Notre Dame Endowment now over $10.5B

[MNIrishman]

Notre Dame Endowment Gains 8.7% on Private Equity, Real Estate - Bloomberg Business

That's good for top 10 nationally and more than the entire SEC combined minus Vanderbilt and A&M. Of Power 5 schools, only Michigan, Texas Junior, and the Tree have more, but only Stanford has more per capita than we do. Not bad for a little parochial school in northern Indiana. All hail Malpass.

If we do start paying players, and ND wants to play that game, we could buy and sell everyone else for dominance like it was the 40s all over again.

Comparisons are based on available data, which may not be as up to date as ND's (even if the article is just a touch old).

EDIT: Based on the most recent data I could find, we have a few hundred million bucks more than Blue and about 3-4x as much per capita. We are about $2B behind A&M, but have about 10x as much per capita.

 

[phgreek]

Notre Dame Endowment Gains 8.7% on Private Equity, Real Estate - Bloomberg Business

That's good for top 10 nationally and more than the entire SEC combined minus Vanderbilt and A&M. Of Power 5 schools, only Michigan, Texas Junior, and the Tree have more, but only Stanford has more per capita than we do. Not bad for a little parochial school in northern Indiana. All hail Malpass.

If we do start paying players, and ND wants to play that game, we could buy and sell everyone else for dominance like it was the 40s all over again.

Comparisons are based on available data, which may not be as up to date as ND's (even if the article is just a touch old).

EDIT: Based on the most recent data I could find, we have a few hundred million bucks more than Blue and about 3-4x as much per capita. We are about $2B behind A&M, but have about 10x as much per capita.

...so what we'd have is Notre Dame still graduating players among those with the highest rates in the country...but because compensation was "out in the light", and no longer an advantage to cheaters...the cheaters would graduate 50% of their kids, and suck. Truly fitting.

I still think it is a crime that anyone graduates less than 85% of their players, and think it should cost one scholarship for every percentage point you go below 85%. I think places that go over 90% should get an extra scholarship for every kid over 90% they achieve...would solve a lot of problems.

 

[Irish YJ]

So we can afford a new D-coordinator and strength coach.... nice.

 

[NDRock]

So we can afford a new D-coordinator and strength coach.... nice.

Throw in a TE/Special teams guy while we're at it.

 

[greyhammer90]

So we can afford a new D-coordinator and strength coach.... nice.

Oh good, more people are going to start doing this...

Great...

 

[NorthDakota]

...so what we'd have is Notre Dame still graduating players among those with the highest rates in the country...but because compensation was "out in the light", and no longer an advantage to cheaters...the cheaters would graduate 50% of their kids, and suck. Truly fitting.

I still think it is a crime that anyone graduates less than 85% of their players, and think it should cost one scholarship for every percentage point you go below 85%. I think places that go over 90% should get an extra scholarship for every kid over 90% they achieve...would solve a lot of problems.

If you put a stethoscope to the ground, you can hear the wailing and gnashing of teeth from South of the Mason Dixon line.

I am not sure how many problems it would solve. Those schools would find a way to game the system, perhaps a more legitimate version of UNC's African American studies program.

 

[RDU Irish]

...so what we'd have is Notre Dame still graduating players among those with the highest rates in the country...but because compensation was "out in the light", and no longer an advantage to cheaters...the cheaters would graduate 50% of their kids, and suck. Truly fitting.

I still think it is a crime that anyone graduates less than 85% of their players, and think it should cost one scholarship for every percentage point you go below 85%. I think places that go over 90% should get an extra scholarship for every kid over 90% they achieve...would solve a lot of problems.

I remember going to orientation at Iowa State (wasn't sure I could swing ND and enrolled at both). "Look to your left, now look to your right, those two people won't be here when you graduate." State school general population has a crappy graduation percentage just like their football players. Wouldn't be surprised if the grad rate of athletes is actually better than general population at lots of schools which makes for a comparative argument (that is pretty pathetic at the end of the day.)

Your greater point I completely agree with. Punish low grad rates with schollies - or at least give extra to high performers for a bit more reward for the folks doing it right.

