UNC Receives Notice of Allegations

NDinL.A.

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YOU HAVE GOT TO BE KIDDING

@InsideCarolina: UNC notified NCAA on Aug24, 2011 of AFAM issues. UNC & NCAA "concluded there were no violations of current NCAA rules."

@DanWolken
So UNC has years of documented, institutionalized academic fraud and no NCAA rules were broken? Got it.

@awfulannouncing: You know where else there wasn't NCAA rules broken? Penn State. Glad the NCAA is such a beacon of consistency

You have to be fu**ing kidding me. Wow...PSU gets basically the death penalty, USC gets hammered, but UNC gets nothing for all the crap they pulled with the bagman coach and the academic fraud????? Their friggin' assistant coach was named Black Santa for Pete's sake!!!

You know who is celebrating right now? Miami...
 

KPENN

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You have to be fu**ing kidding me. Wow...PSU gets basically the death penalty, USC gets hammered, but UNC gets nothing for all the crap they pulled with the bagman coach and the academic fraud????? Their friggin' assistant coach was named Black Santa for Pete's sake!!!

You know who is celebrating right now? Miami...

Yup. I love UNC(family went there,still have some in the area, been to Chapel Hill alot, etc) but i'm absolutely stunned. They should have been punished. But it is pretty much par of the course with the NCAA. No consistency
 

IrishLax

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WOW!

NCAA just opened the door for rampant academic fraud. You will see oodles upon oodles of "no show" classes south of the Mason-Dixon line, I promise you that.
 

Ironman8

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<blockquote class="twitter-tweet" lang="en"><p>Rashad McCants tells <a href="https://twitter.com/OTLonESPN">@OTLonESPN</a> that he took bogus classes and tutors wrote his term papers at UNC. » <a href="http://t.co/wVfznF1ofA">http://t.co/wVfznF1ofA</a></p>— SportsCenter (@SportsCenter) <a href="https://twitter.com/SportsCenter/statuses/474892514764525568">June 6, 2014</a></blockquote>
<script async src="//platform.twitter.com/widgets.js" charset="utf-8"></script>
 

BleedBlueGold

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I just got done reading this. Makes my blood boil. And your heart has to go out to some of these kids like McCants, who actually took some real classes his freshman year. He did poorly, but rather than help him learn and better himself, they simply swapped out his AFAM classes (which he did nothing in) to skew his GPA and keep him eligible. Quick rant: The priorities in this country are wildly out of whack. Especially as it pertains to education vs sports in cases like this. Talk to anyone from a different country and it's pretty much the polar opposite to what goes down here in the States.
 

T Town Tommy

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Reckon the former Irish commit RB at UNC is having second thoughts now? Ouch.
 

Luckylucci

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I just got done reading this. Makes my blood boil. And your heart has to go out to some of these kids like McCants, who actually took some real classes his freshman year. He did poorly, but rather than help him learn and better himself, they simply swapped out his AFAM classes (which he did nothing in) to skew his GPA and keep him eligible. Quick rant: The priorities in this country are wildly out of whack. Especially as it pertains to education vs sports in cases like this. Talk to anyone from a different country and it's pretty much the polar opposite to what goes down here in the States.

I'm am by no means saying this isn't true but Rashad McCants is fucking nuts. Like literally has multiple screws loose crazy. So, while this falls in line with previous accusations I'm not sure we should be taking what he says as gospel.
 

wizards8507

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I've said this before but this just kills me because UNC is a GOOD school. They're not Arizona or LSU.

Sent from my Samsung Galaxy S III using Tapatalk 4
 

irishog77

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Thanks.

Someting tells me UNC is about to get hammered.

If history is any indicator, something tells me unc is MAYBE going to get a slap on the wrist. ohio state, miami, unc previously, even your own crimson tide-- nothing.

After the debacles of essentially the entire Southwest Conference, Oklahoma, Oklahoma State, Miami, Alabama, Auburn, and others from the 80's-early 90's, usc is the only school the ncaa has levied any sort of serious punishment on. I expect nothing different from the ncaa.
 

