Brian Kelly Revisited (RIP BOZO)

[PANDFAN]

Did I miss the clickbait articles about David Shaw or Clay Helton or Charlie Strong throwing their teams under the bus? Just did a Google search and didn't find anything.

The fact is that Brian Kelly gives the media something to roll with. Other coaches in his position, generally speaking, don't.

they also aren't ND coaches...david shaw barely speaks and no one outside of the west coast watches stanford football nor do their "fans", clay helton is old news and nothing juicy on him as usc has been in shambles for quite some time now and charlie strong--how many times can you beat a dead horse, he is a dead man walking...click bait as some examples below:
WHAT DOES LSU AND FLORIDA HAVE TO DO W/ BK'S PIC

<blockquote class="twitter-tweet" data-lang="en"><p lang="en" dir="ltr">What should LSU and Florida do about their postponement? How do we curb these 4.5-hour games? More Mailbag: <a href="https://t.co/8ZI4ykdTj7">https://t.co/8ZI4ykdTj7</a></p>— Stewart Mandel (@slmandel) <a href="https://twitter.com/slmandel/status/786345282552246272">October 12, 2016</a></blockquote>
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4.5HR GAME NOT ND, THAT WAS A&M AND TENN, BUT USE HIS PIC
<blockquote class="twitter-tweet" data-lang="en"><p lang="en" dir="ltr">The Mailbag puts it out there to the readers: What do we do about these 4.5-hour games? <a href="https://t.co/8ZI4ykdTj7">https://t.co/8ZI4ykdTj7</a></p>— Stewart Mandel (@slmandel) <a href="https://twitter.com/slmandel/status/786246813405761536">October 12, 2016</a></blockquote>
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HIS PIC WAS TWEETED 5X'S with articles yesterday

 

[ulukinatme]

^^^^ WTF

Stewart Mandel sure wants those clicks.

 

[IrishSteelhead]

Brian Kelly Revisited

"If we were 6-0, this wouldn't be an issue...."

No shit. Of course BK is gonna get raked over the coals after starting 2-4 in a season they ranked in the top ten to start.

Feel like I'm taking crazy pills. Mandel is answering a question for his mailbag. When your team is 2-4, all losses against average opponents, don't expect a 5 star review.

I don't feel any click bait or singling out with what was written. If you're worried about the "this hurts recruiting" angle, so does being 2-4.

 

[kmoose]

they also aren't ND coaches...david shaw barely speaks and no one outside of the west coast watches stanford football nor do their "fans", clay helton is old news and nothing juicy on him as usc has been in shambles for quite some time now and charlie strong--how many times can you beat a dead horse, he is a dead man walking...click bait as some examples below:
WHAT DOES LSU AND FLORIDA HAVE TO DO W/ BK'S PIC

<blockquote class="twitter-tweet" data-lang="en"><p lang="en" dir="ltr">What should LSU and Florida do about their postponement? How do we curb these 4.5-hour games? More Mailbag: <a href="https://t.co/8ZI4ykdTj7">https://t.co/8ZI4ykdTj7</a></p>— Stewart Mandel (@slmandel) <a href="https://twitter.com/slmandel/status/786345282552246272">October 12, 2016</a></blockquote>
<script async src="//platform.twitter.com/widgets.js" charset="utf-8"></script>
4.5HR GAME NOT ND, THAT WAS A&M AND TENN, BUT USE HIS PIC
<blockquote class="twitter-tweet" data-lang="en"><p lang="en" dir="ltr">The Mailbag puts it out there to the readers: What do we do about these 4.5-hour games? <a href="https://t.co/8ZI4ykdTj7">https://t.co/8ZI4ykdTj7</a></p>— Stewart Mandel (@slmandel) <a href="https://twitter.com/slmandel/status/786246813405761536">October 12, 2016</a></blockquote>
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HIS PIC WAS TWEETED 5X'S with articles yesterday

To be fair(not that I care much about being fair to Mandel): The long delays in games might have been the biggest issue in his mailbag, which is why it was the headline; but the first question he addressed in the article was "What's gone wrong for ND, this year?" So I'm sure that's why Kelly's pic showed up.

 

[Rocket89]

This is a great example of the power of Twitter and how it encourages a culture of outrage.

