Post Game Observations Stanford '14

[Irish2155]

When has Folston fumbled?

He just fumbled his french toast this morning. Bacon stayed on the plate.

Orange juice, was cold.

 

[WakeUpEchoes]

I won't post the vine b/c it's on auto play, but check the link out. Isaac Rochell destroying Andrus Peat - potential top 10 pick.

vine.co/v/OKhl1upEgWm

 

[aubeirish]

I won't post the vine b/c it's on auto play, but check the link out. Isaac Rochell destroying Andrus Peat - potential top 10 pick.

vine.co/v/OKhl1upEgWm

Damn we play tough. I love every bit of it.

 

[Buster Bluth]

lolespn

 

[phgreek]

This is accurate. It's pointless to talk about sloppy play or whatever because the players were in the exact same situation. I had two layers of waterproof rain gear on and ended up soaked to the bone, my fingers didn't have enough strength to tie my shoes at the end of the game. It was very very easy to tell that the players were having a ton of trouble with their hands. At some point, your body stops responding the way you want it to. Both teams reached that point tonight. Any analysis of the game that downplays the weather is straight up wrong.

...I will say when they zoomed in on Kajuste (or however you spell it) you could see he was freakin shivering hard...so I maybe think I'll ease up on the receivers a little...a little.

 

[zelezo vlk]

lolespn

Well with how Purdue and Michigan have been playing, ESPN must be confused.

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-G900A using Tapatalk

 

[Whiskeyjack]

Can't believe we played so much Nickel against Stanford. Farley is basically our starting SAM LB. He got beat on a few plays, but otherwise held up very well.

For those complaining about the lack of screens, they wouldn't have helped. Screens are constraint plays designed to punish a defense for rushing aggressively. But Stanford was regularly getting pressure with only 4-5. Can't call screens against that, just like opponents couldn't do it against us in 2012.

As others have mentioned, Hegarty had a terrible game. Would have liked to see Martin at C and Hanratty at ROG, but it sounds like Martin's thumb injury prevents him from snapping effectively. So we might be stuck with the current lineup.

We would not have won that game on grass. Grateful for the turf.

All criticism of our offensive skill players needs to account for the horrible weather. While it was a sloppy game all around, we played with much more discipline than Stanford, as the penalty yardage shows.

How about those true freshman on defense? Incredible that they're playing at such a high level this soon.

Very gutsy performance by the Irish. So proud of them.

 

[Irish2155]

lolespn

Funny as hell. Probably need to start scheduling the Detroit Lions. Chicago Bears?

 

[Irish YJ]

Can't believe we played so much Nickel against Stanford. Farley is basically our starting SAM LB. He got beat on a few plays, but otherwise held up very well.

For those complaining about the lack of screens, they wouldn't have helped. Screens are constraint plays designed to punish a defense for rushing aggressively. But Stanford was regularly getting pressure with only 4-5. Can't call screens against that, just like opponents couldn't do it against us in 2012.

As others have mentioned, Hegarty had a terrible game. Would have liked to see Martin at C and Hanratty at ROG, but it sounds like Martin's thumb injury prevents him from snapping effectively. So we might be stuck with the current lineup.

We would not have won that game on grass. Grateful for the turf.

All criticism of our offensive skill players needs to account for the horrible weather. While it was a sloppy game all around, we played with much more discipline than Stanford, as the penalty yardage shows.

How about those true freshman on defense? Incredible that they're playing at such a high level this soon.

Very gutsy performance by the Irish. So proud of them.

Understatement of the year LOL. Got crushed. On one series I paid particular attention to, he looked like he was roller skates going backwards. He got mack trucked back into Golson on one keeper, and got ole'd on a few others. Can't continue to allow that type of crack in the wall.

 

[Irish#1]

This!!!

don't forget our OL issues. Stanford blew them up several times. Anyone recall our C getting knocked the F... back into EG on a planned keeper. Sweet Jesus that was ugly.

Elmer and Heharty are still young and need to develop more strength. Stanford's D line was several years older and stronger. Comes with age.

