Brian Kelly Revisited (RIP BOZO)

[Ndaccountant]

Tyler Santucci makes a whole bunch of sense.

 

[Jiggafini19Deux]

Rees and Freeman didn't go with him. He had to ring up Denbrock to go down there and now he left him for ND.

I'm really curious to see how this round of assistant coaching hires go. This was $9M in assistant buyout money they just decided on. I'm not going to write Kelly's obituary yet, but I think their streak of NC winning head coaches stops with him. This is going to require a pretty significant turnaround.

 

[sfk324]

Rees and Freeman didn't go with him. He had to ring up Denbrock to go down there and now he left him for ND.

I'm really curious to see how this round of assistant coaching hires go. This was $9M in assistant buyout money they just decided on. I'm not going to write Kelly's obituary yet, but I think their streak of NC winning head coaches stops with him. This is going to require a pretty significant turnaround.

Bobby D is on staff already. BVG is available, too, and comes with SEC experience. The sky is the limit!

 

[KPENN]

$9M in assistant buyouts.

 

[jprue24]

This worked at ND.

 

[Giddyup]

Actually Diaco might not be a bad choice for DC. Assuming he hasn’t gone crazy like I thought.

Bring that ol 3-4 to LSU

 

[forkbeard3777]

Other than Joe Sloan, and I'm not so sure how thrilled I'd be for that promotion, I'm going to be pretty damn disappointed if BK promotes someone (Diaco, for instance) or doesn't go outside of his usual running of guys (Rees, Chip Long - I think he just took a new job, though).

I'm prepared to be pretty damn disappointed...

 

[Jiggafini19Deux]

This sounds rather obvious, but hire outside and go with two Louisiana natives: Slade Nagle at OC and Lance Guidry at DC. Nagle is unattached right now. Guidry may not even require a pay raise to come home and leave Cristobal at 3-5 in the ACC University.

Nagle and Guidry have both never coached at LSU to this point in their careers.

 

[Giddyup]

Jim Leonhard wouldn’t be a bad hire for LSU DC.

He’s a Midwest guy though.
Leonhard signed a separation agreement with Wisconsin when he left that will pay him $1 million if he does not land an FBS or NFL coaching job. He couldn’t coach last year hence the analyst role.

 

[Ndaccountant]

Jim Leonhard wouldn’t be a bad hire for LSU DC.

He’s a Midwest guy though.
Leonhard signed a separation agreement with Wisconsin when he left that will pay him $1 million if he does not land an FBS or NFL coaching job. He couldn’t coach last year hence the analyst role.

I agree, but BK loves himself guys he has worked with before. My hunch is that he plucks Tyler Santucci. Worked with while at ND for a year.

 

[rtrn2glory]

Kinda off topic but does anyone think that the reason we had success holding on to our recruits this cycle with less decommits is the fact that MF seems to continue to recruit the entire cycle unlike his predecessor? I really am starting to think that the recruiting effort this staff is putting in is exponentially better than BK especially from our head coach

 

[Polish Leppy 22]

Van Gorder. That is all.

 

[FU BK]

Van Gorder. That is all.

I would laugh my ass off

 

[T-Boone]

Kinda off topic but does anyone think that the reason we had success holding on to our recruits this cycle with less decommits is the fact that MF seems to continue to recruit the entire cycle unlike his predecessor? I really am starting to think that the recruiting effort this staff is putting in is exponentially better than BK especially from our head coach

Definately.

 

[forkbeard3777]

Kinda off topic but does anyone think that the reason we had success holding on to our recruits this cycle with less decommits is the fact that MF seems to continue to recruit the entire cycle unlike his predecessor? I really am starting to think that the recruiting effort this staff is putting in is exponentially better than BK especially from our head coach

Did BK lose a bunch of commits when at ND? Unlike Orgeron, BK has done a tremendous job of locking down Louisiana recruits.

 

[Irish#1]

"Build a championship caliber coaching staff in support of our mission to graduate champions".

So many thoughts running around in my head after reading that.

 

[rtrn2glory]

Did BK lose a bunch of commits when at ND? Unlike Orgeron, BK has done a tremendous job of locking down Louisiana recruits.

He had a reputation of being very lazy on the trail and not recruiting the full year. The fact he's in a hot bed like La works out perfect for him. Little to no traveling and the top players in the state grow up dreaming of playing for the state school.

 

[GowerND11]

Did you all see 'ol Krian Belly on the sidelines during their bowl game constantly working on and bitching at the refs. Reminded me of crybaby Tom Izzo for MSU b-ball. If they coached during the game rather than working the officials, maybe their teams would play to their abilities.

