'11 CA LB Joe Schmidt (Scholarship Earned)

[NDinL.A.]

1. On Sept 1, 2012, George Atkinson had a 56 yard run against Navy.

2. On Oct 9, 2013, Cam McDaniel had a 36 yard run against USC.

3. On Nov 23, 2103, Tarean Folston had a 43 yard run against BYU.

4. On Aug 31, 2013, Amir CarLISLE had a 45 yard run against Temple.

5. On Oct 27, 2012, Cierre Wood had a 62 yard run against Oklahoma.

6. On Oct 20, 2012, Theo Riddick had a 55 yard run against BYU.

There's a half dozen runs of over 30 yards in the last 3 years. And that only takes into account the single longest run for each player listed. It does not include other runs of over 30 yards that they may have had. I get your point about athletes on the field, but you really should base your opinion in some kind of reality, rather than emotion.

Don't bother. Wingman Ray is the same genius who said that not only was Kizer was not good enough to be the ND QB, he wasn't even good enough to be a D1 QB.

Of course, he won't own up to it as he pretends he never said it lol. (He also insisted that we beat Virginia on a Hail Mary...the first Hail Mary in the history of football in which only one player went deep and the other team had zero players in the end zone lol.)

 

[Bluto]

So long story short, Joe Schmidt is the new Tommy Rees?

 

[Booslum31]

This is when the criticism gets over the top. Sure, his play has been lacking and people should criticize it.

But it's gotten to the point where I read all over place that Joe does everything for the cameras and he's a fake and blah blah blah. Do you really think he waits for the camera and THEN starts to talk to the players? Do you think that in the middle of a heated game in front of 80,000 people that he is more interested in looking like a leader in front of the cameras than winning a game and leading his defense for real? Do you think he is the one who asks them to do stories on him, or that he asks the cameras to follow him?

I've played with guys just like Joe, and there were no cameras around...it was just their personality. Call me crazy, but perhaps Joe is always like that. It is in the realm of possibility. He was like this before Showtime...now it's just more in our face. But that's on ND and Showtime for pushing the story...that's not on Joe.

Agree. I've played with guys like Joe as well and it's not something they turned on and off...it's who they were. If it wasn't authentic he would have been blown up long ago. Teams have a way of self-policing themselves. I think what we see is what you get with Joe. He's a smart kid and I'm sure that he knows that he's been knocked off the ball and missed some tackles. I also think that he knows that he is out-gunned at times and is trying to use his head to minimize the outcomes. A missed tackle that slows a guy down is better that a missed assignment...most of the time.

 

[kmoose]

I don't know what he's been asked to do... but regardless, it's clear that a lot of the plays the defense makes are in spite of Joe, rather than because of Joe. It doesn't matter what he's being asked to do when he is a liability on many basic, early-down situations.

He's 3rd on the team in tackles. You can argue that he should be, being that he is the MLB. But even if that is true, then he is still doing his job. Maybe he is only doing the minimum, but he's accomplishing it. Would he be first or second if he didn't miss so many tackles? He would at least be 2nd (he only trails Keivarae Russell by 1 tackle). But think of it this way: If CJ Prosise were only on pace for 1,000 yards and 4.5 yards a carry, would anyone be complaining that his play sucked? Probably not, because he would be doing his job; not at an elite level, but no one would be accusing him of sucking. I don't think it's clear that the defense is making plays in spite of Joe. He's in on the third most tackles.

I would argue that Manti had two monster years, and that he was able to run through blockers and make physical plays, and at least had a chance at fighting through the OL, whereas Joe is finished once the OL has engaged.

Manti was only a first team All American for one year, which is why I say he only had one monster year. Not that he did not have other years that were very good. If Manti, who was a MUCH stronger, much better athlete than Joe Schmidt, had "at least a chance of fighting through the OL", then how realistic is it for us to expect Joe Schmidt to do it? And Manti got worked by O Linemen for a few years, before finally getting a couple of stud D Linemen to keep O Linemen from releasing on him.

The guy is blitzing 6+ times per game, and has two sacks. That's not a great ratio by any means when you are relying on him to rush the passer so much. But again, maybe a few ugly pass-rush attempts make it seem more common than it actually is.

