Environmental Issues

Old Man Mike

Fast as Lightning!
Messages
8,972
Reaction score
6,460
This will never stop. The Cancer Alley of Louisiana and the "curl" of the Texas coast swamping out in Houston has been home to these dumps, floods, breeches, "accidents" for MANY decades. Why does it continue unabated? King Oil. All you have to read in the articles are two words: Exxon-Mobil. Game over.

Oil is the Heartblood, and Exxon-Mobil is the pump. NOBODY is allowed to mess with The Pump, for obvious systemic economic reasons. But surely if people die? one might argue. .... believe me, plenty have died already.

"You don't tug on Superman's Cape; you don't spit into the Wind; you don't pull the Mask off the ol' Lone Ranger, and you don't mess around with E-M."
 

Legacy

New member
Messages
7,871
Reaction score
321
Just when I was about to post about further incidents on the petrochemical corridor around Houston (and after Mike's post), this happened yesterday:

Fire contained at ExxonMobil plant in Baytown; 37 injured in blast
(Yesterday. See where Deer Park is on the map where the incident below happened)

Explosion sends flames, smoke into sky at ITC Deer Park tank farm (March 20, 2019)

Lawsuits Against ITC Pile Up As Harris County Sues For Environmental Violations In Deer Park Fire (This is the same company that illegally dumped hazardous waste into the water when Harvey was approaching. See above. No word from this Admin's EPA about fines, violations)

Houston’s Wright Containers hit with felony charges for alleged dumping of toxic chemicals
(Houston Chronicle, Feb 2018)
A Houston chemical container company and two of its principals face felony environmental charges after using a hidden storm drain to dump benzene and other highly toxic liquids into waterways near homes and schools over a period of at least months, injuring their employees in the process, prosecutors said Friday.

The indictments by a Harris County grand jury are rare. Though unpermitted hazardous materials facilities have been allowed to flourish in the city's unzoned sprawl, catching chemical waste dumpers — or merely getting an inventory of all the haz-mat sites around town — has proven difficult for the Houston Fire Department.

Prosecutors said they want this case to institute a new era of accountability for environmental crimes, relying on new lines of communication with the community to ferret out wrongdoers.

"If you're operating without a license and handling hazardous waste, discharging hazardous waste, disposing of it, we're going after you," said Alex Forrest, chief of the environmental crimes division of the Harris County District Attorney's Office.

RELATED VIDEO:

At Wright Containers, named in the indictments Thursday, the injured employees turned into whistleblowers, Forrest said.

They complained that the chemicals burned through their gloves and irritated their eyes. The company refused to pay for their medical care, they told investigators. Police officers searching the site with a warrant smelled strong chemical odors and felt more nauseous the closer they got to the drain, he said.

"Some of the chemicals would burn the skin off your bones," he said.

A whistleblower provided video of chemicals being dumped into the drain, which ultimately leads to Sims Bayou and then Galveston Bay, Forrest said.

"We depend on our law-enforcement agencies, concerned citizens and whistleblowers to develop and communicate the intelligence and information we need to shut down these hazardous operations," he said. "The community truly is our eyes and ears, and we want the public to know we are here."

A 2016 investigation by the Houston Chronicle found that the fire department had no idea where most hazardous chemicals are, that less than a quarter of hazardous materials facilities with permits had been inspected, and little effort was being made to find ones skirting the rules.

Chemical facilities are sprinkled across neighborhoods and aren't always obvious. A fire at a chemical warehouse in Spring Branch in 2016 triggered evacuations of schools and homes, and caught neighbors and the fire department off guard. Updating the city database of hazmat facilities has been slow.

READ MORE: A year later Houston is still in dark on chemical stockpiles

The extent of any environmental damage at Wright Containers was unclear Friday. State and local environmental officials couldn't immediately be reached for comment about any cleanup efforts.

The dumped chemicals included benzene, ethylbenzene, butylbenzene, dichloromethane, ethylbenzene and toluene, among others. Some are carcinogenic and highly flammable. It was impossible for investigators to estimate how much had been dumped into the drain over several months, Forrest said.
 
Last edited:

Irish#1

Livin' Your Dream!
Staff member
Messages
44,585
Reaction score
20,038
Asian carp has been a known problem for several years now, but the video alone shows how bad it really is. Article is below, but you'll need to go to the link to see the short video.

https://www.cnn.com/2019/07/31/us/asian-carp-kentucky-scn-trnd/index.html

(CNN)Asian carp are a serious problem, and Kentucky is getting creative in dealing with the invasive species.

To show how bad the issue is, the Kentucky Department of Fish and Wildlife Resources used "shocking" boats to stun the carp so they'd float to the surface and could be collected and measured. Video shows countless fish leaping after the boat sent an electrical current through the water at Barkley Dam on Tuesday.
Stunning fish with electricity is a common practice when it comes to counting the population or tagging them, the department explained. The stunning does not kill the fish, only temporarily shocks them so they can be counted or caught.

"It's just to give folks an idea of how many fish we're dealing with below the dam. We collect and try to distribute to them to buyers," said Ron Brooks, the department's fisheries division director. These carp were stunned, harvested and sold to buyers who make fertilizer, fish bait and even food products for humans.

How Asian carp took over
Don't feel too bad. Asian carp are an invasive fish that were introduced to the United States by catfish farmers in the '70s. They've inundated waterways along the Mississippi watershed and the Illinois and Missouri rivers. Carp populations grow at a rapid rate, and all their eating reduces the amount of food for other fish in the ecosystem.

"They were allowed to bring Asian and silver carp in to take care of algal blooms, and they used the fish and sold them to the ethnic markets, like Chinese markets," Brooks said. The four species of carp hail from Asia, averaging 8 to 10 pounds, but they vary in size, he added. "What they didn't realize is that these things would escape the ponds and get into the river system quickly. It took 30 years for them to get there," Brooks said. "They were brought here for a good reason, but the folks who brought them had no idea that it would cause such a terrible problem."

Carp are sensitive to noise, so when a boat motor disturbs the water, the fish leap out of the water. Silver carp can jump up to 10 feet high. The big fish are famous for damaging fishing boats, breaking equipment on board and even injuring boaters.
"They're the ones you hear about jumping up and hitting people and even breaking bones sometimes," Brooks said. "They spew blood and mucus as a stress response. If they land in your boat, they'll be flopping around, and they'll get slime around."

