'14 OT FL Mason Cole (Michigan Verbal)

[Grahambo]

I guess it's a bummer but it's February..I'll hold off until later in the year.

 

[Rocket 94]

Recruiting is a (series of) zero-sum game(s), so it doesn't really matter. If one of your chief competitors is routinely eating your lunch, doesn't matter if he's beating you by an inch or a mile.

Maybe Cole and Hood were just naturally predisposed to prefer the big state school environment over ND. If that's the case, probably nothing to worry about here. But these were both kids for whom we initially led, and UM's sales pitch is pretty similar to ours.

Michigan eating our lunch? We just finished 2013 with a higher ranked class than theirs. And this was after all the hand wringing last February and March about how UM was outrecruiting us. Hood has not commited to MI and everyone knew Cole was going to UM weeks ago. Talk about hyperbole.

 

[IrishLax]

Michigan eating our lunch? We just finished 2013 with a higher ranked class than theirs. And this was after all the hand wringing last February and March about how UM was outrecruiting us. Hood has not commited to MI and everyone knew Cole was going to UM weeks ago. Talk about hyperbole.

But they are consistently out recruiting us in the early cycle under Hoke. When there is no scoreboard to point at, he is cleaning up with all of the prospects he gets on campus for regular visits, junior days, "BBQ at the Big House", etc. What are they doing better? Or is it just a a by-product of other factors?

Of random neutral kids who didn't choose either Michigan or Notre Dame I can only think of one who had a better visit to ND and that was Andrus Peat. I can think of oodles who have said Michigan was their best unofficial visit experience out of ND, Michigan, and Ohio State even when they went elsewhere besides Michigan. Months ago Mike Frank talked about this on Power Hour too where when they talk to kids they routinely rave about the Michigan visit experience relative to ND's and elsewhere in our midwest "peer group" of sorts.

 

[DCIrish]

I'll never understand all the hand-wringing when Michigan gets a recruit. They will get good players every year. Get over it.

 

[Whiskeyjack]

Michigan eating our lunch? We just finished 2013 with a higher ranked class than theirs. And this was after all the hand wringing last February and March about how UM was outrecruiting us. Hood has not commited to MI and everyone knew Cole was going to UM weeks ago. Talk about hyperbole.

See Lax's post above. I was referring only to these early cycle commitments. Sorry for the lack of clarity.

I'm not upset, and I'm certainly not suggesting that anyone should panic. But a pattern is starting to emerge here, and it doesn't make sense based on most of the known discrepancies between the two programs. Simply makes me wonder what they're doing that we're not.

 

[Emcee77]

Yeah, it does seem like they kill it in the early cycle. They had a great class going after last spring, and we only caught up because we got some big recruits in-season.

FWIW, I went back and looked at the 2013 classes for both schools and tried to determine who won most often among kids interested in both schools, and I think we played them pretty even, actually. I could be way off on this, but I got:

2013 Michigan commits we were recruiting fairly seriously:
Bosch (apparently lower on our board than theirs)
Kugler
Taco
Jake Butt

ND commits Michigan was recruiting fairly seriously:
Elmer
Onwualu
Matuska

 

[arrowryan]

But they are consistently out recruiting us in the early cycle under Hoke. When there is no scoreboard to point at, he is cleaning up with all of the prospects he gets on campus for regular visits, junior days, "BBQ at the Big House", etc. What are they doing better? Or is it just a a by-product of other factors?

Of random neutral kids who didn't choose either Michigan or Notre Dame I can only think of one who had a better visit to ND and that was Andrus Peat. I can think of oodles who have said Michigan was their best unofficial visit experience out of ND, Michigan, and Ohio State even when they went elsewhere besides Michigan. Months ago Mike Frank talked about this on Power Hour too where when they talk to kids they routinely rave about the Michigan visit experience relative to ND's and elsewhere in our midwest "peer group" of sorts.

They can out recruit us all they want in February for all I care. Recruiting is a marathon, not a sprint. As long as we finish stronger and finish with a better class then I am happy. Lets see if they can keep their recruits.

 

[GBdomer]

ND fans had a minor heart attack when Michigan started out last year, by Feb. some people didn't want a commit off there list.

Michigan will get there's
Notre Dame will get ours

Two Blue Blood programs with so much to offer.

 

[Grahambo]

If we end up getting Braden Smith, KC McDermott, and Jamarco Jones..would it matter? (Sarcastic question)

 

[arrowryan]

ND fans had a minor heart attack when Michigan started out last year, by Feb. some people didn't want a commit off there list.

Michigan will get there's
Notre Dame will get ours

Two Blue Blood programs with so much to offer.

Preach!

 

[Ironman8]

Yeah, it does seem like they kill it in the early cycle. They had a great class going after last spring, and we only caught up because we got some big recruits in-season.

