Clark Lea - Defensive Coordinator

Irish YJ

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Well, he didn't inherit Jones. Currie fired Jones and had an agreement in place to get Leach, but Phil worked back channels with the BoT to basically cockblock Currie and Leach (not important whether that was "right" or not, he went backdoor to get his way which hints to how he would be if he was your boss). Currie was then fired and Phil stepped in and botched the entire process, finally getting someone to agree to be coach. The rumors have been consistent for some time that Phil is very "hands on" and has an omnipresence around the football office. Not in a good way I should add. For Phil, it's about UT and Phil, not just UT. All AD's have ego's, but this is on another level.

Leach said himself the meeting with Currie really didn't go anywhere. IIRC, Currie went off the reservation even flying out to meet with Leach and didn't have approval from the Chancellor or anyone else. That's on top of the Schiano scandal. I don't have an issue with either Leach or Schiano to be honest, but Currie seemed to invite his demise.

As far as Phil being hands on, I don't see that as an excuse for poor performance. I agree though if he's heavy handed, it's not a good look for incoming coaches. At the same time, UT hasn't won 10 games in a season since Phil was coach, so I can understand a bit of micro management.

BTW, when I said inherited Jones, I meant the general situation, and meant he wasn't a Fulmer hire.

Meanwhile, you have a fanbase that is passionate, but irrational. If Lea would go 8-4 (similar to ole Butch), they will run him out of town (and that is likely given the schedule they would have, so long as Saban is around). The school has finished in the top 10 one time this millennium. The run in the mid-late 90's was fantastic, but the SEC was a 2 team league at that point. It was UF/UT. Bama was at the end of the Stallings era before they went to the abyss, UGA was languishing under Goff and Jimmy D, LSU was untapped potential and Auburn was cheating but still losing 4+ a year. The SEC is just so much different now and while there is obviously a significant amount of talent in the SE, UT doesn't have "home state" advantage like LSU / UF / UGA does. It's an uphill climb thru and thru.

There's some great talent in TN, and they've been doing pretty darn good recruiting.

And all fanbases are irrational. If they weren't, they wouldn't be trying to get back to the 90s form. Do you expect them to say "hey, we shouldn't try to win because GA and FL are in our division"? FL just started coming on. UGA is looking all that great, and has never been able to get over the hump. They've ruled over a lot of mediocrity, and lost to FL who really didn't have a good D.

I would much rather be at a school that a) doesn't have to play a guaranteed 3 games against the top 15 b) will pay me well (all the schools I mentioned would be over $3M per year) c) appreciate, but not demand, 9 wins annually

Plus, if you win 8-9 games a year, you will have your pick of top 10-15 jobs when they open. If your goal is to win a championship in your next spot, UT would have the best chance. But if your goal is to win a championship at some point, I would use some of the other schools as a stepping stone to something more. Matt Campbell isn't winning a championship at ISU. But Pruitt (or Butch or Dooley or Lane Train) isn't winning one at UT either. But Campbell at Texas would have a much better chance of a title than Campbell at Tennessee.

I agree if he's playing the long game, there might be other lesser schools to go to that might be a better, but weaker stepping stone.

If he's confident though, and a good coach, he'll have every resource at his disposal at TN.

BTW, Lane had TN going in the right direction. He's a bag of dicks, but the team was recruiting well, and playing well under him. I had season tix that year. Most losses were very close, even against Florida (who I think was #1 when they played) and Bama (who was #1 at that point). They also smoked UGA.
 

T-Boone

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As in, you just haven’t listened or read them or you don’t think he’s done them?

Haha, yeah I assume he doesn't do them.
I really don't think it would be post worthy for me to notify the thread of the former.
 

ulukinatme

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The Vandy job will always be there for Lea. I may be a bit biased, but he'd be in a much better position waiting for BK to retire.
 

phillyirish

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Leach said himself the meeting with Currie really didn't go anywhere. IIRC, Currie went off the reservation even flying out to meet with Leach and didn't have approval from the Chancellor or anyone else. That's on top of the Schiano scandal. I don't have an issue with either Leach or Schiano to be honest, but Currie seemed to invite his demise.

As far as Phil being hands on, I don't see that as an excuse for poor performance. I agree though if he's heavy handed, it's not a good look for incoming coaches. At the same time, UT hasn't won 10 games in a season since Phil was coach, so I can understand a bit of micro management.

BTW, when I said inherited Jones, I meant the general situation, and meant he wasn't a Fulmer hire.



