2020 Elections

[fightingirish26]

No thanks. I don't want the 5 largest cities in the country dictating policy for the rest of us.

any way to disenfranchise black voters, right bro

 

[NorthDakota]

Imagine if we simply elected the candidate with the most votes

Pretty difficult to imagine because that was a non-starter from the get go lol. Imagine if instead of pissing and moaning, people would quit whining about something that's very unlikely to ever change.

 

[GowerND11]

<blockquote class="twitter-tweet"><p lang="en" dir="ltr">thinking about how if california’s number of electoral votes were proportional to wyoming’s it’d have *checks notes* 202 votes</p>— obj (@objsucks) <a href="https://twitter.com/objsucks/status/1324000498484236288?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">November 4, 2020</a></blockquote> <script async src="https://platform.twitter.com/widgets.js" charset="utf-8"></script>

That's such a BS comparison though. It's on the basis of Reps and Senators, which is already decided by population size. You can't proportion them any other way, and even if you did increase, say CA, like that says, you'd still have to up the winning score from 270 which would nullify that increase anyway.

 

[Irish#1]

I am concerned as we all should be about the near future "social"/"hatred" responses that we're likely to see around the country ... and I am concerned about certain other impacts upon COVID matters and, following on that, economic matters --- all connected pretty overtly to the public "show" that the current executive will put on. (place blame wherever, but these coming activities are closely tied to these predicted actions either way.)

First: The Captain Obvious predictions.
A. Biden will be declared the winner of the votes in Pennsylvania, Arizona, Michigan, Nevada, and Wisconsin (and who knows what else) and therefore winner of the election;
B. Trump will claim that he is the winner and has been cheated across the whole nation in a variety of premeditated ways;
C. Trump will demand recounts in several states. This he will do even though he does not really believe that recounts in most of those places will overturn anything;
D. Trump will then move on to trying to take various states or whomever to court. Most if not all of these nuisance suits will be denied as having no merit, and he will know that ahead of time;
E. C&D will create an environment and a significant length of time to spew forth a Twitter Storm of complaining --- but worse than that, just barely beneath the threshold of direct calls for rioting and serious civil disobedience, embedded in that storm will be all manner of "suggestion" as to why he has been wronged and what the True Americans should do about it.

That's the Captain Obvious part of this.

Second: What's not quite so obvious.
A. As time goes on, people will think and believe that he cannot possibly believe anything that he's saying, and is just "being Trump" putting on his "normal" It's-all-about-me ego-show. And some of this will begin that way;
B. But as time goes further on, Trump WILL believe all of it himself. He WILL in his mind become truly the victimized hero of the tale, the Man Who Did No Wrong, The Chosen One --- The Man Above All Others. He knows that is who he is, and always has been --- The Genius, The Smartest Man in Any Room;
C. As he achieves those details of that mental state completely (he already has the mental state just lacks a few details), what will he continue to say?

Why would I think that might happen?

I consulted, for a little less than two years, for a real estate billionaire quite like Trump. He was a nightmare to work for. His outstanding characteristic was that he had huge wealth in sufficient portions to his ego, that he could basically "buy" his own historical narrative. No one stayed near to him in his employ who disagreed with anything of substance. One Strike and You're Out! (Reminds me of Trump's famous "smiling line": You're FIRED!!. Thank God my consultancy only required one weekend every quarter --- still, I and my buddies only lasted six quarters even so.)

This guy had been insanely wealthy for so long that he had no balancing anchor to his ego. If something happened --- and I mean something that was just flat concretely true --- that went against his image of himself as The Smartest Guy in the Room --- a couple of days later you would find that the "facts" had subtly changed, then the "image" wholly changed, then the King restored. Reminding him of things was not advisable --- not only were you fired, but you never could penetrate the BRILLIANT PICTURE of My LIFE and do any good.

As this megalomaniac (Trump) crystallizes his Crowned King image --- what is he going to do? TWITTERSTORM for sure, but what will the content be? Will he continue to suggest divisive even "physical" things? Will he arrange his own out-of-office GALA events?

