COVID-19

[IRISHDODGER]

If I’m being real the main reason I exercise and eat healthy is so I can keep drinking beer. Lol.

LOL. I can relate. Whatever it takes.

 

[GrangerIrish24]

If I’m being real the main reason I exercise and eat healthy is so I can keep drinking beer. Lol.

I just want to be able to look down and see that everything is still there and accounted for

 

[ACamp1900]

If I’m being real the main reason I exercise and eat healthy is so I can keep drinking beer. Lol.

Kindred

 

[ulukinatme]

Looks like I've got the COVID again. Another Omicron strain most likely, feels like the last one: light headache and fever, little bit of a cough. I hit the vitamins early this time and have been sleeping a lot to shake it, already feeling a bit better after just a few days.

 

[sixstar]

A new study uncovers the potential reason why vaxxed people are more susceptible to catching COVID. It appears that the shots are replacing IgG3 immunoglobins with IgG4 immunoglobins.

Putting it simply: this study potentially shows that the shots are training your immune system to tolerate and ignore SARS-COV-2 rather than kill it off. And, if true, this is obviously very bad.

IgG3 are your virus-fighting antibodies - they are the primary mechanism that your body uses to clear COVID. IgG4 are non-inflammatory antibodies for allergens - they do not fight viruses - they simply tell your body to ignore the intruder and stop creating an inflammatory response to an allergen.

For those of you who get allergy shots, those shots boost your IgG4 antibodies so that your body doesn't have such terrible reactions to pollen or peanuts or any other substance. IgG4 tells your body to ignore the intruder.

This is fine for non-replicating intruders like pollen. This is potentially very dangerous for replicating viruses like SARS-COV-2, RSV, etc. because it tells your body to ignore the viruses rather than kill them.

Here's the primary picture.


Results are grouped by Ig type, and categorized by "post 2nd" (short time after 2nd shot), "follow up 2nd" (long time after 2nd shot), "post 3rd" (short time after 3rd shot), and "follow up 3rd" (long time after 3rd shot).

Look at how the cohort's IgG3 drops to nearly zero while the IgG4 rises to a majority of anti-S (anti-spike) IgG percentage.

This is one study, but it potentially explains why UK HSA and why the Cleveland Clinic study both showed vaxxed infection rates 2-4x higher than unvaxxed per 100k.

This requires additional research, but you won't hear our public health talking about it - all you will hear is "get your booster." Fellow ND friends, I encourage you to inform yourselves because public health will not.

Study here: https://www.science.org/doi/10.1126/sciimmunol.ade2798

 

[PerthDomer]

Come get your pre-Christmas propaganda booster:
“Anti-vaccine activism, which I actually call anti-science aggression, has now become a major killing force globally."



Why is it that the people that call detractors "anti-science" never want to analyze and debate the data?

Imagine if these propagandists acknowledged natural methods to health, you know: good diet, vitamins, exercise. But nope: vaccine or death. That's the message. Inject that into your veins.

Because they are anti science and we're seeing people rejecting the standard vaccine schedule. Predictably we're seeing measles outbreaks. The arguments vs the covid vaccines are indistinguishable from the standard schedule and the movements are bleeding together. We'd been seeing more and more snowflakes who have special medical knowledge and don't vaccinate pre covid. That population has exploded since.

Signed a pediatric ICU doctor who's dealt with vaccine preventable illness including COVID at work.

 

[sixstar]

No, people against the COVID shots are not anti-science. In fact, there is ample science that shows that the COVID shots are neither safe nor effective. The health establishment has been unwilling to debate the safety and efficacy of the COVID shots, instead dismissing those who want to debate anti-science, anti-vax, or conspiracy theorists. Are you in this group too? I hope not. If you want a meritorious debate on the matter, I'm more than happy to engage. I find it curious that the science establishment is so afraid to discuss the data with the so-called anti-vaxxers.

Public health's coercion (free burgers and foot massage!), threats (lose your job), and ineffective NPIs (masks and school shutdowns) have ruined public trust. They pushed too hard into the COVID shot and NPIs despite hard data showing that it didn't work, and they made the general public question not only their current guidance but all guidance up to this point. To be so incorrect, they must either be corrupt or inept - which one is it? So that's why you are seeing people become vax hesitant across the board. That's on public health; don't blame the general public for losing trust.

