COVID-19

[Armyirish47]

He would have had his heart tested just because he's LeBron's kid?

Surely they do that at the facility where LeBron picks up his adrenochrome.

 

[TorontoGold]

I'm not buying this. Media keeps pushing like it's a normal thing and it was always happening, but not this often and this many young healthy people. I'd find it hard to believe that LeBron James would have a kid that has an undiagnosed heart issue that was missed prior to now. He's one of the richest athletes in the world with every advantage available to him. Social media isn't a new concept, I feel like we would have been hearing more about famous young athletes dropping from cardiac arrest in the past if this was a normal thing.

Would be interested to see what proof there is for supporting this position. I wonder if the loudest fringe voices in the media are contributing to this media push of sudden cardiac events.

A 2021 observational study involving 1,597 athletes who had COVID-19 found that 37 of them (2.3%Trusted Source) had diagnosable myocarditis and possible myocarditis.

A 2022 study found this rate to be higher — 4%Trusted Source — for athletes who underwent cardiac magnetic resonance (CMR) testing.

Researchers in a 2021 studyTrusted Source investigated the association between vaccination and myocarditis among 4,931,775 people who received the vaccine.

They found that on average, there were 5.7 events of myocarditis or myopericarditis per 100,000 vaccinated people. That is 0.0057 of a percent.

Athletes Dying of Heart Attacks: How Common Is It?

Heart attacks on the playing field are fairly uncommon, but it's still a good idea to learn about them, especially if you are an athlete with a heart condition. Here's what you need to know.

www.healthline.com

 

[AKRowdy]

I'm not buying this. Media keeps pushing like it's a normal thing and it was always happening, but not this often and this many young healthy people. I'd find it hard to believe that LeBron James would have a kid that has an undiagnosed heart issue that was missed prior to now. He's one of the richest athletes in the world with every advantage available to him. Social media isn't a new concept, I feel like we would have been hearing more about famous young athletes dropping from cardiac arrest in the past if this was a normal thing.

A lot of genetic issues are not found/ looked for until one of these events occur. Even screening ECGs may not pick up on these issues. Ultrasounds are not indicated without symptoms or significant family history. I mean if the James family doesn’t have any family history of cardiac disease why would they think any different? Just live a healthy life style, etc.
The interesting thing will be if NIL makes athletes undergo medical screens similar to the big league contracts.

 

[PerthDomer]

I don't regret getting the vaccine but at some point these things keep happening at a rate we never saw pre-COVID

This sort of thing is actually more common than you'd think. I saw a few sudden cardiac collapses in previously health kids pre covid. It's why all sports stadiums have AEDs and why we've pushed so hard to have high schools outfitted with them.

 

[PerthDomer]

Would be interested to see what proof there is for supporting this position. I wonder if the loudest fringe voices in the media are contributing to this media push of sudden cardiac events.

Athletes Dying of Heart Attacks: How Common Is It?

Heart attacks on the playing field are fairly uncommon, but it's still a good idea to learn about them, especially if you are an athlete with a heart condition. Here's what you need to know.

www.healthline.com

Myocarditis is generally a pretty rare cause of cardiac arrest in sporting events. Generally you feel like crap and aren't able to practice. That tends to kill people in other settings.

More common are structural or rhythm abnormalities that don't cause symptoms before the event. We screen athletes, but screening isn't perfect. Some of the causes don't even get picked up with perfect screening/pre testing.



This has a good link to data. There hasn't been a significant change in under 35 yo cardiac arrest mortality in the last 20 years. Deaths of athletes during sports actually drives this number (and always has)

 

[yankeehater]

Myocarditis is generally a pretty rare cause of cardiac arrest in sporting events. Generally you feel like crap and aren't able to practice. That tends to kill people in other settings.

More common are structural or rhythm abnormalities that don't cause symptoms before the event. We screen athletes, but screening isn't perfect. Some of the causes don't even get picked up with perfect screening/pre testing.