First off, somehow it got lost that Kelly lit into Mustipher on the sidelines and that's the seed that let the rest of this episode grow. Also, it got lost that Mustipher didn't have a bad snap in the sense of poor fundamentals due to the weather but he mistimed the snap and the ball was a good snap otherwise.

But the thing is, like most games Kelly's post game presser isn't live on TV so everyone is dependent on reading Twitter for updates. In this case, we saw the ND media mischaracterize Kelly's quotes and from there the fire starts.

Virtually no ND fans actually watch the presser when it gets uploaded later in the day. Even less people in the media will watch. After a couple hours, and still before anyone outside the stadium press have watched the presser, the narrative is already set. Does anyone believe Paul Finebaum took the time to watch the presser?

So if you look at what's actually published after the fact almost nothing comes with direct quotes. This is how lazy the media is right now. A couple of the ND media will do a good job and tweet/write a full quote for more context but it's usually ignored.

If you search this story nearly everyone says Kelly called Mustipher's snapping "atrocious" with nothing more. Heck it's not even a real quote let alone a full quote.

Then you've got someone like GK in this thread taking part in the outrage but when asked to provide some quotes he's left to Google the topic because he didn't watch the press conference. Hence why, after being pushed enough he started bringing up comments from other games instead of NC State.

True it's all about perception. But it amazes me how much of a pass people will give the media on stuff like this and then how they'll turn around and think that job by the media gives the a solid footing to argue issues.

 

[IrishSteelhead]

To be fair(not that I care much about being fair to Mandel): The long delays in games might have been the biggest issue in his mailbag, which is why it was the headline; but the first question he addressed in the article was "What's gone wrong for ND, this year?" So I'm sure that's why Kelly's pic showed up.

Exactly. It was a specific question about ND. What did anyone expect the picture to be?

 

[PANDFAN]

Exactly. It was a specific question about ND. What did anyone expect the picture to be?

the initial time he tweeted about BK and used his pic is fine...but when you keep tweeting other stuff and continue to use his pic then use the other teams involved pic

 

[gkIrish]

Then you've got someone like GK in this thread taking part in the outrage but when asked to provide some quotes he's left to Google the topic because he didn't watch the press conference. Hence why, after being pushed enough he started bringing up comments from other games instead of NC State.

Who the fuck said I didn't watch the press conference? I watched it when it came out and watched it again yesterday to make sure I wasn't missing something.

You have a right to your opinion but don't make shit up about me.

 

[BeauBenken]

What I would prefer to hear is nothing. There's plenty of middle ground in this. You can easily not publicly blame the coaches and yourself as well as not publicly blame a position/position group/players. For me, I don't need to hear him blame himself or the coaches. But I don't need to hear him blame someone else either. You can respond to this equestrians without specifically blaming anyone. He didn't, and often doesn't.

Give an example of how to say that the snaps and timing were bad without it somehow (through common sense) coming back to any players or coaches involved. The thing is, you can't...at least not any better than he already did. He spread the blame; he didn't go up to the podium and say "Sam Mustipher is the only reason we lost this game," but that's how people are reacting.

Unless you're suggesting he just doesn't publicly answer any questions or admit any fault or errors, which like I said, there would be even more uproar about. It's already happened this year.

 

[Irish Insanity]

Give an example of how to say that the snaps and timing were bad without it somehow (through common sense) coming back to any players or coaches involved. The thing is, you can't...at least not any better than he already did. He spread the blame; he didn't go up to the podium and say "Sam Mustipher is the only reason we lost this game," but that's how people are reacting.

Unless you're suggesting he just doesn't publicly answer any questions or admit any fault or errors, which like I said, there would be even more uproar about. It's already happened this year.

We aren't just talking about his last PC following the NCST loss.

 

[koonja]

I hate losing.

 

[BeauBenken]

We aren't just talking about his last PC following the NCST loss.

So what are we talking about then?

 

[BeauBenken]

I hate losing.

lol yup.

 

[PANDFAN]

So what are we talking about then?

 

[kmoose]

We aren't just talking about his last PC following the NCST loss.

But what do you expect? He's the Head Coach, he has to answer reporters' questions. Is he supposed to stand there and give all of the positives from the game, then refuse to answer a question about why the Red Zone offense didn't work this week, or if the Defense allowed the other team to take advantage of an injury? Think for a minute about how THAT would look.........

BK: Welcome. I thought we did a really good job today on Offensive tempo and production.

