Marcus Freeman named Dick Corbett Head Football Coach

Plankton

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IrishBoognish said:
I've said it before

He looks like archetype of a Law and Order vice squad cop who got caught stuffing dead hookers in his trunk.
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Jiggafini19Deux

Jiggafini19Deux

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MrNimbus said:
I've never seen a coach do less with more than this guy. He's the reverse Kirk Ferentz.
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I think he's more The New Bob Stoops.

He won the 2024 National Championship and the two games he lost last season were to eventual champion Indiana and runner up Miami. Pretty harsh when it comes down to it. Held to a very high standard, and rightfully so, though. The perception of him is different because the two guys before him beat Michigan all of the time.

The only thing that has stopped Ryan Day from a double digit winning season was the first global pandemic in a century. He is one of four active head coaches with a National Championship: Dabo Swinney, Kirby Smart and Curt Cignetti being the others.

Pope Ohio was 83-9, 54-4 with a National Championship at Ohio State.

Ryan Day is 82-12, 55-5 with a National Championship at Ohio State.

But Michigan.
 
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Me2SouthBend

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NDPhilly said:
When he wins a title at ND he going to instantly become a megastar. He's already one of the most respected people in sports among his peers.

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Ahead of 2 SB winning coaches, a coach that just won a Natty and a multi time WS winning coach. Love it.
 
ulukinatme

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I was a Bulls mark in the 90s during the Jordan run, but Steve Kerr #1? I dunno, who did they survey for this thing?
 
ulukinatme

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BabyIrish said:
4-time NBA champion head coach with sustained success over like 12/13 seasons. And then coaching the Olympic team to Gold Medal. Makes sense to me.
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Eh, more like 7 good seasons. Golden State isn't the powerhouse they were a decade ago when they had a ridiculous roster to work: Curry, Draymond, Thompson, Durant, etc in their prime. Also, since when was it hard for the US to produce gold medals at the Olympics? Since 1936 there's only been 4 US Olympic teams that failed to win gold. The last time they failed to take gold was over 20 years ago. My grandma could coach a bunch of NBA players to gold, and she's not here anymore.

Point is he wins when he's loaded with talent. That doesn't necessarily make you a great leader, much less the #1 guy in all sports. 100 "voices" were surveyed for this thing, pretty small sample size, and I'd wager they're all sports writers given the source.
 
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Bane

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ulukinatme said:
Eh, more like 7 good seasons. Golden State isn't the powerhouse they were a decade ago when they had a ridiculous roster to work: Curry, Draymond, Thompson, Durant, etc in their prime. Also, since when was it hard for the US to produce gold medals at the Olympics? Since 1936 there's only been 4 US Olympic teams that failed to win gold. The last time they failed to take gold was over 20 years ago. My grandma could coach a bunch of NBA players to gold, and she's not here anymore.

Point is he wins when he's loaded with talent. That doesn't necessarily make you a great leader, much less the #1 guy in all sports. 100 "voices" were surveyed for this thing, pretty small sample size, and I'd wager they're all sports writers given the source.
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Every coach only wins when they are loaded with talent, especially in the NBA. Jackson and Pop had plenty of talent to work with. Same with Pat Riley. That's just sort of a dumb, circular argument.

I'm not arguing for Kerr to be #1 on this list, I don't really care one way or the other, but I think it's a bad faith argument to just dismiss Kerr out of hand simply because the Warriors had talent. Every great coach in any sport has always had talent.
 
ulukinatme

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Bane said:
Every coach only wins when they are loaded with talent, especially in the NBA. Jackson and Pop had plenty of talent to work with. Same with Pat Riley. That's just sort of a dumb, circular argument.

I'm not arguing for Kerr to be #1 on this list, I don't really care one way or the other, but I think it's a bad faith argument to just dismiss Kerr out of hand simply because the Warriors had talent. Every great coach in any sport has always had talent.
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I don't think talent has anything to do with being a great leader. Great leaders find ways to win even when the deck is stacked against them. Freeman took a team with arguably less talent than some other teams in that 2024 playoff and managed to get to the championship, and with 1/3 of his starters out. That's real leadership. Does anyone think Ryan Day is a superior head coach if you take his talent away? Just look at how he had 4 of the first 11 draft picks playing for him and he got beat by teams with less talent this year.