Whiskeyjack

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I've said this before but this just kills me because UNC is a GOOD school. They're not Arizona or LSU.

ASU and LSU both offer significantly better degree value and have much more respectable GSR figures. Hell, UNC isn't even the best public school in its own state. NCSU is much better, at least according to Football ROI.

UNC is in the bottom quartile for degree value and African-American ROI.

I was initially surprised by these figures, but thus far I've seen nothing objective that indicates UNC deserves its academic reputation.
 
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koonja

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<blockquote class="twitter-tweet" lang="en"><p><a href="https://twitter.com/TheIrishTP">@TheIrishTP</a> Colin Cowerd: "When someone comes on the air, if they're from <a href="https://twitter.com/search?q=%23ND&src=hash">#ND</a> we're good. If <a href="https://twitter.com/search?q=%23Georgia&src=hash">#Georgia</a>, <a href="https://twitter.com/search?q=%23UNC&src=hash">#UNC</a>, we have to be careful."</p>— Jake (@IrishJake1) <a href="https://twitter.com/IrishJake1/statuses/474936308377587712">June 6, 2014</a></blockquote>
<script async src="//platform.twitter.com/widgets.js" charset="utf-8"></script>

You guys should retweet this. Since everyone slobs on the ESPN personalities, this is a funny gut check.
 

RammerJammer91

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I just got done reading this. Makes my blood boil. And your heart has to go out to some of these kids like McCants, who actually took some real classes his freshman year. He did poorly, but rather than help him learn and better himself, they simply swapped out his AFAM classes (which he did nothing in) to skew his GPA and keep him eligible. Quick rant: The priorities in this country are wildly out of whack. Especially as it pertains to education vs sports in cases like this. Talk to anyone from a different country and it's pretty much the polar opposite to what goes down here in the States.
I agree, especially with the latter. While I doubt that every university offers fake classes for their student athletes, the unfortunate thing is that rules are being broken at every school. Whether it be having grades for "student-athletes" changed, enrolling them in fake classes, giving them money for gas/food/cars/plane tickets. Fans of schools with great academics are probably having a field day with this story, especially Duke fans. And that I can't stand. If rules can be broken at Harvard (2012 cheating scandal), it can happen (and is happening) everywhere. That also goes for Northwestern, Stanford, Wake Forest, etc. Quit being snobs and pumping your chest out like you're better than everyone...you're not. Don't act like your school follows all of the rules. And if you do believe that, I've got some land to sell you.

Now, for the NCAA. One of the most hypocritical organizations in the world today. Enough with caring about the "academic integrity" of "student-athletes." You don't. For the few who haven't realized it yet, it's all about the money with the NCAA. If the NCAA actually followed the rules that they supposedly pride themselves in, I would guess that every football and basketball program in the country would be penalized. But that will never happen, since the overall product would suffer and the NCAA's pockets would become emptier. Now, I doubt that the NCAA will do anything to UNC, much like they did nothing with Duke Basketball (Lance Thomas), Alabama Football (yes, I believe they should be penalized), and a few others. Personally, I think a lot of this has to do with the fact that these programs are premier programs and have helped the NCAA make a great profit. If a story came out with the basketball players at Southern Miss being enrolled in fake classes, the NCAA would likely penalize the program. Why? No offense to the players and coaches, but who cares about Southern Miss basketball? But would the NCAA penalize UNC, Kansas or Duke? Not likely.
 

MNIrishman

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I agree, especially with the latter. While I doubt that every university offers fake classes for their student athletes, the unfortunate thing is that rules are being broken at every school. Whether it be having grades for "student-athletes" changed, enrolling them in fake classes, giving them money for gas/food/cars/plane tickets. Fans of schools with great academics are probably having a field day with this story, especially Duke fans. And that I can't stand. If rules can be broken at Harvard (2012 cheating scandal), it can happen (and is happening) everywhere. That also goes for Northwestern, Stanford, Wake Forest, etc. Quit being snobs and pumping your chest out like you're better than everyone...you're not. Don't act like your school follows all of the rules. And if you do believe that, I've got some land to sell you.

