Athlon on ND this year, wow.

[Cali_domer]

2011 Football Predictions: Notre Dame | AthlonSports

 

[PANDFAN]

we just need to back it up!

 

[rtrn2glory]

wow...seriously i thought some guys on here were glass half full guys. I was thinking we maybe crack the 15-20 range at best and these dudes have us in the top 10???? i agree let's back up a second and let things get cleared out first at the QB position. I think our expectations are reasonable, but a top 10 preseason ranking might be a little far fetched.

 

[Cali_domer]

wow...seriously i thought some guys on here were glass half full guys. I was thinking we maybe crack the 15-20 range at best and these dudes have us in the top 10???? i agree let's back up a second and let things get cleared out first at the QB position. I think our expectations are reasonable, but a top 10 preseason ranking might be a little far fetched.

I agree, I can't believe they were debating if they should put us top 5.

 

[Veer option]

polarbearfacepalm.jpeg

 

[IrishSteelhead]

Can't say I agree with a pre-season ranking at all, but the first 3 games make or break it anyways, so we'll know right away who's right, and hopefully its them lol.

 

[irishtrain]

we just need to back it up!

BULLSEYE

 

[Sherm Sticky]

wow...seriously i thought some guys on here were glass half full guys. I was thinking we maybe crack the 15-20 range at best and these dudes have us in the top 10???? i agree let's back up a second and let things get cleared out first at the QB position. I think our expectations are reasonable, but a top 10 preseason ranking might be a little far fetched.

^This

 

[Rocket89]

I don't want to say that you could make a case for a top 10 ranking but.....

I think once you get past about the top 4 or 5 teams, there are some programs with talent for sure, but those teams have a lot of question marks.

I have a preseason top 5 of:

1. Alabama
2. LSU
3. Oklahoma
4. FSU
5. Oregon

Once you get past those teams, Notre Dame is actually one of the top two or three teams with the LEAST amount of questions in my opinion.

That probably won't manifest itself into a top 10 ranking when the poll officially comes out, but in terms of talent/returning starters/coaching/recruiting/etc...we are very much in the mix.

 

[IrishLax]

It's all about Michael Floyd. We are no better than a solid 8/9 win regular season without him. With Michael Floyd both our running game and passing game get huge bumps. I think he is worth at least a touchdown per game.

The only team on our schedule that is actually better than us on paper is Stanford. And even that is debateable. While a lot of the other games can be classified as "toss ups" there also aren't any games where we should be expected to lose.

 

[Sherm Sticky]

It's all about Michael Floyd. We are no better than a solid 8/9 win regular season without him. With Michael Floyd both our running game and passing game get huge bumps. I think he is worth at least a touchdown per game.

The only team on our schedule that is actually better than us on paper is Stanford. And even that is debateable. While a lot of the other games can be classified as "toss ups" there also aren't any games where we should be expected to lose.

I would still say USC starting 22 is more talented than ours. They are probably better than us on paper also.

 

[rikkitikki08]

Athlon has been drinking some brian kelly kool-aid and rightfully so but if we can come out of the gates strong i like our chances at finishing top 10. How accurate is athlon year in and year out?

 

[IrishSteelhead]

After further thought, there are only 6 teams I consider "undoubtedly better, we can't beat them", and they are (in no particular order):

Bama, LSU, Oklahoma, Ohio State, Oregon, Florida State

There are some other teams that I consider "certainly better, but who knows in a game"

TCU, Boise, Nebraska, Virginia Tech, Texas A&M, and Stanford

And finally "Could go either way, but i still think they are better"

Penn State, Michigan State, Oklahoma State, U$C, Wisconsin, Arkansas, Mississippi State, Auburn, South Carolina


All my humble opinion though, and other than the top 6, I really wouldn't fear a game against anyone else.

 

[IrishLax]

I would still say USC starting 22 is more talented than ours. They are probably better than us on paper also.

Respectfully disagree:

QB-Wash. Barkley and Dayne are both highly rated and unproven. Dayne throws poorly on the run and Barkley throws awful picks.
RB-Wash. USC trumps us on depth by a lot but Cierre is as good as any of the RBs they have.
WR-Wash with Floyd, huge edge to USC without Floyd. Matchup Floyd+TJ+Theo with Woods+Farmer+??? (see how the last two are completely unproven) and I feel it's pretty comparable... without Floyd USC has an epic advantage.
TE-Huge edge ND.
OL-Huge edge ND. Lack of depth/talent/experience on the OL could be the one thing that holds USC back this year.

DB-Slight edge ND.
LB-Huge edge ND.
DL-Wash.

