ClausentoTate
New member
- Messages
- 631
- Reaction score
- 43
The only thing I want to say about the game is: The Chicken Dance? Really? You stay classy, Michigan.
Anyone have breakdown of stats from last night? I know Tommy went for over 300, but total yards, rushing, rushing/pass balance?
I keep hearing about Diaco's bad game plan. I agree, although I can't quite put my finger on what was wrong with it. Too aggro? not enough contain?
I think Diaco thinks we have the athleticism to blitz and go man coverage. Against better teams, as we saw last night, there are some players that simply do not have the athleticism to do this. I'm afraid Bennett and Farley are two of them.
I'll watch the game again at some point, but I didn't have any problem with declining that penalty. It's easy to second guess knowing the outcome, but you take 3rd and long every time. If you can't trust your defense to get off the field on 3rd and long then you have big problems. Also, wasn't there a sequence later in the game where we had them 2nd and 25 and they converted the first down? If BK had accepted the penalty, put them in 2nd and 19 and they convert, we're calling him a dumbas$ for accepting. Declining there is the right call. Our defense just didn't execute.
The defense did lose the game, but they really gave 34 because of that Tommy Pick. I accept Tommy is our QB and I will support him, but 23 is not enough to beat a good team.
Does anyone really think that 23 points should be enough for any offense in any game?
I have a slightly different take; mind you unfortunately, I was at an event that didn't allow me to concentrate 100% on the game, but this is what the group with me thought.
No doubt about it; our defense is slow again. Temple QB ran on us as did DG last night (for the record - temple lost yesterday to Houston). While Manti was great and people noticed, Spond's play was almost as crucial last year - he graded out well just about every game and is missed.
While our defense didn't win us the game, neither did the Offense. In order to be a top team, an offense should be able to score more than 23 points. Does anyone really think that 23 points should be enough for any offense in any game? Add to that the fact that via the 1st half INT we gave UM the ball at the ND23 yard line, this translates into needing even more points.
So the Defense gave up 41 total. Net out the 7 (Tuitt INT) and the defense gave up a net 34. Add in the fact that the Offense gave Michigan a present (at ND23) via the INT at the end of Q2, reduce that number by another 7 = 27. Even if you, blame the D for the TD, use a FG (-3) points => 34-3=31. So even by the most stringent analysis, The D gave up a net 31 points. Is that too much to expect an offense to score?
Where do you stand?
Do you think an offense scoring 23 points is enough? If so, the defense lost the game.
If you think an offense should score more than 30 (27 for the less stringent), the offense lost the game.
23 points yesterday would have beaten Florida, Texas, Oklahoma, and USC.
23 points yesterday would have beaten Florida, Texas, Oklahoma, and USC.
And it would have beaten every team on our regular season schedule last season except for Pitt, which didn't pass 23 until overtime.
I disagree (obviously). Everyone in the thread was calling it a dumb decision (myself included) BEFORE they picked it up. Here's why:![]()
A 2nd & 19 = ~30% chance of conversion. 3rd & 9 = ~35% chance of conversion. That's a big 5%. You take the penalty every time because of the math.
Exactly. And that's why 3 out of those 4 lost yesterday.
Please note how many points EVERY other top 25 team scored.
Notice where we rank among them?
The only series our defense really punched DG and UM in the mouth was the series we got the gift of a pick 6. Aside from that, our defense didnt really do anything.
Scoring 23 points should be enough to win the game.
I was left scratching my head at the defense many more times than I was scratching my head at the offense last night.
Exactly. And that's why 3 out of those 4 lost yesterday.
Please note how many points EVERY other top 25 team scored.
Notice where we rank among them?
After re watching the game and listening to Kelly's post game press conf, I will say...
1. He has very unrealistic expectations for Rees.
2. He has very little expectations for our defense.
Michigan had one weapon and tore us up. Why we didn't roll a safety to double him is stupid. Why does our offense and defense have to be so dame complicated?
TJ, Daniels, brown, and Niklas are every bit as good as Gallon and we can't find a way to get one of them the ball?
Staring down the first read and dumping it off to a back that can't catch is a joke.
We badly need a huge power back that can plant his foot and run forward. Our line played very well.
The lack of any emotion on D and the inept play of our DL baffles me.
They key will be the defense.If they can't stop a team from scoring its going to be a long season.
Humble thoughts:
a). Tommy Rees is just fine. He will have one of the most productive passing seasons in ND history.
b). Coach Kelly is just fine. He will scheme and direct us to a massive yardage and points total --- as much as he's allowed to do by Diaco's "give them the 20-to-20 yardlines" philosophy of eating time on the clock.
c). Maybe Coach will finally fall out of love with George Atkinson, and play RBs who can catch the ball. Dropping passes stops drives.
And now the really painful things.....
d). although I agree with all that BGIF has said about the defense and replacing Te'o, KLM, and Zeke [let alone Danny], we STILL should be better than we are showing so far. Sheldon Day is very good. Collinsworth is, supposedly, very field smart. The rest of the returning stars are a year older --- they should have improved ... but, no. We seem to have gone backwards.
e). My, and practically every green-koolaid drinker's, optimism about this team was founded upon the belief that the defense would be one of the top-5 if not THE best defense in the country. So far, we're OK, but far from top-5. Why?
f). some of this is what BGIF has said... loss of great leadership. But I believe that it's "worse" than that. This is my very unpopular breakdown:
1]. secondary is flawed. NOT Keivaree Russell. That TD pass was as well defended as one could ask. The ball was placed preternaturally. Farley still takes the wrong road and isn't instinctive. Sometimes he looks great; sometimes.... BJ will be generally "good". Collinsworth will improve with reps. We need him for his brains.
