Post Game Observations (Stanford '15)...

[Luckylucci]

Look around the country. There are dozens of defensive coordinators doing a LOT better with less talent than BVG

This is my issue. There is said to be a lot of talent of this defense for what was a terrible performance last night.

 

[IrishLax]

This is my issue. There is said to be a lot of talent of this defense for what was a terrible performance last night.

See, I don't think the defense was "terrible" last night. The end of the game is mind blowing levels of terrible/stupid, but in general I didn't feel like they were THAT bad. They stopped their best player and challenged Hogan + mediocre receivers to beat them... which they did.

Cole Luke getting beat 1v1 in the red zone on 3rd down is on him. Devin Butler getting destroyed trying to make a tackle is on him. Then the other two TDs where they ran misdirection and hit the wide open guy in the flat... I think there is a combination of blame, because when players are blowing assignments all year, that's got to be in large part on coaches. When Joe Schmidt has to be on the field to "line everybody up" and PEOPLE STILL AREN'T LINED UP CORRECTLY AND DON'T KNOW WHO THEY'RE COVERING that's on coaches, as easy as it would be for me to blame Redfield or Coney. The other TD is just a bunch of rushes that eventually landed them in the endzone, so props to them for out-manning us down there.

So against one of the elite offenses in football they gave up 420 yards and that's not the end of the world... held McCaffrey to under 100 yards on 3.5 YPC which is flat out great... and still lost, because they went 5-for-5 in the red zone and then we played ridiculously conceived prevent defense. So what BVG has to answer for is why our RZ defense continues to be abysmal and easily beat by misdirection, why we have so many coverage breakdowns, and why we're playing that ridiculous defense when Stanford just needs 25 yards to get in field goal range and has timeouts.

But I think it's unfair for some to act like the entire game plan was garbage, or that the defense was just dreadful in all phases.

 

[Rizzophil]

See, I don't think the defense was "terrible" last night. The end of the game is mind blowing levels of terrible/stupid, but in general I didn't feel like they were THAT bad. They stopped their best player and challenged Hogan + mediocre receivers to beat them... which they did.

Cole Luke getting beat 1v1 in the red zone on 3rd down is on him. Devin Butler getting destroyed trying to make a tackle is on him. Then the other two TDs where they ran misdirection and hit the wide open guy in the flat... I think there is a combination of blame, because when players are blowing assignments all year, that's got to be in large part on coaches. When Joe Schmidt has to be on the field to "line everybody up" and PEOPLE STILL AREN'T LINED UP CORRECTLY AND DON'T KNOW WHO THEY'RE COVERING that's on coaches, as easy as it would be for me to blame Redfield or Coney. The other TD is just a bunch of rushes that eventually landed them in the endzone, so props to them for out-manning us down there.

So against one of the elite offenses in football they gave up 420 yards and that's not the end of the world... held McCaffrey to under 100 yards on 3.5 YPC which is flat out great... and still lost, because they went 5-for-5 in the red zone and then we played ridiculously conceived prevent defense. So what BVG has to answer for is why our RZ defense continues to be abysmal and easily beat by misdirection, why we have so many coverage breakdowns, and why we're playing that ridiculous defense when Stanford just needs 25 yards to get in field goal range and has timeouts.

But I think it's unfair for some to act like the entire game plan was garbage, or that the defense was just dreadful in all phases.

Great, balanced post

 

[IrishFanJMercy]

Here's my issue with BVG that I noticed numerous times this year. How many huge plays did we give up on 3rd down? A huge amount. I don't know how many times, it was 3rd and 7 or 3rd and 10 and BVG decided to rush only 3 and have the safeties sit back 15 yards that's just stupid. This is where I would like to see a full out Blitz make the QB get the ball out quick instead of having all the time in the world to find an open guy.

 

[Luckylucci]

To me, when you add all that up it's a pretty sad picture. I didn't expect it to be great or even good but I think Stanford is still driving on this defense.

 

[Luckylucci]

Here's my issue with BVG that I noticed numerous times this year. How many huge plays did we give up on 3rd down? A huge amount. I don't know how many times, it was 3rd and 7 or 3rd and 10 and BVG decided to rush only 3 and have the safeties sit back 15 yards that's just stupid. This is where I would like to see a full out Blitz make the QB get the ball out quick instead of having all the time in the world to find an open guy.

Our 3rd down defense was atrocious last night, at least early. However, I don't know how the numbers came out. I can just recall numerous 3rd downs early that we have up.

