'17 MD SDE Joshua Paschal (Kentucky Verbal)

[koonja]

And only PSU really wanted Fuller.

Kizer was given the potential tag at the Elite 11 and finished behind this group. 1) Sean White 2) Allen 3) Grier 4) Heard 5) Park 6) Blough 7) Barker 8) Rubenzer 9) Kaaya 10) Watson 11) Carta-Samuels

Hell, Kaaya and Watson will probably go Ham on college football as well, but were bested by guys that no one will remember.

Josh Adams had an offer list that was Boston College, PSU, Temple, Stanford, Pitt, Wiscy.

Whittaker has UGA, Tenn., South Carolina, North Carolina.

I thought we were past having to do this every time the staff goes after a player that isn't a 247 stud.

I guess I could ask 'what does ND like about him that no one else does?', but I'm trying to cover the predictable response: "What are you taking about", where I have to respond with 'look at his ratings and offers'.

I'm not sure how else to ask what does ND see that others don't.

 

[GBdomer]

I guess I could ask 'what does ND like about him that no one else does?', but I'm trying to cover the predictable response: "What are you taking about", where I have to respond with 'look at his ratings and offers'.

I'm not sure how else to ask what does ND see that others don't.

If we didn't have 24 7 and rivals rankings could you honestly tell me you would be able to tell the difference between a 92 player and lets say an 85 player?

 

[koonja]

If we didn't have 24 7 and rivals rankings could you honestly tell me you would be able to tell the difference between a 92 player and lets say an 85 player?

No because I haven't watched his film. The 'don't ask about the talents of an 85 rating with Ball State type offers' crowd's defensiveness is getting annoying. I use the ratings and offers as a reference.

I simply asked what is ND seeing in him that others don't.

 

[House16]

And only PSU really wanted Fuller.

Kizer was given the potential tag at the Elite 11 and finished behind this group. 1) Sean White 2) Allen 3) Grier 4) Heard 5) Park 6) Blough 7) Barker 8) Rubenzer 9) Kaaya 10) Watson 11) Carta-Samuels

Hell, Kaaya and Watson will probably go Ham on college football as well, but were bested by guys that no one will remember.

Josh Adams had an offer list that was Boston College, PSU, Temple, Stanford, Pitt, Wiscy.

Whittaker has UGA, Tenn., South Carolina, North Carolina.

I thought we were past having to do this every time the staff goes after a player that isn't a 247 stud. Plus, like I said above, numbers get a little foggy on the DL after Ewell commits so I'm not even sure Whittaker is a take.

I feel like it's really fair to be less than pleased about staff going after this kind of player because it's a sign that they're whiffing on higher rated prospects. If the staff had their choice between a 96 rated player and an 83 rated player and chose the latter, then we could say trust the coaches. However, I'm not going to trust that we hit a home run with an 83 rated player when it looks like we're only taking him because we can't get anyone better.

It's why I feel really good about the potential of a guy like Pouncey, because we have lots of WRs who want in and we picked him from the group. However, what reason do we have for confidence in a low rated DE? It's not like we have a bunch of blue chip DEs knocking down the door this cycle.

 

[GBdomer]

No because I haven't watched his film. The 'don't ask about the talents of an 85 rating with Ball State type offers' crowd's defensiveness is getting annoying. I use the ratings and offers as a reference.

I simply asked what is ND seeing in him that others don't.

I'm assuming Central Michigan saw something in Antonio Brown, BC saw something in Kuechly and LSU saw something in the Honey Badger

 

[koonja]

I'm assuming Central Michigan saw something in Antonio Brown, BC saw something in Kuechly and LSU saw something in the Honey Badger

Edit: This is too stupid to talk about.

 

[GBdomer]

Edit: This is too stupid to talk about.

I am just saying ND needs all the help they can get on the Dline and maybe they think Whitaker can fill a role in this scheme. Sometimes when a staff throws out an offer it's not always committable either. Maybe this was ND's way of throwing there hat in the game in a few months if they whiff on some prospects.

 

[connor_in]

No because I haven't watched his film. The 'don't ask about the talents of an 85 rating with Ball State type offers' crowd's defensiveness is getting annoying. I use the ratings and offers as a reference.