In fairness, working officials is part of a coaches job. When you factor in the amount of assistants (in both college football and basketball) plenty of coaching is being done on the sidelines of games by them. Unless the head football coach is calling plays, they aren't "coaching" much in games. They work officials, make executive decisions on 4th downs, 2 pt conversions, and make tweaks to play calls.

 

[Jiggafini19Deux]

Kinda off topic but does anyone think that the reason we had success holding on to our recruits this cycle with less decommits is the fact that MF seems to continue to recruit the entire cycle unlike his predecessor? I really am starting to think that the recruiting effort this staff is putting in is exponentially better than BK especially from our head coach

He had a reputation of being very lazy on the trail and not recruiting the full year. The fact he's in a hot bed like La works out perfect for him. Little to no traveling and the top players in the state grow up dreaming of playing for the state school.

The early returns seem to suggest this is the case. I think they're digging into Plan B and Plan C quicker, not wasting any time if they feel like a certain guy isn't going to fall their way. We've discussed this is other threads and similar points have been made. They're finding ballers where perhaps maybe the BK Era regimes would not. Recruiting seems to be on an uptick, maybe just due to the freshness of the new staff. Headed into Year Three now, however.

It could very well be that Kelly is benefitting from being at LSU where per capita there is a ton of Division I talent in his home state. It is part of what makes jobs like LSU, any of the FL or TX schools, etc. so attractive. There still has to be a national element to it for a program like LSU if you're competing for championships, but you lay the brick and mortar with the in state guys and Louisiana has plenty of those that are more than talented enough.

 

[IrishSteelhead]

Did BK lose a bunch of commits when at ND? Unlike Orgeron, BK has done a tremendous job of locking down Louisiana recruits.

There are many, but some of the most notable defections that would have been difference makers:

Taylor Decker
Deontay Greenberry (still too soon)
Eddie Vanderdoes
Elijah Hood
Alex Anzalone
Ronald Darby
Pete Werner

This isn’t a BK exclusive problem, and the trend of “latch onto ND offer then spend the rest of the recruiting period shopping around” is always going to be a thing


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[tussin]

There are many, but some of the most notable defections that would have been difference makers:

Taylor Decker
Deontay Greenberry (still too soon)
Eddie Vanderdoes
Elijah Hood
Alex Anzalone
Ronald Darby
Pete Werner

This isn’t a BK exclusive problem, and the trend of “latch onto ND offer then spend the rest of the recruiting period shopping around” is always going to be a thing


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I am dead serious when I say this. If Deontay Greenberry came to ND, he would have won the Biletnikoff and been a Top 15 pick. I was new to the game back then and that flip killed me.

 

[IrishSteelhead]

I am dead serious when I say this. If Deontay Greenberry came to ND, he would have won the Biletnikoff and been a Top 15 pick. I was new to the game back then and that flip killed me.

Excruciating to say the least. That was also my first flip while actually following services.

The first one I remember without being invested in the process was Lorenzo Booker.


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[IrishLax]

Did BK lose a bunch of commits when at ND? Unlike Orgeron, BK has done a tremendous job of locking down Louisiana recruits.

What you will learn is that BK "locking down" recruits and not having a lot of flips is a direct product of how he does not hard sell / hustle in recruiting. It's either a feature or a side effect depending on how you look at his way of doing things, and it comes from the "BK 2.0" evolution in the second half of his tenure at ND.

When he came to ND, he went Big Game Hunting and was aggressively after a number of 5-star style recruits nationwide. Hustled like crazy, and was involved in some super dramatic recruitments with guys like Aaron Lynch, Stephon Tuitt, Tee Shephard/Deontay Greenberry, etc. etc. Most of these guys did not not pan out for one reason or another. Some (like Tuitt) were home runs, but too many ended up being total whiffs.

This culminated in the 2013 class which was elite on paper and honestly could've been a #1 style class if he never flirted with the NFL or if ND was willing to play even a little bit dirty in recruiting. Eddie "Sick Grandma" Vanderdoes basically flipped Kelly's entire mindset on recruiting. Not only were there post-LOI tampering from UCLA of all freaking places but it was the cherry on top of a bunch of very talented kids committing to ND -> having people in their life tell/push/force them to go somewhere else -> ND being left with a roster hole.

So what Kelly started doing was no longer "recruiting hard"... he basically let ND recruit itself, with the idea being that if a player expresses proactive interest in ND and their parents really want ND then they are unlikely to flip AND they are more likely to work out well when they get on campus. In a sense, he would intentionally be very lazy and not do a lot of "selling" or "convincing." He also focused a lot more on kids in ND's geographic footprint unless there were specific reasons to go outside of that.

The result was ND recruiting in the 10-15 range each year, but after the 2016 debacle it also resulted in consistent winning from 2017 to 2021. Championship level winning? No. But it was a very competitive product and much more consistent than what he got from 2010 to 2016.