 

[RDU Irish]

And yes, Malpass is and has been a complete boss at ND for two decades+. Guy deserves a statue on campus.

 

[phgreek]

If you put a stethoscope to the ground, you can hear the wailing and gnashing of teeth from South of the Mason Dixon line.

I am not sure how many problems it would solve. Those schools would find a way to game the system, perhaps a more legitimate version of UNC's African American studies program.

yea...I know the dreaded curriculum issue. Of course we are defining common core for k-12...sooo maybe minimum standards and a set of acceptable courses of study? I mean, ABET accredits engineers...pretty sure Hollywood would love to do the same for film and arts etc.

 

[phgreek]

And yes, Malpass is and has been a complete boss at ND for two decades+. Guy deserves a statue on campus.

mmmhmmm...Amen to that.

 

[phgreek]

I remember going to orientation at Iowa State (wasn't sure I could swing ND and enrolled at both). "Look to your left, now look to your right, those two people won't be here when you graduate." State school general population has a crappy graduation percentage just like their football players. Wouldn't be surprised if the grad rate of athletes is actually better than general population at lots of schools which makes for a comparative argument (that is pretty pathetic at the end of the day.)

Your greater point I completely agree with. Punish low grad rates with schollies - or at least give extra to high performers for a bit more reward for the folks doing it right.

That is a good point...if the school is a cluster, well then what do you do. I do think if you draw on a population similar in Motivation, it might provide a better yard stick...like say academic scholarship grad rates...or girl's softball grad rates (its pretty amazing, but they all seem to take real classes and graduate fairly well) certainly need a population with similar benefits and motivations if the entire school has an issue.

 

[ClausentoTate]

And yes, Malpass is and has been a complete boss at ND for two decades+. Guy deserves a statue on campus.

I heard he has his own table at Ruth's Chris, what else does a guy need?

 

[NorthDakota]

I remember going to orientation at Iowa State (wasn't sure I could swing ND and enrolled at both). "Look to your left, now look to your right, those two people won't be here when you graduate." State school general population has a crappy graduation percentage just like their football players. Wouldn't be surprised if the grad rate of athletes is actually better than general population at lots of schools which makes for a comparative argument (that is pretty pathetic at the end of the day.)

Your greater point I completely agree with. Punish low grad rates with schollies - or at least give extra to high performers for a bit more reward for the folks doing it right.

It was pretty much the same at North Dakota State.

Of my friends from high school that went, maybe 1/2 of us graduated. Next to no one graduated in 4, and maybe 1/4 of us graduated from NDSU. Those rates were lower than what NDSU was dealing with on a university-level, but it was still kinda nuts to think about when graduation was rolling around. Welcome to public school!

 

[RDU Irish]

It was pretty much the same at North Dakota State.

Of my friends from high school that went, maybe 1/2 of us graduated. Next to no one graduated in 4, and maybe 1/4 of us graduated from NDSU. Those rates were lower than what NDSU was dealing with on a university-level, but it was still kinda nuts to think about when graduation was rolling around. Welcome to public school!

And those are not unique to those schools. Most public universities are meat grinders, you are pretty much on your own and have to figure it out yourself. Such huge enrollment numbers make scheduling what you want/need challenging. Add in immaturity and kids that probably shouldn't be in college to begin with and you have some pretty embarrassing drop out rates.

I have seen many planners advocate for comparing 4 year private school with 5 years of public school when comparing college costs. Private schools do a much better job of getting and keeping you on schedule for a four year experience.

 

[NDVirginia19]

I think we are really gonna start making the push for a research reputation now with the bigger endowment... The campus is trying to push the name for the new quad with the new dorms east of Mod quad as "Research Quad". I think that the new academic building east of the Library is going to be big on research but I'm not entirely sure

 

[phgreek]

And those are not unique to those schools. Most public universities are meat grinders, you are pretty much on your own and have to figure it out yourself. Such huge enrollment numbers make scheduling what you want/need challenging. Add in immaturity and kids that probably shouldn't be in college to begin with and you have some pretty embarrassing drop out rates.

I have seen many planners advocate for comparing 4 year private school with 5 years of public school when comparing college costs. Private schools do a much better job of getting and keeping you on schedule for a four year experience.