Predictably we're seeing measles outbreaks.

Where are you seeing this? The Australian Government Department of Health and Aged Care data does not reflect your statement. In fact, they are only reporting 7 cases in 2022, which is the 2nd lowest since the record set started over 30 years ago. This is essentially diametrically opposed to your claim (link here: Dashboard · NINDSS Portal):




The US is not seeing an increase in measles either. 2022 data is current as of DEC 22 per the CDC (Measles Cases and Outbreaks):

Signed a pediatric ICU doctor who's dealt with vaccine preventable illness including COVID at work.

Since you are so confident in this, please answer these questions with actual data:

• What is the hospitalization rate for pediatric COVID cases? Hospitalization for* not with*
• What is the death rate for pediatric COVID cases? Death from* not with*
• What is the Absolute Risk Reduction in pediatric COVID hospitalization achieved through the COVID shot?
• What is the Absolute Risk Reduction in pediatric COVID death achieved through the COVID shot?
• What is the Severe Adverse Effect rate in pediatric COVID shots?
• What is the ARR:SAE ratio in pediatric cohorts?

The most basic premise of health care is benefit/risk analysis. To intervene, one must show a positive benefit:risk ratio. So since we have been injecting people for 2 years, please show me the hard data to quantify this analysis. It should be readily available, yes?

 

[ulukinatme]

Both times I've gotten COVID I get tired and headaches/light fever which lasts for 1-2 days and then I feel fine...except for a lingering congestion that creates an occasional cough that won't go away for over a week. Anyone else get that? It's just annoying more than anything at this point. Dunno if it just turns into a sinus infection and I need a shot or something. Could just be the price of living in Ohio during the winter too. Used to get colds all the time around Christmas and the symptoms would last for a few weeks, and then we'd visit family in Florida for the holidays and the humid weather would clear me up within a day

 

[sixstar]

i've had it twice (delta last November and omicron in June) with almost identical symptoms to you. First day, both times, I had zero energy, pounding headache, fever, body aches, and general malaise. Second day was mostly headache and fever, 90% clear by day 3, 98% by day 4, with a cough that lingered for 1-2 weeks.

 

[PolishDomer]

i've had it twice (delta last November and omicron in June) with almost identical symptoms to you. First day, both times, I had zero energy, pounding headache, fever, body aches, and general malaise. Second day was mostly headache and fever, 90% clear by day 3, 98% by day 4, with a cough that lingered for 1-2 weeks.

Same with me Sixstar...no idea what I had in December...I just had a sore throat pretty much. One son had the same symptom, his twin no symptoms. We came in to test for Strep Throat...we had Covid...lol

 

[irishff1014]

Both times I've gotten COVID I get tired and headaches/light fever which lasts for 1-2 days and then I feel fine...except for a lingering congestion that creates an occasional cough that won't go away for over a week. Anyone else get that? It's just annoying more than anything at this point. Dunno if it just turns into a sinus infection and I need a shot or something. Could just be the price of living in Ohio during the winter too. Used to get colds all the time around Christmas and the symptoms would last for a few weeks, and then we'd visit family in Florida for the holidays and the humid weather would clear me up within a day

The first time I had it I ended up with thrush in my throat and was worse than any strep I ever had. And no energy.

My second felt like a mild sinus infection. It I hadn’t been tested I wouldn’t even known I had it again.

 

[sixstar]

UKHSA used to be the best government organization for posting raw case/hospitalization/death data for vax vs. unvaxxed. They stopped posting the data in April 2022 when case rates were 2-3x higher in vaxxed than unvaxxed. The data contradicted the narrative.

So, after that, New South Wales provided the best data set. Except, now, NSW has decided to stop posting the numbers. Take a look at the latest report:




NSW is reporting 97.4% of the population (older than 16) with at least 1 dose, so if the vax is effective, unvax population should make up much more than 2.6% of cases, hospitalizations, and deaths. Let's run the numbers:

Percent of unvaccinated population: 2.6%
Percent of unvaxx cases: 0%
Percent of unvax hospitalizations: 0%
Percent of unvax deaths: 6.3%

So, we see worse performance in cases and hospitalizations and a positive 3.7% delta in deaths. Obviously - bad numbers for a miracle drug.