There's some great talent in TN, and they've been doing pretty darn good recruiting.

And all fanbases are irrational. If they weren't, they wouldn't be trying to get back to the 90s form. Do you expect them to say "hey, we shouldn't try to win because GA and FL are in our division"? FL just started coming on. UGA is looking all that great, and has never been able to get over the hump. They've ruled over a lot of mediocrity, and lost to FL who really didn't have a good D.



I agree if he's playing the long game, there might be other lesser schools to go to that might be a better, but weaker stepping stone.

If he's confident though, and a good coach, he'll have every resource at his disposal at TN.

BTW, Lane had TN going in the right direction. He's a bag of dicks, but the team was recruiting well, and playing well under him. I had season tix that year. Most losses were very close, even against Florida (who I think was #1 when they played) and Bama (who was #1 at that point). They also smoked UGA.

I don’t think Butch Jones should have been fired. He was getting the occasional upset against the SEC elite, snapped the 11 game losing streak vs Florida (which began well into Fulmer’s coaching tenure) and posted back to back 9 win seasons only to be fired before the end of the following year.

Tennessee does a great job recruiting, and most of it doesn’t even come from their own state. Only 2 of their 4-5 stars commits are from Tennessee and they don’t have any of the top 5 in state guys locked up. Yet they are currently rated 15th by 247 in total team talent, only issue is that’s only good enough for 7th in the SEC.

They’ve looked awful this year, but I’m not sure they’ll move on from Pruitt yet but when they do they will probably want somebody with a proven track record rather than another coordinator.
 

Irish#1

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As long as Phat Phil is still around, I don't see UT as all that attractive. It's better than Vandy no doubt, but I would put other jobs ahead of it if they were to open (Iowa State, NC State, L'ville, etc). Basically, UT has a bigger name and brand appeal. But if I were a first time coach, I wouldn't want to climb out of the whole UT is in (including dealing with Phil) while having to go against UGA, UF and Bama each year. There are places that can pay near the same amount that offers a much better path to success and the ultimate goal of landing a T1 job. Pruitt was Clark Lea at one point, but with better recruiting chops. I think there is/was a reason why other people turned them down before. Nothing has changed except Mullen killing it at UF.

I don't see any of those schools more attractive that Tenn. UoL comes the closes, but it's a basketball school first. Coaches are driven and don't like to be told they can't do something, so he could have the "F@ck 'em, "I'll show them the Vols can be good again." attitude.
 

Free Manera

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I feel like when Clark does leave, Mickens is going to get the job. Continuity has been working for the program, and he is probably ready.

I don't think the coach-in-waiting stuff is realistic. You can't bet on that if you are Clark. What if Kelly stays 10 more years? I just hope he doesn't go to a destination job (sorry Clark) so we still have a shot at him down the road.
 

irishff1014

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I think that would be a really good get for them. He's a hot name and would probably be willing to test the waters of taking on Vandy.

If Pruitt gets the boot in Tennessee, I wonder if Lea would jump to that if offered?

Could possibly be said about Texas too. Him and Elko recruiting the same players. Yikes. Not sure Texas would hire him but Herman looks to be a bad hire so far.
 

DONALDIII

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Can someone tell me what makes Lea a big get for HC? He has DC'd well for a few years. He was a linebackers coach before that. I don't understand how his resume is superior to many, especially head coaches at G5 schools having success.
 

Polish Leppy 22

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Why not?

You have to at least consider Elston, surely. His familiarity with the Elko/Lea system + players love him...

I'm not saying it's an automatic hire. But it's an automatic "must think about it" situation.

Same reasons Tony Alford is still a RB coach and not an OC.
 

TorontoGold

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Could possibly be said about Texas too. Him and Elko recruiting the same players. Yikes. Not sure Texas would hire him but Herman looks to be a bad hire so far.

Could you imagine Lea running wild with all that talent there? Damn, but as an ND fan would love to see him succeed at B level job before taking the reins from BK.
 

Irishize

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Well, he didn't inherit Jones. Currie fired Jones and had an agreement in place to get Leach, but Phil worked back channels with the BoT to basically cockblock Currie and Leach (not important whether that was "right" or not, he went backdoor to get his way which hints to how he would be if he was your boss). Currie was then fired and Phil stepped in and botched the entire process, finally getting someone to agree to be coach. The rumors have been consistent for some time that Phil is very "hands on" and has an omnipresence around the football office. Not in a good way I should add. For Phil, it's about UT and Phil, not just UT. All AD's have ego's, but this is on another level.