Everyone whose minds work realizes that the country doesn't need more incendiary fuel poured on it now (or anytime for that matter.) MANY Republicans have already said exactly these things ... and so, Democrats, Independents, Americans of all types and Non-Americans of all types --- Everybody is pleading NOT to burn the place down in any ways. WILL HE SEE THAT? WILL HE CARE?

... and one other thing that I can almost predict clearly: Trump will continue to meddle with big important matters and his Twittering will prove quite sufficient as a tool. The big one will be COVID. His tweeting will contain nothing encouraging discipline on this, and I will bet, much encouraging ignoring the lockdowns, and grouping warnings, and flagrant defiance of the CDC and the "fake scientists" who, he will decide, also cost him the election.

This (despite what a small number of IE posters like to project) will not be "funny." Leaving aside the fact that people will die, these defiances will prolong the COVID problem and the sickening of the economy.

Do any of us think that Trump will take that into account in his Twitterstorm?

I would imagine when Biden doesn't have COVID cured within a few weeks of taking office, Trump will be more than happy to Tweet about it. I really don't think it matters if he rails about wearing masks or following guidelines. We already have a significantly portion of the population that doesn't follow them anyway. However, I don't see Trump asking for rioting or civil disobedience. I could be wrong, but I don't see him going that far.

 

[goldandblue]

So I have a legit question. Why doesn't the country just split? Allow the states to vote which direction they want to go. Have two governments. We were 48 states until '48 and '52.

So why not split it? Do you feel that is unpatriotic? It would be something like what 36 and 14? That way you have an option to not feel as though you are having to live under policies that you do not agree with.

Why not have a peaceful split before things turn for the worse? I don't know if a civil war would ever even happen again it just seems like we are so polarized as a nation.

 

[NorthDakota]

<blockquote class="twitter-tweet"><p lang="en" dir="ltr">thinking about how if california’s number of electoral votes were proportional to wyoming’s it’d have *checks notes* 202 votes</p>— obj (@objsucks) <a href="https://twitter.com/objsucks/status/1324000498484236288?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">November 4, 2020</a></blockquote> <script async src="https://platform.twitter.com/widgets.js" charset="utf-8"></script>

I love Californian sadness. It's almost erotic

 

[GowerND11]

So I have a legit question. Why doesn't the country just split? Allow the states to vote which direction they want to go. Have two governments. We were 48 states until '48 and '52.

So why not split it? Do you feel that is unpatriotic? It would be something like what 36 and 14? That way you have an option to not feel as though you are having to live under policies that you do not agree with.

Why not have a peaceful split before things turn for the worse? I don't know if a civil war would ever even happen again it just seems like we are so polarized as a nation.

So when it gets tough, just break up?

 

[goldandblue]

So when it gets tough, just break up?

Valid point, I see where you are coming from. Thank you for your input. I was hoping for a little more in depth discussion. I'm not advocating for a split in our country and I hope I didn't come off that way. I just see so much strife, hatred, anger that we are applying toward each other it makes me sick. Does it get better or worse?

We have to do a much better job of understanding each other for starters. We have to understand that there are bad stupid people in our world but a handful of them should not label the rest. That goes for black people, Hispanics, cops, white people, republicans, democrats, etc.

 

[NorthDakota]

So I have a legit question. Why doesn't the country just split? Allow the states to vote which direction they want to go. Have two governments. We were 48 states until '48 and '52.

So why not split it? Do you feel that is unpatriotic? It would be something like what 36 and 14? That way you have an option to not feel as though you are having to live under policies that you do not agree with.

Why not have a peaceful split before things turn for the worse? I don't know if a civil war would ever even happen again it just seems like we are so polarized as a nation.

I think violence is inevitable. Both groups want to assert dominance over the other and the worldviews are so different.

I still think the only way to maintain a multicultural country is to have the Feds take a step back and States to fill those roles.

 

[GowerND11]

Valid point, I see where you are coming from. Thank you for your input. I was hoping for a little more in depth discussion. I'm not advocating for a split in our country and I hope I didn't come off that way. I just see so much strife, hatred, anger that we are applying toward each other it makes me sick. Does it get better or worse?

