Protest Erupts In Charlotte

Polish Leppy 22

Well-known member
Messages
6,594
Reaction score
2,009
Side note, these "protesters" who riot, loot, and destroy property in their own community is by far the stupidest thing I've seen in my adult lifetime. Right below that is football players who drop the football before crossing the goal line.
 

wizards8507

Well-known member
Messages
20,660
Reaction score
2,661
And every time a cop shoots someone, it's as if they are all lumped in together as one big issue...which is more rhetoric. These cases are all independent of each other and involve different people and different circumstances. It's frustrating to watch a community burn before there is even an investigation.
Exactly. Every time this happens, there are a number of possibilities.

1. Appropriate use of police force.
2. A bad shooting due to police incompetence.
3. A bad shooting due to racism.

The Left wants us to believe that every single incident is an example of #3. The vast majority of them are probably somewhere between #1 and #2.
 

IrishBroker

New member
Messages
1,278
Reaction score
50
Yes.

That is why I did. I felt it was susinct and to the point. And clearly my opinion.

Everyone between my post and BGIF's didn't seem to have the same quality of thought BGIF put into the original post. Or of those that came later including but not limited to IrishCop and Buster.

Buster is right on. Where ever in the world you concentrate violence, ignorance, and poverty, you get the same reaction. (Just like the Charlotte protestors.) And of course the opposite side of the equation is that it is just like when you gather a bunch of the privileged that observe it. (Just like the kneejerk posters here who continue to post their clichéd, worn out prejudices, that are critical of the situation and all people of a race (African-American), without the slightest clue of what is going on. Logic is out the door!

Here is the test of the bigotry that I am opposed to in this thread : In my neighborhood of around 500 homes, I can think of 25 or 30, off of the top of my head, that are occupied by one or more person that is 'black,' as some insist on saying. If I would take all of those people, and put them in a room and show them any of these shootings, no one would react by rioting!

Why? Because as Buster stated, or strongly implied, they were raised with some semblance of the overwhelming advantages of the white boys club, that is fit to sit in judgment of these events. When didn't your Christian God warn you about sitting in judgement, once or twice? Mine did.

What I would feel comfortable about doing is drilling down and discussing why something like this happens. Now that would be a room for people to show their intelligence! Of course I don't have much hope for that.

People just want to stay with their tried and true prejudices, because they don't feel comfortable with anything else, anything beyond.

I subscribe to the Chaos Theory, and its iterations in everyday life. I see human behavior as expanding symmetry, (eliminating time as a variable), or at least evolving symmetry, that because of our limited perspective looks to be small magnifications of the Mandelbrot set. (I think I had an interesting conversation with a UND Professor about this not too many years ago.)

So that being said if you agree with me, agreeing with Buster, that these incidents show the illogic of repressed people. (Remember the people of Western Europe rioted in the street not too many centuries ago when the switch was made from the Julian to the Gregorian calendar, because all the commoners saw is that the calendar was moving forward ten days in the month of October of 1582, so they were pissed off they were being cheated out of 10 days!)

I see the same illogic taking over the Presidential election in 2016. We are going to put a totally unqualified liar in the White House because we are pissed at the system! I honestly see no more illogic in those in poverty burning their neighborhoods down around them, than the American electorate playing Russian-roulette with Donald Trump.

I would certainly entertain and comments, criticisms, or discourse on the matter.

Pointing out the reactions of these rioters isn't the same as claiming the entire black community is responsible for this. Also, what is your issue with the word "black"? What would you prefer?

Nobody claimed that. That's you putting words in others mouths, sir.


Even people from no privilege, don't act like this. So that's another cliché' that's tired and worn out. The concept of privilege is extremely subjective and doesn't hold any water as people walk in different shoes. Sure, someone without money has problems they face that are different than mine, but that doesn't make them more noble and it doesn't make my problems any less important. I'm sure someone, who has money and a very sick child, would call others with less means "privileged" because their children have health, no?