So by my rough outline USC might have a slight edge at the skill positions because they have more depth but our top guys are as good as any. We have a huge advantage at OL/TE/Defense. I don't see how, on paper, anyone can think USC "has more talent" unless their defense is VASTLY improved this season.

 

[Sherm Sticky]

Respectfully disagree:

QB-Wash. Barkley and Dayne are both highly rated and unproven. Dayne throws poorly on the run and Barkley throws awful picks.
RB-Wash. USC trumps us on depth by a lot but Cierre is as good as any of the RBs they have.
WR-Wash with Floyd, huge edge to USC without Floyd. Matchup Floyd+TJ+Theo with Woods+Farmer+??? (see how the last two are completely unproven) and I feel it's pretty comparable... without Floyd USC has an epic advantage.
TE-Huge edge ND.
OL-Huge edge ND. Lack of depth/talent/experience on the OL could be the one thing that holds USC back this year.

DB-Slight edge ND.
LB-Huge edge ND.
DL-Wash.

So by my rough outline USC might have a slight edge at the skill positions because they have more depth but our top guys are as good as any. We have a huge advantage at OL/TE/Defense. I don't see how, on paper, anyone can think USC "has more talent" unless their defense is VASTLY improved this season.

QB-Wash? I go with USC-Barkley has more experience than Crist and Barkley will be the second player chosen behind Luck in next years draft. Edge USC.
RB-USC. They have more depth at RB and they are more talented: Taylor, Baxter, etc.
WR-I agree with you. Although I think Rob Woods is the best WR on either team.
TE-ND. USC has a talent there, but they don't have the experience and depth we have.
OLND-USC again has talent, but they aren't deep and they are young. ND does win easily here.
DL-I agree wash.
LB-I say slight edge ND. We have two excellent backers in Teo and Fleeming. The rest of the group is solid and talented, but young. USC has more talent across the board at LB, but doesn't have a game changer like Teo.
DB-Slight Edge to USC.

On paper at a talent standpoint I think they got us beat. But ovverall on paper, push.

 

[rtrn2glory]

After further thought, there are only 6 teams I consider "undoubtedly better, we can't beat them", and they are (in no particular order):

Bama, LSU, Oklahoma, Ohio State, Oregon, Florida State

There are some other teams that I consider "certainly better, but who knows in a game"

TCU, Boise, Nebraska, Virginia Tech, Texas A&M, and Stanford

And finally "Could go either way, but i still think they are better"

Penn State, Michigan State, Oklahoma State, U$C, Wisconsin, Arkansas, Mississippi State, Auburn, South Carolina


All my humble opinion though, and other than the top 6, I really wouldn't fear a game against anyone else.

First six: agree with all except Florida St. (still trying to turn things around)

Second 6: Virginia Tech (extremely overrated for years) Texas A&M (we would have beat them last year)

Third 6: Penn St. (Will start to go downhill in the next few years) Michigan St and Missisippi St (we're dead even with them right now, with us trending up and them possibly reaching their peak)

My take on the above teams, but i agree for the most part.

 

[IrishLax]

After further thought, there are only 6 teams I consider "undoubtedly better, we can't beat them", and they are (in no particular order):

Bama, LSU, Oklahoma, Ohio State, Oregon, Florida State

There are some other teams that I consider "certainly better, but who knows in a game"

TCU, Boise, Nebraska, Virginia Tech, Texas A&M, and Stanford

And finally "Could go either way, but i still think they are better"

Penn State, Michigan State, Oklahoma State, U$C, Wisconsin, Arkansas, Mississippi State, Auburn, South Carolina


All my humble opinion though, and other than the top 6, I really wouldn't fear a game against anyone else.

It's hard to take this seriously when you say Auburn (who lost everyone and anyone who was good) and Penn State (having watched their games last season because my little brother is currently attending school there.... I can safely say that if we are not better than Penn State this is going to be a miserable season) are "better" than us. There is also no way you can make the case that TCU, Boise State, Virginia Tech and Nebraska are "certainly better." TCU loses Dalton and tons of players, Tech loses Taylor and some other key guys, Boise State loses some of their playmakers, and Nebraska really sucked at the end of last year.

 

[IrishSteelhead]

It's hard to take this seriously when you say Auburn (who lost everyone and anyone who was good) and Penn State (having watched their games last season because my little brother is currently attending school there.... I can safely say that if we are not better than Penn State this is going to be a miserable season) are "better" than us. There is also no way you can make the case that TCU, Boise State, Virginia Tech and Nebraska are "certainly better." TCU loses Dalton and tons of players, Tech loses Taylor and some other key guys, Boise State loses some of their playmakers, and Nebraska really sucked at the end of last year.