 

[KPENN]

Elmer and Heharty are still young and need to develop more strength. Stanford's D line was several years older and stronger. Comes with age.

Hegarty's a senior...

 

[Irish#1]

No injuries! If we get the suspended players back and they play like I think they can, I like our chances against FSU a lot.

Was going to start a 'revised prediction' thread, but no sense in it until we hear from the decision committee.

Smoking or drinking again? lol

 

[Irish YJ]

Elmer and Heharty are still young and need to develop more strength. Stanford's D line was several years older and stronger. Comes with age.

Elmer yes, but Hegarty is a weak link. Elmer will get better as the year continues, and is not near as bad as Hegarty. IMO Hegarty should sit. Get Conner back in the mix and do a shuffle. Love the kid (MH), but he was freaking awful yesterday.

 

[CHIDomer9]

Golson: With him it is all about confidence. I think the reason he is late is that he is questioning what he is seeing. Essentially, I think he is reading "open" twice before throwing the ball. I would be fine with <2 designed runs for him per game the rest of the way.

RBs: I don't know what Greg Bryant does for this team. He does not want contact, that much is for sure. UNC will be a very important game for Bryant and Folston. If ND can stretch a lead there will be plenty of reps for both.

OL: This is a problem. Back to back great recruiting classes and this is as good as ND can do? Are none of the OL from the '13 class good enough to replace Hegarty? Thank goodness for Ronnie Stanley. My patience with Steve Elmer is being tested.

WR: I really like the way Robinson was used late in the game. He's a matchup problem for most teams and also a good possession receiver. I though ND was lucky to get the late PI call in the end zone. It is an easy call to make if Fuller comes back to the ball and into the body of the defender, but on replay it looked a lot cleaner than in real time.

DL: Nice performance against a good offensive line. I love the way Trumbetti plays and Rochelle has been a pleasant surprise.

LB: These guys are fitting against the run very well. I consider JO part of this group now. Sort of concerned about the depth at this position if someone goes down.

DB: Cole Luke had a great day. I would like to see what Devin Butler could do with more reps.

 

[IrishJayhawk]

ND getting a bunch of good press on ESPN's "the Sports Reporters". Mostly old school guys. Saying ND is a top 4 team, and the FSU/ND game will be the game of the season. Would love to see Mark May thrust into that forum....

But...ESPN bias...

 

[Bogtrotter07]

Coley O'Brien's Nephew Hogan is 19-4 as a starter, against some pretty tough competition. (One of those losses was to MSU at the end of the season in the Rose Bowl, after we beat them earlier in the season, true.) But this kid plays hard and is always up for the game. Yesterday may have been one of his best games ever. It certainly was devoid of his characteristic turnovers or breakdowns in the red zone.

Defensive line versus Stanford Offensive line Just above was a play where Rochell buried Peat. Wow! But all day our defensive line hit their senior/5th year senior offensive line and did damage. My point, in addition to the sacks, tackles for losses, picks/rushed passes, Stanford's 1.4 yard per carry average, by the end of the game Stanford's o-line was hobbled. Yes VanGorder blew everyone's mind with a blitz up the middle at the end. But the reason it came through untouched? The Stanford line was on skates or crutches or something. They couldn't even move anymore!

Onwualu's second is the bench Whiskey alluded to it, but when we run our nickel (or dime) package, James O comes out and is replaced by Farley. So we shift from a 4-3 to a 4-2-5 really; that is why it seems like he is out there less than the rest of the starters. That all the same Onwualu really mixed it up. He hit people. In my opinion it is amazing to think of this kid playing wide receiver as a true freshman last year. If Redmond's (I believe) head had come off, I think they would have charged him with manslaughter!

Weather conditions I talked to a couple people at the game and they said the worst thing about the ball game was the gusting wind. It even seemed to change up (as perceived across the line of scrimmage, left to right, then right to left.) Both people I talked to thought that this affected both quarterbacks and was the main reason both of their throws were usually late. I wasn't there, but I will buy it. A couple of times they showed the flags, it looked like it was swirling to me. This does remind me of how incredible Golson's grip and arm strength are. He was still zipping it in the rain!