FWIW, I went back and looked at the 2013 classes for both schools and tried to determine who won most often among kids interested in both schools, and I think we played them pretty even, actually. I could be way off on this, but I got:

2013 Michigan commits we were recruiting fairly seriously:
Bosch (apparently lower on our board than theirs)
Kugler
Taco
Jake Butt

ND commits Michigan was recruiting fairly seriously:
Elmer
Onwualu
Matuska

Uhhh Michigan was definitely recruiting Jaylon Smith fairly seriously.

Durham Smythe was also recruited by Michigan heavily at the end.

 

[Buster Bluth]

If we end up getting Braden Smith, KC McDermott, and Jamarco Jones..would it matter? (Sarcastic question)

THIS.

 

[IrishLax]

And you can cross Jake Butt off that list he basically ended up at Michigan because they offered pursued/hard from the onset and we did not.

Taco Carlton... dunno there. Not sure how much we recruited him.

Add Logan Tulley-Tillman we definitely recruited him.

 

[IrishLax]

For guys they went after...

Definitely add Jaylon Smith, Vanderdoes (see: original top 15 for Vanderdoes that we didn't make), Smythe (he cancelled his vist there after committing to us), Bivin, and possibly Rochelle (he almost visited them for Air Force game).

 

[Emcee77]

Uhhh Michigan was definitely recruiting Jaylon Smith fairly seriously.

Durham Smythe was also recruited by Michigan heavily at the end.

And you can cross Jake Butt off that list he basically ended up at Michigan because they offered pursued/hard from the onset and we did not.

Taco Carlton... dunno there. Not sure how much we recruited him.

Add Logan Tulley-Tillman we definitely recruited him.

I guess what guys you include depends on how you define the question, but these suggestions reinforce my basic point: we don't really have a problem of losing guys to Michigan. We recruited them basically evenly last cycle; we may have won more than we lost. Just some hopefully cheering perspective coming off the Cole miss.

 

[aubeirish]

I remember when last year everybody was freaking out because Michigan had this great class early in the process. In the end though, ours ended up being better. Patience fellas, patience. Michigan will do well recruiting, as long as we do better.

 

[NDinMich]

So far this year, ND - 4 verbals, MI - 4 verbals. One of MI's verbals is a QB whose rating differs from site to site (not rated on some sites vs a 3 star on others). The others are 4-stars; an OT, a DT and an MLB who likes to make t-shirts...I'll take ND's class right now (sound ridiculous saying that in February).

 

[Jebediah Springfield]

I don't know about you guys but I'm freaking out.

 

[Irish#1]

I don't look at it as getting beat. I look at it as a kid that prefers Michigan having some sort of deficiency or abnormality that is difficult to account for.

Michigan? Ha....ok. Good luck, kid.

I agree. UM started strong in their recruiting early then tapered off with the 13 class . I thought we ramped up, kept chopping wood then closed strong.

 

[Irish Fam]

Our staff takes a different approach to recruiting. Everything I have read indicates that we encourage recruits to take their time and make sure it is a well thought out decision. I believe Michigan has been known to pressure interested kids into committing early

 

[Bogtrotter07]

Our staff takes a different approach to recruiting. Everything I have read indicates that we encourage recruits to take their time and make sure it is a well thought out decision. I believe Michigan has been known to pressure interested kids into committing early

This was what I was getting at more in Hood's thread yesterday. The guys that come to ND aren't as susceptible to the hard sell. They know what they want when they see it, or really know what they don't want.

I am sorry I obfuscated my point with talk of cash envelopes and bj's. The picture I was trying to create is that those things are out there and think how hard dealing with all of that makes seeing things for what they really are?

 

[Redbar]

Really, really wanted this young man to make Notre Dame home. I hope we keep in touch you never know, you know.

 

[irishroo]

Hate Michigan, but I have to respect the way Hoke is building this team - strong in the trenches. Michigan has signed 10 O linemen in the last 2 classes, 8 of whom rated 4 stars or better, and 6 of whom who were ranked in the Rivals 250.

 

[md_bennett]

Hate Michigan, but I have to respect the way Hoke is building this team - strong in the trenches. Michigan has signed 10 O linemen in the last 2 classes, 8 of whom rated 4 stars or better, and 6 of whom who were ranked in the Rivals 250.

A really good friend is a scUM fan and their boards apparently are saying they only take 2-3 OL this year so that should really open us up for taking a few more who like what we have to offer without having to worry about UM. Stinks we lost out on Cole BUT we still have plenty of people on our boards that we are in good shape with. We have the space and that works in our favor.

 

[condoms SUCk]

Mason, come on now, Michigan?
Really MICHIGAN???

 

[irishff1014]

I know we have a long way to go this recruiting cycle but i didn't want this young man to go there.

 

[STLDomer]

Looking like he will be the starting LT for the Skunkbears.

 

[IrishLax]

Looking like he will be the starting LT for the Skunkbears.

Hahahahaha wow... really good prospect, but starting LT as a true frosh? Death sentence.

 

[Luckylucci]

Hahahahaha wow... really good prospect, but starting LT as a true frosh? Death sentence.

I would expect that either Ishaq or Okwara dominates this matchup.

 

[phork]

Where is this info coming from? Hoke has said he is shuffling the line through camp...