Oh, and I'm still trying to figure out how unvax can account for 6.3% of deaths while accounting for 0 cases and 0 hospitalizations. Can someone help me out with that?

Does anyone want to guess why NSW has decided to stop posting the data?



Now, here's a fused dataset of relative risk of all cause hospitalizations vs. vax status. Why is it that vaxxed cohorts have 55% - 217% increased RR of hospitalization over unvaxxed?




You would have to be a conspiracy theorist to trust this organization.

 

[PerthDomer]

UKHSA used to be the best government organization for posting raw case/hospitalization/death data for vax vs. unvaxxed. They stopped posting the data in April 2022 when case rates were 2-3x higher in vaxxed than unvaxxed. The data contradicted the narrative.

So, after that, New South Wales provided the best data set. Except, now, NSW has decided to stop posting the numbers. Take a look at the latest report:

View attachment 3052541


NSW is reporting 97.4% of the population (older than 16) with at least 1 dose, so if the vax is effective, unvax population should make up much more than 2.6% of cases, hospitalizations, and deaths. Let's run the numbers:

Percent of unvaccinated population: 2.6%
Percent of unvaxx cases: 0%
Percent of unvax hospitalizations: 0%
Percent of unvax deaths: 6.3%

So, we see worse performance in cases and hospitalizations and a positive 3.7% delta in deaths. Obviously - bad numbers for a miracle drug.

Oh, and I'm still trying to figure out how unvax can account for 6.3% of deaths while accounting for 0 cases and 0 hospitalizations. Can someone help me out with that?

Does anyone want to guess why NSW has decided to stop posting the data?

View attachment 3052542

Now, here's a fused dataset of relative risk of all cause hospitalizations vs. vax status. Why is it that vaxxed cohorts have 55% - 217% increased RR of hospitalization over unvaxxed?

View attachment 3052543


You would have to be a conspiracy theorist to trust this organization.

If you're not stratified by age/comorbidity you're going to get results that vaccines are bad. Why? People at higher risk got vaccinated more frequently than low risk people. If you're 20 and vaccinated you're less likely to die than a 20 year old unvaccinated person. If you're 65 and vaccinated you're still far higher risk than a 20 year old unvaccinated person.

In terms of that IgG subtype study, the paper itself says we really don't know what it means. On the one hand sicker patients get the vaccine type response. Did the IgG subtype compromise them? Or did they get a strong dose of virus that put them in the ICU and the immune response is downstream of that?

The clinical data we have stratified by age/comorbidity still shows vaccinated people doing better than unvaccinated. Since a big chunk of disease is caused by cytokine storm (disordered strong host inflammation response) having a dampened IgG response probably reduces that. So I'd lean towards that being a good thing.

In terms of Measles, cases are picking back up from the pandemic itself. You'd expect the sharp reduction in foreign travel/COVID NPI's to slow measles introduction in the short term. Unfortunately we're seeing some outbreaks (Columbus just had a slew of hospitalized Measles kids). COVID has disrupted vaccine programs in the 3rd world, allowing more circulation and we have more unvaccinated kids here than we have since the early 90's (before medicaid expansion a lot of poor kids didn't get reliably vaccinated and you had more outbreaks). I'd wager we'll see more big measles outbreaks in the following year.

 

[sixstar]

If you're not stratified by age/comorbidity you're going to get results that vaccines are bad. Why? People at higher risk got vaccinated more frequently than low risk people. If you're 20 and vaccinated you're less likely to die than a 20 year old unvaccinated person. If you're 65 and vaccinated you're still far higher risk than a 20 year old unvaccinated person.

Age stratified data showed the same issues before governments stopped posting it.
Separately, NSW's vax rate is so high that the age stratification shouldn't matter as much.