And trying to equate burning down buildings, violence, and racist behavior to our open election system, is absurd and I won't even get into that.


The point is, as one poster pointed out, this is all just idiotic behavior justified in the name of "social justice". Trying to get poetic about it doesn't polish it. And claiming we just "don't understand" doesn't either. Wrong is wrong. I don't care what your cause.
 

Wingman Ray

Banned
Messages
1,578
Reaction score
110
There will never been cause or justification for anyone, of any race, to riot and destroy other people's property. People that do that are animals and animals need to be locked up. That isnt a white, black, or whatever thing. Anyone who would be okay with that deserves to have someone burn their house down and take their things because of something that someone did that had nothing to do with them. It is amazing how perceptions are when the scenario has zero impact on them.

Sure there are better areas, better schools and better opportunities in some places than in others. Always will be always have been until the second coming of Jesus. There is nothing you can do about it and it is amazing how those that stand up and rave about it sure arent willing to empty their bank accounts to make it better by any degree. You see these liberal movie stars giving donations that are 1% of their worth while keeping the other 99%. Wow big sacrifice there buddy. Big loss.

Can people make a better future for themselves with hard work? Absolutely. Im an example of that. Can people waddle in the same crap daily because they are too lazy to make a difference for themselves and their loved ones? Absolutely.
 

BleedBlueGold

Well-known member
Messages
6,270
Reaction score
2,493
Exactly. Every time this happens, there are a number of possibilities.

1. Appropriate use of police force.
2. A bad shooting due to police incompetence.
3. A bad shooting due to racism.

The Left wants us to believe that every single incident is an example of #3. The vast majority of them are probably somewhere between #1 and #2.

The "Regressive Left."

Dave Rubin wuz here '16
 

GoIrish41

Paterfamilius
Messages
9,929
Reaction score
2,120
There will never been cause or justification for anyone, of any race, to riot and destroy other people's property. People that do that are animals and animals need to be locked up. That isnt a white, black, or whatever thing. Anyone who would be okay with that deserves to have someone burn their house down and take their things because of something that someone did that had nothing to do with them. It is amazing how perceptions are when the scenario has zero impact on them.

Sure there are better areas, better schools and better opportunities in some places than in others. Always will be always have been until the second coming of Jesus. There is nothing you can do about it and it is amazing how those that stand up and rave about it sure arent willing to empty their bank accounts to make it better by any degree. You see these liberal movie stars giving donations that are 1% of their worth while keeping the other 99%. Wow big sacrifice there buddy. Big loss.

Can people make a better future for themselves with hard work? Absolutely. Im an example of that. Can people waddle in the same crap daily because they are too lazy to make a difference for themselves and their loved ones? Absolutely.

Really? Nothing we can do about it? How about increasing opportunities in those places, improve the schools, and provide the same support structures that are in the better neighborhoods? We can do those things, can't we?

Blaming poor people for being poor ... suggesting they are lazy or just don't want it bad enough to break the cycle ... that's Trumpspeak, man. It ignores the realities that poor people face every day.
 

kmoose

Banned
Messages
10,298
Reaction score
1,181
...How about increasing opportunities in those places, improve the schools, and provide the same support structures that are in the better neighborhoods? We can do those things, can't we? ...

How do you do those things?
 

wizards8507

Well-known member
Messages
20,660
Reaction score
2,661
Really? Nothing we can do about it? How about increasing opportunities in those places, improve the schools, and provide the same support structures that are in the better neighborhoods? We can do those things, can't we?

Blaming poor people for being poor ... suggesting they are lazy or just don't want it bad enough to break the cycle ... that's Trumpspeak, man. It ignores the realities that poor people face every day.
Whether you want to talk about The Great Society or The New Deal, what in American history has given you confidence that government largesse will have any positive impact in these communities?
 