 

[NDgradstudent]

Our 3rd down defense was atrocious last night, at least early. However, I don't know how the numbers came out. I can just recall numerous 3rd downs early that we have up.

Incredibly, we are 18th on 3rd down conversions at 32.9%. Last night was 66%.

 

[Redbar]

IMO the reason we got beat by a mediocre QB and receivers is because we sold out to stop McCaffrey. So I am not that impressed that we managed to hold him to a modest game. One guy should not beat this defense, and we should not have to drop the safeties down every play to do it. If it does take that much to stop one guy, then there should be no surprise that just about everything else will be available to the offense. And it was. 8/12 on third down is because BVG is predictable, in the sense that you know you will have single coverage outside because if it 3rd and more than a couple he is sending the ranch.

 

[IrishinSyria]

Don't want to dwell on this, because who cares at this point but yesterday was exactly why people have been worried about Joe S all year. He just could not make a play to save his life, or our season.

 

[phgreek]

Dline has been pretty solid all year. Jaylon's speed has cleaned up a number of plays at the next level, but after that...SMH...Too many times it appeared to me people blew assignments, and the tackling in the secondary was average or below, and pass coverage...was generally poor. Also, where were the turnovers? Not a lot of thunderous hits jarring the ball lose...which unfortunately is another sign of people being out of position. The pass rush was ok at times, but also not where I expected it to be. Also, what percentage of blitz hit home? I'm sorry this defense was REALLY inconsistent.

Now, I think NDs players are at least as smart as everyone else's players, just as courageous, just as driven, and their athleticism is approaching top end. So what is the problem then? Because there is most assuredly a problem.

My belief is BVG can coordinate a really fine defense, but I have doubts as to rather that translates to college level, particularly those who actually have to play school too. I do not doubt his brains, creativity, or desire. I question getting whats in his head into the players' heads. After two years, and with the players that were present this year, I expected way better. I hope he spends the off season refining...because he'll be down 1 Sheldon Day, and 1 Jaylon Smith...and the Defensive QB. I hate to admit it, but maybe BVG could spend some time at a TCU clinic?

 

[Bugzly21]

I was at the game. Long drive there and back so I haven't read through any of the posts yet. Here is was my experience..

1) Stanford pissed me of before they even kicked. The band cut off the national anthem mid-way through it. Us in the stands ended up singing it. Not sure if that's was the purpose but F them for that.

2) Was probably about 50-50, maybe 60-40, Stanford to ND fans and they were way louder than ND fans. Home field could have easily been lost for them in the game.

3) ND killed themselves in the game at crucial moments. Kizer 1st half fumble, Martin infraction in redzone, Carlisle dropping and easy pass in the redzone. The very controversial facemask on the last drive. (Oh well)

4) Hung out with Fuller's mom and dad, as well as Nelson's dad for a bit. When I complimented Fuller on making such a grown up decision about coming back, his dads reaction was not one that gave me a fuzzy that he is coming back. Take it for what it's worth.

5) 2016 Offense is going to be ridiculous. Anyone that had negative things to say about Adams during the week I hope you're eating crow.

6) Watched Jaylon slam his helmet at the end and stand in anger and disappointment. Hopefully this game has an impact about next year and wanting to accomplish the mission.

7) Scott Booker earned his paycheck this year, if only for this game. Special teams was excellent.

8) It was an amazing game that I am so happy my 8 y/o got to see as his first ND game. Wish it was a win but him and I will have more for years to come. U$C next year for sure

 

[Bugzly21]

He gave us credit repeatedly after the game. The students are stupid for rushing the field though.

Watched grown ass people knock down kids on the field, look at them on the ground then kept running

 

[gkIrish]

Seemed like the game plan was to stop McCaffrey and to let Hogan try to beat us. He did.

 

[Luckylucci]

So Lou S at BGI put out a pretty good piece of 3 takeaways from the season. One of them highlighted the defense. Essentially, overall the numbers look good but it leaves something to be desired. Also, with the talent that is there and experience you have to ask the question how does it get any better. He points out that BVG has a tenet of his philosophy that players don't peak until age 25 relative to football IQ and skill. Which, is probably true but how do we get those players to maximize their talent while at ND? Recruiting is going well and should continue but it's not like the defense doesn't have a lot of "stars" already.