This has a good link to data. There hasn't been a significant change in under 35 yo cardiac arrest mortality in the last 20 years. Deaths of athletes during sports actually drives this number (and always has)

What has happened to the rate of cardiac events? Bronny would not show on that list nor would the kid from the Bills. Maybe the rate has not shown significant change because, as you stated, a lot of these locations are now supplied with AEDs. Our office has one and we didn't have it 10 years ago. Same with the gym I work out in.

Is there a rise in blood clots? Seems like every day there is a report of a new major profile person experiencing them.

 

[ulukinatme]

Myocarditis is generally a pretty rare cause of cardiac arrest in sporting events. Generally you feel like crap and aren't able to practice. That tends to kill people in other settings.

More common are structural or rhythm abnormalities that don't cause symptoms before the event. We screen athletes, but screening isn't perfect. Some of the causes don't even get picked up with perfect screening/pre testing.



This has a good link to data. There hasn't been a significant change in under 35 yo cardiac arrest mortality in the last 20 years. Deaths of athletes during sports actually drives this number (and always has)

Maybe not more deaths, but it feels like there's more episodes. You've got Bronny, Damar Hamlin, a number of soccer players, all young healthy athletes that are suddenly dropping.

 

[PerthDomer]

Maybe not more deaths, but it feels like there's more episodes. You've got Bronny, Damar Hamlin, a number of soccer players, all young healthy athletes that are suddenly dropping.

List of association football players who died during their careers - Wikipedia

en.m.wikipedia.org

We were averaging 10 FIFA deaths in game/practice per year in 2017, 2018, 2019. People are just more primed to pay attention now.

Hamlin got commotio cordis which is rare, but unrelated to covid or the vaccine. Just wrong place wrong time right force in the right spot.

 

[GATTACA!]

List of association football players who died during their careers - Wikipedia

en.m.wikipedia.org

We were averaging 10 FIFA deaths in game/practice per year in 2017, 2018, 2019. People are just more primed to pay attention now.

Hamlin got commotio cordis which is rare, but unrelated to covid or the vaccine. Just wrong place wrong time right force in the right spot.

I was shocked how seemingly common that is in baseball.

 

[sixstar]

Hamlin got commotio cordis which is rare, but unrelated to covid or the vaccine. Just wrong place wrong time right force in the right spot.

Unverified.

If it was CC, why didn't he just say it?

 

[Lberry]

This sort of thing is actually more common than you'd think. I saw a few sudden cardiac collapses in previously health kids pre covid. It's why all sports stadiums have AEDs and why we've pushed so hard to have high schools outfitted with them.

List of association football players who died during their careers - Wikipedia

en.m.wikipedia.org

We were averaging 10 FIFA deaths in game/practice per year in 2017, 2018, 2019. People are just more primed to pay attention now.

Hamlin got commotio cordis which is rare, but unrelated to covid or the vaccine. Just wrong place wrong time right force in the right spot.

Why were there 100+ FIFA deaths in 2021?

Is a 1,000X increase a good sign? Not a doctor.

 

[PerthDomer]

Unverified.

If it was CC, why didn't he just say it?

He values his privacy? Near death experiences are generally traumatic. He may want to avoid discussion of some specific details to avoid further conversations.

Most other causes would stop you from playing sports again, so given what we saw Commotio Cordis is by far most likely explanation.

 

[PerthDomer]

Why were there 100+ FIFA deaths in 2021?

Is a 1,000X increase a good sign? Not a doctor.

There were 18 in game deaths in 2021, 2 in 2020. The 2020 season was shortened due to COVID. So some may have been deaths that would have happened in 2020 deferred to 2021 (or just randomness). A few deaths were head trauma related as well, so really unrelated to covid infection or potential vaccine side effects.

2022 only had 8 game/practice related deaths.

Also remember that in the US we didn't get general vaccine availability until June 2021. That was several months later in the rest of the world. Vaccine uptake was also relatively low in the under 30 crowd.

 

[sixstar]

lol - why would someone who values privacy go on a nationally televised interview to discuss the incident?

CC is only "by far the most likely explanation" if you want it to be. Several factors argue against CC, including age and bluntness of impact, which, as an unbiased party, you should be willing to admit.