Wingman Ray

Banned
Messages
1,578
Reaction score
110
Really? Nothing we can do about it? How about increasing opportunities in those places, improve the schools, and provide the same support structures that are in the better neighborhoods? We can do those things, can't we?

Blaming poor people for being poor ... suggesting they are lazy or just don't want it bad enough to break the cycle ... that's Trumpspeak, man. It ignores the realities that poor people face every day.

Have you ever seen a brand new project built in a low income neighborhood? It is really nice. I mean, pretty high rent nice in non low income areas. Within 3-5 years it looks like crap and is a place you wouldnt let your dog go by itself.

THAT is the govt trying to make peoples lifes better with what return? History has always shown that people do not appreciate what is just handed to them.

Another question...who is going to pay for this? Oh yea, the working people will pay for the non working people. And then more money from our military to pay for it. Let me ask you, when America falls due to a weak military and everyone is speaking Russian or Chinese, do you think the Russians or Chinese will give one rats behind about a population of people that have it bad because they wont work hard to make it better for themselves?
 

BobbyMac

Staff & Stuff
Staff member
Messages
33,950
Reaction score
9,294
Yes.

I see the same illogic taking over the Presidential election in 2016. We are going to put a totally unqualified liar in the White House because we are pissed at the system! I honestly see no more illogic in those in poverty burning their neighborhoods down around them, than the American electorate playing Russian-roulette with Donald Trump.

Why is Clinton unqualified? Because she's a liar? Shouldn't she be more "qualified" than Trump?
 

kmoose

Banned
Messages
10,298
Reaction score
1,181
Have you ever seen a brand new project built in a low income neighborhood? It is really nice. I mean, pretty high rent nice in non low income areas. Within 3-5 years it looks like crap and is a place you wouldnt let your dog go by itself.

THAT is the govt trying to make peoples lifes better with what return? History has always shown that people do not appreciate what is just handed to them.

Another question...who is going to pay for this? Oh yea, the working people will pay for the non working people. And then more money from our military to pay for it. Let me ask you, when America falls due to a weak military and everyone is speaking Russian or Chinese, do you think the Russians or Chinese will give one rats behind about a population of people that have it bad because they wont work hard to make it better for themselves?

Give him a chance to explain how it would happen before just dismissing it as impossible?
 

TheOneWhoKnocks

New member
Messages
691
Reaction score
46
Its at the point now it doesn't matter if justified or not, people in the fucking streets second they hear about it on some shitty news network.

When your shit head in chief goes on tv saying yo whities be killing the blackies with his half truth facts, shit isn't going to change.
 

Wild Bill

Well-known member
Messages
5,519
Reaction score
3,263
Really? Nothing we can do about it? How about increasing opportunities in those places, improve the schools, and provide the same support structures that are in the better neighborhoods? We can do those things, can't we?

Blaming poor people for being poor ... suggesting they are lazy or just don't want it bad enough to break the cycle ... that's Trumpspeak, man. It ignores the realities that poor people face every day.

No. Investors aren't investing in the absence of law and order.
 

wizards8507

Well-known member
Messages
20,660
Reaction score
2,661
No. Investors aren't investing in the absence of law and order.
Exactly. Civilized behavior leads to investment and opportunity, not the other way around. You can't magically "increase opportunities" and think people's behavior will change.
 

BobbyMac

Staff & Stuff
Staff member
Messages
33,950
Reaction score
9,294
The problem with America today is the Democratic Party. They were the protector of the lower and lower-middle classes and they sold them out. The Progressives have destroyed the party. They run every large urban area, their school systems, their social services networks, have for decades and things never get better and they say it's because they don't have money. Democrats have signed NAFTA and TPP agreements giving a big FU to the American worker, there's where your money went idiots. But it's always some faceless, rich white guy who obviously is a Republican in a golf course community in the suburbs who is to blame.