So when you are seeing him focus on Louisiana kids, it's because it's convenient/low effort for him; they're less likely to flip; and more likely to work out when they get on campus. Is his approach to HS recruiting good enough for LSU to win a championship? Absolutely not. But in the NIL era where you can buy key transfers? It really may work out well in the end, because it builds a solid base of guys and also produces a lot of high end talent from "underrated" players that are a good culture fit / invested in success. ND has more pro bowlers this year than anyone but Alabama and four of the five that played for BK were very underrated coming out of HS.

 

[NDPhilly]

Harbaugh essentially has taken the Kelly strategy of "fit" over ranking after strong early classes with a bunch of flakes. Working well for them.

 

[Katzenboyer]

This sounds rather obvious, but hire outside and go with two Louisiana natives: Slade Nagle at OC and Lance Guidry at DC. Nagle is unattached right now. Guidry may not even require a pay raise to come home and leave Cristobal at 3-5 in the ACC University.

Nagle and Guidry have both never coached at LSU to this point in their careers.

Apparently Guidry has some beef with the admin at LSU and has effectively been blacklisted by the school. Also, if LSU comes knocking, I think Miami would back up the Brinks truck to keep him.

 

[Katzenboyer]

 

[Jiggafini19Deux]

Apparently Guidry has some beef with the admin at LSU and has effectively been blacklisted by the school. Also, if LSU comes knocking, I think Miami would back up the Brinks truck to keep him.

Good intel. You'd think there had to be a good reason why he hadn't found his way there yet at this point in his career.

Miami seems to be throwing money around, indeed.

Baker was at LSU for one year, Orgeron's last, and Kelly didn't retain him. If there are no hard feelings and they're giving him the keys at DC it seems like a great hire.

 

[StPaul_Irish]

This sounds rather obvious, but hire outside and go with two Louisiana natives: Slade Nagle at OC and Lance Guidry at DC. Nagle is unattached right now. Guidry may not even require a pay raise to come home and leave Cristobal at 3-5 in the ACC University.

Nagle and Guidry have both never coached at LSU to this point in their careers.

Isn't he headed to Houston w/ his old head coach?

NVM, just say that he isn't going with Fritz...

Would be a knock out hire, I hope he doesn't go to LSU, he was VERY high on my list until we brought back Uncle Mike.

 

[Jiggafini19Deux]

What you will learn is that BK "locking down" recruits and not having a lot of flips is a direct product of how he does not hard sell / hustle in recruiting. It's either a feature or a side effect depending on how you look at his way of doing things, and it comes from the "BK 2.0" evolution in the second half of his tenure at ND.

When he came to ND, he went Big Game Hunting and was aggressively after a number of 5-star style recruits nationwide. Hustled like crazy, and was involved in some super dramatic recruitments with guys like Aaron Lynch, Stephon Tuitt, Tee Shephard/Deontay Greenberry, etc. etc. Most of these guys did not not pan out for one reason or another. Some (like Tuitt) were home runs, but too many ended up being total whiffs.

This culminated in the 2013 class which was elite on paper and honestly could've been a #1 style class if he never flirted with the NFL or if ND was willing to play even a little bit dirty in recruiting. Eddie "Sick Grandma" Vanderdoes basically flipped Kelly's entire mindset on recruiting. Not only were there post-LOI tampering from UCLA of all freaking places but it was the cherry on top of a bunch of very talented kids committing to ND -> having people in their life tell/push/force them to go somewhere else -> ND being left with a roster hole.

So what Kelly started doing was no longer "recruiting hard"... he basically let ND recruit itself, with the idea being that if a player expresses proactive interest in ND and their parents really want ND then they are unlikely to flip AND they are more likely to work out well when they get on campus. In a sense, he would intentionally be very lazy and not do a lot of "selling" or "convincing." He also focused a lot more on kids in ND's geographic footprint unless there were specific reasons to go outside of that.

The result was ND recruiting in the 10-15 range each year, but after the 2016 debacle it also resulted in consistent winning from 2017 to 2021. Championship level winning? No. But it was a very competitive product and much more consistent than what he got from 2010 to 2016.

So when you are seeing him focus on Louisiana kids, it's because it's convenient/low effort for him; they're less likely to flip; and more likely to work out when they get on campus. Is his approach to HS recruiting good enough for LSU to win a championship? Absolutely not. But in the NIL era where you can buy key transfers? It really may work out well in the end, because it builds a solid base of guys and also produces a lot of high end talent from "underrated" players that are a good culture fit / invested in success. ND has more pro bowlers this year than anyone but Alabama and four of the five that played for BK were very underrated coming out of HS.

 

[Jiggafini19Deux]

DJ Durkin's name is coming up for LSU DC. Kelly and Durkin together....wow.

Still sounds like they're going all in on Baker from Mizzou.