Now, for the NCAA. One of the most hypocritical organizations in the world today. Enough with caring about the "academic integrity" of "student-athletes." You don't. For the few who haven't realized it yet, it's all about the money with the NCAA. If the NCAA actually followed the rules that they supposedly pride themselves in, I would guess that every football and basketball program in the country would be penalized. But that will never happen, since the overall product would suffer and the NCAA's pockets would become emptier. Now, I doubt that the NCAA will do anything to UNC, much like they did nothing with Duke Basketball (Lance Thomas), Alabama Football (yes, I believe they should be penalized), and a few others. Personally, I think a lot of this has to do with the fact that these programs are premier programs and have helped the NCAA make a great profit. If a story came out with the basketball players at Southern Miss being enrolled in fake classes, the NCAA would likely penalize the program. Why? No offense to the players and coaches, but who cares about Southern Miss basketball? But would the NCAA penalize UNC, Kansas or Duke? Not likely.

If ND were found to have violated rules, I would be very angry with the school. If ND compromised its academic integrity for sports, I would no longer be a fan.
 

ACamp1900

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<blockquote class="twitter-tweet" lang="en"><p><a href="https://twitter.com/TheIrishTP">@TheIrishTP</a> Colin Cowerd: "When someone comes on the air, if they're from <a href="https://twitter.com/search?q=%23ND&src=hash">#ND</a> we're good. If <a href="https://twitter.com/search?q=%23Georgia&src=hash">#Georgia</a>, <a href="https://twitter.com/search?q=%23UNC&src=hash">#UNC</a>, we have to be careful."</p>— Jake (@IrishJake1) <a href="https://twitter.com/IrishJake1/statuses/474936308377587712">June 6, 2014</a></blockquote>
<script async src="//platform.twitter.com/widgets.js" charset="utf-8"></script>

You guys should retweet this. Since everyone slobs on the ESPN personalities, this is a funny gut check.

What does this even mean?? Someone from ND isn't gonna curse on the air??
 
K

koonja

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What does this even mean?? Someone from ND isn't gonna curse on the air??

I can't fit it all in 140 characters, but the context was that ND players will be articulate and make for a good interview because they get an education, and the other schools, you have to worry about them sounding like Rocky Balboa.

He was ripping on how most schools don't demand or teach athletes anything if they're good big time players.

Sorry for the confusion.
 

ACamp1900

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I can't fit it all in 140 characters, but the context was that ND players will be articulate and make for a good interview because they get an education, and the other schools, you have to worry about them sounding like Rocky Balboa.

He was ripping on how most schools don't demand or teach athletes anything if they're good big time players.

Sorry for the confusion.

No prob... thanks for clarifying... I have come to conclude I have twitter and will never join it... I never understand what people are saying.
 
K

koonja

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No prob... thanks for clarifying... I have come to conclude I have twitter and will never join it... I never understand what people are saying.

I didn't make it very clear. Like I said, it's really hard to fit into 140 letters, lol. I should have worded it better.

He said he legitimately enjoys interviews with ND/Stanford kids more. I thought it was really cool to hear an ESPN personality admit that, and wanted to share with the world.
 

wizards8507

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I just got done reading this. Makes my blood boil. And your heart has to go out to some of these kids like McCants, who actually took some real classes his freshman year. He did poorly, but rather than help him learn and better himself, they simply swapped out his AFAM classes (which he did nothing in) to skew his GPA and keep him eligible. Quick rant: The priorities in this country are wildly out of whack. Especially as it pertains to education vs sports in cases like this. Talk to anyone from a different country and it's pretty much the polar opposite to what goes down here in the States.

I'm sorry but you're WAY off when you paint this as an American issue as it relates to other countries. Powerhouse European football clubs sign kids to professional contracts when they're as young as seven years old. Maybe we're more hypocritical because we try to fake like we care about education, but the "sports first" mentality is NOT unique to us.