But yet when someone from the city's first album drops, or they get drafted in the first round or in Ben Carson's case goes to school for 20+ years, they move in the same gated community as their record label President or Team owner and start using the same accounting firm to pay as little tax as they can.

FYI... I've never been a registered Republican, I have been a registered Democrat and mostly Independent. I grew up in a USW household with UAW grandparents. I was born in Gary, IN. I've seen it like few others. Progressives are a disease. They are the new Plantation Owners. They love them some dependents to play God for. They deal in misery and hopelessness and business is booming... or is it?

They also deal in disinformation. They want everyone to think things are worse than they've ever been. Well there are more guns in the hands of Americans RIGHT NOW and yet...

homicide_51yr.JPG


I'm just waiting for a state like Illinois to jettison the city of Chicago/Cook Co. Make it a little self supportive city-district like DC. That will teach some of the sociologists running the town some fiscal responsibility real quick.
 

MNIrishman

Well-known member
Messages
2,532
Reaction score
481
Have you ever seen a brand new project built in a low income neighborhood? It is really nice. I mean, pretty high rent nice in non low income areas. Within 3-5 years it looks like crap and is a place you wouldnt let your dog go by itself.

THAT is the govt trying to make peoples lifes better with what return? History has always shown that people do not appreciate what is just handed to them.

Another question...who is going to pay for this? Oh yea, the working people will pay for the non working people. And then more money from our military to pay for it. Let me ask you, when America falls due to a weak military and everyone is speaking Russian or Chinese, do you think the Russians or Chinese will give one rats behind about a population of people that have it bad because they wont work hard to make it better for themselves?

Neither of those countries have any capacity whatsoever to project force against the US Mainland. They don't even have the ships to come close to launching an invasion, even if we had no military at all. We have a bigger military budget than the next ten countries put together and more and better carriers than all the other nations on earth combined. So my question then is, how much military budget at the expense of infrastructure and other things that make a real difference on the homefront is justifiable? I don't know about you, but I'd rather invest in bridges than bombers.

And please don't argue from a position of reductio ad absurdum. I'm not advocating for zero military, just that limitless military expenditure is basically a crime against humanity. If you rank countries by military expense as a function of GDP, North Korea and Pakistan are at the top. There's just a limit where you're not helping people anymore, but stealing away functional schools and highways and taking talented young men and women out of the economy.
 
Last edited:

GoIrish41

Paterfamilius
Messages
9,929
Reaction score
2,120
Exactly. Civilized behavior leads to investment and opportunity, not the other way around. You can't magically "increase opportunities" and think people's behavior will change.

Maybe it is public investment that should drive opportunity.
 

wizards8507

Well-known member
Messages
20,660
Reaction score
2,661
Maybe it is public investment that should drive opportunity.
That's asinine. Human beings have been surviving and thriving for 100,000 years without "public investment." We've been feeding ourselves, raising our children, and loving our wives since long before there was any such thing as taxation, organized government, or money. The modern poor only "need" public assistance because they've been conditioned to need it. Homo sapiens is more than capable of providing Maslow 1 and 2 without any assistance from others.
 

SaltyND24

Well-known member
Messages
2,165
Reaction score
484
I was looking for the threads to pop up with the Tulsa shooting happened but I guess it didn't fit the narrative for some of the people on this board but I'll just add my $0.02. The real movement is against police brutality of any kind, f*ck the race of any person involved. Whether it be that officers are incompetent and/or racist, they shouldn't be on the streets, period. There shouldn't be a process in these situations that is much different to what you and I would face in the same situation. Why are such laws on the books allowing more than 30 days before an officer can be questioned in an on-duty shooting? If any of us were involved in a shooting today, 95% (or a high percentage) of us are being arrested and charged. Now, whether those charges stick or not is another thing.

With that being said, it's counterproductive to loot and destroy your own community. I would never involve myself in any of that nonsense. However, let's not focus all of the energy on the reaction and put more into the action that caused it. From the article, it is extremely sketchy.
 