We have to do a much better job of understanding each other for starters. We have to understand that there are bad stupid people in our world but a handful of them should not label the rest. That goes for black people, Hispanics, cops, white people, republicans, democrats, etc.

I only kid in the last post.

I think the biggest issue is that no longer do either side want to work with each other. We've hit a point where reaching across the aisle has become a death sentence by your own party, and how both sides want to "flame each other." It's sad really. But I don't have a real answer how to fix it right now. It would take a lot of standing down and swallowing of pride.

 

[yankeehater]

Imagine if we simply elected the candidate with the most votes

I looked at your user name and that explains this comment.

 

[yankeehater]

And to think some regard his as the one with a higher mental acuity, very "stable genius" indeed.

Where are all the protests from the "left wing" mob that we were promised? I need to know who I can send bail money to.

Took less than 24 hours for this not to age well.

BTW...the anarchist rioters in the streets were here before Trump and will not go away when Trump is gone.

 

[Old Man Mike]

The unfortunate but probably necessary use of National Guard troops to put down rioting and illegal property destruction and attempts to block necessary organizational actions will be the Crude Hammer end of getting past some of this. I watched the so-called "60s" (early 70s) behave somewhat like this, and the only thing that "efficiently" stopped it was The Fist.

It was the States mainly who had to employ the power and that's probably going to be Governor's duty again. It will be helpful if no one inserts "R" or "D" into the discussion of calling in force as the Problem is an overreaching one.

My witnessing of the "60s" stuff indicated to me that few "protesters" (percentage wise) really cared about causes --- they were in it for the loot or the cheap thrills. Once the police et al made it obvious that destruction of property or function had a price, the majority of the crowds dissipated leaving only the persons who truly cared. Some of those were good people (almost all non-violent) and they at least did some good. It was, however, necessary to put the hammer down (not excessively) to separate the saints from the thugs. (This was an imperfect distillation of course and good people got caught in the gears, while asses might escape. Still, it had to be done to restore civil order.)

After restoring some semblance of order (done via State-level decisions mainly [though in our crappy times Homeland Security will have a great presence --- does anyone think that terrorists have somehow missed the impact of one virus?]), it is the individual States which will need to follow up with their own organized ways of dealing with the chaos and social rubble. The States, most of them, will not have the money, and many of the States will also not have the responsible legislators to pass stimulus packages --- like work programs a la construction --- to get persons who DO want a job, a job (don't kid yourself --- LOTS of unemployed want that job). Here the Feds will have to help, but with a minimum of strings ... and the State legislators will have to get their economic philosophies in touch with reality. The States COULD ultimately handle State-level sociologies and economies, but the politicians must WANT to, and the Feds must facilitate.

So yes --- States could be their own salvation but State Politicians have rarely been willing to look problems like this squarely in the eye and give a solution big enough for the size of the problem which exists.

 

[Cackalacky2.0]

<blockquote class="twitter-tweet"><p lang="en" dir="ltr">BREAKING: First batch of new votes from NV, from Clark, shows Biden lead up to 12K.<br><br>Via <a href="https://twitter.com/RalstonReports?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">@RalstonReports</a></p>— Political Polls (@Politics_Polls) <a href="https://twitter.com/Politics_Polls/status/1324398211835043842?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">November 5, 2020</a></blockquote> <script async src="https://platform.twitter.com/widgets.js" charset="utf-8"></script>

 

[DCDomer]

No thanks. I don't want the 5 largest cities in the country dictating policy for the rest of us.

Cities don't vote, people do.

 

[NorthDakota]

Cities don't vote, people do.

You animals should be grateful that you were even given 3 votes in the EC. Should be zero.

 

[DCDomer]

You animals should be grateful that you were even given 3 votes in the EC. Should be zero.

Lol!

 

[Old Man Mike]

"you animals ... ?"

 

[TorontoGold]

Took less than 24 hours for this not to age well.

