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condoms SUCk

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That's fine. Let me ask you this, if Kelly wants to take over play calling duties halfway through game 3 of the season, is JS going to stop him? Because that is what you're indicating.

I would have to say what prompted him taking over play calling duties?
1). Just b/c he wanted to?- If so then he should be gone
2). did Chip get sick and go on a LOA?- if so then Kelly has every right to take over play calling.
3). Was Chip screwing up (how ever you want to define that) and BK had to salvage the season? - If that what was needed then we have a bigger problem and I doubt BK would last.
 

Old Man Mike

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Some of this conversation eludes me. Kelly's offense can pass the ball; Kelly's offense can run the ball; Kelly's offense can use the TEs --- all proven to be true here at ND. What the offense hasn't shown yet (for my satisfaction) is dominant power football in the Red Zone.

To my understanding Long has proven he can run an offense which passes the ball; Long has run an offense which can run the ball; Long has run an offense which utilizes TEs. Both Kelly and Long want to win the football game right in front of them each week.

Therefore: if we're playing a team structured so that we can run over them: Long will call those plays. If we meet a thug team with very difficult run defenders (as a old coach has said when film-studying a great DLineman (it was Bob Lilly): "That guy needs a good leavin' alone"), Long will call plays to throw over and around them.

That is: Long and Kelly are going to game plan every game differently. At Memphis, Long apparently realized that he couldn't beat up the opponents and gave their BIGS a good leavin' alone. That inspires me to believe that Long might be more flexibly out-of-the-box that Kelly (who believes his schematic advantage can beat anything --- he's almost right, but as we've seen the QB has to be dammed near perfect.)


p.s. comments about Swarbrick having anything to do with calling plays is so out-of-reality that I can't believe we're reading the words.
 
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Irish#1

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That's fine. Let me ask you this, if Kelly wants to take over play calling duties halfway through game 3 of the season, is JS going to stop him? Because that is what you're indicating.

I would have a hard time believing JS gets that deeply involved with the team. He tells BK "Shape up or Ship out", but leaves it to BK to best decide what to change. Given BK knows this is probably his final chance, I can see BK resisting the urge to start calling plays unless things are going south quickly.
 
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koonja

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Did chip have NFL WRs at Memphis or something? I'm being serious, IDK his WR personal.

I ask because many of you are assuming he was so pass heavy because he didn't have the OL/RBs to be successful in the run game.. ok, but we're his WRs exceptional?
 
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koonja

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Did chip have NFL WRs at Memphis or something? I'm being serious, IDK his WR personal.

I ask because many of you are assuming he was so pass heavy because he didn't have the OL/RBs to be successful in the run game.. ok, but we're his WRs exceptional?
 

Domina Nostra

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Some of this conversation eludes me. Kelly's offense can pass the ball; Kelly's offense can run the ball; Kelly's offense can use the TEs --- all proven to be true here at ND. What the offense hasn't shown yet (for my satisfaction) is dominant power football in the Red Zone.

To my understanding Long has proven he can run an offense which passes the ball; Long has run an offense which can run the ball; Long has run an offense which utilizes TEs. Both Kelly and Long want to win the football game right in front of them each week.

Therefore: if we're playing a team structured so that we can run over them: Long will call those plays. If we meet a thug team with very difficult run defenders (as a old coach has said when film-studying a great DLineman (it was Bob Lilly): "That guy needs a good leavin' alone"), Long will call plays to throw over and around them.

That is: Long and Kelly are going to game plan every game differently. At Memphis, Long apparently realized that he couldn't beat up the opponents and gave their BIGS a good leavin' alone. That inspires me to believe that Long might be more flexibly out-of-the-box that Kelly (who believes his schematic advantage can beat anything --- he's almost right, but as we've seen the QB has to be dammed near perfect.)


p.s. comments about Swarbrick having anything to do with calling plays is so out-of-reality that I can't believe we're reading the words.

Thank you! This about sums up how I feel about Kelly and offense.

He has actually shown himself to be extremely gifted and Xs and Os, but has shot himself in the foot too times switching things up and throwing off his own team as much as the other team.

But he did use run-first football--if not exactly power football--to great effect in a few memorable games. I'm thinking:

- 2010 USC, with Robert Hughes (the announcer hilariously referred to Hughes as a guy who knew what he was good at, but didn't realize that RH had refused to play that way for his first 3.5 years)
- 2011- alternating with gray and Wood (the Maryland game in D.C. was domination)
- 2014 LSU - using the QBs
- 2015 Stanford - Kizer and Adams ran that game plan to perfection in the 4th Q...
 