Reporter: Coach, was that a result of a change of philosophy, or just some young players finally "getting it"?

BK: We moved some personnel around and that seemed to make a big difference.

Reporter: Coach, it seemed like the short passing game faltered just a little bit today. Can you tell us if you saw that same thing?

BK: No Comment

Reporter: Coach, 4 false start penalties in the first half. Did the guys just come out flat and not focused, or was the crowd noise an issue?

BK: No Comment

Reporter: Coach, the RBs looked strong today. Care to comment?

BK: Yeah, I think our running game was firing on all cylinders today. We blocked well, we hit the holes, and we ran with power. I was really pleased with the results of that, today.

Reporter: Coach, the Defense gave up 3 big pass plays today. Was that a function of scheme or just talent?

BK: No comment

That's just not a good PC for your team, your fans, or your brand.

 

[Wingman Ray]

This is what it comes down to:

US military with advanced weapons loses a battle with equal number of troop with the opposition carrying simple rifles. What happens? That commander is removed from his position and is working a desk job in Alaska next.

ND losing to NCS is the same scenario.

ND had the quality troops (ranking) and upgrades but still lost to a significantly worse team. That has to be on the commander.

 

[Irish Insanity]

So what are we talking about then?

These issues go back to comments about Kizer to the media all while publicly stroking BVG's cock. All at a time when the offense wasn't an issue and the D was.

But what do you expect? He's the Head Coach, he has to answer reporters' questions. Is he supposed to stand there and give all of the positives from the game, then refuse to answer a question about why the Red Zone offense didn't work this week, or if the Defense allowed the other team to take advantage of an injury? Think for a minute about how THAT would look.........

BK: Welcome. I thought we did a really good job today on Offensive tempo and production.

Reporter: Coach, was that a result of a change of philosophy, or just some young players finally "getting it"?

BK: We moved some personnel around and that seemed to make a big difference.

Reporter: Coach, it seemed like the short passing game faltered just a little bit today. Can you tell us if you saw that same thing?

BK: No Comment

Reporter: Coach, 4 false start penalties in the first half. Did the guys just come out flat and not focused, or was the crowd noise an issue?

BK: No Comment

Reporter: Coach, the RBs looked strong today. Care to comment?

BK: Yeah, I think our running game was firing on all cylinders today. We blocked well, we hit the holes, and we ran with power. I was really pleased with the results of that, today.

Reporter: Coach, the Defense gave up 3 big pass plays today. Was that a function of scheme or just talent?

BK: No comment

That's just not a good PC for your team, your fans, or your brand.

So he had to throw Kizer and the offense out as an issue early in the season and pat BVG in the back when the questions he was asked didn't need that answer? Especially when it wasn't true?

BK, lately, comes across, to me, as that guy that stands there demanding and telling everyone he's the leader, and not a single person follows.

 

[gkIrish]

But what do you expect? He's the Head Coach, he has to answer reporters' questions. Is he supposed to stand there and give all of the positives from the game, then refuse to answer a question about why the Red Zone offense didn't work this week, or if the Defense allowed the other team to take advantage of an injury? Think for a minute about how THAT would look.........

BK: Welcome. I thought we did a really good job today on Offensive tempo and production.

Reporter: Coach, was that a result of a change of philosophy, or just some young players finally "getting it"?

BK: We moved some personnel around and that seemed to make a big difference.

Reporter: Coach, it seemed like the short passing game faltered just a little bit today. Can you tell us if you saw that same thing?

BK: I'll have to look at the tape but I think USC did a good job scheming against our short passes.

Reporter: Coach, 4 false start penalties in the first half. Did the guys just come out flat and not focused, or was the crowd noise an issue?

BK: Yeah I think the crowd noise had something to do with it. We will work on it in practice. Maybe pump up the volume

Reporter: Coach, the RBs looked strong today. Care to comment?

BK: Yeah, I think our running game was firing on all cylinders today. We blocked well, we hit the holes, and we ran with power. I was really pleased with the results of that, today.

Reporter: Coach, the Defense gave up 3 big pass plays today. Was that a function of scheme or just talent?

BK: We had some blown coverage, but I think our gameplan could have been a lot better. We decided to focus on stopping the run and short routes which lead to some of those big plays you are talking about. Have to credit that WR they have over there in SoCal though. One of the fastest players I've seen

That's just not a good PC for your team, your fans, or your brand.