But are we "relying on him" to rush the passer? At least in terms of getting sacks? Most college QBs are not Tom Brady, Joe Montana, Peyton Manning, or even Tom Tupa. They generally panic and make a LOT of mistakes in the face of pressure. It doesn't have to be a bunch of sacks; just getting close is usually enough to cause problems for MOST college QBs. So it's entirely possible that the MLB blitz that ND is using is NOT designed to sack the QB, as much as it is designed to force him to throw the ball before he is ready to.

I don't think I've piled on or used (too much) hyperbole. The things I've mentioned are legitimate issues. Even if you contend that they aren't as prevalent as I make them seem, the fact still remains that they ARE issues, and that all of those different issues being present in one guy's game is a big problem.

No, you haven't been overboard. In fact, what I meant to say was

So all I ask is that people not kill the kid. If you want to present logical arguments for why he hasn't been good this year, like you have done then that's fine. But what I am saying is let's cut out all of the hyperbole and piling on about how "terrible" he is.

And, again......... I'm not debating "Joe Schmidt has been good.". I'm debating "Joe Schmidt has not been TERRIBLE, like so many on here would have us believe." Has the MLB position been a disappointment? It sure has. But has it been "terrible", or does Joe Schmidt "suck"? I don't think the facts bear that out.

But at the end of the day, I'm as bipolar about Schmidt's play as his play actually is. And when you can describe your MLB's play as "bipolar," it doesn't make me feel awesome.

I call my 6 year old niece after a loss. I find it helps me to maintain my perspective on what's really important in my life.

 

[ThePiombino]

So long story short, Joe Schmidt is the new Tommy Rees?

Nope, Tommy could tackle. Granted, it was a cop. But still.

 

[Irish#1]

I already know your answer but do you feel that the team responds positively to Joe? I don't and it seems like most people who watch the show agree with me.

1. I think what Joe shows is genuine. Look at the convo he had with Jaylon in the last episode. Looks to me that Jaylon was very interested in what Joe had to say. I think part of Joe's reactions are simply a product of him knowing this is his last year and he wants to make the most out of it and wants the team to be part of his experience because he cares for them. Not everyone is going to react to Joe the same way. Some may be channeling his energy internally, rather than screaming back.

2. I won't argue that Joe's play isn't what we would like it to be, but if Morgan was a better option, I think he'd be out there now. With Joe, he gets guys lined up correctly and while he may miss some tackles or get blocked, he's typically where he needs to be. To the coaches that's the lesser than having Morgan make a play and then misread the next play.

 

[ThePiombino]

1. I think what Joe shows is genuine. Look at the convo he had with Jaylon in the last episode. Looks to me that Jaylon was very interested in what Joe had to say. I think part of Joe's reactions are simply a product of him knowing this is his last year and he wants to make the most out of it and wants the team to be part of his experience because he cares for them. Not everyone is going to react to Joe the same way. Some may be channeling his energy internally, rather than screaming back.

2. I won't argue that Joe's play isn't what we would like it to be, but if Morgan was a better option, I think he'd be out there now. With Joe, he gets guys lined up correctly and while he may miss some tackles or get blocked, he's typically where he needs to be. To the coaches that's the lesser than having Morgan make a play and then misread the next play.

While we all certainly hope this to be true, why does everyone assume it is? Coaches are humans too, and they are not immune to bias.

 

[gkIrish]

While we all certainly hope this to be true, why does everyone assume it is? Coaches are humans too, and they are not immune to bias.

Cardale Jones started for about 6 games this year before Urban made the change despite 90% of OSU fans knowing it was a mistake since game 2. Coaches aren't perfect, and they don't like to admit to making a mistake.

 

[Te'o4Heisman]

He's 3rd on the team in tackles. You can argue that he should be, being that he is the MLB. But even if that is true, then he is still doing his job. Maybe he is only doing the minimum, but he's accomplishing it. Would he be first or second if he didn't miss so many tackles? He would at least be 2nd (he only trails Keivarae Russell by 1 tackle). But think of it this way: If CJ Prosise were only on pace for 1,000 yards and 4.5 yards a carry, would anyone be complaining that his play sucked? Probably not, because he would be doing his job; not at an elite level, but no one would be accusing him of sucking. I don't think it's clear that the defense is making plays in spite of Joe. He's in on the third most tackles.