Meanwhile, you have a fanbase that is passionate, but irrational. If Lea would go 8-4 (similar to ole Butch), they will run him out of town (and that is likely given the schedule they would have, so long as Saban is around). The school has finished in the top 10 one time this millennium. The run in the mid-late 90's was fantastic, but the SEC was a 2 team league at that point. It was UF/UT. Bama was at the end of the Stallings era before they went to the abyss, UGA was languishing under Goff and Jimmy D, LSU was untapped potential and Auburn was cheating but still losing 4+ a year. The SEC is just so much different now and while there is obviously a significant amount of talent in the SE, UT doesn't have "home state" advantage like LSU / UF / UGA does. It's an uphill climb thru and thru.

I would much rather be at a school that a) doesn't have to play a guaranteed 3 games against the top 15 b) will pay me well (all the schools I mentioned would be over $3M per year) c) appreciate, but not demand, 9 wins annually

Plus, if you win 8-9 games a year, you will have your pick of top 10-15 jobs when they open. If your goal is to win a championship in your next spot, UT would have the best chance. But if your goal is to win a championship at some point, I would use some of the other schools as a stepping stone to something more. Matt Campbell isn't winning a championship at ISU. But Pruitt (or Butch or Dooley or Lane Train) isn't winning one at UT either. But Campbell at Texas would have a much better chance of a title than Campbell at Tennessee.

This^

I was surprised to hear Andy Staples echo your sentiment about the irrational fan base. He took it a step further by saying it may be the “toughest FBS job around” b/c of how irrational they are. He noted that EVERY word spoken and EVERY move made is documented & talked about ad nauseam. Yes, all fan bases are irrational but Staples was pretty adamant about how overboard the UT one can be.

Don’t forget when Fulmer had his successful run in the 1990s, he was recruiting nationally b/c the state of TN isn’t the same hotbed of recruiting as LA, MS, GA or FL. Fulmer was always competitive out in CA for big names, too. Had Butch Jones won the SEC East the year they beat UF & UGA, he’s likely still there but it wasn’t meant to be. I assume Butch is still w/ Charlie Strong at Nick Saban’s Half-way House for Fired Coaches.
 

Rogue219

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1. First question I ask Clark Lea on a job interview: who are you hiring as your offensive coordinator.

2. Maybe Vanderbilt interviews some other people and likes one or two of them better than they like Clark Lea? I guess the thought occured to me it COULD happen. Might also be possible that Lea isn't interested in going to Vanderbilt. James Franklin won there, and he's a shady ass person as far as I'm concerned, but otherwise it is a tough place to win. Still a better job than Kansas, though. Barf.

3. One way or another, he is going to move on at some point, be it as a head coach or maybe he pulls an Elko for more money as a DC at a football factory job (or maybe the NFL is possible?). Maybe now is not the time and Vanderbilt is not the place.
 

NorthDakota

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This^

I was surprised to hear Andy Staples echo your sentiment about the irrational fan base. He took it a step further by saying it may be the “toughest FBS job around” b/c of how irrational they are. He noted that EVERY word spoken and EVERY move made is documented & talked about ad nauseam. Yes, all fan bases are irrational but Staples was pretty adamant about how overboard the UT one can be.

Don’t forget when Fulmer had his successful run in the 1990s, he was recruiting nationally b/c the state of TN isn’t the same hotbed of recruiting as LA, MS, GA or FL. Fulmer was always competitive out in CA for big names, too. Had Butch Jones won the SEC East the year they beat UF & UGA, he’s likely still there but it wasn’t meant to be. I assume Butch is still w/ Charlie Strong at Nick Saban’s Half-way House for Fired Coaches.

I like to think ND fans are a bit irrational and delusional but yeah I got no idea how a UT fan rolls out of bed in the morning, looks himself in the mirror and says "we should win 10 games a year minimum and should be regularly winning the conference."
 

Dizzyphil

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I like to think ND fans are a bit irrational and delusional but yeah I got no idea how a UT fan rolls out of bed in the morning, looks himself in the mirror and says "we should win 10 games a year minimum and should be regularly winning the conference."




Because they have just as much of a delusional AD....