Kentucky's lake tourism is at risk
Kentucky and Tennessee have been working together to get the commercial fishing industry to remove Asian carp. This latest project is aiming to save Kentucky and Barkley lakes, Brooks said. "The two lakes themselves are very important for tourism for both recreational fishing and boating," Brooks said. "It's an industry of over a billion dollars a year for our two states. We're trying to figure out how to remove mass amounts of Asian carp." The wildlife department is working on an experimental project to prevent carp from entering Lake Barkley.

A bio-acoustic fish fence will use bubbles, sound and light to try to redirect the noise-sensitive fish away from the lock chambers. The barrier has been used in the Western United States and Europe to change the migration patterns of salmon, but it's never been used on carp, Brooks said. If the fence works, Brooks expects a lot of other states to seek out their own as a way of controlling the carp.

The other part of the mission is to get commercial fishers to catch the carp and reduce the fish population.
"If we can get a barrier and combine that with the commercial fishing effort, then our ability to get the carp numbers down will be sufficiently enhanced," Brooks said. "This year, we expect 5 million pounds of Asian carp, at least, to be caught." The idea is to entice fishers to the lakes to help support local tourism. "We're trying to save the lakes with commercial fishing and use it as a tool to save the tourism industry," he said.
 
Last edited:

Old Man Mike

Fast as Lightning!
Messages
8,972
Reaction score
6,460
This carp problem is bigger yet than the post indicates. Our DNRs and naturalists have been monitoring these things for some time and two of the four species pose serious threats to all of Great Lake fishing if they are allowed to get a good purchase on our habitats. (Great Lakes fishing is, by the way, a MIGHTILY important piece of our economy both as to eating fish --- northern Lake Michigan perch are regular visitors to my table --- and for sportsman recreation --- a gigantic Michigan industry and tourism issue.)

As to whether the carp were brought in for a "good reason": that Carp is Crap. There are almost Zero instances where invasive species are brought in where they do not belong to deal with some ecology problem that don't make the end result far worse. Every ecologist knows this. So why is it ever done? Three reasons: Profound Ignorance as to ecology; Wanting a cheap economic fix; and fantasy-prone don't-really-give-a-damm self-interests. Add in "this is a free country", plus the cynical reality of impacts rarely really hurting the specific malfeasant perpetrator, and these play-it-again-Sam boneheads repeat cyclically.

Keeping these dammed things out of the Great Lakes is a BIG deal, and probably not do-able in the end. We need to make a Herculean effort here, and an unneeded expensive one. Thanks a lot Arkansas for your "gift."
 

Legacy

New member
Messages
7,871
Reaction score
321
This abomination has once again risen from the dead despite an unprecedented coalition of Alaskans: tribes, village corporations, businesses, commercial fishermen, recreational fisherman, lodge-owners, hunters, conservationists and Native American subsistence fishing. The vast majority of Alaskans are vehemently and vocally against it. It's the one environmental issue former Senator Ted ("Drill Baby Drill") Stevens opposed and it united both Democrats and Republicans nationally and in a state generally in favor of mining. In 2014, a majority of Alaskans in every voting district in the state — regardless of partisan preference — voted for additional protections for Bristol Bay. Why? This is a huge mine in pristine wilderness at the edge of Bristol Bay and its watershed. Mostly, this will be an open pit mine. The open pit might reach 2 miles (3.2 km) wide and several thousand feet deep. Most of the rock removed from the pit would become waste, amounting to as much as 10 billion tons.[50] That material, along with allowed discharge chemicals, would be stored permanently in two artificial lakes behind embankment dams. The largest would be 740 feet (230 m) tall and 4.3 miles (6.9 km) long and will need to be preserved in perpetuity. The Bristol Bay watershed, to the region’s wild-salmon based economy—generating $1.5 billion a year in revenue and 14,000 jobs. Last summer alone, the Bristol Bay fishery generated a record 62 million wild salmon. Both Republican Senators voiced their opposition to the mine proposal by a Canadian company. Senators from the Northwest whose fishing industry and their jobs fish Bristol Bay. The Pebble Mine group has already spent $11 million to lobby Congress. To put that into perspective, the entire pharmaceutical industry contributed $28 million to lobby Congress in all of 2018. Pebble Partnership CEO and long-time Washington, D.C. lawyer Tom Collier this week attacked opponents of the massive proposed mining project for their continuing opposition, asserting that “they choose Alaska primarily because they don’t have to suffer the backlash from the economic impact of the project being killed because no one gives a rat’s ass what happens in Alaska.” The permitting process by the Army Corps of Engineers is almost done as required by the Clean Water Act. Trump's EPA is currently composed of people who have represented mining industries. This is truly mind-numbing. What motivates the Trump Administration besides the billions to made? The disgraced former EPA director, Scott Pruitt, who was investigated by the FBI for conflicts of interest, gave an indication for his motivation in his resignation letter to Trump.

If ever there was something for which Clean Water Act was established, it is to prevent this.

This will be Trump's crowning achievement in the destruction of the environment that provides 14,000 jobs and $1.5 billion annually. There is no way that the toxic waste from this huge mine can be contained forever. Is it really surprising that their investors were given a heads up by the Admin that the EPA's General Counsel would reverse the agency? Is it really any surprise that the current EPA administrator, Andrew Wheeler, had to recuse himself due to a conflict of interest because his firm lobbies on the mining company's behalf?

Everyone in this Administration will make a lot of money off these types of decisions while leaving all the resultant costs of cleanup to the taxpayers. Under Wheeler, the EPA eliminated the Office of the Science Advisor, which provided critical data on environmental standards. He also disbanded the Clean Air Scientific Advisory Committee.

The number of scientists on the EPA’s Science Advisory Board has plummeted 27% since 2017. The Board of Science Counselors – a body which has informed EPA policy since 1962 – saw scientist membership plummet 45%.

When scientists could provide expert analysis of the impacts of Pebble Mine on one of the most important ecosystems in the U.S. -
An Assessment of Potential Mining Impacts
on Salmon Ecosystems of Bristol Bay, Alaska


A GAO report also found the EPA failed to follow committee member recommendation protocols by skipping thorough review in favor of private in-person or one-off briefings.