Offensive line Watch the game again. Make the distinction between picked up assignments and technical competence.

Yesterday, Stanford's defensive linemen knocked ND offensive linemen back more than anyone this year. But did you see what they did to SC's offensive line? No comparison, to our good. Also, the front three, including subs, have the same ability to play off the block and move laterally as Sheldon Day does! And that is what makes him great! It was a bit like playing a line of Sheldon's! So this was the biggest test. And by the second half, generally, I thought ND was holding their own.

Now what was disconcerting in the first half was the number of times that two defenders were bypassing either side of our guards or right tackle with no one picking up either. And the running backs were terrible with this too! So the first big problem yesterday were protections, because Stanford's new defensive coordinator is almost as good as BVG. The second problem was the adjustment our offensive line needed to make to execute in the weather. Elmer in particular didn't get traction, and this was apparent in the QB draw where Golson ran into Elmer. Elmer was getting pushed by his opponent, but there was a hole there. With the weather and everything else, the offensive timing was way off!

I think that the line is making a lot of progress along the path to becoming a formidable offensive front. And I think there are more injuries that have affected the process than we know. Yes I was a little unhappy with the first 2/5ths of the game. But they came around, and I think they are on track to do just fine.

 

[Irish YJ]

But...ESPN bias...

If you've ever watched this particular segment, it's not the typical ESPN jackoffs. Old guys, old style, old swag. They aint drinking no ESPN Kool Aid. It's one of the only segments I can stomach besides Mike and Mike.

 

[IrishJayhawk]

Dude,
Slow down. You will throw your diaphragm out, spouting that much hyperbole at once.

I was just pointing out that there is room for criticism of Golson. It doesn't mean that he didn't have a great game. For fvck's sake, there are more choices than "all in" or "all out".

The diaphragm is actually a muscle of inhalation. You're not using it when "spouting."

 

[Irish YJ]

OL: This is a problem. Back to back great recruiting classes and this is as good as ND can do? Are none of the OL from the '13 class good enough to replace Hegarty? Thank goodness for Ronnie Stanley. My patience with Steve Elmer is being tested.

I think Conner gets a go. Elmer will be fine if they quit moving him. Hegarty is the piece right now that just doesn't fit. Good kid, but played awful. I think BK/HH make a move with one or two of the young pups this week, but ultimately I see Conner as the answer if they can make things fit. CM and MM could be the answer if not.

 

[Sherm Sticky]

Anyway we see Bivin in at Center and leave Mart at RG?


Sent via tapatalk

 

[kmoose]

The diaphragm is actually a muscle of inhalation. You're not using it when "spouting."

Well played, Mister. Well played....

 

[N_D_Fighting_Irish]

Coley O'Brien's Nephew Hogan is 19-4 as a starter, against some pretty tough competition. (One of those losses was to MSU at the end of the season in the Rose Bowl, after we beat them earlier in the season, true.) But this kid plays hard and is always up for the game. Yesterday may have been one of his best games ever. It certainly was devoid of his characteristic turnovers or breakdowns in the red zone.

Defensive line versus Stanford Offensive line Just above was a play where Rochell buried Peat. Wow! But all day our defensive line hit their senior/5th year senior offensive line and did damage. My point, in addition to the sacks, tackles for losses, picks/rushed passes, Stanford's 1.4 yard per carry average, by the end of the game Stanford's o-line was hobbled. Yes VanGorder blew everyone's mind with a blitz up the middle at the end. But the reason it came through untouched? The Stanford line was on skates or crutches or something. They couldn't even move anymore!

Onwualu's second is the bench Whiskey alluded to it, but when we run our nickel (or dime) package, James O comes out and is replaced by Farley. So we shift from a 4-3 to a 4-2-5 really. That all the same Onwualu really mixed it up. He hit people. In my opinion it is amazing to think of this kid playing wide receiver as a true freshman last year. If Redmond's (I believe)
head had come off, I think they would have charged him with manslaughter!