<samp class="EmbedCode-container"><code class="EmbedCode-code"><blockquote class="twitter-tweet"><p lang="en" dir="ltr">Phillip Fulmer: "The Vols are back". <a href="https://twitter.com/hashtag/Vols?src=hash&ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">#Vols</a> <a href="https://twitter.com/hashtag/NSD20?src=hash&ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">#NSD20</a> <a href="https://t.co/jXTKtsCebv">pic.twitter.com/jXTKtsCebv</a></p>— Marshall Hughes (@marshallhughes) <a href="https://twitter.com/marshallhughes/status/1225280991222288385?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">February 6, 2020</a></blockquote> <script async src="https://platform.twitter.com/widgets.js" charset="utf-8"></script> </code></samp>
 

zelezo vlk

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I wouldn't blame Lea for going to Vandy, he has strong ties to the area and it's his alma mater for goodness sake.

But let's be honest, winning at Vandy is hard. The SEC East is significantly harder than it was back when James Franklin coached there, and the odds are greatly stacked against you. If you want Vandy to be your "forever home" a la Snyder at K State, then that's fine for a coach. But if your ultimate end goal is to be coaching at a blue blood, and we have every reason to think that Lea would love to be the ND head coach, then maybe Vandy isn't a great move.

Heck this could be a Barry Alvarez move in the 90s, where he went to Wisconsin to resurrect that program. By the time Barry got it up and running, Davie had already kicked Holtz out. What could have been...
 

Armyirish47

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I wouldn't blame Lea for going to Vandy, he has strong ties to the area and it's his alma mater for goodness sake.

But let's be honest, winning at Vandy is hard. The SEC East is significantly harder than it was back when James Franklin coached there, and the odds are greatly stacked against you. If you want Vandy to be your "forever home" a la Snyder at K State, then that's fine for a coach. But if your ultimate end goal is to be coaching at a blue blood, and we have every reason to think that Lea would love to be the ND head coach, then maybe Vandy isn't a great move.

Heck this could be a Barry Alvarez move in the 90s, where he went to Wisconsin to resurrect that program. By the time Barry got it up and running, Davie had already kicked Holtz out. What could have been...


I think a somewhat realistic best case scenario is as follows:

1. Vandy hires Clawson from Wake

B. Wake hires Lea

III. Lea builds his recruiting profile and the Defense and takes Wake up just slightly in the ACC for 3 years, but not TOO high, learns the hard lessons, etc.

Profit! Lea returns to ND in 2025 to keep the party going.
 

zelezo vlk

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I think a somewhat realistic best case scenario is as follows:

1. Vandy hires Clawson from Wake

B. Wake hires Lea

III. Lea builds his recruiting profile and the Defense and takes Wake up just slightly in the ACC for 3 years, but not TOO high, learns the hard lessons, etc.

Profit! Lea returns to ND in 2025 to keep the party going.

Yeah honestly Clawson seems like a good hire for Vandy. You gotta think he'd be a great cultural fit and he's consistently developing QBs and receivers. If he could've kept Elko more, there's a legit chance Wake would have won double digit games. Which is insane at Wake!

For as much as we're talking about Vandy being a dead end job, Wake should be just as much of one. I think Lax said that Wake Forest may be the hardest job in P5 considering they're 4th in their state, have academic requirements, and uninspiring facilities. Clawson should be commended for how well he's done there.
 

Rogue219

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Dave Clawson leaving Wake Forest for Vanderbilt would be career suicide. I am trying to understand how that is a plausible move for him.
 

dublinirish

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Monken to Vandy running the triple option or a variant of it would be hilarious when all the other SEC coaches complain about them
 

Pops Freshenmeyer

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I think a somewhat realistic best case scenario is as follows:

1. Vandy hires Clawson from Wake

B. Wake hires Lea

III. Lea builds his recruiting profile and the Defense and takes Wake up just slightly in the ACC for 3 years, but not TOO high, learns the hard lessons, etc.

Profit! Lea returns to ND in 2025 to keep the party going.

I would be less upset about Lea taking the Wake job.

My fear of the Vandy job is that if he goes there and he is successful (by Vanderbilt standards) he would be unlikely to spurn his hometown school and alma mater for ND. I have no such fears about Wake Forest.
 

Armyirish47

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Dave Clawson leaving Wake Forest for Vanderbilt would be career suicide. I am trying to understand how that is a plausible move for him.

SEC > ACC

From what I saw Clawson only makes 2.1 million while Mason made at least 3.5.

If he improves them back to a consistent bowl team it launches him to upper tier job.