 

[TheSunIsRising]

So Lou S at BGI put out a pretty good piece of 3 takeaways from the season. One of them highlighted the defense. Essentially, overall the numbers look good but it leaves something to be desired. Also, with the talent that is there and experience you have to ask the question how does it get any better. He points out that BVG has a tenet of his philosophy that players don't peak until age 25 relative to football IQ and skill. Which, is probably true but how do we get those players to maximize their talent while at ND? Recruiting is going well and should continue but it's not like the defense doesn't have a lot of "stars" already.

Steal Florida's model by fully recruting more Latter Day Saints players?? "Notre Dame, BYU of the East"

 

[Irish#1]

IMO the reason we got beat by a mediocre QB and receivers is because we sold out to stop McCaffrey. So I am not that impressed that we managed to hold him to a modest game. One guy should not beat this defense, and we should not have to drop the safeties down every play to do it. If it does take that much to stop one guy, then there should be no surprise that just about everything else will be available to the offense. And it was. 8/12 on third down is because BVG is predictable, in the sense that you know you will have single coverage outside because if it 3rd and more than a couple he is sending the ranch.

I've watched Hogan several times this year and he's a much better QB than a lot of you want to give him credit for. He has the smarts.

The good news for many is that's the last of JS. We should see an upgrade in athleticism and speed.

 

[phork]

Fucking 2 point.

The only thing the prevent defence does is prevent you from winning. They needed chunk yards, make them earn it. Drop 8 and STILL get a 30 yard pass? COME ON MAN.

PS: I believe the officiating rule is 6 seconds run off for any FG attempt.

 

[Redbar]

I've watched Hogan several times this year and he's a much better QB than a lot of you want to give him credit for. He has the smarts.

The good news for many is that's the last of JS. We should see an upgrade in athleticism and speed.

I actually like Hogan. I was repeating what someone above said, but really what you are saying only furthers my point that we should not have to "sell out' to stop one player from putting up ridiculous numbers, when doing so basically leaves our cover guys on islands with 6'4" TE's and some other very competent threats, like Love and Hogan. I also don't like sending everyone on dang near every passing down, (except for the last drive). I prefer a more balanced approach to defense. I feel like we are always trying to go for broke on Defense. We are not creating TO's, not getting there regularly and consequently we give up big plays a lot.

 

[kmoose]

Here's my issue with BVG that I noticed numerous times this year. How many huge plays did we give up on 3rd down? A huge amount. I don't know how many times, it was 3rd and 7 or 3rd and 10 and BVG decided to rush only 3 and have the safeties sit back 15 yards that's just stupid. This is where I would like to see a full out Blitz make the QB get the ball out quick instead of having all the time in the world to find an open guy.

ND's defense was #18 on 3rd down defense. They allowed a first down conversion on 3rd down only 32.9% of the time. That's better than LSU, Ohio State, Michigan State, and Oklahoma, to name a few. So I'm not sure what you think you saw this year, but ND's defense being bad on 3rd down wasn't it.

 

[Polish Leppy 22]

ND's defense was #18 on 3rd down defense. They allowed a first down conversion on 3rd down only 32.9% of the time. That's better than LSU, Ohio State, Michigan State, and Oklahoma, to name a few. So I'm not sure what you think you saw this year, but ND's defense being bad on 3rd down wasn't it.

They're a very average defense with potential first round draft pics at DL, LB, and CB. That's the issue, IMO.

 

[kmoose]

They're a very average defense with potential first round draft pics at DL, LB, and CB. That's the issue, IMO.

That's a fair observation. Characterizing this defense as terrible on 3rd down is not.

 

[Irish#1]

I actually like Hogan. I was repeating what someone above said, but really what you are saying only furthers my point that we should not have to "sell out' to stop one player from putting up ridiculous numbers, when doing so basically leaves our cover guys on islands with 6'4" TE's and some other very competent threats, like Love and Hogan. I also don't like sending everyone on dang near every passing down, (except for the last drive). I prefer a more balanced approach to defense. I feel like we are always trying to go for broke on Defense. We are not creating TO's, not getting there regularly and consequently we give up big plays a lot.

Stanford is known for using their TE's all the time. When they hit the big one you knew before the play they were going to him and we didn't line anyone up anywhere near him.

 

[IrishLax]

They're a very average defense with potential first round draft pics at DL, LB, and CB. That's the issue, IMO.

This is exactly the legit criticism. What is "good enough"? Sheldon Day and Jaylon Smith are about as good as it gets. And the defense on the whole has better athleticism player-for-player than 2012, but the squads couldn't be more different in production.