Someone made the case that Kerr won a lot of games and an Olympic gold medal, but never has a coach been given more talent on an NBA team than what Kerr had during the Warriors dynasty. They were already dominant, and then they went and got Kevin Durant. The Bulls were damn close or on par, and Jordan was better than anyone on the Warriors, but top to bottom the Warriors in their prime probably beat the Bulls (They have the edge in 3 point shooting for sure). Quite frankly it's amazing that Cleveland came back to beat Golden State in 2016, as good as Lebron was the Warriors were a better team top to bottom.

Point is, I think steering the leadership debate towards championships shouldn't be indicitive that someone is a great leader. There are plenty of mediocre coaches that have won championships because of the talent available to them, real leaders are the ones that can motivate, innovate, and foster teamwork and success with less talent. I'm not saying Steve is a poor leader, I'm just dismissing the idea that he's the #1 guy because he has a bunch of championships. There are plenty of lesser coaches that would have won with those rosters.
 
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Bane

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ulukinatme said:
I don't think talent has anything to do with being a great leader. Great leaders find ways to win even when the deck is stacked against them. Freeman took a team with arguably less talent than some other teams in that 2024 playoff and managed to get to the championship, and with 1/3 of his starters out. That's real leadership. Does anyone think Ryan Day is a superior head coach if you take his talent away? Just look at how he had 4 of the first 11 draft picks playing for him and he got beat by teams with less talent this year.

Someone made the case that Kerr won a lot of games and an Olympic gold medal, but never has a coach been given more talent on an NBA team than what Kerr had during the Warriors dynasty. They were already dominant, and then they went and got Kevin Durant. The Bulls were damn close or on par, and Jordan was better than anyone on the Warriors, but top to bottom the Warriors in their prime probably beat the Bulls (They have the edge in 3 point shooting for sure). Quite frankly it's amazing that Cleveland came back to beat Golden State in 2016, as good as Lebron was the Warriors were a better team top to bottom.

Point is, I think steering the leadership debate towards championships shouldn't be indicitive that someone is a great leader. There are plenty of mediocre coaches that have won championships because of the talent available to them, real leaders are the ones that can motivate, innovate, and foster teamwork and success with less talent. I'm not saying Steve is a poor leader, I'm just dismissing the idea that he's the #1 guy because he has a bunch of championships. There are plenty of lesser coaches that would have won with those rosters.
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Okay but this all gets into nebulous, vibes based territory. You're pointing to a bunch of unfalsifiable, subjective conjecture to build your case, all I or an actual Kerr fan has to do is point to his actual record, titles, and accomplishments which actually happened. Maybe the actual best leader in sports history is some unknown DII coach grinding away in obscurity that has never been given the chance and he could have led the Warriors to even greater heights. It's possible, but the problem is, that didn't happen, Kerr went to the Warriors and did what he did, and that is all we can know for certain.

I don't really care for GOAT debates because this is usually what happens. Take the MJ vs. Lebron debate for example. Usually, anyone over, say, 40 is never going to be convinced that anyone but MJ is the GOAT. Why? Because MJ dominated during their formative years and people generally have a bias towards their younger years. Younger people are going to say Lebron for the same reason. What happens from there is a series of unfalsifiable "what ifs" and scenarios.

Again, I'm not here to defend Kerr per se, I'm not a Warriors fan and hardly watch basketball. I just don't like casually dismissing a man's accomplishments based on hypotheticals and whatnot.
 
MrNimbus

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The whole goat debate in the NBA is weird. I've never seen hockey fans today say that Gretzky couldn't play in today's game. Or that Connor McDavid would score 300 points in the 80s. Based off of the fundamentals of basketball, lebron kinda sucks. He's probably the best pure athlete I've ever seen though. But the guy can't even dibble properly. But then again, no one dribbles properly now.
 