In terms of that IgG subtype study, the paper itself says we really don't know what it means. On the one hand sicker patients get the vaccine type response. Did the IgG subtype compromise them? Or did they get a strong dose of virus that put them in the ICU and the immune response is downstream of that?

Right, nobody knows the impact. Not the researchers, not the doctors, not the media. Is this bad? TBD. But it certainly wasn't ever discussed when media pushed "safe and effective" and shot mandates caused folks to lose jobs.

As I said, this is just one study, but it requires additional research to understand the scope and the impact.

The clinical data we have stratified by age/comorbidity still shows vaccinated people doing better than unvaccinated.

You have raw age stratified data? Can you link me please? Would love to look at it. Needs to be raw numbers, not processed data products, as those can be manipulated.

In terms of Measles, cases are picking back up from the pandemic itself. You'd expect the sharp reduction in foreign travel/COVID NPI's to slow measles introduction in the short term. Unfortunately we're seeing some outbreaks (Columbus just had a slew of hospitalized Measles kids). COVID has disrupted vaccine programs in the 3rd world, allowing more circulation and we have more unvaccinated kids here than we have since the early 90's (before medicaid expansion a lot of poor kids didn't get reliably vaccinated and you had more outbreaks). I'd wager we'll see more big measles outbreaks in the following year.

I wonder why the Australia DHAC isn't reporting any cases. Do these hospitals not report up the chain?


UK's ONS has posted age stratified all cause mortality raw data by vax status and gender. Why is all cause mortality greater (RRR > 1.0) in vaxxed cohorts almost across the board? Looking at this data, would you question whether the vax could be causing side effects leading to higher mortality rates?





UK ONS also provides limited mortality data for those < 21 days after vax. The data is only available for ages 60+ for males and 70+ for females.

Why is the all cause RRR 1.26 - 4.17x higher than unvaxxed mortality in all but 1 cohort?


and here is the comparison of boosted vs. unboosted. Similarly, we see increased RRR of all cause mortality.


Looking at the two charts above, do you have any concerns that all cause mortality RRR is higher across the board? Do you think that this could indicate safety issues with vax side effects?

 

[PerthDomer]

Age stratified data showed the same issues before governments stopped posting it.
Separately, NSW's vax rate is so high that the age stratification shouldn't matter as much.



Right, nobody knows the impact. Not the researchers, not the doctors, not the media. Is this bad? TBD. But it certainly wasn't ever discussed when media pushed "safe and effective" and shot mandates caused folks to lose jobs.

As I said, this is just one study, but it requires additional research to understand the scope and the impact.



You have raw age stratified data? Can you link me please? Would love to look at it. Needs to be raw numbers, not processed data products, as those can be manipulated.



I wonder why the Australia DHAC isn't reporting any cases. Do these hospitals not report up the chain?

Off the top of my head here's an Israeli study showing seniors with a bivalent booster had an 86% reduction in COVID related mortality. You would of course expect this to drop off as the acute antibody response went down, but there's no sign that the IgG response is anything but good for vaccine recipients.

Effectiveness of the Bivalent mRNA Vaccine in Preventing Severe COVID-19 Outcomes: An Observational Cohort Study

Background: During Late 2022, the SARS-CoV-2 Omicron BA.5 sublineages accounted for most of the sequenced viral genomes worldwide. Bivalent mRNA vaccines contai

papers.ssrn.com

The US system is very fragmented, so for this kind of research it's often easier to get information from places on Scandinavia/Israel because it's really easy to aggregate health data and get results quickly. If you think that the whole world is coordinating a conspiracy to suppress information you have more confidence in their ability to coordinate than I do.

 

[sixstar]

Off the top of my head here's an Israeli study showing seniors with a bivalent booster had an 86% reduction in COVID related mortality. You would of course expect this to drop off as the acute antibody response went down, but there's no sign that the IgG response is anything but good for vaccine recipients.

Effectiveness of the Bivalent mRNA Vaccine in Preventing Severe COVID-19 Outcomes: An Observational Cohort Study

Background: During Late 2022, the SARS-CoV-2 Omicron BA.5 sublineages accounted for most of the sequenced viral genomes worldwide. Bivalent mRNA vaccines contai

papers.ssrn.com

That study didn't analyze unvaxxed. The cohort was entirely vaxxed, so even by achieving reduction in mortality, that is reduction against vaxxed cohort.