President Donald Trump’s June executive order directed federal agencies to audit federal advisory boards and shed at least a third of the committees by September, physicians, scientists and watchdogs told members of a House Science, Space and Technology subcommittee. There is no transparency, impartiality or ethical compliance at the EPA now. A number high level EPA administrators have been forced to resign due to conflicts of interest. $11 million and counting in lobbying money spread around - to whom?

How investors got a heads-up on EPA's Pebble mine reversal

Trump should benefit big-time from this decision.
 
Last edited:

Legacy

New member
Messages
7,871
Reaction score
321
I intended to continue on the toxic waters and air in Texas, but decided this for a change of pace.

The Anchorage Daily News has been reporting on this through the summer as salmon headed to spawning grounds are dying. Alaska has just had its hottest month on record. Subsistence fishing in the summer is key for many Alaskans. Should this type of die-off continue for a couple of years the drop in spawning and salmon production will impact humans in commercial fishing and species that rely on eating salmon.

Alaska salmon deaths blamed on record high temperatures

Temperatures above 55 degrees put stress on salmon, Mauger said, and her group on July 7 recorded a temperature of 81.7 in the Deshka River, a major salmon stream north of Anchorage. It’s a temperature that climate models predicted wouldn’t be reached until 2069, she said.



The Seattle Times published a series of articles on the southern orca populations (California to Washington) decrease in numbers attributed to environmental changes including toxins in the water getting into their food chain and into their mother's milk and decreases in their salmon population, which is their primary food - as it is for the northern orcas. The visuals are terrific.

(Intro with to "Hostile Waters" with links to Parts) - 3 southern resident orcas missing, presumed dead

Some of the toxins attributed are PCBs and coal dust from the coal docks.

Hostile Waters, Part I - Orcas thrive in a land to the north. Why are Puget Sound’s dying?

An excerpt on the different types:
“They are so successful,” said Spong, reflecting on Orcinus orca, ruler of the seas and the top predator in every ocean of the world. They live in cooperative cultures and even in peace among different tribes of their own kind. In the North Pacific, northern and southern resident orcas, transient orcas — or Bigg’s killer whales — and a third type called offshores have worked out a sophisticated diplomacy, sharing space over a vast territory. While they will overlap in their hunting and travels, they mostly each keep to their distinct ecological niches.

The northern residents generally keep to northern Vancouver Island and Southeast Alaska, while the southern residents ply the trans-boundary waters of the Salish Sea between the U.S. and Canada and outer coast of Washington, Oregon and even California. The transients travel both places and the offshores typically keep to the outer continental shelf. The three types don’t interbreed, don’t share language, food or culture, and are not known to fight.

Specialization in diet might be one reason: The transients eat seals and other marine mammals; the offshores eat sharks, while the northern and southern residents eat fish, mostly chinook salmon.

There is hope in at least three pregnancies in the southern resident pods, J, K and L. However, that hope is fragile. Of 35 pregnancies among whales tracked by University of Washington scientists from 2007 to 2014, more than two-thirds failed to produce a live calf. And the losses were probably higher; not every pregnancy is detected. Struggling to survive in hostile waters, the southern residents have not successfully reproduced in three years.

To the north, life is so different; 10 new calves were born to orca families there just last year.

For now, ocean salmon populations in the waters off Alaska are still plentiful.
 
Last edited:

Old Man Mike

Fast as Lightning!
Messages
8,972
Reaction score
6,460
Thank you, Legacy, as usual, for the information.

As to the Pacific Northwest Salmon: though we have reasonable hopes for the species in general, we can't be too proud of the situation. This still needs critical attention. The history simply stated is this: In 1990 there were about 500 "stocks" of salmon in the PNW. These "stocks" are the independently living/breeding salmon "runs" which return only to certain sites. 100 of those stocks are now already extinct.

Ecologists try to remind us that, unlike professional football, "you only have to lose once."
 

Legacy

New member
Messages
7,871
Reaction score
321
Thanks, Mike, and great points and info from an expert.

Texas has one of the highest concentrations of petro-chemical plants along the Ship Channel and San Jacinto river as well as cancer clusters in the area in Harris and surrounding counties. Since they can no longer rely on the lawsuits by the EPA, Harris County and the state have brought these lawsuits.

Report: Major Texas industrial facilities rank first nationally in illegal water pollution;
A study by a Texas environmental group and a California think tank found that about half of Texas’ major industrial facilities released illegal levels of pollution into rivers, lakes and other waterways over the past two years.


Trump claims to be an environmentalist but withdrew from the G7 meeting on the environment and has said
"From day one, my administration has made it a top priority to ensure that America has among the very cleanest air and cleanest water on the planet. We want the cleanest air, we want crystal clean water, and that's what we're doing and what we're working on so hard."

Texas Among Nation's Worst Water Polluters
Texas is the second-biggest water polluter in the country, in terms of pounds released. But when the toxicity of the pollution is factored in, Texas jumps to the top of the list — and it’s not even close.


Trump also said:
"For the first time in nearly 30 years, we’re in the process of strengthening national drinking water standards to protect vulnerable children from lead and copper exposure. Something that has not been done and we’re doing it."

I doubt anyone on this board believes Trump's statements. Anyone?
 
Last edited:

Old Man Mike

Fast as Lightning!
Messages
8,972
Reaction score
6,460
Well, we have many IEers apparently who do not believe any of these nearly-endless violations of environmental concern and truths so, sure, plenty of people right here still believe him.

My observations of this sort of behavioral commentary are that it fits the currently successful modus operandi of simply never admitting that anything one does or believes is wrong. Just don't admit anything. The 45-second attention-span connected to the vast educational gap between what is needed to live in and understand things in a high-tech world and our actual educational base (ex. no understanding of fundamentals of chemistry and ecology at all) insure that simple denial is effective.

It is a characteristic long known by psychologists that if one just continues to say something, regardless of a person's understanding of the truth or falsity of it, that person will ultimately somehow convince himself that it is true. It is really handy to have some ready clever phrases to shunt things off into the waste bin ("Fake News" is a fabulous creation, and "Liberals" is another.) These sorts of things are terrific for obviating the need to dig into the issue involved as an issue divorced from labels. Most issues are not "labels" but complexities which demand more than shallow diversions if we actually care to address them.

The handy human trait of self-delusion, in concert with the combative stance that any admission of error in previous actions or words is a sign of weakness (almost the prime characteristic of chat sites), allows us to have "eternal denial." ... unless some day the thing denied becomes so "personal" that it kills you or someone you care about. Crash-and-burn can finally occur, but not necessarily even then. "It wasn't MY fault."
 

