QB situation

[SouthernIndianaNDFan]

If Phil was ready don’t you think he would be playing? Kelly has already stated as much.

No, I honestly don't think BK would make the move. WHY isn't he ready is the better question? Who is gonna be throwing to JJ, Tyree, Colzie, and Styles, cuz if it's a guy like Book, with this offense, guys may start decommitting. Would you wanna play in that dumpster fire?

 

[SouthernIndianaNDFan]

Yeah just like dexter wasn’t ready huh... lol. If book got hurt it would be hilarious to see Kelly backtrack and say ohh Phil is ready. Kelly probably didn’t think that through when he threw Phil under the bus last week

Exactly. People act like this hasn't been BK's M.O. during his entire tenure at ND.

 

[Circa]

Book has almost no weapons to work with --- zero good running backs (except maybe one who is redshirting), one good receiver, one sort-of good tight end. Nothing else with any consistency nor ability to separate either quickly or with length downfield.

Add to that, he lost his best two players --- they happen to play right tackle and right guard.

Book has a basket of lemons out of which he is supposed to make lemonade. Well, he just did, and did it almost entirely on his own back.

We should be giving him a medal not boos.

Nobody has said It better! Beautiful.

 

[EddytoNow]

In all seriousness here..

I hate Chip Long and his playcalling at times is pathetic..

but answer me this. Do you really not think Kelly would play Phil if he was even remotely close to being decent? Has he ever been afraid to pull/ play more than 1 quarterback? No. If Phil even shows a little bit of promise during the week, I just don't see how Kelly wouldn't give him some type of shot at some point. Dude must just not be good..

Move on from Ian? Nah fam, move on from Phil.

To the contrary, Kelly has been reluctant to change quarterbacks until the team (or the offense more specifically) is in total collapse. That usual involves a number of turnovers on the part of the quarterback. Despite yesterday's interceptions, Book has not been a turnover machine. His problem has been a reluctance or hesitancy to throw the ball. He has been bailed out this season by a generally strong defense (except for the UM game). If Book had the same defense that Jimmy Clausen had, we would be 2-6 right now. The offense is playing as though they are afraid of making a mistake - no passion and no aggression.

Is the blame Kelly's, Long's, or Book's? The offense is predictable and ineffective. Something needs to change.

 

[IrishLax]

I do think people need to cut Book some slack. I really wonder what the offense would like if they just let Book call the plays and run what he wants to do. I’m not saying that’ll fix all of his limitations overnight, but I think it’s telling that the team supports Book and does not support the OC. Long needs to go NOW before he costs ND another game.

 

[SouthernIndianaNDFan]

I do think people need to cut Book some slack. I really wonder what the offense would like if they just let Book call the plays and run what he wants to do. I’m not saying that’ll fix all of his limitations overnight, but I think it’s telling that the team supports Book and does not support the OC. Long needs to go NOW before he costs ND another game.

Is that gonna stop him from fleeing the pocket, rolling right, and throwing it out of bounds every other play? If so. I'm in.

 

[BobbyMac]

The one thing that I've gotten out of all this is:

Any talk about "We're hear to win National Championships" is BS. They are hear to win games now and get the best paying bowl game they can. Right now, they are still in line for either a Cotton or Orange Bowl spot. So being that BK/staff feels Book is ahead of PJ, then they are gonna play Book to get a money bowl. If they lose one more, and get a lower tier chump bowl, will they?

Because... If you are here to win Championships, you play PJ (and Clark) now. They are your only hopes in maybe '21? Most likely '22. Play them and build for a run when the difference makers of '20 - '21 can contribute.

So no more Championship talk BK unless you mean it.