But the study you linked actually agrees with the charts I posted. If you look at the charts, they show a similar decrease in all cause mortality in boosted vs. vaxxed/unboosted.

I'm looking for an explanation as to why all cause mortality is consistently higher in vaxxed vs. unvaxxed.

The US system is very fragmented, so for this kind of research it's often easier to get information from places on Scandinavia/Israel because it's really easy to aggregate health data and get results quickly.

Agree that US' data sucks. Now ask yourself why. The US has spent 4x more than the next 3 countries combined on COVID response. There is zero explanation as to why they couldn't collect and report data with the same fidelity as Israel, UK, and Australia.

If you think that the whole world is coordinating a conspiracy to suppress information you have more confidence in their ability to coordinate than I do.

Okay, let's debate on the actual raw data then. You in? Let's start with the charts above.

 

[sixstar]

In those charts above, you will notice that the numbers were from May 2022. You might ask why I didn't provide more recent numbers. That's because ONS stopped posting deaths by vax status in May. They still post all cause mortality, but they no longer separate it by vax status. Let's take a quick peak on all cause mortality after May 2022. Something tells me that the numbers for the vaxxed started looking even worse. Way worse.

So why did ONS stop reporting the numbers? I would love an explanation.

 

[Blazers46]

Project Veritas

 

[TorontoGold]

Wait, you mean to tell me that, a drug manufacturer is using their labs and resources to try and get ahead of the future mutations so that vaccines are ready for them? Geebus this is.....bad! This is completely different than every other trip of vaccine development....surely? Wait no, flu vaccines do this too? Ah, whatever.

A for profit company is....making a....profit? Corruption! We should limit their ability to dominate the market...wait no...that's socialism...ok yolo we can't address this issue but it's certainly an issue!

Holy hell I hope the conspiracies are correct because I'm guessing the next step in this discovery is that soap is actually bad because it's tested on animals before it is on humans. The anti-intellectual movement is a trip lmao. Hopefully my next injection is straight bleach.

 

[IRISHDODGER]

It is interesting that the Left is more pharma-friendly since COVID began whereas the right seems more pharma-unfriendly especially towards one of the few US-based companies (Pfizer). Bottom line, for the majority (this means not 100%)that rail against Big Pharma, Big Banks, Big Insurance, Big Oil…they conveniently forget that their retirement is partially dependent on those specific stocks.

 

[Blazers46]

Wait, you mean to tell me that, a drug manufacturer is using their labs and resources to try and get ahead of the future mutations so that vaccines are ready for them? Geebus this is.....bad! This is completely different than every other trip of vaccine development....surely? Wait no, flu vaccines do this too? Ah, whatever.

A for profit company is....making a....profit? Corruption! We should limit their ability to dominate the market...wait no...that's socialism...ok yolo we can't address this issue but it's certainly an issue!

Holy hell I hope the conspiracies are correct because I'm guessing the next step in this discovery is that soap is actually bad because it's tested on animals before it is on humans. The anti-intellectual movement is a trip lmao. Hopefully my next injection is straight bleach.

Covid was developed and transmitted to the world very much the same way. But fuck it, profits and my 401k...

 

[ulukinatme]

It is interesting that the Left is more pharma-friendly since COVID began whereas the right seems more pharma-unfriendly especially towards one of the few US-based companies (Pfizer). Bottom line, for the majority (this means not 100%)that rail against Big Pharma, Big Banks, Big Insurance, Big Oil…they conveniently forget that their retirement is partially dependent on those specific stocks.