Obviously I disagree, but am rock solid on:

Auburn- #15-20 in virtually every pre-season poll, far from depleted, way faster than ND (google Michael Dyer if you think they lost everyone who was good)

TCU- #10-15 in virtually every pre-season poll, far from depleted, have BCS winning coach, still formidable defense

Boise- #5-10 in virtually every pre-season poll, best home field advantage in cfb, Heisman candidate at QB, BCS winning coach

The ones I believe you make good points on:

Penn State- we'll have to wait and see I guess, but my guess is they have a solid 8-9 win year

VT- Agree they are overrated, but always have a great D and special teams

Nebraska- After seeing Navy destroy ND's defense, I can only imagine what the Huskers would do

*Thank you for the differing view, it gives me a new perspective

 

[ACamp1900]

when the actual mag comes out they'll have ND ranked in the 15-25 range

 

[PigtownIrish]

And I think in the 15-25 range is where we belong for now

 

[Jerry]

It's weird reading people's perspective of the program now that we actually have a defense. Kind of nice.

 

[IrishLax]

Obviously I disagree, but am rock solid on:

Auburn- #15-20 in virtually every pre-season poll, far from depleted, way faster than ND (google Michael Dyer if you think they lost everyone who was good)

TCU- #10-15 in virtually every pre-season poll, far from depleted, have BCS winning coach, still formidable defense

Boise- #5-10 in virtually every pre-season poll, best home field advantage in cfb, Heisman candidate at QB, BCS winning coach

The ones I believe you make good points on:

Penn State- we'll have to wait and see I guess, but my guess is they have a solid 8-9 win year

VT- Agree they are overrated, but always have a great D and special teams

Nebraska- After seeing Navy destroy ND's defense, I can only imagine what the Huskers would do

*Thank you for the differing view, it gives me a new perspective

Touche on Michael Dyer.... but they did lose the whole OL, almost all of their defensive playmakers and Cam Newton. I don't think they finish the year ranked.

Completely disagree with you on TCU, but we won't know how good they are because they don't play anyone besides one game against Boise so they'll likely go 12-0 or 11-1 again.

Saying Nebraska would beat us because Navy tore up our defense is not the same thing as saying they are "better" than ND or will have a better season. The truth is after starting last year with a dynamic offense they really struggled down the stretch. Nebraska lost 3 out of their last 4 games and loses some top tier NFL talent on their defense which was the one consistent part of their team. There is no way that they are "certainly better" than Notre Dame.

 

[BestBIrish47]

I would love to just win two bowl games in a row... maybe a BCS win before we are Knighted a TOP 5...........

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[irishpat183]

I'd be suprised if we were in the top 10 pre-season. I'm with Acamp, 15-20 range. Which will suit me just fine. We'll work our way up as everyone else loses!

And a comment on the "Who's more talented" between us and USC?? Nobody in the country has more TALENT, than USC. I'm not saying they're more experienced or a better team, but raw talent...USC and FSU are the two best right now.

 

[Irish Man3]

I'd feel good about a 20-25 ranking in the pre-season polls. We don't deserve any higher than that. We were unranked going into the bowl game last year, in which we beat a Miami team that had already quit on their coach. I will agree 100% that we made a ton of progress over the final four games of last season but let's not get ahead of ourselves.

As for compairing our team to USC:

QB- USC. Barkely is a top 10 pick in next years draft. He makes dumb mistakes but his physical skill set is superior to anyone on our roster.

RB- USC. Deeper and more talented from top to bottom.

WR- USC. What do we have past Michael Floyd? TJ who started hot but disapeared at times throughout the year? Is this finally the year we see Walker or Goodman make huge strides? Compare that to Woods, Prater, Ambles, and the 100 other 4-5* WR on their roster. A lot of their guys are unproven as well but their talent gives them the edge.

TE- ND. I'll take what we have at TE over any other roster in the country.

OL- USC. Tyron Smith is a potential top ten pick and didn't even play left tackle if my memory serves me right. They're not deep at OL but they are as talented as any.

DEFENSE- From top to bottom, they still have more talent. However, I like what Diaco has done. Let's call this a wash until we see what Diaco/kiffin do in year two.

Just my opinion... but let's not take one win over USC to far. They are very talented. I would certainly take our coaching staff over theirs. Facts are facts but as good as we played last year, we lose that game if Rojo makes that catch.