 

[SouthernIndianaNDFan]

To the contrary, Kelly has been reluctant to change quarterbacks until the team (or the offense more specifically) is in total collapse. That usual involves a number of turnovers on the part of the quarterback. Despite yesterday's interceptions, Book has not been a turnover machine. His problem has been a reluctance or hesitancy to throw the ball. He has been bailed out this season by a generally strong defense (except for the UM game). If Book had the same defense that Jimmy Clausen had, we would be 2-6 right now. The offense is playing as though they are afraid of making a mistake - no passion and no aggression.

Is the blame Kelly's, Long's, or Book's? The offense is predictable and ineffective. Something needs to change.

That's the million dollar question...

 

[BobbyMac]

Oh and Long?

BK needs to dial back his duties and start taking over some of the play calling. Hire Warren Ruggiero from Wake to replace him ASAP but keep Rees if the pipeline depends on it.

 

[BobbyMac]

That's the million dollar question...

Here's the obvious 2 cent answer.

D. All of the above

 

[SouthernIndianaNDFan]

Here's the obvious 2 cent answer.

D. All of the above

I hope not man, because that means things are pretty bad. If it's just Book being the 3* guy that he is, then that's easily repairable, but if it's Long it gets slightly more complicated, and if it's BK then we're essentially screwed.

 

[BobbyMac]

I hope not man, because that means things are pretty bad. If it's just Book being the 3* guy that he is, then that's easily repairable, but if it's Long it gets slightly more complicated, and if it's BK then we're essentially screwed.

I'm not saying they all suck. I mean, I love asparagus, chocolate cake and Tabasco but they don't work in the same bowl.

 

[SouthernIndianaNDFan]

I'm not saying they all suck. I mean, I love asparagus, chocolate cake and Tabasco but they don't work in the same bowl.

Who doesn't like Chocolate Tabasco Asparagus cake?

Yeah, I just hope they can win out, win the bowl game, and really do some soul searching this offseason. They have a ton of talent coming in these next 2 classes, gotta have the personnel in place to maximize that.

 

[IrishLax]

Is that gonna stop him from fleeing the pocket, rolling right, and throwing it out of bounds every other play? If so. I'm in.

Maybe? I doubt a change of coach is going to fix all of the problems, but if it even fixes 20% of them I'd say it's worth doing.

Here's what I'll say about coaching in general: your job is to put your team in the best position to win, and there are two big picture ways to do that. The first is to know what you want to do and then get the players to do that. An example would be Jim Boehiem recruiting players to fit his 2-3 zone at Syracuse. The other is to tailor what you want to do the players you have to work with. An example would be Nick Saban just going out and signing the best talent he can each year on offense, and then basically running a different scheme each year to fit whatever talent he's got.

Long is in year 3. He has two QBs he recruited. He signed zero skill position players of note last year. And he inherited some pretty darn good players that he has been using for his three years at the helm.

He ran Wimbush out of town ostensibly because he couldn't run the offense Long wanted to run. And now you have Book, who also can't run the offense Long wants to run for entirely different reasons. Maybe the problem is the offense you're trying to run? For example, if Ian Book isn't capable of sitting in the pocket and always wants to roll to his right... maybe run some plays that roll him out? Have we seen a single bootleg or designed rollout this entire year? If you know your player has limitations, why isn't there a two-way discussion about his 10 favorite plays or more input from the player if you're not willing to make a change?

I don't know shit about football, but I do coach and I've known lots of coaches like Long. They do the same thing over and over again and when it isn't working they point the finger somewhere else. They tend to do "less with more" because they can't get over their egos. And if ego isn't the case, then it's a matter of intelligence that he can't see that what he's doing doesn't work and he needs to change it. Either way, he should already be out on his ass, and if ND loses any of the remaining four games I put it on Kelly for not canning him or taking away his duties.

 

[koonja]

I'd like to see Long fired today with Tommy Rees getting a shot at interim OC.

I do think there's a chance Rees is our next OC.

 

[SouthernIndianaNDFan]

Maybe? I doubt a change of coach is going to fix all of the problems, but if it even fixes 20% of them I'd say it's worth doing.