Nashville has hot chicken, which is awesome.

What else you need?
 

Wingman Ray

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I would be less upset about Lea taking the Wake job.

My fear of the Vandy job is that if he goes there and he is successful (by Vanderbilt standards) he would be unlikely to spurn his hometown school and alma mater for ND. I have no such fears about Wake Forest.

Vandy is a no win situation. Anyone taking that job has to know .500 is a dream year. .30 is much more likely. I cannot imagine anyone wanting to go to Vandy unless they had zero other coaching options.

Fact is if ND doesnt lock this guy down, they are complete and utter fools that deserve what they get. This guy is a once in a decade or more hire and if they let him go, then something is really, really wrong. It isnt like ND doesnt have the money either. Take Lea away and ND is a .500 team this year using the coaches BK has chosen in the past to run the defense.
 

Rogue219

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SEC > ACC

From what I saw Clawson only makes 2.1 million while Mason made at least 3.5.

If he improves them back to a consistent bowl team it launches him to upper tier job.

Nashville has hot chicken, which is awesome.

What else you need?

It's Vanderbilt, not the SEC. Come on.

Doing this strictly for the money he may as well wait for Kansas to open up since Lester makes $3.3M.

Dave Clawson isn't leaving Wake to go to Vanderbilt to satisfy an ND's fans timeline where Lea goes to Wake and winds up back at ND as HC. Now back to talking about Tennessee and Texas' delusional fanbases.
 

Armyirish47

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It's Vanderbilt, not the SEC. Come on.

Doing this strictly for the money he may as well wait for Kansas to open up since Lester makes $3.3M.

Dave Clawson isn't leaving Wake to go to Vanderbilt to satisfy an ND's fans timeline where Lea goes to Wake and winds up back at ND as HC. Now back to talking about Tennessee and Texas' delusional fanbases.



How dare you.

It's not strictly for the money, there is also hot chicken.

I was just throwing out a somewhat realistic scenario, as per my original post. It has nothing to do with satisfying anything. Trollolol.
 

Rogue219

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Monken to Vandy running the triple option or a variant of it would be hilarious when all the other SEC coaches complain about them

I have seen this suggested as a new path for Vanderbilt multiple times over the years. It isn't all that far fetched considering the situation they're in with their academics and being in the SEC.

You'd still have to recruit the athletes on defense, though. I still think the Vanderbilt bar is Northwestern. Respectable, competitive on the field with good academics off of it. Best they can ever hope for. I don't think they can have a Stanford run of success there.

Why not give a try? If you can find a guy that can implement that offense who wants the job, give it a go. Can't be much worse than what you've already seen in recent years.
 

dublinirish

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I have seen this suggested as a new path for Vanderbilt multiple times over the years. It isn't all that far fetched considering the situation they're in with their academics and being in the SEC.

You'd still have to recruit the athletes on defense, though. I still think the Vanderbilt bar is Northwestern. Respectable, competitive on the field with good academics off of it. Best they can ever hope for. I don't think they can have a Stanford run of success there.

Why not give a try? If you can find a guy that can implement that offense who wants the job, give it a go. Can't be much worse than what you've already seen in recent years.

The triple option just ain't fair PAWWWWWWWWWWWL
 

Blaise

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Vandy is a no win situation. Anyone taking that job has to know .500 is a dream year. .30 is much more likely. I cannot imagine anyone wanting to go to Vandy unless they had zero other coaching options.

Fact is if ND doesnt lock this guy down, they are complete and utter fools that deserve what they get. This guy is a once in a decade or more hire and if they let him go, then something is really, really wrong. It isnt like ND doesnt have the money either. Take Lea away and ND is a .500 team this year using the coaches BK has chosen in the past to run the defense.

.500 team? ok buddy.. undefeated? no... but .500, you are being silly
 

TorontoGold

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Vandy is a no win situation. Anyone taking that job has to know .500 is a dream year. .30 is much more likely. I cannot imagine anyone wanting to go to Vandy unless they had zero other coaching options.

Fact is if ND doesnt lock this guy down, they are complete and utter fools that deserve what they get. This guy is a once in a decade or more hire and if they let him go, then something is really, really wrong. It isnt like ND doesnt have the money either. Take Lea away and ND is a .500 team this year using the coaches BK has chosen in the past to run the defense.

Two out of three seasons of the BVG era ND was better than .500 - there is *no way* that ND would be a .500 team this year. Absolutely nonsensical.
 
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