Notre Dame Coaching Changes

[Me2SouthBend]

Per BGI it looks like the top two targets as Alford's replacement are Denson and Deland McCullough RB coach at Indiana. The main factors that Kelly is looking for is somebody that players can look up to as a role model and a good recruiter.

I find it hard to believe that Kelly would put those 2 qualities in a coach ahead of actually coaching the position at a high level.

 

[Irish_I_HadHair]

If Lyght wasn't such a novice, I don't think the desire for an established "star" RB coach would be so great. I can understand the apprehension by Kelly (if he has any) or fans in welcoming two fairly green (though moreso Lyght) college coaches aboard in place of two guys with long-developed reputations as strong recruiters.

Denson's on his way to becoming a respected coach in the business. He at least has some body of work. That's why I don't expect Lyght to be the sole DB coach. Maybe Elliott slides back to coach safeties. It's a much more extensive job than RB. Way more kids and techniques, etc.

While Gran was always a pipedream, the version of him 5 years ago is probably the ideal hire. This staff is desperately lacking a ST coach. Another reason the young gun hires is a bit of a gamble.

 

[stlnd01]

I find it hard to believe that Kelly would put those 2 qualities in a coach ahead of actually coaching the position at a high level.

I'd assume the ability to coach at a reasonably high level is a given, as far as requirements go. The role model/recruiter stuff is what Alford especially brought to the table and will be missed in his absence.

 

[ThePiombino]

I'd assume the ability to coach at a reasonably high level is a given, as far as requirements go. The role model/recruiter stuff is what Alford especially brought to the table and will be missed in his absence.

Agreed.

 

[Johannes]

In last night's ISD Power Hour, Coach D praised Denbrock for the improvement that guys like Fuller, Prosise, and Brown showed between the beginning of the season and the bowl game. Some of that credit was given to offensive GA Ryan Mahaffey, who apparently was given greater independence to work with the receiver corp than is typical for a grad assistant. Anyone know if Ryan is going to be back for another season? Would be great to have him stick around since the vets know him now, the staff trusts him, and we have a bevy of freshman receivers coming in.

The comments I'm referencing begin at about 58:30 of the podcast.

 

[NDdomer2]

This deserves its own thread.

Does it? The kardashian thread has more posts than this.

 

[Me2SouthBend]

I'd assume the ability to coach at a reasonably high level is a given, as far as requirements go. The role model/recruiter stuff is what Alford especially brought to the table and will be missed in his absence.

That's why I say it needs to be first. We collectively bitch about an apparent lack of development at a number of position groups (special teams), wonder aloud about why certain players don't get on the field (Bryant because he hasn't learned to pass protect) and bitch about a variety of other very coachable issues this team struggles w at times (for many it was the overall complexity of the defense under Diaco). The replacements that get brought in had better be able to coach the position first and in a way that can be picked up by a seemingly intelligent group of young men. I think this is why some schools seem to overperform vs their recruiting talent year after year. Being a role model and good recruiter? Yes very important but damn they better be able to coach their position(s).

 

[kmoose]

Dang KMoose. I get that there are unrealistic expectations, but are you trying to balance the equation?

What is wrong with saying, "Let's wait until we see how they do before we determine how great they are"?

 

[Irish#1]

Cooks didn't recruit in Florida. Clark is a defensive coach. We need a RB coach.

Position coaches switch responsibilities all the time. I'm more concerned about their recruiting abilities.

There are plenty of guys without a lot of coaching experience that can do the job. To me the key is finding out, if they have the passion and are willing to be hard workers. Look at Brad Stevens. The guy was working for Eli Lily quit the job to take an assistant position at a much lower pay rate. In the blink of an eye, he takes Butler to two consecutive NCAACG's and now coaches the Celtics. Frank Vogel is another example. Very little experience gets thrown into the HC position after O'Brien is fired and turns out to be pretty good.

Besides, these coaches learn a lot from each other hanging out together, attending meetings together, etc.. It's not like they are being asked to develop a nuclear bomb and have no scientific training.

 

[Rocket89]

That's why I say it needs to be first. We collectively bitch about an apparent lack of development at a number of position groups (special teams), wonder aloud about why certain players don't get on the field (Bryant because he hasn't learned to pass protect) and bitch about a variety of other very coachable issues this team struggles w at times (for many it was the overall complexity of the defense under Diaco). The replacements that get brought in had better be able to coach the position first and in a way that can be picked up by a seemingly intelligent group of young men. I think this is why some schools seem to overperform vs their recruiting talent year after year. Being a role model and good recruiter? Yes very important but damn they better be able to coach their position(s).