Here's what I'll say about coaching in general: your job is to put your team in the best position to win, and there are two big picture ways to do that. The first is to know what you want to do and then get the players to do that. An example would be Jim Boehiem recruiting players to fit his 2-3 zone at Syracuse. The other is to tailor what you want to do the players you have to work with. An example would be Nick Saban just going out and signing the best talent he can each year on offense, and then basically running a different scheme each year to fit whatever talent he's got.

Long is in year 3. He has two QBs he recruited. He signed zero skill position players of note last year. And he inherited some pretty darn good players that he has been using for his three years at the helm.

He ran Wimbush out of town ostensibly because he couldn't run the offense Long wanted to run. And now you have Book, who also can't run the offense Long wants to run for entirely different reasons. Maybe the problem is the offense you're trying to run? For example, if Ian Book isn't capable of sitting in the pocket and always wants to roll to his right... maybe run some plays that roll him out? Have we seen a single bootleg or designed rollout this entire year? If you know your player has limitations, why isn't there a two-way discussion about his 10 favorite plays or more input from the player if you're not willing to make a change?

I don't know shit about football, but I do coach and I've known lots of coaches like Long. They do the same thing over and over again and when it isn't working they point the finger somewhere else. They tend to do "less with more" because they can't get over their egos. And if ego isn't the case, then it's a matter of intelligence that he can't see that what he's doing doesn't work and he needs to change it. Either way, he should already be out on his ass, and if ND loses any of the remaining four games I put it on Kelly for not canning him or taking away his duties.

If you can Chip, how many of the 20/21 skill guys bolt? I know either Colzie or Styles (can't remember which) personally committed because of his relationship with Long.

 

[SouthernIndianaNDFan]

You can't convince me that Phil Jurkovec couldn't come in and do a better job than Ian Book right now. I think Tommy Rees could come down out of the booth and do a better job.

 

[Irishman77]

I'd like to see Long fired today with Tommy Rees getting a shot at interim OC.

I do think there's a chance Rees is our next OC.

That would be one of the few things that would cause me to stop watching all together . Would tune back in when the dumpster has completely melted and logic is restored.

 

[koonja]

That would be one of the few things that would cause me to stop watching all together . Would tune back in when the dumpster has completely melted and logic is restored.

Why?

 

[stlnd01]

If you can Chip, how many of the 20/21 skill guys bolt? I know either Colzie or Styles (can't remember which) personally committed because of his relationship with Long.

Colzie and Styles are still more than a year from Signing Day, 20 months from showing up on campus and probably three years from being meaningful contributors to our football team. The odds Long is their OC are pretty low regardless of why he leaves. I’d certainly hope they know that.

 

[irishandy]

Tommy Rees as our OC...your an idiot.

Book has regressed since last year, but this is not the same team as last year.

Book is winning us games, I am fine going 10-2, but he has reached his ceiling at ND.

 

[zelezo vlk]

Maybe? I doubt a change of coach is going to fix all of the problems, but if it even fixes 20% of them I'd say it's worth doing.

Here's what I'll say about coaching in general: your job is to put your team in the best position to win, and there are two big picture ways to do that. The first is to know what you want to do and then get the players to do that. An example would be Jim Boehiem recruiting players to fit his 2-3 zone at Syracuse. The other is to tailor what you want to do the players you have to work with. An example would be Nick Saban just going out and signing the best talent he can each year on offense, and then basically running a different scheme each year to fit whatever talent he's got.

Long is in year 3. He has two QBs he recruited. He signed zero skill position players of note last year. And he inherited some pretty darn good players that he has been using for his three years at the helm.

He ran Wimbush out of town ostensibly because he couldn't run the offense Long wanted to run. And now you have Book, who also can't run the offense Long wants to run for entirely different reasons. Maybe the problem is the offense you're trying to run? For example, if Ian Book isn't capable of sitting in the pocket and always wants to roll to his right... maybe run some plays that roll him out? Have we seen a single bootleg or designed rollout this entire year? If you know your player has limitations, why isn't there a two-way discussion about his 10 favorite plays or more input from the player if you're not willing to make a change?