Legacy

New member
Messages
7,871
Reaction score
321
I had heard last spring that coal jobs were drying up in the Powder River Basin, a region straddling northeastern Wyoming and southeastern Montana, that produces cleaner burning thermal coal.

Idle mines portend dark days for top US coal region (AP, today)

Coal companies frequently use bankruptcies to escape their obligations to workers and for reclamation. Wyoming has let the companies "self-insure" - also called self-bonding - though recently attempting to change that. perhaps too late. At risk is taxpayer money both state and federal. Wyoming has the largest open surface coal mines in the country and the money required to return those mine sites to open prairie or ranchland someday as required by law is significant.

Coal companies have a legal obligation to ensure that the cleanup of waste sites under the Comprehensive Environmental Response, Compensation, and Recovery Act (CERCLA) and the Resource Conservation and Recovery Act (RCRA). In December 2017, EPA’s Office of Inspector General reported that the Agency did not have the ability to determine if a company’s self-insurance is valid and adequate to ensure that the cleanup of waste sites

GAO Urging Congress to End Self-Insurance for Coal Mines (EHS, May 15, 2018 )

Coal is in a long-term decline. Trump has loosened or eliminated all regulations. One of Trump's major supporters, who has donated millions, is Robert Murray, head of Murray Energy. Trump's EPA Administrator is Andrew Wheeler, whose former firm's largest client was Murray Energy. Wheeler was confirmed on a largely party-line vote. Congress has not taken up the GAO's recommendation on self-insurance.

Trump during his campaign did promise to get rid of the EPA.
"We are going to get rid of it in almost every form. We’re going to have little tidbits left, but we’re going to take a tremendous amount out."
The Robert Murrays are off the hook. Wyoming and Montana will have to fill in their own giant holes and, as jobs diminish, will look to DC for federal tax dollars.
 
Last edited:

Legacy

New member
Messages
7,871
Reaction score
321
open-uri20140922-16-ecojvx-810x453.


Estimated 400,000 people march in NYC comes ahead of the annual U.N. General Assembly on the issue.

jkc7Ji6A6FLHl1jv


The demonstration was an international effort with 2,646 events in more than 150 countries, attended by hundreds of thousands more people.

Photos: What the youth climate strike looks like around the world (NBC)

In Germany,
ss-190920-climate-protest-mc-10_8b72febab2f3fbd926a2512fe23de75d.fit-880w.JPG


What You Can Do About Global Warming (Union of Concerned Scientists)

Climate change: Where we are in seven charts and what you can do to help (BBC)
 
Last edited:

IrishLax

Something Witty
Staff member
Messages
37,545
Reaction score
28,995
#ShutDownDC is in effect today. This is a climate protest with the specific goal of... making it hard to do my job? Basically, large swaths of unemployed people are blocking streets.

Accordingly, I'm having a double cheeseburger for lunch because fuck you.
 

Irish#1

Livin' Your Dream!
Staff member
Messages
44,585
Reaction score
20,038
#ShutDownDC is in effect today. This is a climate protest with the specific goal of... making it hard to do my job? Basically, large swaths of unemployed people are blocking streets.

Accordingly, I'm having a double cheeseburger for lunch because fuck you.

What kind of cheese?
 

Legacy

New member
Messages
7,871
Reaction score
321
The U.S. is the second most emitter of greenhouse gases and the third most emitter of CO2 gases. The U.S. emits more CO2 than the third (India), fourth (Russia) and fifth (Japan) combined. (Source)

Coal is increasingly unprofitable. More than 40% of the world's coal plants are unprofitable and require shutting down, retrofitting to reduce emissions or propping up with state and/or federal taxpayer money. From 2019 onwards, falling renewable energy costs, air pollution regulations and carbon pricing to result in further cost pressures and make around 72 percent of the coal power fleet cashflow negative by 2040.

Part of coal power plant - which are run by energy companies - shutdowns is economics. They just can't compete anymore. Dan Bakal, senior director of electric power at Ceres, which works with businesses to transition to clean energy says:
“It’s just the economics keep moving in a direction that favors natural gas and renewables. Five years ago, it was about the older coal plants becoming uneconomic. Now, it’s becoming about every coal unit, and it’s a question of how long they can survive.”

Coal plant closures have been a feature of U.S. power markets for the better part of a decade, as stagnant demand, low natural gas prices and increasing competition from renewables have battered the coal fleet.

For an analysis of all the factors and quantification of emissions of U.S. plants closures and those impending, this is a good read and the Source for above. And Now the Really Big Coal Plants Begin to Close (Scientific American)

In the midst of aging coal-fired energy generated plants becoming less efficient, unprofitable and huge contributors to the warming of our planet, they require taxpayer money and changes in federal policies and elimination of quality requirements to support them as well as continuing support among a majority party in Congress, a sympathetic President and state legislatures. Coal lobbyists are pouring money into political campaigns with the expectation of favorable changes by politicians. Buying politicians is essential. The Swamp in D.C.

The costs of coal ash - the toxic byproduct of coal-powered plants - is in the billions and will take a decade or more to stem the tide of seepage into our groundwater. Coal Ash Contaminates Groundwater at 91% of U.S. Coal Plants, Tests Show

As one example of the cost of cleanups, TVA coal ash cleanup to cost billions of dollars and decades to complete, officials say (Times Free Press)

The Tennessee Valley Authority is planning to spend billions of dollars over the next 20 years cleaning up the legacy of what was once its biggest source of power — coal.

TVA CEO Jeff Lyash, the grandson of a coal miner who briefly worked himself in a coal mine growing up in Pennsylvania, said coal helped power America and will continue to play a role in future power supply for TVA. But there is now a price to pay for cleaning up the coal ash and other residuals left after the coal is burned and many of the fossil plants are shut down.

"These coal plants over the last 100 years are really what electrified the U.S. and now we're dealing with 100 years of the deferred costs of those plants,"Lyash said. "It's not just for us at TVA, it's the entire utility industry."

"We've had 60 years of benefit from the coal plants at TVA and now we have a deferred cost to pay for it," Lyash said last month after TVA adopted a 10-year plan to try to keep electric rates stable through 2029. "That is for a benefit already received."