I simply asked what is ND seeing in him that others don't.

Being as how the staff cannot discuss recruits, someone's gut feeling that they see something they can work with is hard to explain to die hard fans.

Sparty's Coach Dantonio has made a living off these kids and gotten a number of them into The League.

 

[Luckylucci]

I feel like it's really fair to be less than pleased about staff going after this kind of player because it's a sign that they're whiffing on higher rated prospects. If the staff had their choice between a 96 rated player and an 83 rated player and chose the latter, then we could say trust the coaches. However, I'm not going to trust that we hit a home run with an 83 rated player when it looks like we're only taking him because we can't get anyone better.

It's why I feel really good about the potential of a guy like Pouncey, because we have lots of WRs who want in and we picked him from the group. However, what reason do we have for confidence in a low rated DE? It's not like we have a bunch of blue chip DEs knocking down the door this cycle.

Can't bold on my phone to well but in response to the first sentence. No, not even close. This is clearly you missing the bigger picture. The staff doesn't give two shits about ratings so why should we care. Maybe they don't view them as higher rated prospects. Your entire premise is that the rankings are 100% accurate and more important than the staffs view. Who says they are less than pleased?

How do you know that Whttaker isn't a top of the board guy? Because he was offered later? Order of offers is so overrated. Hamlin was the top CB last cycle until Prides senior season. Pride became the # 1 CB on their board 3ish months before NSD. You think they cared that he was rated a 3 star in July before his Senior season? Lol

FWIW, Kirby Smart the defensive guru offered this kid and he's still only an 83.

 

[Luckylucci]

Being as how the staff cannot discuss recruits, someone's gut feeling that they see something they can work with is hard to explain to die hard fans.

Sparty's Coach Dantonio has made a living off these kids and gotten a number of them into The League.

Exactly, so have a lot of programs and coaches.

 

[koonja]

Can't bold on my phone to well but in response to the first sentence. No, not even close. This is clearly you missing the bigger picture. The staff doesn't give two shits about ratings so why should we care. Maybe they don't view them as higher rated prospects. Your entire premise is that the rankings are 100% accurate and more important than the staffs view. Who says they are less than pleased?

How do you know that Whttaker isn't a top of the board guy? Because he was offered later? Order of offers is so overrated. Hamlin was the top CB last cycle until Prides senior season. Pride became the # 1 CB on their board 3ish months before NSD. You think they cared that he was rated a 3 star in July before his Senior season? Lol

FWIW, Kirby Smart the defensive guru offered this kid and he's still only an 83.

We don't, but he's apparently not on many other team's boards which is apparent in his offer list. Again, asking if anyone knows what the staff sees in him based on film and/or things they've read. I'm baffled that this question is hit with such defense.

 

[House16]

Can't bold on my phone to well but in response to the first sentence. No, not even close. This is clearly you missing the bigger picture. The staff doesn't give two shits about ratings so why should we care. Maybe they don't view them as higher rated prospects. Your entire premise is that the rankings are 100% accurate and more important than the staffs view. Who says they are less than pleased?

How do you know that Whttaker isn't a top of the board guy? Because he was offered later? Order of offers is so overrated. Hamlin was the top CB last cycle until Prides senior season. Pride became the # 1 CB on their board 3ish months before NSD. You think they cared that he was rated a 3 star in July before his Senior season? Lol

FWIW, Kirby Smart the defensive guru offered this kid and he's still only an 83.

So, how do you judge how excited to be about recruits? If your litmus test for a recruit being good is "hey, our staff offered them," then every recruit will pass and there isn't any reason to follow this stuff.

My argument is that A) of course ratings and offer lists aren't always perfectly accurate but B) they're literally the only objective measures we have, at least for those of us who can't break down tape well.

 

[brewdog_14527]

If we didn't have 24 7 and rivals rankings could you honestly tell me you would be able to tell the difference between a 92 player and lets say an 85 player?

That is the question of the year and should be posted every time we start one of these "why is he good enough for ND" debates!!