NDRock

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I would have a hard time believing JS gets that deeply involved with the team. He tells BK "Shape up or Ship out", but leaves it to BK to best decide what to change. Given BK knows this is probably his final chance, I can see BK resisting the urge to start calling plays unless things are going south quickly.

I agree. I'm sure him and JS sat down and talked about what needed to be done/fixed. What I found crazy is the idea that the AD would "demote" a HC from calling plays. Just couldn't see that happening and if JS is micromanaging that much, we're screwed.
 

IrishLion

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Did chip have NFL WRs at Memphis or something? I'm being serious, IDK his WR personal.

I ask because many of you are assuming he was so pass heavy because he didn't have the OL/RBs to be successful in the run game.. ok, but we're his WRs exceptional?

Based on efficiency, their run game could have been fine had they leaned on it, but rather they leaned on their QB, who is pretty good.

Memphis' rushing totals were low, but I'm pretty sure their efficiency running the ball was really high when adjusted. They were good in short yardage, especially.
 

condoms SUCk

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I would have a hard time believing JS gets that deeply involved with the team. He tells BK "Shape up or Ship out", but leaves it to BK to best decide what to change. Given BK knows this is probably his final chance, I can see BK resisting the urge to start calling plays unless things are going south quickly.

I believe that JS and BK had an extremely in depth and detailed conversation about the direction of the football program. Yes, I also think that includes who is the one calling plays among a plethora of other items discussed. Why do I believe this?

1). Look at the off season hires- almost a complete overhaul. You don't make those kind of changes without having a major shake up in the direction you want the program to go.
2). Who was hired, namely Chip and Elko. BK needed an DC that can operate independently and an OC that shares his offensive philosophy so he can do what, you guessed it handle play calling. Why?
3). BK can focus on the team as a whole and be a true HC as opposed to just a highly paid play caller/ HC.
4). The ND football brand s worth north of $100 Million. If you are JS and the program is starting to go sideways, you communicate w/ your HC and go through everything to find out how to get things back on track. Yes, that conversation should include what /how the HC is spending his time. Both off the field (speaking events, fund raising ect, and during games, i.e. play calling.
 

NDRock

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I believe that JS and BK had an extremely in depth and detailed conversation about the direction of the football program. Yes, I also think that includes who is the one calling plays among a plethora of other items discussed. Why do I believe this?

1). Look at the off season hires- almost a complete overhaul. You don't make those kind of changes without having a major shake up in the direction you want the program to go.
2). Who was hired, namely Chip and Elko. BK needed an DC that can operate independently and an OC that shares his offensive philosophy so he can do what, you guessed it handle play calling. Why?
3). BK can focus on the team as a whole and be a true HC as opposed to just a highly paid play caller/ HC.
4). The ND football brand s worth north of $100 Million. If you are JS and the program is starting to go sideways, you communicate w/ your HC and go through everything to find out how to get things back on track. Yes, that conversation should include what /how the HC is spending his time. Both off the field (speaking events, fund raising ect, and during games, i.e. play calling.

BK didn't call plays last year. He had a DC that operated independently, and an OC that he worked with for years who who understood his philosophy. Still went 4-8.
 
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NDRock

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Did you watch the games? It's pretty obvious who is calling the plays. The have a play sheet in front of them and are talking into the headset. Go find a replay of any game last year.

I do think he was very involved with the O though and assume he will be this year too.
 
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condoms SUCk

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BK didn't call plays last year. He had a DC that operated independently, and an OC that he worked with for years who who understood his philosophy. Still went 4-8.

I think play calling was a topic brought up during the off season and changes were made as a result, some folks don't think so, fair enough.

Time to move, none of us were in those meetings between BK and JS ergo no one knows for sure.
 

snoopdog

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I think it's kinda unfair to take one season of a man's career and extrapolate it to future efforts at an entirely different school. Memphis didn't have two first round offensive linemen. They didn't have three talented RB's.





If he can do that at the spots he's coached at, then why not at Notre Dame, where there is more talent than he's ever had previously.

Not only does long have a high 4 star oline, at least two quality blocking TE's and 3 outstanding RB's..... Long has a 225lb QB who ran a 10.8 100m running a RPO. The RPO being key, because there is no way any defense can focus on shutting down the run and play straight man up on this receiving group.
 

Meatloaf

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Since we're on the topic of Chip Long:
https://irishsportsdaily.com/s/3338/everything-starts-with-our-run-game---chip-long

“Everything starts with our run game. We’re a run-playaction team, so it’s not about getting enough carries. It’s about who can withstand the tempo and who can stay out there. They do a good job of servicing themselves, so they stay fresh. Coach Denson does a great job of subbing those guys.

“They are going to get as many carries as they can take.”
 