Irish Insanity

Well-known member
Messages
9,885
Reaction score
584
Its at the point now it doesn't matter if justified or not, people in the fucking streets second they hear about it on some shitty news network.

When your shit head in chief goes on tv saying yo whities be killing the blackies with his half truth facts, shit isn't going to change.
This
 

kmoose

Banned
Messages
10,298
Reaction score
1,181
When your shit head in chief goes on tv saying yo whities be killing the blackies with his half truth facts, shit isn't going to change.

Like him or not, he IS the President of the United States. Referring to him as the "shit head in chief" is pretty disrespectful.
 

wizards8507

Well-known member
Messages
20,660
Reaction score
2,661
I was looking for the threads to pop up with the Tulsa shooting happened but I guess it didn't fit the narrative for some of the people on this board but I'll just add my $0.02. The real movement is against police brutality of any kind, f*ck the race of any person involved. Whether it be that officers are incompetent and/or racist, they shouldn't be on the streets, period. There shouldn't be a process in these situations that is much different to what you and I would face in the same situation. Why are such laws on the books allowing more than 30 days before an officer can be questioned in an on-duty shooting? If any of us were involved in a shooting today, 95% (or a high percentage) of us are being arrested and charged. Now, whether those charges stick or not is another thing.

With that being said, it's counterproductive to loot and destroy your own community. I would never involve myself in any of that nonsense. However, let's not focus all of the energy on the reaction and put more into the action that caused it. From the article, it is extremely sketchy.
+1 this. Any reasonable person who has seen the Tulsa video can tell that it was a bad shooting, and that cop belongs in jail for a very long time. As much as I can't stand the "all cops are racists" message, the knee-jerk reaction of many that "all cops are saints" is equally dangerous. Police officers need to be held accountable for 1) intentional bad actions as well as 2) bad actions due to incompetence. The circumstances of Freddie Gray are not the same as the circumstances of Michael Brown, which are not the same as the circumstances of Terence Crutcher. It's inappropriate to lump them all in together and act as if all cops are guilty of murder or all police shooting victims deserved it.
 
Last edited:

GoIrish41

Paterfamilius
Messages
9,929
Reaction score
2,120
To invest in what exactly?

Rebuilding of schools; fixing toxic water systems and other infrastructure; refurbishing run-down housing; fixing roads and bridges; opening of youth centers ... there are numerous things that we could do to improve the condiitions, opportunities, education of poor people.
 

wizards8507

Well-known member
Messages
20,660
Reaction score
2,661
Rebuilding of schools; fixing toxic water systems and other infrastructure; refurbishing run-down housing; fixing roads and bridges; opening of youth centers ... there are numerous things that we could do to improve the condiitions, opportunities, education of poor people.
Yes, how did anyone in history ever raise their children to be good and decent people without public schools and youth centers?
 

ND NYC

New member
Messages
3,571
Reaction score
209
from simple, random google search after discussing yet another protest/riot with my one of my daughters...who again asked me "why did this happen".
Her 14 year old perspective cant make sense of all the bad shit she sees on tv almost daily..as a parent I try to have a better answer than "its just bunch of hooligans"...so I really didn't have a good answer to answer "why" this seems to happen all over our country these days.
what kind of world have we created for our kids? such madness everywhere, home and abroad.

https://www.psychologytoday.com/blog/hidden-motives/201108/understanding-why-people-riot


We hear it all the time about riots: "hooliganism" or, as David Cameron put it last week, "criminality, pure and simple." But riots are complex events, hard to reduce to something as simple as that.

It's no surprise that established authorities, feeling attacked, see the violent behavior of their citizens in such terms. They react by becoming dismissive and punitive. The Chinese government used the same language to characterize student protests in Tiananmen Square, as did Arab leaders recently to describe rebellions in their countries.