Weather conditions I talked to a couple people at the game and they said the worst thing about the ball game was the gusting wind. It even seemed to change up (as perceived across the line of scrimmage, left to right, then right to left.) Both people I talked to thought that this affected both quarterbacks and was the main reason both of their throws were usually late. I wasn't there, but I will buy it. A couple of times they showed the flags, it looked like it was swirling to me. This does remind me of how incredible Golson's grip and arm strength are. He was still zipping it in the rain!

Offensive line Watch the game again. Make the distinction between picked up assignments and technical competence.

Yesterday, Stanford's defensive linemen knocked ND offensive linemen back more than anyone this year. But did you see what they did to SC's offensive line? No comparison, to our good. Also, the front three, including subs, have the same ability to play off the block and move laterally as Sheldon Day does! And that is what makes him great! It was a bit like playing a line of Sheldon's! So this was the biggest test. And by the second half, generally, I thought ND was holding their own.

Now what was disconcerting in the first half was the number of times that two defenders were bypassing either side of our guards or right tackle with no one picking up either. And the running backs were terrible with this too! So the first big problem yesterday were protections, because Stanford's new defensive coordinator is almost as good as BVG. The second problem was the adjustment our offensive line needed to make to execute in the weather. Elmer in particular didn't get traction, and this was apparent in the QB draw where Golson ran into Elmer. Elmer was getting pushed by his opponent, but there was a hole there. With the weather and everything else, the offensive timing was way off!

I think that the line is making a lot of progress along the path to becoming a formidable offensive front. And I think there are more injuries that have affected the process than we know. Yes I was a little unhappy with the first 2/5ths of the game. But they came around, and I think they are on track to do just fine.

I must have watched a different game. Our center MH was a liability. There were at least a half a dozen whiffs at a block. It was ugly. Stanford's D line is good, but not terribly athletic....yet anyone who went one on one vs MH looked like the reincarnation of Warren Sapp. There was one play where MH was thrown down like a rag doll...he doesn't seem to have the skill sets to play at this level. I imagine the coaches noticed and have developed a contingency plan. Otherwise, we have no chance against FSU...and the offense will struggle against a team with a decent Dline.

 

[greyhammer90]

Great game by C Breezy. Starting to show what he's capable of.

 

[Bogtrotter07]

I must have watched a different game. Our center MH was a liability. There were at least a half a dozen whiffs at a block. It was ugly. Stanford's D line is good, but not terribly athletic....yet anyone who went one on one vs MH looked like the reincarnation of Warren Sapp. There was one play where MH was thrown down like a rag doll...he doesn't seem to have the skill sets to play at this level. I imagine the coaches noticed and have developed a contingency plan. Otherwise, we have no chance against FSU...and the offense will struggle against a team with a decent Dline.

Maybe you (and I) did. Their nose and one defense end (Anderson) though not heretofore considered first or second round material, looked like it in what I saw of their play in two games this year.

And last year against the Cardinal, when Hegarty started, he had some of the most solid play of anyone in that game on the line.

The next two successive games will tell all. If the protections and combinations are more efficient against UNC, and if we do progressively better against FSU's defensive front, I will claim to be clairvoyant! If not, your point just may stand, with one or two losses (God forbid!). With FSU's best down lineman out for the season. I lean toward believing Stanford is a little better. Especially where it counts, as a team. In other words I think it is rare for a starting front to be that much better than the some of its parts. Stanford is, I am not sure about FSU.

And I think the sloppy weather cut back the look of the progress ND's offensive line has made.

With all respect for your position, I guess we will see consecutively over the next two weeks!

 

[N_D_Fighting_Irish]

What I find interesting is how fast our defense is playing. Players seem to know what their assignments are and they are running full speed.

It has been awhile since our secondary could be considered the strength of the defense. Luke is playing at an AA level. Riggs' assertiveness has become contagious. Max & Shumate are growing and playing better each week.

Golson's issue IMO is lack of experience. He doesn't trust his reads, which explains why he is late with the pass. He has the game experience of a sophomore...his timing will improve.