Imagine a world where he just answers things like a normal person without being a douche.

 

[kmoose]

These issues go back to comments about Kizer to the media all while publicly stroking BVG's cock. All at a time when the offense wasn't an issue and the D was.

So he had to throw Kizer and the offense out as an issue early in the season and pat BVG in the back when the questions he was asked didn't need that answer? Especially when it wasn't true?

BK, lately, comes across, to me, as that guy that stands there demanding and telling everyone he's the leader, and not a single person follows.

Kizer still has a job; Brian Van Gorder doesn't. We are talking about post game pressers. The Head Coach hasn't had time to review a single piece of film yet. He can only go by what he can see from the sidelines. I don't think anyone doubts that Kelly knows the QB position. So, of course, he is going to be able to better comment on that, based on what he sees from the sidelines. Once he's had time to sit and watch the tape, then he probably can give a fair analysis of the defense, from a schematic point of view. What question was asked, that he needless threw Kizer and the offense out as an issue in response to?

 

[Irish Insanity]

Kizer still has a job; Brian Van Gorder doesn't. We are talking about post game pressers. The Head Coach hasn't had time to review a single piece of film yet. He can only go by what he can see from the sidelines. I don't think anyone doubts that Kelly knows the QB position. So, of course, he is going to be able to better comment on that, based on what he sees from the sidelines. Once he's had time to sit and watch the tape, then he probably can give a fair analysis of the defense, from a schematic point of view. What question was asked, that he needless threw Kizer and the offense out as an issue in response to?

When I have more time I'll look up the PC or questions. But I will say the media wouldn't ask a player about being blamed, nor would that player make a comment about being called out, if neither of those people felt it was happening. So you have the actual player, and someone strongly connected to the program, making comments to it.

 

[Irish Insanity]

And I assume a player wouldn't need to say the following if they didn't feel the coach was blaming others/not accepting responsibility.

 

[koonja]

If these many questions are being asked by these many people, but inside and out, it's an issue. That's a general rule of thumb.

Doesn't mean it's an issue that will be the end of Kelly, but it's an issue. I think that's blatantly clear. Smoke meet fire.

 

[pkt77242]

When I have more time I'll look up the PC or questions. But I will say the media wouldn't ask a player about being blamed, nor would that player make a comment about being called out, if neither of those people felt it was happening. So you have the actual player, and someone strongly connected to the program, making comments to it.

That is necessarily true. The reporter might ask the question because some readers are reacting that way to the post game PC, and thus he feels that he should ask about it.

I would also add that there is a difference between calling out players and throwing them under the bus.

 

[kmoose]

When I have more time I'll look up the PC or questions. But I will say the media wouldn't ask a player about being blamed, nor would that player make a comment about being called out, if neither of those people felt it was happening. So you have the actual player, and someone strongly connected to the program, making comments to it.

We've been through this, already, last night. The players appear to be supporting BK, AND his style of coaching. So if they aren't upset about it, then why is anyone else?

 

[irishog77]

This thread now sucks

 

[gkIrish]

This thread now sucks

Thanks, Obama

 

[Irish Insanity]

We've been through this, already, last night. The players appear to be supporting BK, AND his style of coaching. So if they aren't upset about it, then why is anyone else?

No

 

[kmoose]

No

que?

 

[koonja]

que?

No means the same in Spanish FYI.

 

[Cackalacky]

We've been through this, already, last night. The players appear to be supporting BK, AND his style of coaching. So if they aren't upset about it, then why is anyone else?

Well that is one way to look at it.

Another is that what Kizer says may just be coach speak by the players. It may be his understanding of what BK has told them. It is a very "professional" answer in any manner of understanding. SO I dont think we can conclusively say that the players "support" BK based on random and limited interviews from the players.

The converse is it is a bad look for the players to answer in a manner that does not reflect well on BK. Regardless, we gleam little of the inner workings from any player or coach interviews. I honestly dont let interviews sway me one way or the other. Its very shortsighted to base an opinion on interviews. On the field actions carry much more wight for me than these things. I mean the extreme end is trying to discern any of the inner goings on of the Patriots by listening to Belichik. He literally gives you shit for answers and people try to parse the good shit from the bad shit/irrelevant shit. Pointless in my opinion.