At least with the running backs coach, recruiting>>>>>>>>teaching

Just about any coach will tell you that the RB position is the easiest to teach, or put another way, is the least complex and is most reliant on a mixture of skill/athleticism with hard work from the players. Take a look at some of the RB coaches across the country:

Frank Wilson, LSU, 41
Johnny Nansen, USC, 40
Clarence McKinney, Texas A&M, 45
Tommie Robinson, Texas, 50
Tyrone Wheatley, Michigan, 43
Charles Huff, Penn State, 35
Tony Elliot, Clemson, 36
Jay Graham, Florida State, 42
Bryan McClendon, Georgia, 31

There are exceptions, but almost exclusively at the highest level of college football the running backs coach is in his late 30's to early 40's, without a ton of experience, black, and very good at recruiting.

The only white guys coaching the RB position that I could find at major programs following a quick search were Bo Graham at Arizona State and Jeff Lebby at Baylor. Both in their mid-30's with recruiting backgrounds and noted high impact recruiters.

Recruiting comes first at this position.

 

[Luckylucci]

So, I watched some interviews with Deland McCullough (RB coach IU) and came away pretty impressed. Seems like he's very straight forward and hard working guy. Also, he had a very injury plague career which is something that he can convey to prospects about why academics are important. Also, he has a history in education becoming a teacher then principal prior to his coaching career. I could see him very easily being able to gain prospects trust similar to Alford. Also, like BGI has said he has some experience recruiting nationally.

 

[ThePiombino]

So, I watched some interviews with Deland McCullough (RB coach IU) and came away pretty impressed. Seems like he's very straight forward and hard working guy. Also, he had a very injury plague career which is something that he can convey to prospects about why academics are important. Also, he has a history in education becoming a teacher then principal prior to his coaching career. I could see him very easily being able to gain prospects trust similar to Alford. Also, like BGI has said he has some experience recruiting nationally.

What's your gut on who would be the better hire between he and Denson?

 

[Luckylucci]

What's your gut on who would be the better hire between he and Denson?

My heart says Denson (one of my favorite players of my lifetime) but my head says Deland, if its just between those two. Deland just has more experience on a higher level not only coaching but also recruiting.

 

[Fbolt]

Also, he has a history in education becoming a teacher then principal prior to his coaching career.

Because I always trusted my teacher and principal.

 

[Luckylucci]

Per Irish247 Denson has heard from ND but Gran and Powlus have not.

 

[Grahambo]

Per Irish247 Denson has heard from ND but Gran and Powlus have not.

I still don't see any reason why Gran would leave his OC job.

 

[Luckylucci]

I still don't see any reason why Gran would leave his OC job.

I agree but you'd think we'd at least reach out to see.

 

[ulukinatme]

Gran is unlikely to leave an OC job, especially if we pay "meh" compared to what some other programs pay assistants. Even at Cincinnati he probably makes more as an OC than he would at ND as a position coach, but that's speculation as we never get the actual numbers here.

I like Denson as a RB coach. Obviously he's inexperienced in comparison to some other candidates, but none of the other candidates know ND like he would. He's also coming out of Florida, so there's a connection there and he can certainly sway kids that are hesitant to leave the area. He can show what he's accomplished in his life and what ND did for him coming out of FL.

Powlus as QB coach I don't like. I think he's a decent coach, great guy, but I don't know if he can teach spread mechanics and he wasn't exactly a mobile QB himself (Although he did run a little bit of Option for Holtz, but not much).

 

[Luckylucci]

Gran is unlikely to leave an OC job, especially if we pay "meh" compared to what some other programs pay assistants. Even at Cincinnati he probably makes more as an OC than he would at ND as a position coach, but that's speculation as we never get the actual numbers here.

I like Denson as a RB coach. Obviously he's inexperienced in comparison to some other candidates, but none of the other candidates know ND like he would. He's also coming out of Florida, so there's a connection there and he can certainly sway kids that are hesitant to leave the area. He can show what he's accomplished in his life and what ND did for him coming out of FL.

Powlus as QB coach I don't like. I think he's a decent coach, great guy, but I don't know if he can teach spread mechanics and he wasn't exactly a mobile QB himself (Although he did run a little bit of Option for Holtz, but not much).

While I wouldn't be mad about the hire, that statement is an assumption as there is no proof that he's done it. Its a belief that he could but a lot easier said than done.

