Russia Invades Ukraine

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ab2cmiller

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Irish#1 said:
I guess Musk and this guy don't realize that you can't negotiate with Putin. They must have forgot that they've already had several meetings where Putin refused to budge.
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I’m certainly ok with arguing against Musk’s proposal. I have a lot of issues with being able to trust Putin in any negotiated deal.

My purpose for posting the tweet is to point out how bat shit crazy people react to this stuff. People calling Musk pro Russian for posting that tweet is literally insane.
 
GowerND11

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ab2cmiller said:
I’m certainly ok with arguing against Musk’s proposal. I have a lot of issues with being able to trust Putin in any negotiated deal.

My purpose for posting the tweet is to point out how bat shit crazy people react to this stuff. People calling Musk pro Russian for posting that tweet is literally insane.
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Right. He literally provided internet through Starlink to Ukraine right away at the beginning of the war. It's a dumb thought to assume Putin will behave, but that tweet, even if it's poorly thought out/executed, isn't pro-Russia.
 
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GowerND11 said:
Right. He literally provided internet through Starlink to Ukraine right away at the beginning of the war. It's a dumb thought to assume Putin will behave, but that tweet, even if it's poorly thought out/executed, isn't pro-Russia.
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I think why everyone is up at arms over it is because it’s truly a take on appeasement. Ukraine doesn’t want appeasement. nATO and Europe aren’t doing everything they have done for appeasement. The goal is to get Russia out of the areas it forcibly took over including Crimea. Musk taking an appeasement stance is a terrible take. Especially considering how successful The UAF have been with the support of its Allie’s.

Most everyone agrees that having a stable and prosperous Ukraine is a good thing for the geopolitics and economics of the region. Calling for appeasement gives Putin air to breath. He needs zero. Suffocate the shit out of him.
 
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Cackalacky2.0 said:
I think why everyone is up at arms over it is because it’s truly a take on appeasement. Ukraine doesn’t want appeasement. nATO and Europe aren’t doing everything they have done for appeasement. The goal is to get Russia out of the areas it forcibly took over including Crimea. Musk taking an appeasement stance is a terrible take. Especially considering how successful The UAF have been with the support of its Allie’s.

Most everyone agrees that having a stable and prosperous Ukraine is a good thing for the geopolitics and economics of the region. Calling for appeasement gives Putin air to breath. He needs zero. Suffocate the shit out of him.
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Well said. Appeasement isn't something that can be done here. Putin, like other megalomaniacs doesn't understand boundaries.
 
Irish#1

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GowerND11 said:
Well said. Appeasement isn't something that can be done here. Putin, like other megalomaniacs doesn't understand boundaries.
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Cackalacky2.0 said:
I think why everyone is up at arms over it is because it’s truly a take on appeasement. Ukraine doesn’t want appeasement. nATO and Europe aren’t doing everything they have done for appeasement. The goal is to get Russia out of the areas it forcibly took over including Crimea. Musk taking an appeasement stance is a terrible take. Especially considering how successful The UAF have been with the support of its Allie’s.

Most everyone agrees that having a stable and prosperous Ukraine is a good thing for the geopolitics and economics of the region. Calling for appeasement gives Putin air to breath. He needs zero. Suffocate the shit out of him.
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He has received several leaders of their countries and sent a team to the negotiating table. Each and every time it was just to appease and make everyone think he was willing to negotiate. When they finally put him in a coffin, he'll probably be laying in it giving everyone the finger.
 
Irish#1

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ndfanatic78 said:
You'd expect wrong. Russia will end all life on this planet before losing the Donbas and Crimea to a hostile military alliance. I dont get what part of this people dont get. Didn't you all think Russia would never invade Ukraine. I know thats what the ruling elite thought before they funded the coup in 2014 boy were they wrong. Now we got thousands dead so western oligarchs can make more profits. Soon we will see how much value all that wealth has when we are sitting on a planet ravaged by nuclear fallout. I hope you all like watching your loved ones dying a slow painful death from the nuclear radiation. Seriously can someone point to one example of Putin bluffing and not following through on his rhetoric?
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Ukraine. Last time I checked his army was going backwards.

As far as the nukes, what proof do you have that Putin will use them?
 
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I'm sure it's been mentioned here already, but I just saw something that said we've got confirmed US Special forces working in Ukraine. Would explain the recent shifts in the war effort.
 
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dublinirish said:


taking back Crimea would be wild shit
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I like that but with winter coming I think the territory gains will be minimal. They better get Kherson quickly and them separate Crimea before then. If not it will be next year before they can even sniff the Black Sea.
 
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ulukinatme said:
I'm sure it's been mentioned here already, but I just saw something that said we've got confirmed US Special forces working in Ukraine. Would explain the recent shifts in the war effort.
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Like boots on the ground? or just intel sharing and training?
 
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Irish#1

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ndfanatic78 said:
thegrayzone.com

US, UK sabotaged peace deal because they ‘don’t care about Ukraine’: fmr. NATO adviser - The Grayzone

Former Swiss intelligence officer and NATO adviser Jacques Baud on the next phase of the Russia-Ukraine war and new allegations that the US and UK undermined a peace deal that could have ended it. The West's aim "is not the victory of Ukraine, It's the defeat of Russia," Baud says. "The problem...
thegrayzone.com thegrayzone.com
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is not the victory of Ukraine. It's the defeat of Russia?
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Kind of hard to have one without the other.
 
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Cackalacky2.0 said:
Like boots on the ground? or just intel sharing and training?
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I can't find it now, so I can't say :cautious: I'm sure it's more intel sharing and training than anything which seems to have been known for awhile, but if they were working undercover I wouldn't be surprised too. It's hard to fathom Ukraine is turning this thing around with just outside cash and weapons being supplied, there has to be more going on. Even if Russia's current soldiers are replacements and ill trained you figure they should still have an overwhelming numbers advantage over the Ukrainians, among other assets. The fact they seemed to be getting pushed back now lends itself to maybe some additional outside help intervening.
 
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ulukinatme said:
I can't find it now, so I can't say :cautious: I'm sure it's more intel sharing and training than anything which seems to have been known for awhile, but if they were working undercover I wouldn't be surprised too. It's hard to fathom Ukraine is turning this thing around with just outside cash and weapons being supplied, there has to be more going on. Even if Russia's current soldiers are replacements and ill trained you figure they should still have an overwhelming numbers advantage over the Ukrainians, among other assets. The fact they seemed to be getting pushed back now lends itself to maybe some additional outside help intervening.
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Hmmmm I mean I thought NATO and US intelligence has been helping since the beginning.
 
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Cackalacky2.0 said:
Hmmmm I mean I thought NATO and US intelligence has been helping since the beginning.
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For sure, I have seen reports of that. Whatever I read earlier today made it seem like there were US Special Forces on the ground working covertly too. I can't find or remember where I read it now, so either the information got scrubbed or it was bogus info. Who knows.
 
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