Totally agree. Even kids who figure it out often change their minds...changing a major at a Goliath state school is likely 4+1...if you are lucky.

I changed, and still graduated in 4 years. But I went to a smaller private school. The guys that went to state schools...those who survived, well, 5-6 years. I will say...there are a ton of respectable smaller schools in the east which allow you to be a little indecisive, and get out in 4...but seemingly few beyond Iowa as you head west.

Great engineers come out of places like little old Wilkes College in Wilkes barre PA...IMHO living in the east provides a decided advantage on the education front...at least in terms of finding great schools with a reasonable faculty to student ratio...

 

[MNIrishman]

I think we are really gonna start making the push for a research reputation now with the bigger endowment... The campus is trying to push the name for the new quad with the new dorms east of Mod quad as "Research Quad". I think that the new academic building east of the Library is going to be big on research but I'm not entirely sure

I sure hope so. That's where we've got the most room to grow as a university. We send the fewest students to get PhDs of our peer group and, since engineering rankings are based on research, we struggle to attract engineering students against Purdue and Michigan. With our resources, we should be able to leverage NDs prestige to become a global leader in science and technology. More graduate students would also vastly improve the South Bend area, since their business is less seasonal. I would use the Stanford model to keep such growth from impinging on the undergraduate experience.

 

[BobbyMac]

Oh no...

All this talk of "research university" makes me think ND will someday soon be eligible for AAU membership and that means the B1G rumors start up again and could actually be an option. Hate the thought of even a possibility.

 

[MNIrishman]

Oh no...

All this talk of "research university" makes me think ND will someday soon be eligible for AAU membership and that means the B1G rumors start up again and could actually be an option. Hate the thought of even a possibility.

The B1Gots already want us badly. AAU isn't going to change that, but it will make a difference to prospective faculty and our national and international academic reputation.

 

[kmoose]

I sure hope so. That's where we've got the most room to grow as a university. We send the fewest students to get PhDs of our peer group and, since engineering rankings are based on research, we struggle to attract engineering students against Purdue and Michigan. With our resources, we should be able to leverage NDs prestige to become a global leader in science and technology. More graduate students would also vastly improve the South Bend area, since their business is less seasonal. I would use the Stanford model to keep such growth from impinging on the undergraduate experience.

That could be an indication that ND is failing to prepare or motivate students to take that next step, or it could also be an indicator that the type of people who attend ND are the type that want to do actual WORK, and not just theoretical exercises?

 

[BobbyMac]

The B1Gots already want us badly. AAU isn't going to change that, but it will make a difference to prospective faculty and our national and international academic reputation.

.... but, but, but they couldn't accept ND as a B1G member unless they were an AAU member.

Love the ACC agreement for ND... and that's coming from a B1G basketball fan since birth.

.

 

[MNIrishman]

That could be an indication that ND is failing to prepare or motivate students to take that next step, or it could also be an indicator that the type of people who attend ND are the type that want to do actual WORK, and not just theoretical exercises?

Engineering graduate school is beyond actual work. For a PhD, it is often 60-70 hours a week of research and development. In my case, it resulted in two patents and spinning off a startup company.

 

[phgreek]

Engineering graduate school is beyond actual work. For a PhD, it is often 60-70 hours a week of research and development. In my case, it resulted in two patents and spinning off a startup company.

Hope you benefited some...but yes I see it go that way a bit....in fact many of the funding sources I utilize pretty much require University participation. Savvy professors get a TON of headway on research initiatives based on the work of Grad students. I'm still iffy on understanding the controls there to keep the relationship from being abusive...particularly as relates to foreign exchange students....but in terms of being thrust into "the real world" the one place the generalized view of academia breaks down is STEM...$$$$$ flows and otherwise unattainable experience arises out of being a grad student with an active faculty...

 

[MNIrishman]

Hope you benefited some...but yes I see it go that way a bit....in fact many of the funding sources I utilize pretty much require University participation. Savvy professors get a TON of headway on research initiatives based on the work of Grad students. I'm still iffy on understanding the controls there to keep the relationship from being abusive...particularly as relates to foreign exchange students....but in terms of being thrust into "the real world" the one place the generalized view of academia breaks down is STEM...$$$$$ flows and otherwise unattainable experience arises out of being a grad student with an active faculty...