TVA is doing more to ensure dikes and earthen dams are safe so the utility doesn't have another accident like the Kingston coal ash spill in 2008. More than 1.1 billion gallons of coal sludge spilled into the Emory River and nearby properties when a wall in the coal ash pond near the plant collapsed in the worst such spill in American history. TVA has spent $1.2 billion cleaning up and compensating injured property owners from that disaster and TVA is spending at least that much again on converting other coal ash ponds to dry ash storage to avoid any other such spills.

TVA also is having to clean up sites and underground wells, including those at its Gallatin and Allen fossil plants, where residues have created groundwater pollution problems.

At Cumberland, Lyash agreed to a settlement this spring with state and federal regulators to dig up 12 million tons of coal ash stores in unlined pits and clean up the contamination left by the coal residues. Under the settlement, TVA has 20 years to complete the removal, which TVA estimates will cost it $640 million.

Virginia lawmakers agree to $3 billion plan to clean coal ash ponds

Taxpayer money. For those of us who live in Virginia, get ready for the costs to you.
 
Last edited:

Old Man Mike

Fast as Lightning!
Messages
8,972
Reaction score
6,460
The energy and environmental communities both realized a long, long time ago that coal was an increasingly losing resource. We might all remember that years ago most of the big energy companies began offering rebates (and cheap costs for things like lightbulbs). Some marveled at this, but the cost projections on building new coal plants vs the economic gain showed loser status big time. Not having to build a new coal-burner was important.

That is where the two groups took very different paths however. The environmental path was transparent: solar-based technologies and all that goes on necessary to enable that. This is of course the "losing position" in a shorter term economic game. The Big Boys, the guys IN the economic game, had to create a "slow-turn-of-a-big-ship" plan. (Lots of folks don't realize even yet that the big oil companies had already purchased most of the big coal companies and were one and the same.)

The strategy was to shift everything to natural gas (playing, cleverly, the anti-coal card with just enough subtlety --- they have been astoundingly good at walking that line) while maintaining coal's presence long enough to soften the suffering of the great slow death. What we are just allowed to see is a monster economic sector slowly cutting off a withering diseased arm, while building up its replacements so that alert stockholders won't gripe about what they don't understand anyway.

People intractably stuck in the diseased arm of course will fantasize (normal human desperation reflex) that there is no such need for amputation (re: my old home state of WV). They are particularly vulnerable to manipulation of any sort, particularly politically. Bones can be thrown to them which come nowhere near sustaining them, but the desperate fantasy of the trapped individual keeps them on their walk to the edge of the waiting cliff-face.

Lovely story, eh?
 

Legacy

New member
Messages
7,871
Reaction score
321
Great insight, Mike. Thank you.

The Traditional Method of Setting Utility Rates involved a petition state regulators to increase utility rates. Utilities submit a formal request to regulators containing their proposed rates to charge customers. The utility’s request is reviewed in a formal proceeding, which is called a “rate case.” Interested parties, such as representatives of residential or business customers, are allowed to intervene and review the utility’s documentation to determine if the utility’s request is reasonable. The case is resolved by a hearing and the regulators issue a formal decision.

The utility’s requested rate is called a “revenue requirement” which is the amount necessary for the utility to cover its financial obligations associated with providing safe, reliable service to customers, along with earning a reasonable “return.” Basic accounting and ratemaking principles serve as the foundation in setting rates to be charged by utilities to provide safe, reliable service.

The primary purpose of utility ratemaking is to establish rates that allow a utility to recover its prudently incurred operating and maintenance expenses, plus a fair return on its investment in assets that are used and usefulin providing utility service. Rates are calculated based on a “test-year” which is a 12-month period to be representative of operating conditions when the rates being established will be in effect.

Utilities are generally required to “net” all costs and benefits of operation at the time rates are set to avoid “cherry-picking” individual cost increases that may be offset by other cost decreases. Under traditional ratemaking, utilities cannot change rates charged to customers outside of a rate case. (Source)

Surcharges added onto rate increases to bills to consumers are increasingly being used by energy/utility companies to fund infrastructure and inefficient, failing and environmentally damaging investments.
Understanding your bill

Virginia, North Carolina and other Atlantic coast states are grappling with Duke Energy's losing investments in nuclear plants as well as the infrastructure for the Atlantic Coast Pipeline and such costs as cleaning up toxic coal ash.

Energy companies like Duke Energy, serving Atlantic coast states, have gone around traditional rate setting by getting bills passed in state legislatures that would pass along costs to consumers and taxpayers. These have been opposed by consumers, businesses, environmentalists and other groups.

Duke Energy’s $13 billion 10-year plan was denied by the North Carolina Utilities Commission. The NC bill would bypass traditional rate-setting processes, guarantee Duke Energy a profit, and lessen the pressure to shutdown costly, inefficient coal-fired plants. Such a bill effective over years that was passed in the Virginia legislature resulted in the main utility provider, Dominion Energy, an excess profit of $300 million at the expense of consumers.

“The Virginia case is complicated by interference in the rate-setting process by the state General Assembly, leading to accusations that the political coziness between the utility and the legislature resulted in a fleecing of consumers,” Bennear said. “The details matter a lot and require effective and trusted regulatory oversight by the [NCUC].”

The fear that legislators are in cahoots with Duke Energy is a large motivator for Energy Justice NC’s opposition to the bill, said Rory McIlmoil, a senior energy analyst for Appalachian Voices, a nonprofit that is part of Energy Justice NC.

In a paid advertisement in The News & Observer, Energy Justice NC said, “Duke Energy and other electric monopolies are trying to pass a deceptive bill that’s opposed by consumers and businesses. That’s why they gave our politicians $1.6 million over 10 years and ramped up their giving in 2018 while they wrote this bill.”
(Source: The controversial bill on Duke Energy rates, explained: How does it affect customers?)

Cost estimate for Duke Energy-backed Atlantic Coast Pipeline hits $7B

For anyone who advocates free market competition eliminating poorly preforming companies and leading to decreased prices for consumers, these types of bils propping the Duke Energies up and passing along losses to consumers needs to consider the disregard consumer groups and the abuse of political power behind those legislations.
 
