical things to take care of right now? SERIOUSLY!!!!

 

[IrishLax]

First of all, try taking a chill pill. I can feel your anger through my screen.

Second of all, you found two random stories where high schools were ok with the name. The reality is that most groups are adament about it being removed and they are the ones that are trying to get it removed. They are the ones approaching the politicians and they are the ones that are filing claims. Just because you found two random stories on google, doesn't take away the fact that they are having protests inand synopsiums regarding the issue. Obviously people care.

Finally... you are a raging moron if you think that native americans don't see the term "redskin" as a deragotory term. I had my native american friend compare it to someone using the term "wetback" for a latino person. I think that's fair.

It really depends on the Native American you're talking to. I know quite a few from lacrosse, the vast majority didn't have a problem with it. Of those that did, about half were "meh" about it and the other half were REALLY offended by it. Every person is different.

Interestingly enough, most of them had more problem with the Cleveland Indians mascot than the Washington franchise being named the "Redskins"... before Europeans ever arrived in the Americas, many Native Americans referred to themselves as "red people" or equivalent and many tribes have words in their native language that equate on some level to "redskin" so it's not by default a slur.

There is polling data to support that roughly ~10% of Native Americans find the name offensive. Coupled with recent polling data of the general populous, it shows that white people are far more offended on the whole about an NFL franchise being named the Redskins than Native Americans are. Go figure.

So Pat isn't talking out of his @ss on this occasion. At the same time, that polling data he is referring to was flawed. And you can find really flawed polling data to support that most Native Americans are offended, too. It's more of a complex issue than people on the extremes want to admit.

 

[woolybug25]

I'm glad you have a Native American friend...

The only people that care...again...are white liberals and about 10% of native americans

I am also part native american myself, you prick. How about that? Does that make my opinion matter now?

WAY more than 10% of Native Americans care about this issue and I showed you a republican from Oklahoma that feels the same way too. So obviously it's not ALL liberals.

Keep telling yourself that white liberals are the ones driving this, but it's completely untrue. But the reality is that other people's viewpoints, other cultures and general respect for others are all traits that you simply do not possess.

For the rest of you, i'm fine with debating the issue in a respectful manner and am not just disregarding other points of view on the subject. My comments above are strictly pertaining to Pat. It's one thing to debate an issue with mutual respect, it's another to constantly bash other people and insuinate that other people are ignorant for having a difference of opinion. That is who Pat is, and I am frankly tired of listening to him.

 

[IrishGlory]

I'm 50% irish and I don't fight. Should I be at least half offended?