Do I think Hamlin's SCA was caused by the vax? No clue one way or the other because there isn't enough information to confidently reach a conclusion. But to rule it out is arguing in bad faith.

 

[GATTACA!]

Why were there 100+ FIFA deaths in 2021?

Is a 1,000X increase a good sign? Not a doctor.

I count 17 on that list.

 

[Lberry]

There were 18 in game deaths in 2021, 2 in 2020. The 2020 season was shortened due to COVID. So some may have been deaths that would have happened in 2020 deferred to 2021 (or just randomness). A few deaths were head trauma related as well, so really unrelated to covid infection or potential vaccine side effects.

2022 only had 8 game/practice related deaths.

Also remember that in the US we didn't get general vaccine availability until June 2021. That was several months later in the rest of the world. Vaccine uptake was also relatively low in the under 30 crowd.

But 10 died in previous years, and 108 in next year.

And that's nothing to you? Or what were the total FIFA deaths in 2017-2019, regardless of on field/off?

Cause i believe that 10 is all. Maybe I'm wrong.

 

[PerthDomer]

lol - why would someone who values privacy go on a nationally televised interview to discuss the incident?

CC is only "by far the most likely explanation" if you want it to be. Several factors argue against CC, including age and bluntness of impact, which, as an unbiased party, you should be willing to admit.

Do I think Hamlin's SCA was caused by the vax? No clue one way or the other because there isn't enough information to confidently reach a conclusion. But to rule it out is arguing in bad faith.

Commotio cordic clusters in teens because they play competitive sports more often. Few people keep playing after their teens but he did as a professional athlete.

Smaller/faster objects are more commonly seen (baseball/hockey puck) but blunt force to the chest can cause it as well. Out of sports assault, car crashes, or even sledding have cased it.

What is commotio cordis, which NFL player Damar Hamlin says stopped his heart?

Buffalo Bills safety Damar Hamlin says commotio cordis caused his "Monday Night Football" collapse. Here's an explanation of the rare, heart-stopping condition.

www.heart.org

The other reason I'm pretty confident it's CC is that almost any other cause would rule out playing sports again. Most other causes would leave you at risk to arrest again and the league wouldn't clear you to return.

And the issue with answering one question is that it'd invite more. He may have some things he just doesn't want to talk about.

 

[AKRowdy]

lol - why would someone who values privacy go on a nationally televised interview to discuss the incident?

CC is only "by far the most likely explanation" if you want it to be. Several factors argue against CC, including age and bluntness of impact, which, as an unbiased party, you should be willing to admit.

Do I think Hamlin's SCA was caused by the vax? No clue one way or the other because there isn't enough information to confidently reach a conclusion. But to rule it out is arguing in bad faith.

Dude got a shoulder to the chest. Idk if he’s cleared to play again it can be really anything else? Age he is close to the age range (8-18 is most common likely from the number of kids playing competitive athletics) so take that out of it. And these athletes don’t owe the general public anything, especially their own healthcare information.

 

[NDdomer2]

Unverified.

If it was CC, why didn't he just say it?

just because he doesnt say what caused it doesnt automatically = COVID VAC either

 

[PerthDomer]

But 10 died in previous years, and 108 in next year.

And that's nothing to you? Or what were the total FIFA deaths in 2017-2019, regardless of on field/off?

Cause i believe that 10 is all. Maybe I'm wrong.

On/related to games/practice you have

2022: 8
2021: 18
2020: 2
2019:10
2018: 9
2017: 10

Where the hell are you getting 100?

 

[yankeehater]

He values his privacy? Near death experiences are generally traumatic. He may want to avoid discussion of some specific details to avoid further conversations.

Most other causes would stop you from playing sports again, so given what we saw Commotio Cordis is by far most likely explanation.

Hank Gathers was prescribed a beta blocker and cleared to play. He wasn't even making money at the time (future hopes to). With the amount of money involved in sports, you can find a doctor somewhere that will clear you.

 

[PerthDomer]

Hank Gathers was prescribed a beta blocker and cleared to play. He wasn't even making money at the time (future hopes to). With the amount of money involved in sports, you can find a doctor somewhere that will clear you.