 

[Luckylucci]

We don't, but he's apparently not on many other team's boards which is apparent in his offer list. Again, asking if anyone knows what the staff sees in him based on film and/or things they've read. I'm baffled that this question is hit with such defense.

Not defensive or even hot on this topic, maybe a tad frustrated. If this was a 5 star this conversation wouldn't be happening. Therefore our conversation and opinions are being influenced by Barton Simmons/Mike Farrell etc. I follow a few boards and I guess I just get tired of reading the same thing. Especially from guys that follow this closely.

 

[koonja]

Not defensive or even hot on this topic, maybe a tad frustrated. If this was a 5 star this conversation wouldn't be happening. Therefore our conversation and opinions are being influenced by Barton Simmons/Mike Farrell etc. I follow a few boards and I guess I just get tired of reading the same thing. Especially from guys that follow this closely.

Correct. If you're a 5 star and/or have a sick offer list, you don't get questioned. When you have neither, the question is warranted.

 

[Luckylucci]

So, how do you judge how excited to be about recruits? If your litmus test for a recruit being good is "hey, our staff offered them," then every recruit will pass and there isn't any reason to follow this stuff.

My argument is that A) of course ratings and offer lists aren't always perfectly accurate but B) they're literally the only objective measures we have, at least for those of us who can't break down tape well.

Is this a serious question? WATCH the tape. It's readily available for all to see. I can't remember the last kid we offered that didn't have extensive highlight tape. Hell, you can even take the time to find game footage at places like MaxPreps. Also, you could choose to find guys that do know what they are talking about. ISD, Driskell, etc. those are some relatively good people to follow and in most cases give you the good and bad with all.

Let's just be real here. Wiltfong just said that after seeing CJ Holmes 4 times in the last 3-5 months, they weren't going to rate him higher because they didn't have testing numbers from today, really? That's who you want to take your que from?

I'm done on this for the evening. Cheers

 

[Luckylucci]

Correct. If you're a 5 star and/or have a sick offer list, you don't get questioned. When you have neither, the question is warranted.

So for you, it's Farrell and Simmons. Good luck with that.

 

[House16]

Is this a serious question? WATCH the tape. It's readily available for all to see. I can't remember the last kid we offered that didn't have extensive highlight tape. Hell, you can even take the time to find game footage at places like MaxPreps. Also, you could choose to find guys that do know what they are talking about. ISD, Driskell, etc. those are some relatively good people to follow and in most cases give you the good and bad with all.

Let's just be real here. Wiltfong just said that after seeing CJ Holmes 4 times in the last 3-5 months, they weren't going to rate him higher because they didn't have testing numbers from today, really? That's who you want to take your que from?

I'm done on this for the evening. Cheers

Ratings services have people that devote their entire careers to watching tape, attending camps, scouting players, etc and then relay that to the public in easy to interpret ratings. But yeah you're right Wiltfong didn't rate Holmes higher so throw all that info out.

 

[Sherm Sticky]

This should all be moved to Whittaker's thread.

But I don't understand how Koon states he has a poor offer list.

Notre Dame
Georgia
UNC
South Carolina
Tennessee
And I'll even add Purdue who has had a ton of big time DL in the past 15 years or so.

That isn't bad list at all IMO.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[STLDomer]

Worth noting also, some rating services, particularly 247 rate in terms of NFL potential. Just because a guy isn't going to be a future NFL player doesn't mean he can't be an effective college player.

97 - 90 -= Four-star prospect. One of the top 300 players in the nation. This prospect will be an impact-player for his college team. He is an All-American candidate who is projected to play professionally.

89 - 80 = Three-star prospect. One of the top 10% players in the nation. This player will develop into a reliable starter for his college team and is among the best players in his region of the country. Many three-stars have significant pro potential.

 

[Big23Head]

Scout: liked ND a lot more than he thought he would. Top schools are Notre Dame, Maryland and Oklahoma. Looking to narrow it down soon

 

[ND Fan Vancouver]

Scout: liked ND a lot more than he thought he would. Top schools are Notre Dame, Maryland and Oklahoma. Looking to narrow it down soon

This is GREAT news. This guy is a 5 star in my eyes.