2]. Linebacking isn't productive. Councell and Smith seem athletic and eager enough. So does Grace. So does Shembo. So, in their own strange way would Foxabreese if they were back to sharing WILL situationally. What's wrong??
3]. Nix is efforting his a$$ off; so is Kona. So also seems Day. Tuitt?? I swear he's taking plays off. Is he still sub-par health-wise and everyone's keeping it mum??
But none of that seems sufficient to explain our gap between last year's play and this. If it's not the players [so much], then what?
What if Saban showed the world how to scheme this team, and "we" cannot effectively adjust?? Every opponent has that tape. What if, despite Big Lou elevating his motor to Olympian proportions [I have never seen a man of his size hustle so much], the opposing OCs "see" the ways to neutralize what last year we did so well?? But why haven't WE adjusted??
On the surface it seems like we are trying to with the increased blitzing, but it doesn't seem to work. Why not??
There are coaches who coach a "pretty good" game, and will forever be only pretty good. There are coaches who coach a perfect "fixed" system --- they are the Watchmakers. They are remarkably good at systematizing something that if you are not extremely "ready" for it, "it" will beat you. The Great Clockwork defensive system is what Diaco makes. As Barrett Jones said: they are good because they're simple. But they're simple.
When opponents figure out Great Clocks, IF they have great personnel themselves, the Clocks will not keep good time. The Clockmaker must adjust. Our DC is young at this job; I don't think that he's yet up to it. [I have yet to see a really good adjustment to defensive problems until we have had a halftime to think about them]. Lots of DCs are this way... but they are not the elite DCs. I have watched VT for years. Budd Foster watches the first one or two series, and figures it out before halftime.
And... despite linebacker training, some DCs know how to scheme and time and disguise and change blitzes, and some haven't quite got it [yet]. Watching us, we ain't got it.... lots of big effort to little real effect.
This defense for whatever the reasons has not improved, AND the opposing OCs have done so. .... Very disillusioning. Very off-putting for enthusiasm for another great season. Where I felt that we'd control almost every game on the schedule due to a suffocating defense, now.............. hah!, we better pray that Tommy really shines. He's going to have to outscore a bunch of teams now.
And now the really painful things.....
d). although I agree with all that BGIF has said about the defense and replacing Te'o, KLM, and Zeke [let alone Danny], we STILL should be better than we are showing so far. Sheldon Day is very good. Collinsworth is, supposedly, very field smart. The rest of the returning stars are a year older --- they should have improved ... but, no. We seem to have gone backwards.
e). My, and practically every green-koolaid drinker's, optimism about this team was founded upon the belief that the defense would be one of the top-5 if not THE best defense in the country. So far, we're OK, but far from top-5. Why?
f). some of this is what BGIF has said... loss of great leadership. But I believe that it's "worse" than that. This is my very unpopular breakdown:
1]. secondary is flawed. NOT Keivaree Russell. That TD pass was as well defended as one could ask. The ball was placed preternaturally. Farley still takes the wrong road and isn't instinctive. Sometimes he looks great; sometimes.... BJ will be generally "good". Collinsworth will improve with reps. We need him for his brains.
2]. Linebacking isn't productive. Councell and Smith seem athletic and eager enough. So does Grace. So does Shembo. So, in their own strange way would Foxabreese if they were back to sharing WILL situationally. What's wrong??
3]. Nix is efforting his a$$ off; so is Kona. So also seems Day. Tuitt?? I swear he's taking plays off. Is he still sub-par health-wise and everyone's keeping it mum??
But none of that seems sufficient to explain our gap between last year's play and this. If it's not the players [so much], then what?
What if Saban showed the world how to scheme this team, and "we" cannot effectively adjust?? Every opponent has that tape. What if, despite Big Lou elevating his motor to Olympian proportions [I have never seen a man of his size hustle so much], the opposing OCs "see" the ways to neutralize what last year we did so well?? But why haven't WE adjusted??
On the surface it seems like we are trying to with the increased blitzing, but it doesn't seem to work. Why not??
There are coaches who coach a "pretty good" game, and will forever be only pretty good. There are coaches who coach a perfect "fixed" system --- they are the Watchmakers. They are remarkably good at systematizing something that if you are not extremely "ready" for it, "it" will beat you. The Great Clockwork defensive system is what Diaco makes. As Barrett Jones said: they are good because they're simple. But they're simple.
When opponents figure out Great Clocks, IF they have great personnel themselves, the Clocks will not keep good time. The Clockmaker must adjust. Our DC is young at this job; I don't think that he's yet up to it. [I have yet to see a really good adjustment to defensive problems until we have had a halftime to think about them]. Lots of DCs are this way... but they are not the elite DCs. I have watched VT for years. Budd Foster watches the first one or two series, and figures it out before halftime.
And... despite linebacker training, some DCs know how to scheme and time and disguise and change blitzes, and some haven't quite got it [yet]. Watching us, we ain't got it.... lots of big effort to little real effect.
This defense for whatever the reasons has not improved, AND the opposing OCs have done so. .... Very disillusioning. Very off-putting for enthusiasm for another great season. Where I felt that we'd control almost every game on the schedule due to a suffocating defense, now.............. hah!, we better pray that Tommy really shines. He's going to have to outscore a bunch of teams now.