Last edited:

Old Man Mike

Fast as Lightning!
Messages
8,972
Reaction score
6,460
The nuclear power plant fiascos (regardless of what one thinks about the +/- of nuclear power) have a strong connection to the coal death issue mention above. When the somewhat independent power companies saw that coal was a loser, they had to go one of two ways: give in to natural gas and the oil titans (thus ultimately losing the independent power of their kingdoms) or go for something oil could not control (uranium --- they were wrong about that too, as Big Oil began buying up the verticality in the uranium mining industry as well.)

Nuclear, they knew, was a BIG social gamble but they thought that the GCC card (no carbon emissions) that they could play (plus standard politician buying) would make it socially viable. This has almost happened. "Sadly" for them, the phenomenal costs and LONG construction times for a nuke plus a relatively intractable citizenry on the Not-in-my-Back-Yard issue (somewhat regularly reinforced by nuke troubles abroad and lingering Chernobyl health news) have put rocks in their path, probably insurmountable for several decades if not in aeternum.

Of course choosing the Third Way (Solar) never seriously crossed their accounting books......
 

Old Man Mike

Fast as Lightning!
Messages
8,972
Reaction score
6,460
I have a difficult time finding words of appreciation for the depth knowledge expansion that your trolling (whoops, check that uncharitable remark) ... your wisdom affords me. So good to have this constant elevation of the discussions on this site.
 

Legacy

New member
Messages
7,871
Reaction score
321
Previously, I've posted the article about the older couple retiring to live in the Permian Basin in NM and Texas, who could no longer go outside due to boom in natural gas wells with venting of toxins, and who suffered new and worsening respiratory problems.

To frame the next article about a rancing family, I'll frame it with two articles on toxic coal ash from coal plants.

In Texas,
Mass pollution at Texas coal plants poses major threat to human health and the environment
New report shows coal ash leaking from 100% of reporting Texas coal plants.


Virtually every coal power plant in Texas is leaking pollution into nearby groundwater, imperiling the environment and the health of neighboring communities, according to new data analysis released this week.

According to a new report published Thursday by the non-profit, non-partisan Environmental Integrity Project (EIP), toxic coal ash pollutants from coal-fired power plants in Texas are leaking into groundwater around the state. Arsenic, cobalt, lithium, and a range of other pollutants are seeping from 100 percent of Texas power plants coal ash sites for which reports are available.

Texas receives 24 percent of its electricity from coal, with 16 coal plants out of at least 19 in the state currently reporting coal ash data. Texas is the leading U.S. generator of both oil and wind power, and while it produces far less coal, the fuel — and its pollution — remains a lagging issue for residents.

Coal ash is the toxic waste left behind after fuel is burned and is composed of a range of deadly pollutants, including carcinogens and neurotoxins. When it comes into contact with groundwater, it becomes particularly dangerous for human health, leading to diseases like cancer, and for the environment, imperiling aquatic life along with drinking water....
Nationally,
Coal Ash Contaminates Groundwater at 91% of U.S. Coal Plants, Tests Show
An analysis of water monitoring reports found unsafe levels of toxic substances near hundreds of coal ash sites, many of them in the Midwest and Southeast.

At a power plant in Memphis, Tennessee, coal ash waste that built up over decades has been leaching arsenic and other toxic substances into the groundwater.

The contamination, ranked as a top problem in a new national assessment of water testing at coal ash sites, is in a shallow aquifer for now. But below that lies a second aquifer that provides drinking water to more than 650,000 people, and there are concerns that the contamination could make its way into the deeper water supply the city relies on.

"We have one of the purest drinking water sources in the whole country, and now we'll have arsenic and other coal ash compounds leaking into our water supply if things don't get cleaned up," said Scott Banbury, a Memphis resident and representative of the Sierra Club. "So getting rid of that ash is important."...

Finally, this is one ranching family's experience,
For a Texas Ranching Family, Toxic Coal Ash Pollution Hits Home
A Texas family’s ranch has been found to be one of the most contaminated coal ash sites in the country. Environmental groups say the pollution — and the ranchers’ bitter legal battle to stop it — is a stark example of the nation’s ongoing coal ash crisis.

In 1954, the Peeler family signed an agreement to lease 6,000 acres of their 25,000-acre Texas ranch for a lignite coal mine. A few years later, they sold an additional 300 or so acres of their property to a small electric cooperative, which had taken over the mine, for the construction of a new coal-fired power plant. The family thought the arrangement would provide them with a modest income from the leases and felt they were playing a part in the electrification of rural Texas, which was then still underway.

The hulking coal plant, owned by the San Miguel Electric Cooperative, was eventually built and came online in 1982. Situated among the rolling hills, grazing cattle, and nodding oil pumps in Christine, Texas, 60 miles south of San Antonio, the 400-megawatt power plant, together with eight other rural co-ops, helps provides electricity to more than 200,000 customers in 42 rural counties across South Texas.

For years, the Peelers and the San Miguel cooperative coexisted peacefully, side-by-side. But no longer. The family and the co-op are now engaged in a bitter legal battle over the dumping of large amounts of coal ash — the toxic byproduct of burning coal — into empty mining pits and in ponds around the San Miguel plant. The soil near the various storage sites is now ashen, with silvery slicks of groundwater pooling on the surface. According to San Miguel’s own testing, pollutants from coal ash have leached into the groundwater around the power plant, with concentrations of cadmium, lithium, arsenic, and other contaminants at levels far exceeding those set by the U.S. Environmental Protection Agency (EPA).

“It looks like a moonscape to me,” says Alonzo Peeler Jr., 79, whose grandfather signed the original agreement with what would later become the San Miguel co-op. The coal ash, says Peeler — a tall man with a high-pitched voice and a face that has been carved by a life spent working in the sun — “kills the vegetation, changes it, kills the grass, and blights the trees.” The Peelers say that the coal ash pollution has left portions of their ranch unsuitable for cattle grazing because the grass is unsafe to eat and the water unfit to drink. The mounds of toxic ash around the old mine are an unearthly contrast to uncontaminated sections of Peeler land, an otherwise gentle, dry landscape, where spring wildflowers create a mottled quilt of pinks, blues, and yellows.

Now the Peelers, a fifth-generation ranching family that has long been skeptical of the federal government’s reach, are looking to the EPA for help. For Alonzo Jr.’s son, Jason Peeler, who runs the family ranch, this struggle has changed his outlook on the role of government and the value of environmental regulation. “We [Texans] pride ourselves on being independent, even of our own government,” said the younger Peeler, 51. “Sitting at the ranch looking out the window at the plant, it’s hard for me believe that this [level of contamination] can happen.”