My favorite part was when Democrat candidates in 2020 were skeptical of the proposed vaccine, but as soon as Biden got into office both sides flipped support/distrust of it in messaging and their respective medias basically overnight. Speaks a lot for both sides and how slimy politics are. Now publications like the Atlantic want to push for "Pandemic Amnesty" and ask forgiveness after they attacked people skeptical of the jab. We've also got this...I really thought this was satire but apparently it is not:

 

[TorontoGold]

My favorite part was when Democrat candidates in 2020 were skeptical of the proposed vaccine, but as soon as Biden got into office both sides flipped support/distrust of it in messaging and their respective medias basically overnight. Speaks a lot for both sides and how slimy politics are. Now publications like the Atlantic want to preach forgiveness for those that attacked people that were skeptical of the jab. We've also got this:

Wasn't the skepticism on the development time? and then once it came out they changed their tune after the results of it's effectiveness? Mass vaccine uptake didn't happen until Trump had left office, so I'm not sure what they're supposed to without an actual vaccine? At the end of the day, politics aside, all governments of political leaning support vaccines and there isn't any real push for a vaccine, and ask yourself why anti-vaxx personalities are still in the news. Grifters are going to grift.

 

[bobbyok1]

My favorite part was when Democrat candidates in 2020 were skeptical of the proposed vaccine, but as soon as Biden got into office both sides flipped support/distrust of it in messaging and their respective medias basically overnight. Speaks a lot for both sides and how slimy politics are. Now publications like the Atlantic want to push for "Pandemic Amnesty" and ask forgiveness after they attacked people skeptical of the jab. We've also got this...I really thought this was satire but apparently it is not:

Don't think that is a real article. Plenty online that shows it being a fake.

This is supposed to be the real original article

COVID: unvaccinated people may be seen as ‘free riders’ and face discrimination

A new study has looked at more than 15,000 people across 21 countries to assess whether vaccinated and unvaccinated people discriminate against each other.

theconversation.com

 

[ACamp1900]

Project Veritas

Spoiler: it’ll be about how the video was taken if anything at all

 

[Irish#1]

 

[PerthDomer]

I just watched a really good video on conspiracy theories/conspiratorial thinking.



Conspiracy theories are separate from partisanship. Different people are differently predisposed to consider evidence as coincidence/not.

In the early 2000s 40% of dems agreed 9/11 was an inside job at some level. A large part of that motivation was wanting to think the other side false flagged us into the War On Terror.

I think an under appreciated thing with Trump is that on economic policy he was actually the most moderate GOP candidate. He appealed to some culturally right wing stuff and people who are more conspiratorial inclined.

So someone like me who voted for Romney was a big Biden Fan. Joe Rogan was a Bernie Fan who's now red pilled.

The dems are now the establishment/institutional party as much as the left wing one and the opposite for the right.

Suffice to say, if we get another Pandemic in 20 years I could see opposite partisan alignment on how to handle it. Left wing people used to own the antivaxx movement but it swung to the right (this was going on pre pandemic). Nothing to say it won't swing back the other way.

 

[Blazers46]

I just watched a really good video on conspiracy theories/conspiratorial thinking.



Conspiracy theories are separate from partisanship. Different people are differently predisposed to consider evidence as coincidence/not.

In the early 2000s 40% of dems agreed 9/11 was an inside job at some level. A large part of that motivation was wanting to think the other side false flagged us into the War On Terror.

I think an under appreciated thing with Trump is that on economic policy he was actually the most moderate GOP candidate. He appealed to some culturally right wing stuff and people who are more conspiratorial inclined.

So someone like me who voted for Romney was a big Biden Fan. Joe Rogan was a Bernie Fan who's now red pilled.

The dems are now the establishment/institutional party as much as the left wing one and the opposite for the right.

Suffice to say, if we get another Pandemic in 20 years I could see opposite partisan alignment on how to handle it. Left wing people used to own the antivaxx movement but it swung to the right (this was going on pre pandemic). Nothing to say it won't swing back the other way.

100%. I remember when all my left-wing friends were all about distrusting government and now they are wanting more government.

 

[PerthDomer]

100%. I remember when all my left-wing friends were all about distrusting government and now they are wanting more government.

Not to get too off topic, but I find the conspiracies about the fed from the right funny. Before the fed, the left was convinced the gold standard was part of a british/globalist conspiracy to keep interest rates high and crush main street to enrich wall street. Now the right is convinced the fed is a globalist conspiracy trying to keep interest rates low to crush main street and enrich wall street.

 

[sixstar]

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