And often there is an element of truth in such descriptions. If you have ever been in mob that was agitated about some injustice, you know how contagious it can be. Ordinary people, normal citizens, you and me - we get swept up and do things that would be unlikely under other circumstances: shouting, shoving, throwing rocks, smashing windows, and, yes, even looting.

It usually takes an incident to get a riot started, such as an accident or the police attacking or killing an innocent bystander. But once it has begun, the raging mob has a life of its own. Deep-seated resentments, repetitive frustrations and long standing disappointments galvanize people into action. And the mob provides cover, an anonymity that makes it easier to overcome one's usual reticence or moral scruples. One is immersed, engulfed. And it can become an exuberant experience, a joyful release for long suppressed emotions. It can also become manic, driven, a means of restlessly seeking new outlets. Leadership emerges spontaneously and changes rapidly.

It offers a kind of intense belonging, not dissimilar to what spectators feel at a sports event or fans at a rock concert. But because it isn't focused on a game or performance, it easily gets out of hand. Freud described such "mass psychology" in 1924, in the tumultuous aftermath of World War One. Others have studied it since as a recurrent form of group behavior.

This is not to justify the behavior of the mob, but to recognize that we all can so easily become "hooligans" ourselves. To be sure, delinquents and petty thieves can easily join in under the cover the mob provides. But riots do not rely on criminals or "criminality, pure and simple."

Thinking that way, though, can distract us from the underlying conditions that give rise to such events. They can be appeals to be heard, when normal channels don't work. They can be eruptions of rage, when frustrations boil over. They can be expressions of hope that things could change. And they could be all these things - and more.

Newsweek reminded us last week of something about the recent riots that many politicians would prefer not to think: "If there's one underlying condition that these movements share, it has to do with unemployment and bitter poverty among people who desire to be part of the middle class, and who are keenly aware of the sharp inequality between themselves and their country's wealthy elite."

Distracted by the flames and the looting, we can easily forget that these are, as Newsweek put it: "social revolutions with a small ‘r,' protests against social conditions that have become unbearable.
 

kmoose

Banned
Messages
10,298
Reaction score
1,181
Rebuilding of schools; fixing toxic water systems and other infrastructure; refurbishing run-down housing; fixing roads and bridges

With what money?


opening of youth centers

There are already youth centers all over the place.

there are numerous things that we could do to improve the condiitions, opportunities, education of poor people.

And what are we going to do, to ensure that we get a return on this immense investment? Just trust that people are going to make smart decisions?

We often complain about "entitled" athletes, who have been given things all of their lives. This is the first step in creating even more of an entitlement attitude, unless we also put some benchmarks in place that require the recipients to do their part as well.
 

Wild Bill

Well-known member
Messages
5,519
Reaction score
3,263
Rebuilding of schools; fixing toxic water systems and other infrastructure; refurbishing run-down housing; fixing roads and bridges; opening of youth centers ... there are numerous things that we could do to improve the condiitions, opportunities, education of poor people.

This has been done for years and how's it working out? How much and how long can you siphon money out of communities with a tax base built on private citizens to redistribute into other communities completely void of a tax base?

I suggest you invest some of your own money to refurbish a home in a blighted area. Tell me how that "investment" works out for you. It's always easier to be benevolent with someone else's money.
 

IrishBroker

New member
Messages
1,278
Reaction score
50
Really? Nothing we can do about it? How about increasing opportunities in those places, improve the schools, and provide the same support structures that are in the better neighborhoods? We can do those things, can't we?

Blaming poor people for being poor ... suggesting they are lazy or just don't want it bad enough to break the cycle ... that's Trumpspeak, man. It ignores the realities that poor people face every day.

Nobody blames the poor for being poor...that's just more rhetoric. Being poor doesn't mean you get to act like an animal.

Talk about liberal talking points.

I'm calling a criminal, a criminal. I don't care the upbringing. Everyone has a choice as to how they will behave. Excusing them of civility is actually the WORST thing you can do.
 
Top