Manti was only a first team All American for one year, which is why I say he only had one monster year. Not that he did not have other years that were very good. If Manti, who was a MUCH stronger, much better athlete than Joe Schmidt, had "at least a chance of fighting through the OL", then how realistic is it for us to expect Joe Schmidt to do it? And Manti got worked by O Linemen for a few years, before finally getting a couple of stud D Linemen to keep O Linemen from releasing on him.



But are we "relying on him" to rush the passer? At least in terms of getting sacks? Most college QBs are not Tom Brady, Joe Montana, Peyton Manning, or even Tom Tupa. They generally panic and make a LOT of mistakes in the face of pressure. It doesn't have to be a bunch of sacks; just getting close is usually enough to cause problems for MOST college QBs. So it's entirely possible that the MLB blitz that ND is using is NOT designed to sack the QB, as much as it is designed to force him to throw the ball before he is ready to.



No, you haven't been overboard. In fact, what I meant to say was


And, again......... I'm not debating "Joe Schmidt has been good.". I'm debating "Joe Schmidt has not been TERRIBLE, like so many on here would have us believe." Has the MLB position been a disappointment? It sure has. But has it been "terrible", or does Joe Schmidt "suck"? I don't think the facts bear that out.



I call my 6 year old niece after a loss. I find it helps me to maintain my perspective on what's really important in my life.

Watch the USC game again...no hyperbole, literally every time he came on a blitz he was completely stonewalled and erased from the play. The offensive linemen were not even knocked back to shrink the pocket at all, it was like watching a 3 yr old kid run full speed into a brick wall. I'm not sure how that would be part of ANYBODY's Gameplan. He's third n the team in tackles...less than a handful in fromt of one of our defensive lineman and that isnt saying much when too many of his tackles are taking down 5 yard beyond the line of scrimmage. Just pure volume of tackles is not indicative of impact or success. Who is to say somebody else wouldnt have more tackles if given the chance, especially if you dont care where on the field the tackles are taking place. Jaylon has made some mistakes but he is making impact tackles, so is Rochell, Shumate and Day. Heck I would even say that cage has made more impact plays this year than Joe.

 

[IrishLion]

Cardale Jones started for about 6 games this year before Urban made the change despite 90% of OSU fans knowing it was a mistake since game 2. Coaches aren't perfect, and they don't like to admit to making a mistake.

Haha two of my good friends, both OSU diehards, were adamant that Cardale was a better option than Barrett, and that he just needed time to run the full playbook. At one point, my friend even said, "they're just saving the playbook, that's why it looks like the offense is struggling."

I said, "what playbook are they saving? The super-simple one with 10 total plays that allowed OSU to win the playoffs? How can you save a playbook when the best playbook is the one everybody knows?"

I also told them that they were crazy and that it was clear that their offense is better and much more efficient with Barrett in, but they regurgitated Meyer's line that Barrett hadn't earned it in practice yet and said that most OSU fans were just dummies.

One of them texted me Saturday night and it just said, "yeah, you were right."

 

[kmoose]

While we all certainly hope this to be true, why does everyone assume it is? Coaches are humans too, and they are not immune to bias.

Coach's are not immune to bias, no. But the difference is........ a coach's job is dependent on making the best choice from a team standpoint, regardless of his own bias. If Kelly's personality was such that he could not identify, and neutralize, his own bias, then I don't think he would have the successful record that he has, as a coach.

 

[kmoose]

Cardale Jones started for about 6 games this year before Urban made the change despite 90% of OSU fans knowing it was a mistake since game 2. Coaches aren't perfect, and they don't like to admit to making a mistake.

No offense to you, because I don't think it applies to you, but let's be honest: 90% of OSU fans couldn't find their a$$hole with two hands in a telephone booth. So I'm not sure that's such a good example.

 

[gkIrish]

No offense to you, because I don't think it applies to you, but let's be honest: 90% of OSU fans couldn't find their a$$hole with two hands in a telephone booth. So I'm not sure that's such a good example.