BTW...the anarchist rioters in the streets were here before Trump and will not go away when Trump is gone.

Your second statement contradicts your first. Kind of like saying stop the vote in PA but keep going in ARZ.....very Trumpian.

 

[TorontoGold]

Cities don't vote, people do.

<iframe src="https://giphy.com/embed/3oz8xTl6sGKbuRPDDW" width="480" height="194" frameBorder="0" class="giphy-embed" allowFullScreen></iframe><p><a href="https://giphy.com/gifs/gene-wilder-blazing-saddles-you-know-morons-3oz8xTl6sGKbuRPDDW">via GIPHY</a></p>

 

[NorthDakota]

"you animals ... ?"

Yes, animals. DC is awful. The people there are awful. Have never been impressed with the town. The only objectively good person there is whoever owns Jack Rose which happens to be the only good place in town. The rest of the district is trash. DCDomer might be okay, he probably has a solid sense of humor and might go to Jack Rose.

Arlington is OK. It would be better if Jack Rose was there. But then DC would be 100% bad instead of just 95% bad.

 

[RDU Irish]

That's such a BS comparison though. It's on the basis of Reps and Senators, which is already decided by population size. You can't proportion them any other way, and even if you did increase, say CA, like that says, you'd still have to up the winning score from 270 which would nullify that increase anyway.

Would rather see states split their EVs like Nebraska and Maine do, particularly the huge strongholds, including TX and FL. Since that is decided on the state level, never going to happen.

Divorce doesn't work, the discrepancy is cities versus rural more than anything. Split Illinios in to north and south, PA east and west, California in to three pieces, NY in to north and south if you want more people to be heard. But that wouldn't play to the liberal power so won't happen. Best answer for is to reduce power of the Feds - good luck with that, both sides want to expand federal government grossly.

 

[GowerND11]

Would rather see states split their EVs like Nebraska and Maine do, particularly the huge strongholds, including TX and FL. Since that is decided on the state level, never going to happen.

Divorce doesn't work, the discrepancy is cities versus rural more than anything. Split Illinios in to north and south, PA east and west, California in to three pieces, NY in to north and south if you want more people to be heard. But that wouldn't play to the liberal power so won't happen. Best answer for is to reduce power of the Feds - good luck with that, both sides want to expand federal government grossly.

That would certainly be more beneficial than scrapping the EC totally.

 

[RDU Irish]

That would certainly be more beneficial than scrapping the EC totally.

Saw some jabs at Ben Sasse for NE losing an EV to Biden. I'm guessing he spearheaded that? If you aren't pissing people off you aren't doing your job - that district has a say in presidential politics versus being drowned out and Sasse was rewarded with over 2/3 majority re-electing him.

 

[Cackalacky2.0]

"you animals ... ?"

There are a lot of minorities in DC......fuck I said the quiet part out loud.

 

[Cackalacky2.0]

Saw where the vote tally in GA has now turned such that Perdue's counts dropped below 50% and his Senate seat will have to go to a runoff with Ossoff. Also Warnock will runoff against Loffler. Wild stuff.

 

[Cackalacky2.0]

All in all though the down ballots didnt get the anti trump decimation many were thinking. GOP gained seats in House (including taking back my SC01) and held the Senate (so far).

Trump somehow managed to 200k more votes in Miami-Dade than in 2016. Interesting.

 

[Irish#1]

Trump somehow managed to 200k more votes in Miami-Dade than in 2016. Interesting.

Cheater

 

[Cackalacky2.0]

Cheater

Im not saying that. Im saying he managed to increase his vote numbers in Dem districts where the Dem vote numbers remained relatively stagnant. from 2016 to 2020.

 

[RDU Irish]

Cubans kind of dislike socialism. Hispanic demographic is ripe for the picking, pro family, pro God, incredible work ethic and serious entrepreneurship.

Cack - might take me a while to count out all of the Vbucks I think I will owe you. Can we get some $1 billion notes around here? I'm going to look like the Philly/Detroit 4am vote fairy delivering it in suitcases and wagons.