 

[IrishLax]

I'd be suprised if we were in the top 10 pre-season. I'm with Acamp, 15-20 range. Which will suit me just fine. We'll work our way up as everyone else loses!

And a comment on the "Who's more talented" between us and USC?? Nobody in the country has more TALENT, than USC. I'm not saying they're more experienced or a better team, but raw talent...USC and FSU are the two best right now.

Nope. By talent you clearly mean "players with lots of stars." I don't have the facts on that, but I strongly doubt FSU and USC have more "stars" than Alabama, Texas and Florida.

Speaking on talent, not in terms of "stars" but in terms of who actually has the most talented players who have proven they can dominate in the college game, USC is not even close. They aren't even in the top 10 much less the best in the country.

 

[ACamp1900]

Speaking on talent, not in terms of "stars" but in terms of who actually has the most talented players who have proven they can dominate in the college game, USC is not even close. They aren't even in the top 10 much less the best in the country.

USC isn't even close to one of the most talented teams in the country?... Okay... just to clarify... are you on crack? lol

 

[jakerbluegold]

I pray we're NOT a top 10 team to start the season. Don't see that working out well for us.

I could go for the 15-25 range though.

 

[IrishLax]

As for compairing our team to USC:

QB- USC. Barkely is a top 10 pick in next years draft. He makes dumb mistakes but his physical skill set is superior to anyone on our roster.

Since when is the "physical skillset" the most important part of a QB? Barkley sucks until he stops throwing game-changing interceptions like it's his job. Same thing for Dayne, but with him it has to do with accuracy on the move. Both of them are nothing more than B- QBs until they prove something.

RB- USC. Deeper and more talented from top to bottom.

Deeper, yes. More talent? Their best returning RB had 5.3 YPC to Cierre Wood's 5.1... but Cierre was much stronger than that down the stretch and is younger so he should see more improvement.

WR- USC. What do we have past Michael Floyd? TJ who started hot but disapeared at times throughout the year? Is this finally the year we see Walker or Goodman make huge strides? Compare that to Woods, Prater, Ambles, and the 100 other 4-5* WR on their roster. A lot of their guys are unproven as well but their talent gives them the edge.

What do they have besides a sophmore who put up average numbers last year? Ambles? He's having all kinds of personal problems right now and is consistently in the dog house/being punished. Prater? Hasn't proved anything yet. Brice Butler is a malcontent who might as well not even be on the team. George Farmer? Maybe he can come in and play right away but still... nothing proven.

Floyd is a proven beast. TJ was great until he hurt his hammy... that's why he disappeared down the stretch. And you're forgetting Theo Riddick who should be absolutely dynamic in the slot. Those three guys match up up with whatever top 3 guys you pick from USC's "hundreds" of 4*/5* players. End of story.

TE- ND. I'll take what we have at TE over any other roster in the country.

Agreed.

OL- USC. Tyron Smith is a potential top ten pick and didn't even play left tackle if my memory serves me right. They're not deep at OL but they are as talented as any.

Simply wrong. Their OL is both not deep and not very good/proven in many places. A lot of USC fans are saying that their incoming true frosh players like Hobbi are going to need to contribute immediately.

DEFENSE- From top to bottom, they still have more talent. However, I like what Diaco has done. Let's call this a wash until we see what Diaco/kiffin do in year two.

I bet you couldn't name me more than one player on their defense without looking it up. This is NOT a wash. It is a HUGE edge towards ND until USC's secondary (which has walk-ons, converted track athletes and 3*s... just so you're aware) proves it doesn't totally suck.

Just my opinion... but let's not take one win over USC to far. They are very talented. I would certainly take our coaching staff over theirs. Facts are facts but as good as we played last year, we lose that game if Rojo makes that catch.

And if our DB doesn't slip Rojo isn't open. Funny the way driving rain works, isn't it?

You're entitled to your opinion, but outside of guys like NDinLA I probably pay more attention to USC than most on this board. The truth is they have a ton of question marks and outside of offensive skill players they aren't "loaded" with talent. I'll totally agree with you that their WR, QB and RB on paper are super dominant... but Cierre, Mike, etc. aren't too shabby either and have proved more at this point in their careers than many of the USC guys.

 

[IrishLax]

USC isn't even close to one of the most talented teams in the country?... Okay... just to clarify... are you on crack? lol

How is this even debatable? They have below average players across their secondary, very average linebackers/DL. Their OL has both weak and strong points but is overall average at best. Their offensive skill players are as talented as any... but that's less than a quarter of the personnel you pout out on the field.

So 25% of their team has elite talent, 75% of their team is average at best. How am I wrong?