Lol can't disagree with that. The point is that Urban (a more successful coach than BK) thought Cardale was the better option. Cardale played like relative crap and Urban stuck with him despite it. If Urban can make a mistake and choose to ignore it for weeks, surely BK can do the same thing.

Not arguing Joe shouldn't have been the Week 1 starter, or even the week 2 or 3. But after 7 weeks of poor play, it's ridiculous not to try something else. If Morgan or Martini or whoever comes in and plays worse and our defense plays worse overall then we were all wrong and Joe can start again. We won't know until the alternative is tested.

 

[Rocket89]

Watch the USC game again...no hyperbole, literally every time he came on a blitz he was completely stonewalled and erased from the play. The offensive linemen were not even knocked back to shrink the pocket at all, it was like watching a 3 yr old kid run full speed into a brick wall. I'm not sure how that would be part of ANYBODY's Gameplan. He's third n the team in tackles...less than a handful in fromt of one of our defensive lineman and that isnt saying much when too many of his tackles are taking down 5 yard beyond the line of scrimmage. Just pure volume of tackles is not indicative of impact or success. Who is to say somebody else wouldnt have more tackles if given the chance, especially if you dont care where on the field the tackles are taking place. Jaylon has made some mistakes but he is making impact tackles, so is Rochell, Shumate and Day. Heck I would even say that cage has made more impact plays this year than Joe.

And he blitzed 3 or 4 snaps the entire game. Big deal.*

It's really difficult not to think you're taking this personal in some way. Just the way you're talking with the "like watching a 3 year old" comment.

It just doesn't make sense. Why would anyone expect Schmidt at his size to be an effective blitzer? Heck, Te'o never excelled at it either and we still blitzed him too.

*I think we might have seen a little different game plan against USC. Both Jaylon and Schmidt were really conservative and didn't blitz nearly as much as usual. Perhaps BVG will use them this way more when he knows the D-line can wreak havoc up front.

 

[kmoose]

Watch the USC game again...no hyperbole, literally every time he came on a blitz he was completely stonewalled and erased from the play. The offensive linemen were not even knocked back to shrink the pocket at all, it was like watching a 3 yr old kid run full speed into a brick wall. I'm not sure how that would be part of ANYBODY's Gameplan.

If it is not hyperbole to say that EVERY TIME(literally, I might add, so there is no doubt about what you are saying) Schmidt came on a blitz, he was COMPLETELY STONEWALLED AND ERASED FROM THE PLAY, then perhaps you can explain how Joe Schmidt was credited with a QB hurry, in the official ND stats?


Notre Dame Football :: UND.COM :: The Official Site of Notre Dame Athletics

Is it your contention that Joe Schmidt used the Jedi Mind Trick, from 10 yards beyond the LOS, to hurry the QB into throwing the ball? If so, that would probably explain why he is still starting. Maybe he ought to develop the "ball carrier falls down behind the LOS" version of it?

He's third n the team in tackles...less than a handful in fromt of one of our defensive lineman and that isnt saying much when too many of his tackles are taking down 5 yard beyond the line of scrimmage. Just pure volume of tackles is not indicative of impact or success. Who is to say somebody else wouldnt have more tackles if given the chance, especially if you dont care where on the field the tackles are taking place.

He's making them when others aren't. I'm not sure how many times I have to say that being 3rd on the team in tackles doesn't mean that he is great, or even really good. It's just an indication that he doesn't "suck".

Who is to say somebody else wouldnt have more tackles if given the chance, especially if you dont care where on the field the tackles are taking place. Jaylon has made some mistakes but he is making impact tackles, so is Rochell, Shumate and Day. Heck I would even say that cage has made more impact plays this year than Joe.

...... never mind. You are obviously incapable of seeing anything but what your bias tells you to see. I'm not wasting any more time on you.

 

[Irish Insanity]

So long story short, Joe Schmidt is the new Tommy Rees?

Rees>Schmidt

 

[kmoose]

Lol can't disagree with that. The point is that Urban (a more successful coach than BK) thought Cardale was the better option. Cardale played like relative crap and Urban stuck with him despite it. If Urban can make a mistake and choose to ignore it for weeks, surely BK can do the same thing.