What will not improve is Golson's lack of speed. He is a borderline mobile QB. I don't see him as a threat running the ball. Too much risk and not enough reward.

 

[Bogtrotter07]

What I find interesting is how fast our defense is playing. Players seem to know what their assignments are and they are running full speed.

It has been awhile since our secondary could be considered the strength of the defense. Luke is playing at an AA level. Riggs' assertiveness has become contagious. Max & Shumate are growing and playing better each week.

Golson's issue IMO is lack of experience. He doesn't trust his reads, which explains why he is late with the pass. He has the game experience of a sophomore...his timing will improve.

What will not improve is Golson's lack of speed. He is a borderline mobile QB. I don't see him as a threat running the ball. Too much risk and not enough reward.

Agree with just about everything.

And I think Stanford's d-line and linebackers play with the same furry as ours. All I was saying is that the o-line took a step forward yesterday, despite looking bad some, due to weather and an off the hook defense.

Put another way, do you agree that our o-line looked "less bad" then Stanford's? I think we rolled them much more often than they did us. And Stanford's o-line came into the season rated as one of the nations best, has higher rated individuals (draft grades), and is comprised of seniors and fifth years.

In fact the completion of my point is we are a freshman-sophomore-one junior defensive line; Stanford is a senior, fifth year line. Stanford's offense is all fifth year and senior as well, ND has one player on the offensive line that will have exhausted his eligibility after this season. Who would you rather have?

 

[Irish YJ]

What I find interesting is how fast our defense is playing. Players seem to know what their assignments are and they are running full speed.

It has been awhile since our secondary could be considered the strength of the defense. Luke is playing at an AA level. Riggs' assertiveness has become contagious. Max & Shumate are growing and playing better each week.

Golson's issue IMO is lack of experience. He doesn't trust his reads, which explains why he is late with the pass. He has the game experience of a sophomore...his timing will improve.

What will not improve is Golson's lack of speed. He is a borderline mobile QB. I don't see him as a threat running the ball. Too much risk and not enough reward.

agree, but I'd add something a bit more simple. He's short. On a couple plays where I could see him looking downfield, he was really impaired by his height, and in turn had to move out of the pocket to see the field, thus late on throws. Simple, but it is a factor.

 

[kmoose]

What will not improve is Golson's lack of speed. He is a borderline mobile QB. I don't see him as a threat running the ball. Too much risk and not enough reward.

Well, like it or not, we need him to run at least a few times per game, on designed runs. That keeps teams from dropping their LBs into coverage at the snap of the ball. The good news is that he doesn't have to be a great running threat. When teams start cheating against the pass, you run the QB draw for 15-20 (or 35, like yesterday), and force them to guard against it.

 

[N_D_Fighting_Irish]

Maybe you (and I) did. Their nose and one defense end (Anderson) though not heretofore considered first or second round material, looked like it in what I saw of their play in two games this year.

And last year against the Cardinal, when Hegarty started, he had some of the most solid play of anyone in that game on the line.

The next two successive games will tell all. If the protections and combinations are more efficient against UNC, and if we do progressively better against FSU's defensive front, I will claim to be clairvoyant! If not, your point just may stand, with one or two losses (God forbid!). With FSU's best down lineman out for the season. I lean toward believing Stanford is a little better. Especially where it counts, as a team. In other words I think it is rare for a starting front to be that much better than the some of its parts. Stanford is, I am not sure about FSU.

And I think the sloppy weather cut back the look of the progress ND's offensive line has made.

With all respect for your position, I guess we will see consecutively over the next two weeks!

Stanford's Dline is solid experienced group with great motors, but they lack a degree of athleticism. Maybe third round picks.

I hope you are right.

FSU's Goldman is out? He is the guy who worries me the most.

 

[Bogtrotter07]

Stanford's Dline is solid experienced group with great motors, but they lack a degree of athleticism. Maybe third round picks.

I hope you are right.

FSU's Goldman is out? He is the guy who worries me the most.

Lawrence-Stample. A couple of other guys keep getting concussed. (Not Goldman.)