 

[Big23Head]

Another Scout article says USC is in the mix too. Considering OVs to ND and Oklahoma with USC possible. Again spoke highly of ND, hopefully he can get academics in order if that is and issue

 

[Big23Head]

<blockquote class="twitter-tweet" data-lang="en"><p lang="en" dir="ltr"><a href="https://twitter.com/hashtag/NotreDame?src=hash">#NotreDame</a> DE target Joshua Paschal (<a href="https://twitter.com/JPaschal5">@JPaschal5</a>) vs. OL Walker Little. <a href="https://twitter.com/gcfootball">@gcfootball</a> <a href="https://t.co/Sjv6u9Mu6n">pic.twitter.com/Sjv6u9Mu6n</a></p>— Tyler James (@TJamesNDI) <a href="https://twitter.com/TJamesNDI/status/751856765617049600">July 9, 2016</a></blockquote>
<script async src="//platform.twitter.com/widgets.js" charset="utf-8"></script>

<blockquote class="twitter-tweet" data-lang="en"><p lang="en" dir="ltr">DE Joshua Paschal showing his power <a href="https://twitter.com/hashtag/GETOPEN?src=hash">#GETOPEN</a> <a href="https://t.co/bor9BfLmYe">pic.twitter.com/bor9BfLmYe</a></p>— Sanjay Kirpalani (@SanjayKirpalani) <a href="https://twitter.com/SanjayKirpalani/status/751542755885658113">July 8, 2016</a></blockquote>
<script async src="//platform.twitter.com/widgets.js" charset="utf-8"></script>

 

[OCIrish]

We don't, but he's apparently not on many other team's boards which is apparent in his offer list. Again, asking if anyone knows what the staff sees in him based on film and/or things they've read. I'm baffled that this question is hit with such defense.

Koon, I don't have an answer, and I can certainly understand the angst, as I've questioned offers in the past. The only person I can think of who might be able to get an answer is L.A.. He seems to know more inside info than anybody else lately. I've stopped questioning the staff on things, because, as my old college DC always told us, "Hell, they've forgotten more about football than I'll ever know......"

 

[BobbyMac]

<blockquote class="twitter-tweet" data-lang="en"><p lang="en" dir="ltr">Top 7.. S/o to <a href="https://twitter.com/Hayesfawcett3">@Hayesfawcett3</a> for the edit. Thank you to every school who recruited me up to this point. <a href="https://t.co/esePlneHtk">pic.twitter.com/esePlneHtk</a></p>— Joshua Paschal (@JPaschal5) <a href="https://twitter.com/JPaschal5/status/752987355422810113">July 12, 2016</a></blockquote> <script async src="//platform.twitter.com/widgets.js" charset="utf-8"></script>

 

[PANDFAN]

<blockquote class="twitter-tweet" data-lang="en"><p lang="en" dir="ltr">Top 7.. S/o to <a href="https://twitter.com/Hayesfawcett3">@Hayesfawcett3</a> for the edit. Thank you to every school who recruited me up to this point. <a href="https://t.co/esePlneHtk">pic.twitter.com/esePlneHtk</a></p>— Joshua Paschal (@JPaschal5) <a href="https://twitter.com/JPaschal5/status/752987355422810113">July 12, 2016</a></blockquote> <script async src="//platform.twitter.com/widgets.js" charset="utf-8"></script>

as bighead mentioned above....wiltfong said Josh told him he has a top 3 of ND, maryland and Okl.

 

[irish4ever]

as bighead mentioned above....wiltfong said Josh told him he has a top 3 of ND, maryland and Okl.

If that is true, you would assume that it comes down to either Maryland (staying close to home) or ND (4 for 40 yrs. decision and appears to be a perennial CFB playoff contender).

 

[condoms SUCk]

Good news, anyone have an idea on a commitment timeline for him?

 

[PANDFAN]

Good news, anyone have an idea on a commitment timeline for him?

not sure, he has some academic stuff to clean up anyways...but loy mentioned he sees him ending up at ND unless he takes too long and loses his spot...or obviously doesn't get the academics straightened out