I don't know shit about football, but I do coach and I've known lots of coaches like Long. They do the same thing over and over again and when it isn't working they point the finger somewhere else. They tend to do "less with more" because they can't get over their egos. And if ego isn't the case, then it's a matter of intelligence that he can't see that what he's doing doesn't work and he needs to change it. Either way, he should already be out on his ass, and if ND loses any of the remaining four games I put it on Kelly for not canning him or taking away his duties.

So he's the offensive version of BVG?

 

[koonja]

Tommy Rees as our OC...your an idiot.

Book has regressed since last year, but this is not the same team as last year.

Book is winning us games, I am fine going 10-2, but he has reached his ceiling at ND.

Solid post.

 

[FDNYIrish1]

Book has clear limitations. That’s obvious. But he is certainly not being put into ideal situations. Good coaches adapt to the personnel they have. The ability to game plan to your strengths is lost. I’m confused by our passing attack. I’m not in the camp that this roster is devoid of talent. We’ve heard how fast Lenzy is but he is used for bubble screens. Let him and Keys spread the field. Take some damn shots if they’re stacking the box. VT had the single high safety rolled away from man coverage on the boundary side. Push the damn vertical routes. It’s frustrating to see true freshmen making plays every Saturday but we are led to believe kids who are students at Notre Dame cannot grasp this horrible playbook.

 

[SouthernIndianaNDFan]

Colzie and Styles are still more than a year from Signing Day, 20 months from showing up on campus and probably three years from being meaningful contributors to our football team. The odds Long is their OC are pretty low regardless of why he leaves. I’d certainly hope they know that.

I actually had it wrong anyways, it was Cane Berrong that said that, said he felt a connection and liked that Long used to be a TE and coached TEs as well as OC. But, like you said, these guys are 2 years out. I'd think the sooner they make a change, the better from a recruiting standpoint, get some stability and hopefully some success, cuz this is a shitshow atm.

 

[SouthernIndianaNDFan]

Book has clear limitations. That’s obvious. But he is certainly not being put into ideal situations. Good coaches adapt to the personnel they have. The ability to game plan to your strengths is lost. I’m confused by our passing attack. I’m not in the camp that this roster is devoid of talent. We’ve heard how fast Lenzy is but he is used for bubble screens. Let him and Keys spread the field. Take some damn shots if they’re stacking the box. VT had the single high safety rolled away from man coverage on the boundary side. Push the damn vertical routes. It’s frustrating to see true freshmen making plays every Saturday but we are led to believe kids who are students at Notre Dame cannot grasp this horrible playbook.

Ian Book can't push the vertical routes, evidenced by his 348 INT's yesterday. He's just not good at it, if they're gonna start pushing the ball downfield then it would only make sense to bring in Phil.

 

[zelezo vlk]

Solid post.

Obviously incredibly harsh, but I can't see Rees being announced as the OC going over very well at all.

 

[FDNYIrish1]

Ian Book can't push the vertical routes, evidenced by his 348 INT's yesterday. He's just not good at it, if they're gonna start pushing the ball downfield then it would only make sense to bring in Phil.

He’s throwing to the same guy, in double coverage. Who by the way was open. There is no other choice. L Get your speed on the field and win the one on one matchup. Book can make those throws. Our routes are too slow to develop. There was plenty of opportunity to take some shots on Fosters defense with the right personnel. Even if you miss it softens up the underneath routes that they were sitting on.

 

[irishandy]

Obviously incredibly harsh, but I can't see Rees being announced as the OC going over very well at all.

Rees as OC would be a bad move for Notre Dame.

 

[ulukinatme]

Rees as OC would be a bad move for Notre Dame.

I'm not saying he'd crush it, but there's really no way of knowing this till he's called plays for a team.