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MrNimbus said:
The whole goat debate in the NBA is weird. I've never seen hockey fans today say that Gretzky couldn't play in today's game. Or that Connor McDavid would score 300 points in the 80s. Based off of the fundamentals of basketball, lebron kinda sucks. He's probably the best pure athlete I've ever seen though. But the guy can't even dibble properly. But then again, no one dribbles properly now.
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Yeah man... remember a decade ago when he was in the NBA Finals and was the first (and only) player to lead all players in the 5 major counting stats?

He averaged 29.7 points, 11.3 rebounds, 8.9 assists, 2.6 steals, and 2.3 blocks.

It was crazy, there were three All-NBA players (future hall of famers, too) on the other team and that team had the best regular season record ever but that's not all...

While this player, whose fundamentals kind of sucks, was leading the series in points, rebounds, assists, steals, and blocks, his team also ended up making the greatest series comeback in NBA Finals history. They came back from 3-1 down against a team that went 73-9 with three hall of fame players and a hall of fame coach.


You guys are out of your fucking minds pretending Lebron isn't firmly a part of the goat conversation. Fantasyland shit.

For context, I think the flu game was the greatest single game performance I'm aware of.
 
MrNimbus

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jprue24 said:
Yeah man... remember a decade ago when he was in the NBA Finals and was the first (and only) player to lead all players in the 5 major counting stats?

He averaged 29.7 points, 11.3 rebounds, 8.9 assists, 2.6 steals, and 2.3 blocks.

It was crazy, there were three All-NBA players (future hall of famers, too) on the other team and that team had the best regular season record ever but that's not all...

While this player, whose fundamentals kind of sucks, was leading the series in points, rebounds, assists, steals, and blocks, his team also ended up making the greatest series comeback in NBA Finals history. They came back from 3-1 down against a team that went 73-9 with three hall of fame players and a hall of fame coach.


You guys are out of your fucking minds pretending Lebron isn't firmly a part of the goat conversation. Fantasyland shit.

For context, I think the flu game was the greatest single game performance I'm aware of.
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Cool. I think it's a weird conversation to begin with. He can be your goat. But I just don't see it. I haven't watched a full game since 2019. It's a garbage product now (to me anyways). Enjoy what you enjoy. I just don't like watching him or the league for years now. I just find it funny how people get so defensive if you say he isn't in the top 2. Like I said. It's really weird.
 
stlnd01

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MrNimbus said:
Cool. I think it's a weird conversation to begin with. He can be your goat. But I just don't see it. I haven't watched a full game since 2019. It's a garbage product now (to me anyways). Enjoy what you enjoy. I just don't like watching him or the league for years now. I just find it funny how people get so defensive if you say he isn't in the top 2. Like I said. It's really weird.
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I haven't watched a basketball game in seven years. These are my opinions about basketball.

Agree the GOAT argument is dumb though. Jordan's probably the one but LeBron, Kobe, Magic, Larry, they're all great in their own ways and defined the game in their different eras. The real crime is that we now forget about Bill Russell. Dude was a stone cold killer.
 
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MrNimbus said:
Cool. I think it's a weird conversation to begin with. He can be your goat. But I just don't see it. I haven't watched a full game since 2019. It's a garbage product now (to me anyways). Enjoy what you enjoy. I just don't like watching him or the league for years now. I just find it funny how people get so defensive if you say he isn't in the top 2. Like I said. It's really weird.
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Unprompted, in the middle of a discussion about a goat discussion, you said his fundamentals suck and you now want to talk about it all being weird... ? Did you just have a spasm that forced you to chime in to this weirdness?
 
greyhammer90

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Why does the heavy anti-Lebron argument in the GOAT debate always come from someone who seems eager to offer up that they haven't watched basketball in roughly a decade (or more)? It's such a weird defining characteristic of the LeBron GOAT debate specifically. I've read so many similar comments that I was even thinking while reading Nimbus' comment "soon he's gonna say he stopped watching the NBA years ago aaaaand there it is."
 
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