The issue is the league. Remember the Armstrong bros? They were both gonna come, but ND wouldn't clear the older brother. He found somewhere else to play but the NFL wouldn't take him. Pro leagues won't touch you with these conditions any more.

Hank also couldn't play initially until they reduced his dose to what was probably a sub therapeutic level. Then he died.

 

[sixstar]

just because he doesnt say what caused it doesnt automatically = COVID VAC either

where did i make that argument?

 

[Lberry]

On/related to games/practice you have

2022: 8
2021: 18
2020: 2
2019:10
2018: 9
2017: 10

Where the hell are you getting 100?

Everywhere on the internet, spin the wheel.

 

[sixstar]

A 2021 observational study involving 1,597 athletes who had COVID-19 found that 37 of them (2.3%Trusted Source) had diagnosable myocarditis and possible myocarditis.

A 2022 study found this rate to be higher — 4%Trusted Source — for athletes who underwent cardiac magnetic resonance (CMR) testing.

Researchers in a 2021 studyTrusted Source investigated the association between vaccination and myocarditis among 4,931,775 people who received the vaccine.

They found that on average, there were 5.7 events of myocarditis or myopericarditis per 100,000 vaccinated people. That is 0.0057 of a percent.

Are we going to ignore the countries that stopped administering the shots to adolescents due to links to myo/peri?

If we are using national data sets, Western Australia's national data shows much higher rates... 11.9 and 18.4 per 100k for Pfizer and Moderna. Look at Vaxzevria data at comparison...

 

[TorontoGold]

Would be interested to see what proof there is for supporting this position. I wonder if the loudest fringe voices in the media are contributing to this media push of sudden cardiac events.

Athletes Dying of Heart Attacks: How Common Is It?

Heart attacks on the playing field are fairly uncommon, but it's still a good idea to learn about them, especially if you are an athlete with a heart condition. Here's what you need to know.

www.healthline.com

@ulukinatme - just following up on the risks you are speaking of. Wondering if you have data to share that would show an increase in myocarditis from athletes and why that gives you pause about vaccines?

Q&A: COVID-19, Vaccines, and Myocarditis

Benefits of COVID-19 vaccines outweigh a very small risk of heart complications

covid19.nih.gov

 

[PerthDomer]

Are we going to ignore the countries that stopped administering the shots to adolescents due to links to myo/peri?

If we are using national data sets, Western Australia's national data shows much higher rates... 11.9 and 18.4 per 100k for Pfizer and Moderna. Look at Vaxzevria data at comparison...

View attachment 3053939

The thing you find is that all myocarditis is not created equal. Viral (and especially COVID) myocarditis kills and maims at a higher rate than vaccine induced myocarditis. In the scheme of things it's a relatively low rate even compared to covid mortality in the healthy teens/young adults.

In 10 years the recommendation is likely going to be a 3 or 4 shot series starting at 6 months with boosters in 65+ and high risk. Prepubescent kids have the lowest vaccine morbidity and now that everyone has built some immunity, you're likely to see the highest mortality among under 2 year olds and 65+.

 

[Lberry]

There is a reason there is no clear proof and the "show me" people will never see that.

There's a reason two people I know in their 30s dropped dead the week of, and never counted towards any count.

There's a reason no one on this board is aware of or follow Peter Mccullough, the most cited Cardiologist in history.

When you spend as much energy "explaining away" with state approved "data" as you would seeing what's obvious, your draw would drop. But some people still believe the official record.

 

[RDU Irish]

There is a reason there is no clear proof and the "show me" people will never see that.

There's a reason two people I know in their 30s dropped dead the week of, and never counted towards any count.

There's a reason no one on this board is aware of or follow Peter Mccullough, the most cited Cardiologist in history.

When you spend as much energy "explaining away" with state approved "data" as you would seeing what's obvious, your draw would drop. But some people still believe the official record.

Didn't the CDC reclassify a third of Covid deaths recently? Was that a legit thing or another tinfoil hat misinfo fest?

 

[Lberry]

Pfizer knew