 

[Junkhead]

Maybe it's me, but it seems like Hogan has been at Stanford for about 8 years.

 

[military_irish]

This was a fun game to watch regardless of the outcome. It had its ups and very big downs. I am just proud of the way this team never throws in the towel. They are 4 points and roughly 13 seconds from being the number 1 team in the country. Can't let losses dictate the success of the season. I am excited for the bowl game and the seasons to come. The talent is here.

 

[garyasher]

Anyone notice the clock mistakes during the game. Around 10 minutes to go in the game and Stanford had the ball, there were 2 plays where they were forced out of bounds and the clock kept running. About a minute was run off. Then after a first down the clock would briefly stop while the chains were moved, but only for a second or 2. No way enough time to get the chains moved.

The run off ended up being in our favor, but it could have killed us.

 

[NDRock]

Anyone notice the clock mistakes during the game. Around 10 minutes to go in the game and Stanford had the ball, there were 2 plays where they were forced out of bounds and the clock kept running. About a minute was run off. Then after a first down the clock would briefly stop while the chains were moved, but only for a second or 2. No way enough time to get the chains moved.

The run off ended up being in our favor, but it could have killed us.

The clock still runs when a player goes out of bounds except for the last two minutes of the first half or last five minutes of the game (or something to that affect).

 

[RDU Irish]

Hey announcers, it is Jaylon - not Jay-lon. Fingers on a chalkboard all night.

PI call was pure BS, receiver face masks the DB and they call PI on the DB. Entire game officiating was suspect. ACC on the field and Pac12 in the booth = two "teams" who want to see ND lose. How do you not have a goal line camera on both sides to see where Kizer has the ball on that TD? I don't think he made it but there definitely was not a camera angle to capture the truth. However, I am convinced the officials were going to call that which ever way benefited Stanford so they gave them as much time as possible to score.

How can we give so much props to the O-line when our redzone offense sucks so bad? Shouldn't that be the space where they take charge? Completely baffled by our lack of power running ability. For one, swap out our TEs for a sixth OL. Seeing that Baylor 400 pound TE makes me laugh until I start crying over out ineffective our TEs are. Then consider how Stanford is undersized upfront yet shut us down inside the 20.

Stanford deserved to win that game. They out executed and took everything we gave them. Contrast to Clemson where we deserved to win, IMO. Frustrating to lose to Top 10 teams that we really should be beating - soundly in Stanford's case if we are even mediocre in the red-zone on either side of the ball.

Even if we won by 20 I am not sure we make the playoffs over Oklahoma. Failing to curb stomp BC AND Wake Forest are my reasons for thinking the ship had already sailed. As such, the outcome of this game was probably meaningless in our bowl placement.

 

[RDU Irish]

College Bowl Game Payouts | Statistic Brain

I don't know if this is right but damn that is huge difference in payouts. As such, Peach doesn't stand a chance we are all Fiesta bound.

 

[wizards8507]

Hey announcers, it is Jaylon - not Jay-lon. Fingers on a chalkboard all night.

PI call was pure BS, receiver face masks the DB and they call PI on the DB. Entire game officiating was suspect. ACC on the field and Pac12 in the booth = two "teams" who want to see ND lose. How do you not have a goal line camera on both sides to see where Kizer has the ball on that TD? I don't think he made it but there definitely was not a camera angle to capture the truth. However, I am convinced the officials were going to call that which ever way benefited Stanford so they gave them as much time as possible to score.

How can we give so much props to the O-line when our redzone offense sucks so bad? Shouldn't that be the space where they take charge? Completely baffled by our lack of power running ability. For one, swap out our TEs for a sixth OL. Seeing that Baylor 400 pound TE makes me laugh until I start crying over out ineffective our TEs are. Then consider how Stanford is undersized upfront yet shut us down inside the 20.

Stanford deserved to win that game. They out executed and took everything we gave them. Contrast to Clemson where we deserved to win, IMO. Frustrating to lose to Top 10 teams that we really should be beating - soundly in Stanford's case if we are even mediocre in the red-zone on either side of the ball.

Even if we won by 20 I am not sure we make the playoffs over Oklahoma. Failing to curb stomp BC AND Wake Forest are my reasons for thinking the ship had already sailed. As such, the outcome of this game was probably meaningless in our bowl placement.

It's in the ACC's best interest for Notre Dame to win.