NDokie13

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p90Gyzz_d.webp


I was going through old game stats while bored, and the names in these receiving figures jumped out at me. All seven of these guys ended up playing in the NFL (at least a bit), and four of the seven have legitimately excelled. Despite all that talent, we still managed to lose this game (2009 vs Michigan) and were a mediocre team at best all year. Makes more sense, though, when you remember that the two QBs in that game throwing these guys the ball were Dayne Crist and Nate Montana (yikes). Just goes to show what everyone's already been saying -- the 2017 team goes only as far as Wimbush takes them.
 

Henges24

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I was going through old game stats while bored, and the names in these receiving figures jumped out at me. All seven of these guys ended up playing in the NFL (at least a bit), and four of the seven have legitimately excelled. Despite all that talent, we still managed to lose this game (2009 vs Michigan) and were a mediocre team at best all year. Makes more sense, though, when you remember that the two QBs in that game throwing these guys the ball were Dayne Crist and Nate Montana (yikes). Just goes to show what everyone's already been saying -- the 2017 team goes only as far as Wimbush takes them.

Tommy threw a pick if I remember correctly. It was some dumb trick play.
 

dublinirish

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<blockquote class="twitter-tweet" data-lang="en"><p lang="en" dir="ltr">What is <a href="https://twitter.com/hashtag/NotreDame?src=hash">#NotreDame</a> looking for in the ideal Rover? LB coach Clark Lea discusses that in-detail with <a href="https://twitter.com/hashtag/Irish247?src=hash">#Irish247</a> <a href="https://t.co/BZ2nGGLJ5L">https://t.co/BZ2nGGLJ5L</a> (FREE) <a href="https://t.co/hDrrnbWyOk">pic.twitter.com/hDrrnbWyOk</a></p>— Irish247 (@NotreDame247) <a href="https://twitter.com/NotreDame247/status/898219315580854273">August 17, 2017</a></blockquote>
<script async src="//platform.twitter.com/widgets.js" charset="utf-8"></script>
 

connor_in

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Notre Dame Coach Brian Kelly Isn't Panicking or Changing after 4-8 Disaster | Bleacher Report

After its coach had to spend too much time, he now reveals to Bleacher Report, fundraising for a football-only facility and not enough making sure he had a firm grasp of his team's physical and mental focus.

Think about that: The head coach at Notre Dame—which at one point was paying two coaches to not coach (Tyrone Willingham, Charlie Weis) while paying Kelly—was fundraising for a facility during the season.

When asked how that impacted 2016, Kelly says bluntly, "It f--ked up last year's team."
 

OCIrish

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I'm trying to understand.....why is the HC working on fundraising for a facility during the season???? He's got much bigger fish to fry. ND has more than enough money to build a facility, BK shouldn't have to worry about fundraising......does anybody in their right mind think Saban or Meyer is gonna have to worry about crap like that during the season?????
 

dublinirish

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I'm trying to understand.....why is the HC working on fundraising for a facility during the season???? He's got much bigger fish to fry. ND has more than enough money to build a facility, BK shouldn't have to worry about fundraising......does anybody in their right mind think Saban or Meyer is gonna have to worry about crap like that during the season?????

because ND athletics is incredibly Booster donation driven. BK has to bend the knee to these old rich bastards so the Gug can be brought 30 years out of the past..
 

Meatloaf

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because ND athletics is incredibly Booster donation driven. BK has to bend the knee to these old rich bastards so the Gug can be brought 30 years out of the past..

Isn't that true of virtually any program though, especially blue bloods? What makes ND's booster situation any different from that of Bama, Ohio St., etc? It just comes off as a lame excuse on Kelly's part to me.
 

dublinirish

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Isn't that true of virtually any program though, especially blue bloods? What makes ND's booster situation any different from that of Bama, Ohio St., etc? It just comes off as a lame excuse on Kelly's part to me.

yes but ND's booster base is on a national level. OSU, Bama's are not. A lot more travel involved and thus time consumed.
 

Irish Insanity

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Doesn't ND require all funds to be raised prior to starting any work and all updates and new construction is fully funded by donations? I don't believe other programs follow that same path.

Sent from my LG-H871 using Tapatalk
 

snoopdog

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because ND athletics is incredibly Booster donation driven. BK has to bend the knee to these old rich bastards so the Gug can be brought 30 years out of the past..

If true, where/how did he find the time to try and resuscitate the 2016 season after the Duke game.
 

Luckylucci

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Old Man Mike

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Thank the Lord that this latter post was about general team information and not ragging on Kelly (which should go in the Brian Kelly revisited thread.) Forgive an old man, but I'd like to read threads which told me something about the team and the upcoming season. Could we separate them from the speculative bitching contests?
 
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