The family may not find a sympathetic ear in Washington. Despite several instances in recent years of major spills at coal ash ponds, resulting in contamination of rivers and groundwater supplies, the Trump administration has been working to reverse or relax the single federal regulation governing disposal of coal ash. In one of his first moves after taking charge of the EPA in July 2018, Trump appointee Andrew Wheeler, a former lobbyist for the coal industry, sought to reverse that 2015 rule. It is one of numerous actions taken by the Trump administration that are favorable to the coal industry and electric utilities.

The Peeler family saga is atypical of most coal ash pollution stories, since most plants or storage sites aren’t on someone else’s property. But the family’s struggle nevertheless highlights a growing problem with this waste product. Coal ash — which contains arsenic, mercury, lead, and other dangerous substances — is a particularly pernicious legacy of America’s reliance on coal. It is one of the country’s largest waste streams, with more than 100 million tons produced across the United States every year. The hazardous dust and sludge are stored in more than 1,000 bodies of water and landfills in nearly every state, posing potential risks to air, soil, water, and human health.

About a third of coal ash ponds are within 5 miles of a public drinking water intake or reservoir, and about 80 percent are within 5 miles of a drinking water well, according to the EPA. The U.S. Commission on Civil Rights has also found that minority and low-income communities are disproportionately impacted by coal ash pollution. Health experts say that long-term exposure to cadmium in drinking water, a coal ash pollutant, can cause kidney, lung, and blood ailments, including an increased risk of cancer.

According to a report from two non-profit groups, the Environmental Integrity Project and Earthjustice, the groundwater near 16 of Texas’ coal-fired power plants is contaminated with levels of arsenic, boron, cobalt, and lithium that exceed EPA standards and make it unsafe for human consumption. The report concluded that the toxins originated in the facilities’ coal ash storage sites. The environmental groups also found that 91 percent of coal plants nationwide have one or more coal ash pollutants in groundwater beneath their storage ponds at levels exceeding safe standards....
 
Last edited:

Irish#1

Livin' Your Dream!
Staff member
Messages
44,585
Reaction score
20,038
Interesting article on tailing dams built by mining companies from the WSJ. They build them to contain waste. Scroll down to where you see two small video clips and play the first. It's video footage of the break and a second camera shows it approach the mining camp. A pickup truck tries to get out of the area and gets blocked by a train which is in the path of the flood.

https://www.wsj.com/articles/minnes...-giving-it-pause-11571064180?mod=hp_lead_pos5
 

BGIF

Varsity Club
Messages
43,946
Reaction score
2,922
I Feel The Earth Move Under My Feet ...

I Feel The Earth Move Under My Feet ...

In seismic shift, Britain orders immediate moratorium on fracking

LONDON (Reuters) - Britain will impose an immediate moratorium on fracking, the government announced on Saturday, saying the controversial gas extraction technique risked causing too much disruption to local communities through earth tremors.


FILE PHOTO: Protest slogans are seen on fencing around a fracking site near Blackpool, Britain, October 22, 2018. REUTERS/Hannah McKay

Prime Minister Boris Johnson’s government had previously signaled its support for the shale gas industry as it seeks ways to cut Britain’s reliance on imports of natural gas which is used to heat around 80% of Britain’s homes.

But fracking, which involves extracting gas from rocks by breaking them up with water and chemicals at high pressure, is fiercely opposed by environmentalists who say it is at odds with Britain’s commitment to reach net zero carbon emissions by 2050.

Saturday’s announcement comes as Johnson gears up for an election on Dec. 12. Proposals for developing fracking in several marginal seats in northern England will now be postponed.

Business Secretary Andrea Leadsom said that the government could not rule out unacceptable impacts on the local communities in the future if fracking continued.

“We’ve always been clear that we will follow the science,” she told BBC radio. “We cannot be certain that shale gas can be extracted safely, and therefore we must impose this moratorium until the science changes.”

The decision follows a report on an incident at a site run by British energy company Cuadrilla near Blackpool, northern England where a 2.9-magnitude tremor shook houses in August.

An anti-fracking campaign by local people emerged as a flashpoint in a growing climate activist movement opposing new fossil fuel projects around the world. Hundreds of protesters have been arrested over the past few years for trying to disrupt Cuadrilla’s operations.

“The toll this has taken on our lives is immeasurable,” said Maureen Mills, from Halsall Against Fracking. “The industry is all about itself and its shareholders. Our communities are left physically and mentally drained and devastated. For what?”

Campaigners resisting a vastly larger fracking industry in the United States also cheered Britain’s decision.

“This is a major step in our global struggle against fracking,” said Xiuhtezcatl Martinez, 19, youth director of climate justice group Earth Guardians, who has been opposing the industry in his home state of Colorado for almost a decade.

Fracking in England resumed only last year after two tremors prompted a seven-year moratorium.

The Blackpool incident was examined by the Oil and Gas Authority (OGA), which regulates and promotes Britain’s oil and gas industry.

Its report found it was not currently possible to predict accurately the probability or magnitude of earthquakes linked to fracking operations.

Cuadrilla is 47.4% owned by Australia’s AJ Lucas (AJL.AX), while a fund managed by Riverstone holds a 45.2% stake. There was no immediate comment from the company.

“Hydraulic fracturing stimulation is a long-standing technology used around the world,” said Ken Cronin, chief executive of industry group UK Onshore Oil and Gas.

“Going forward, we are fully committed to working closely with the Oil and Gas Authority and other relevant regulators to demonstrate that we can operate safely and environmentally responsibly.”
 

Old Man Mike

Fast as Lightning!
Messages
8,972
Reaction score
6,460
Using water/liquid pressures underground for any purposes has been known for years to cause quakes. These procedures are more or less dangerous depending upon the geology that will be affected (Central US areas are notorious for stimulated quakes in some of the oil drilling days of the 80s for instance. North Dakota probably doesn't give a damn since that geology is less quake vulnerable (to my knowledge.) )

But nay-sayers on the fracking side should at least admit that the science on liquid internal pumping is clear; it does cause quakes and the location of those foci are unpredictable. As with all of these sorts of things, the issue will reduce to people with money who don't live around the sites will approve these experiments on the geo-system, and people (usually without money) will take the hits if the "experiments" go wrong.