Not arguing Joe shouldn't have been the Week 1 starter, or even the week 2 or 3. But after 7 weeks of poor play, it's ridiculous not to try something else. If Morgan or Martini or whoever comes in and plays worse and our defense plays worse overall then we were all wrong and Joe can start again. We won't know until the alternative is tested.

So after starting Barrett for one game, you think it was a mistake? What it Barrett goes on to average 3 Turnovers a game, for the rest of the season? Will that affect the odds of Kelly knowing what he is doing?

 

[gkIrish]

So after starting Barrett for one game, you think it was a mistake? What it Barrett goes on to average 3 Turnovers a game, for the rest of the season? Will that affect the odds of Kelly knowing what he is doing?

It was a mistake not to start him since day 1. It was a bigger mistake not to start him after Barrett outplayed Cardale in every game before the one he actually started. Doesn't mean Urban is a bad coach, just means he can make a mistake.

Similarly, starting Joe doesn't mean BK is a bad coach overall, it just means he is not making a good decision.

 

[kmoose]

It was a mistake not to start him since day 1. It was a bigger mistake not to start him after Barrett outplayed Cardale in every game before the one he actually started. Doesn't mean Urban is a bad coach, just means he can make a mistake.

Similarly, starting Joe doesn't mean BK is a bad coach overall, it just means he is not making a good decision.

It's not fair to compare the two, though. Barrett did enough in practice to warrant a shot at some meaningful reps at his position. Morgan, et al, apparently have not. And I have to believe that's the case. I find it hard to believe that all of the guys behind Schmidt would be completely silent on the matter, if they had the faith and support of their position coach or their coordinator. And if they don't have that, then playing Joe is obviously the right decision?

 

[gkIrish]

It's not fair to compare the two, though. Barrett did enough in practice to warrant a shot at some meaningful reps at his position. Morgan, et al, apparently have not. And I have to believe that's the case. I find it hard to believe that all of the guys behind Schmidt would be completely silent on the matter, if they had the faith and support of their position coach or their coordinator. And if they don't have that, then playing Joe is obviously the right decision?

Now who is the one making assumptions about what players have or have not done?

 

[kmoose]

Now who is the one making assumptions about what players have or have not done?

I am. And I know it's not a fact. But I do think that we would have heard some rumblings, if there were better options on the bench.

 

[Bluto]

Nope, Tommy could tackle. Granted, it was a cop. But still.

I think if you ask Larz to review the film he'll conclude it was more of a kick as opposed to a tackle so we're back at square one I suppose.

 

[ulukinatme]

So long story short, Joe Schmidt is the new Tommy Rees?

#JoesusSaves!

 

[koonja]

I am. And I know it's not a fact. But I do think that we would have heard some rumblings, if there were better options on the bench.

Hard to call out the 5th year senior captain who was named MVP last year and who is adored by all ND outsiders. I'm guessing the backups are smart enough to keep quiet if they have a problem with it.

 

[gkIrish]

<iframe width="640" height="360" src="https://www.youtube.com/embed/INX5n8cllos" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>

His teammates really came out in droves for Trick Shot Monday

 

[mtnd15]

How sure are we BK decides who starts at middle linebacker?

 

[Blaise]

Kelly just called Joe their "Cleanup hitter" on defense.. Says Nyles is playing well but they don't want to take Joe out of the lineup

 

[irishknight35]

Kelly just called Joe their "Cleanup hitter" on defense.. Says Nyles is playing well but they don't want to take Joe out of the lineup

Which has been his response to Schmidt/Nyles playing time questions for weeks now.

 

[Blaise]

Which has been his response to Schmidt/Nyles playing time questions for weeks now.

I always just assumed Morgan was struggling, but if he is really playing well... c'mon

 

[irishknight35]

I always just assumed Morgan was struggling, but if he is really playing well... c'mon

Agreed. I am fairly certain a ND defense in 2015 could function without Joe Schmidt on the field for a few plays each game. Especially 2 weeks ago when USC was lining up 3 or 4 WRs and Joe Schmidt was still on the field when the only LB out there should have been Jaylon with 6 of our best DBs. Joe Schmidt covering slot receivers is a disaster that falls on the coaching staff. There has got be better organization of our personnel groupings then that.