2023 - State of the Recruiting Class

Domina Nostra

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According to Rivals (247 doesn't go back this far)
Ty
2002 - 24
2003 - 12
2004 - 32
Ty->Weis
2005 - 40
2006 - 8
2007 - 8
2008 - 2
2009 - 21
Weis->Kelly
2010 - 14
2011 - 10
2012 - 20
2013 - 3
2014 - 11
2015 - 11
2016 - 13
2017 - 13
2018 - 11
2019 - 14
2020 - 22
2021 - 9
Kelly->Freeman
2022 - 6
2023 - 4, for now

Right, and my only point was that Freeman took over such a different program than Kelly, that it's hard to know what to do with the early results.

I am NOT arguing Kelly was a better recruiter. I am arguing that it is unclear that there is not enough information to conclude that Freeman is an upgrade. He might be. He might not be.

No one expected the mediocrity that came after that 2013 class, but that's what we got...

(My actual opinion is that Freeman is an excellent recruiter, as long as he can win games, but that NIL may change the game enough that it won't matter... so that the benefit of his better commitment to recruiting is cancelled out by the harder landscape)
 
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Free Manera

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That 2013 class actually was pretty damn good in hindsight. Lots of NFL players in that class. I looked at it thinking it was going to be the class with Vanderdoes because he skewed those rankings but it wasn't.
 

rtrn2glory

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You mean the class that BVG couldn't even turn into an adequate defense in a stretch that should've had us competing for a Natty?

yea if BVG is coaching for anybody right now I've totally lost all respect for that program.
 

CanadalovesND

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That 2013 class actually was pretty damn good in hindsight. Lots of NFL players in that class. I looked at it thinking it was going to be the class with Vanderdoes because he skewed those rankings but it wasn't.

Yes and no.

Only 5 out of the 23 players in the class went on to be selected. What jumps out the most, is that there were two first round selections (Fuller & McGlinchey), three if you want to count Jaylon Smith. Smythe & Rochell were Day 3 picks, and another two, Cole Luke & James Onwualu, had a few "cups of coffee" in the league.

The rest of the class didn't quite pan out as NFL players, but the class itself, did play an important role in getting the program back up after the first few seasons following the 2012 NC Game.

Like all classes, there were some disappointments with top players not really panning out, some careers derailed by injuries and/or medical hardships, some transfers, but also a few surprises - like Corey Robinson, and the aforementioned James Onwualu.

What turned out to be quite the successful class, happened to be one of BK's worst classes - 2016. Depending on which recruiting website you wish to use, personally 24/7 has always been my go-to, that class finished 15th nationally but also produced NINE NFL draft picks - Eichenberg, Hayes, Claypool, Kareem, Pride, Okwara, Love, Book & Ogundeji. A few others like Kraemer, Jamir Jones, Elliott, Tony Jones and McKinley, are still in the league to some capacity a few years removed from their ND careers.

That's why recruiting is a crap shoot. Honestly. A great class can underperform, but an average class, for ND's standards, can far exceed expectations, and can be the initial piece that can help change and elevate a program.
 

CanadalovesND

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You mean the class that BVG couldn't even turn into an adequate defense in a stretch that should've had us competing for a Natty?

yea if BVG is coaching for anybody right now I've totally lost all respect for that program.

He's fallen off since his coaching days at ND have ended. He had some GA roles, but was a coordinator again, falling to a lower-level of football with each new stop. He coaches high school ball now, at American Heritage in Plantation, Florida - which, is quite consistently a competitive team that plays big ball Florida football, and always has their best players going to P5 & G5 schools each year.
 

NDohio

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Now let's grade Freeman against Kelly based on what holes are filled by the recruiting classes.

That was my biggest frustration with Kelly's recruiting. There are a number of classes that had good rankings but left major holes on the roster. I feel like Freeman is addressing that.
 

Domina Nostra

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Now let's grade Freeman against Kelly based on what holes are filled by the recruiting classes.

That was my biggest frustration with Kelly's recruiting. There are a number of classes that had good rankings but left major holes on the roster. I feel like Freeman is addressing that.

Yeah, especially if you blame the 2021 WR haul on Kelly.

This class is very balanced across the board--although vyper is a huge need and is not being filled.

However, I do think ND gives Freeman a lot more leeway on roster management (cutting players, EEs, transfers, +25 player classes) than Kelly did until very recently. 2022 college football is very different than 2012.
 

ThePiombino

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According to Rivals (247 doesn't go back this far)
Ty
2002 - 24
2003 - 12
2004 - 32
Ty->Weis
2005 - 40
2006 - 8
2007 - 8
2008 - 2
2009 - 21
Weis->Kelly
2010 - 14
2011 - 10
2012 - 20
2013 - 3
2014 - 11
2015 - 11
2016 - 13
2017 - 13
2018 - 11
2019 - 14
2020 - 22
2021 - 9
Kelly->Freeman
2022 - 6
2023 - 4, for now
Should also be noted that it's no coincidence 2021 (Kelly's best class since 2013) was largely due to the DC at the time. Freeman.

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ThePiombino

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Do you mean 2022?
I mean 2021. He was hired January 8, 2021 which means he was the DC for virtually the entire calendar year in which the 2021 class was built and signed. Am I off here? You have me thinking I'm crazy now.

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domer13

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I mean 2021. He was hired January 8, 2021 which means he was the DC for virtually the entire calendar year in which the 2021 class was built and signed. Am I off here? You have me thinking I'm crazy now.

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Yes.

The class year is based on the normal high school graduation, which is the spring after the early signing period. Hence why the current class will sign in '22 but are part of the '23 class. Freeman would have arrived after the early signing period of the '21 class, so little influence. He would have had the entire year to build the '22 class, who would have signed in Dec of '21.
 

CanadalovesND

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I mean 2021. He was hired January 8, 2021 which means he was the DC for virtually the entire calendar year in which the 2021 class was built and signed. Am I off here? You have me thinking I'm crazy now.

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Just a little haha

The 2021 recruiting class was the class for the 2020-21 calendar season. Freeman was hired in January 2021 correct, but he wasn’t recruiting for that class. It all started for him for the 2022 class - players like Jaylen Sneed, Tyson Ford, Junior Tuihalamaka etc
 

NDMatt91

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So it looks like the class will finish the early signing period with a score of 279.94. Higher than all but 1 of BK's classes, which was in 2013 (284.77). Last year's class had a final score of 275.44, for comparison.
 

Veritate Duce Progredi

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So,…. Final grade on the class?
Well, given that it's the best class I've seen in about 15+ years of recruiting, I have to at least give it an A-

The sting of missing out on our top safety prospect after losing a top edge hurts but it can't drop it a whole letter grade because it's still the most balanced class and it has more 4+ stars than we've had in a class prior.
 

NDMatt91

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So,…. Final grade on the class?
B+. I think the only legitimate gripes with respect to the coaching staff were how they handled the QB position prior to getting Minchey and Al Washington not closing the door with some DL, specifically Jason Moore.

I say legitimate because NIL is out of the coaching staff's control.
 

SouthSideChiDomer

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This class is good enough to get us in the 12 team playoff and, if guys develop, could have been good enough to get in the four team playoff.

This class will get run off the field when facing the Alabama class.

Good, not great. Not championship worthy. And given that we seemingly have a one way transfer portal, it could end up being a lot less than good.
 
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