Hint: money always wins at least until it kills somebody.

Then it might still win.
 

Irish YJ

Southsida
Messages
25,888
Reaction score
1,444
Using water/liquid pressures underground for any purposes has been known for years to cause quakes. These procedures are more or less dangerous depending upon the geology that will be affected (Central US areas are notorious for stimulated quakes in some of the oil drilling days of the 80s for instance. North Dakota probably doesn't give a damn since that geology is less quake vulnerable (to my knowledge.) )

But nay-sayers on the fracking side should at least admit that the science on liquid internal pumping is clear; it does cause quakes and the location of those foci are unpredictable. As with all of these sorts of things, the issue will reduce to people with money who don't live around the sites will approve these experiments on the geo-system, and people (usually without money) will take the hits if the "experiments" go wrong.

Hint: money always wins at least until it kills somebody.

Then it might still win.

Honest question. With all the fracking going on around the world, how common is it (quakes), and has there been any actual damage or life loss from the quakes.
 

Old Man Mike

Fast as Lightning!
Messages
8,972
Reaction score
6,460
I don't know. (not a field that I studied closely) That's why I phrased my sentences as I did. I know that liquid infusion activities produce quakes at least sometimes, because I knew a fellow (John Derr, a really good guy) who worked on a government test of that possibility in Colorado, in the 80s it was I believe. He was the lead author.

Whether there has already been tragedy due to this, it would still be an honest moral question as to whether we should experiment with activities which we know from solid tests have the potential to do great harm. People in the medical community would, for instance, find this against their code of ethics.

In other elements of our not-quite-a-culture, we seem to prefer the let-er-rip and see what happens sort of "morality." Either that or the further "militaristic" type rationale that sacrificing the few for the good of the many is morally OK. Each of us has to decide what sort of personal morality we want to stand by, and to what situations it applies.

It's also good practice to look ourselves clearly in the mirror when we decide that letting-er-rip is what we want to support. It's pretty easy to let-er-rip when we're not the ones in the line of fire.
 

Irish YJ

Southsida
Messages
25,888
Reaction score
1,444
I don't know. (not a field that I studied closely) That's why I phrased my sentences as I did. I know that liquid infusion activities produce quakes at least sometimes, because I knew a fellow (John Derr, a really good guy) who worked on a government test of that possibility in Colorado, in the 80s it was I believe. He was the lead author.

Whether there has already been tragedy due to this, it would still be an honest moral question as to whether we should experiment with activities which we know from solid tests have the potential to do great harm. People in the medical community would, for instance, find this against their code of ethics.

In other elements of our not-quite-a-culture, we seem to prefer the let-er-rip and see what happens sort of "morality." Either that or the further "militaristic" type rationale that sacrificing the few for the good of the many is morally OK. Each of us has to decide what sort of personal morality we want to stand by, and to what situations it applies.

It's also good practice to look ourselves clearly in the mirror when we decide that letting-er-rip is what we want to support. It's pretty easy to let-er-rip when we're not the ones in the line of fire.

I'd really like to understand the true impact. We have lost a lot of people in plain sight in coal mines for a very long time, and even continue today. Honestly I've never heard of a fracking caused quake killing anyone. How many kids work in Chinese sweat shops manufacturing solar panels. How many mining deaths to get the metals needed for panels. There's a cost to almost everything, and I think it would be interesting to see the numbers.
 

Legacy

New member
Messages
7,871
Reaction score
321
I've previously posted on the Mount Polley mine tailings dam's failure and disaster in Canada which released the third most volume of toxic water that drained its four-square-kilometre (1.5 sq mi) sized tailings pond. Fortunately, that did not result in loss of life and drained only into a downstream lake, and not the watershed that leads to a productive bay for salmon-fishing.

The Pebble Mine project in Alaska, recently approved by the Trump Admin's EPA, will not only dwarf the size of the area mined and the tailings pond of the Mount Polley mine.

From: Alaska's Bristol Bay & The Pebble Mine | Earthjustice

The project entails mining a pit over a mile long, a mile wide and 200 meters deep, destroying nearly 3,500 acres of wetlands, lakes, and ponds and 81 miles of salmon streams. And that only includes waters directly displaced by mine facilities, not the thousands more acres that would be fragmented, dewatered, and covered with dust from the mine.

The tailings pond is a toxic slurry and a breach would wipe out wildlife downstream and the salmon fishing industry in Bristol Bay.

Pebble envisions treating tens of billions of gallons of wastewater per year in perpetuity after the mine closes. That volume of water treatment would be unprecedented among U.S. mines, and if it should ever fail, metals and other pollutants harmful to fish and public health will be released into the watershed.

The tailings pond would be massive.

For one thing, Pebble envisions treating tens of billions of gallons of wastewater per year in perpetuity after the mine closes. That volume of water treatment would be unprecedented among U.S. mines, and if it should ever fail, metals and other pollutants harmful to fish and public health will be released into the watershed.

Nor is the Army Corps’ conclusion on the likelihood of a tailings dam failure — in which an embankment holding back harmful mine waste splits apart by accident and releases a flood of toxic pollutants into the watershed — considered realistic.

While the Draft EIS suggests that any tailings failure would be miniscule, scientific literature and actual examples of such disasters occurring throughout the world contradict such a finding. A geophysicist who produced a model on behalf of Bristol Bay fishermen found toxic mine tailings released into a river could be carried for 100 kilometers from the mine site.

A breach of the dam would drain directly into Bristol Bay which is the world’s largest Chinook salmon runs, fueling 14,000 jobs and Alaska’s $1.5 billion fishing economy.
 
Last edited:

Irish#1

Livin' Your Dream!
Staff member
Messages
44,585
Reaction score
20,038
I'd really like to understand the true impact. We have lost a lot of people in plain sight in coal mines for a very long time, and even continue today. Honestly I've never heard of a fracking caused quake killing anyone. How many kids work in Chinese sweat shops manufacturing solar panels. How many mining deaths to get the metals needed for panels. There's a cost to almost everything, and I think it would be interesting to see the numbers.

It goes beyond lives lost. My grandparents lived in Duggar, Indiana. Over a period of time, their house was becoming dangerous to live in from all of the vibrations. Gaps in the ducts from the coal furnace and windows not shutting properly are a couple of things I remember. All because the house was very close to being shaken off its foundation.
 
Top