Unfortunately, there are no controls. At least no real ones. Professors "police" each other but because of long-standing relationships, they almost never call each other out on abusive behavior. Since it's expected that you'll work all the time, there's no sympathy if you are told to work 90 hours in a week. And you can't switch advisors without adding years to the PhD. My opinion is that the process should be nationally standardized for STEM doctorates, so that the whims of one person don't keep students from graduating.

You're absolutely right about the money. My department spent about 500k per professor per year on research and issued a ton of patents on top of papers. Since a great university is a great economic engine, especially for high tech economies like the one Mayor Buttigieg wants to build, more research at ND would pay major dividends for anyone who wants South Bend to arise like a phoenix out of its historic suckhole.

 

[phgreek]

Unfortunately, there are no controls. At least no real ones. Professors "police" each other but because of long-standing relationships, they almost never call each other out on abusive behavior. Since it's expected that you'll work all the time, there's no sympathy if you are told to work 90 hours in a week. And you can't switch advisors without adding years to the PhD. My opinion is that the process should be nationally standardized for STEM doctorates, so that the whims of one person don't keep students from graduating.

You're absolutely right about the money. My department spent about 500k per professor per year on research and issued a ton of patents on top of papers. Since a great university is a great economic engine, especially for high tech economies like the one Mayor Buttigieg wants to build, more research at ND would pay major dividends for anyone who wants South Bend to arise like a phoenix out of its historic suckhole.

I laughed...expected a different ending there...

I can only assume this makes sense for ND, as I've seen places like lowly Logan UT blossom due to the very things you point to. To reference football for a moment...When Ray Lewis' kid came to Logan he was SHOCKED to say the least. And Logan is no where near the scale of what ND could be.

 

[NDgradstudent]

The B1Gots already want us badly. AAU isn't going to change that, but it will make a difference to prospective faculty and our national and international academic reputation.

As far as I can tell, elite faculty with offers from more-desirable-to-a-person schools (i.e. schools that are either more highly ranked or located in large urban areas) only come to ND if they are somehow devoted to the Catholic mission of the school. This usually means that they are Catholic themselves, but I also know many Protestants and Jews who came to ND specifically because it is a religious university.

For example, Brad Gregory in the history department left Stanford to come to ND. There are virtually no academics who would make that sort of a move unless they have some specific commitment to ND's mission.

 

[MNIrishman]

As far as I can tell, elite faculty with offers from more-desirable-to-a-person schools (i.e. schools that are either more highly ranked or located in large urban areas) only come to ND if they are somehow devoted to the Catholic mission of the school. This usually means that they are Catholic themselves, but I also know many Protestants and Jews who came to ND specifically because it is a religious university.

For example, Brad Gregory in the history department left Stanford to come to ND. There are virtually no academics who would make that sort of a move unless they have some specific commitment to ND's mission.

The physics department has many faculty who are at ND because of its strength in nuclear physics, but all too often, you are right. Palo Alto, CA was at one time seen as an undesirable place to be, but Stanford (along with other factors) changed that. We've got a lot more going for us than West Lafayette has, and they can attract world class faculty. ND is within an afternoon's drive to Chicago and Michigan's beautiful west coast. We just need to stop thinking that we can only be excellent in undergraduate education, because it is possible with our reputation and money to become a Stanford analogue (in terms of reputation and impact) in the Midwest without sacrificing any aspect of our core identity.

 

[wizards8507]

They really need to open up the endowment portfolio as a private mutual fund for alumni. I'll let them take a cut off the top if they let me give all my money to Malpass.

 

[TheOneWhoKnocks]

My endowment is over 10.5 too

 

[RDU Irish]

They really need to open up the endowment portfolio as a private mutual fund for alumni. I'll let them take a cut off the top if they let me give all my money to Malpass.

Might be possible through CRUT, CRAT type vehicles - leave the corpus to ND and they will give you lifetime income type of deals.