 

[Grahambo]

I agree but you'd think we'd at least reach out to see.

I guess but if I'm filling a position then I wouldn't bother contacting an OC/DC.

 

[Irish#1]

Gran is unlikely to leave an OC job, especially if we pay "meh" compared to what some other programs pay assistants. Even at Cincinnati he probably makes more as an OC than he would at ND as a position coach, but that's speculation as we never get the actual numbers here.

I like Denson as a RB coach. Obviously he's inexperienced in comparison to some other candidates, but none of the other candidates know ND like he would. He's also coming out of Florida, so there's a connection there and he can certainly sway kids that are hesitant to leave the area. He can show what he's accomplished in his life and what ND did for him coming out of FL.

Powlus as QB coach I don't like. I think he's a decent coach, great guy, but I don't know if he can teach spread mechanics and he wasn't exactly a mobile QB himself (Although he did run a little bit of Option for Holtz, but not much).

I'm not arguing your points, but it is Notre Dame. Cincinnati is still way down on the list when you talk about the best and most prestigious football programs.

 

[Grahambo]

I'm not arguing your points, but it is Notre Dame. Cincinnati is still way down on the list when you talk about the best and most prestigious football programs.

Sorry but that's not enough to give up OC duties especially if you have aspirations to become a head coach.

 

[Irish#1]

Sorry but that's not enough to give up OC duties especially if you have aspirations to become a head coach.

Maybe, maybe not. Depends on the coaches mindset. I understand the hierarchy of the coaching tree. If you already have OC experience then adding ND to your resume would enhance your chances to be a HC.

 

[Grahambo]

Maybe, maybe not. Depends on the coaches mindset. I understand the hierarchy of the coaching tree. If you already have OC experience then adding ND to your resume would enhance your chances to be a HC.

Not to downgrade to a position coach though. He's only been an OC since 2012 and he has Auburn, Tennessee, and Florida State on his resume. I don't see the need for him to downgrade and add ND, just to add ND.

 

[stlnd01]

Sorry but that's not enough to give up OC duties especially if you have aspirations to become a head coach.

Does he? Guy's been in the biz a long time to never have made that move.
I get that OC at Cincy's a better job than RBs at ND, but who says he has to just be RBs. There might be a creative solution that gets him here, but you don't know what that is until you start talking.

OTOH, I wouldn't bother with Powlus. Aside from being an ND alum I'm not sure what he brings to the table.

 

[Grahambo]

Does he? Guy's been in the biz a long time to never have made that move.
I get that OC at Cincy's a better job than RBs at ND, but who says he has to just be RBs. There might be a creative solution that gets him here, but you don't know what that is until you start talking.

OTOH, I wouldn't bother with Powlus. Aside from being an ND alum I'm not sure what he brings to the table.

He just became an OC back in 2012 so why would he give it up so quickly?

 

[stlnd01]

He just became an OC back in 2012 so why would he give it up so quickly?

I've no idea what his motivations are. I'd never heard of the guy until last week. But I wouldn't have thought Alford would leave for a lateral job until last week either.
My only point is that Gran appears to be a great coach with a background we could use and he's at least rumored to be interested. Could we get him? Maybe not. But you never know what's possible until you start talking. No harm in trying.

 

[Grahambo]

I've no idea what his motivations are. I'd never heard of the guy until last week. But I wouldn't have thought Alford would leave for a lateral job until last week either.
My only point is that Gran appears to be a great coach with a background we could use and he's at least rumored to be interested. Could we get him? Maybe not. But you never know what's possible until you start talking. No harm in trying.

I understand all of that and I too do not know his intentions. I just felt him to be an unrealistic option the moment his name was mentioned. If Denbrock left for Central Michigan and the OC position was open, then yeah, I can see it but the guy from Indiana and Autry Denson just make much more sense.

 

[stlnd01]

I understand all of that and I too do not know his intentions. I just felt him to be an unrealistic option the moment his name was mentioned. If Denbrock left for Central Michigan and the OC position was open, then yeah, I can see it but the guy from Indiana and Autry Denson just make much more sense.

I'd agree an OC job would be a lot more attractive, Denbrock's not going anywhere, and the other guys seem more realistic. But we'll see.

 

[Irish#1]

Not to downgrade to a position coach though. He's only been an OC since 2012 and he has Auburn, Tennessee, and Florida State on his resume. I don't see the need for him to downgrade and add ND, just to add ND.

Wasn't aware that he had so many stops at some decent programs already.