Edit: For the record, I probably prefer the way Europe does it. College isn't right for everyone and the only way to clean up the amateur system is to admit that fact. Let the guys who ONLY want to go be professionals go be professionals.

Sent from my Samsung Galaxy S III using Tapatalk 4
 
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Whiskeyjack

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While I doubt that every university offers fake classes for their student athletes, the unfortunate thing is that rules are being broken at every school. Whether it be having grades for "student-athletes" changed, enrolling them in fake classes, giving them money for gas/food/cars/plane tickets.

Every school engages in academic fraud? Projecting your own flaws onto others to make yourself feel better is a bad look.

If rules can be broken at Harvard (2012 cheating scandal), it can happen (and is happening) everywhere.

That's completely illogical. You'd be hard-pressed to find a greater concentration of status-obsessed sociopaths outside of Harvard. There are social pathologies present within the Ivy League that you won't find elsewhere. So "cheating at Harvard = cheating everywhere" doesn't fly.

Quit being snobs and pumping your chest out like you're better than everyone...you're not.

Who in this thread stated this? Again, this comes off as insecurity on your part.

Don't act like your school follows all of the rules.

How are we supposed to prove a negative? ND voluntarily chooses to handicap the competitiveness of its sports teams in a ton of ways for purely moral reasons-- we don't oversign, we don't accept JuCos, our academic requirements are much more rigorous than the NCAA minimums, etc. It isn't an accident that ND regularly leads the nation in GSR and other similar metrics. So I have a hard time believing that our athletes are on the take or that we're engaged in academic fraud to keep players eligible when ND refuses to engage in many less morally questionable practices which would produce more tangible competitive benefits.

And that I can't stand.

You know what I can't stand? When the fan of a football factory program tries to tell me that my program is just as dirty as his, and that I'm naive if I believe otherwise, while offering zero evidence to support that assertion other than some hand-waving generalizations about everyone being corrupt. I suppose it's basic human nature, though. A thief suspects that everyone is out to steal his stuff.

Now, for the NCAA. One of the most hypocritical organizations in the world today. Enough with caring about the "academic integrity" of "student-athletes." You don't. For the few who haven't realized it yet, it's all about the money with the NCAA.

The NCAA is its member institutions. It's misleading to speak about it as meaningfully separate from the schools it "governs".
 
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C

Cackalacky

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ASU and LSU both offer significantly better degree value and have much more respectable GSR figures. Hell, UNC isn't even the best public school in its own state. NCSU is much better, at least according to Football ROI.

UNC is in the bottom quartile for degree value and African-American ROI.

I was initially surprised by these figures, but thus far I've seen nothing objective that indicates UNC deserves its academic reputation.

I think the common misconception lies in the fact that the Research Triangle is basically one huge urbanized graduate level educated community fed by NCST, UNC and Duke graduates and grad programs as well as a thriving suburban community supporting the tech, research and hospital businesses.

NCST puts out tons of good engineers, Duke puts out great grads for tech and medicine, and UNC had good graduate programs but the undergrad is actually pretty poor.
 

BleedBlueGold

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I'm sorry but you're WAY off when you paint this as an American issue as it relates to other countries. Powerhouse European football clubs sign kids to professional contracts when they're as young as seven years old. Maybe we're more hypocritical because we try to fake like we care about education, but the "sports first" mentality is NOT unique to us.

Edit: For the record, I probably prefer the way Europe does it. College isn't right for everyone and the only way to clean up the amateur system is to admit that fact. Let the guys who ONLY want to go be professionals go be professionals.

Sent from my Samsung Galaxy S III using Tapatalk 4

I'm not even going to respond to this considering you listed one example and claim I'm "WAY off," when all I simply said was all other countries are "pretty much" the opposite. Most countries with any sort of respectable educational system put learning above sports as a priority. Thank you for pointing out that not ALL of them are that way...
 

wizards8507

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I'm not even going to respond to this considering you listed one example and claim I'm "WAY off," when all I simply said was all other countries are "pretty much" the opposite. Most countries with any sort of respectable educational system put learning above sports as a priority. Thank you for pointing out that not ALL of them are that way...

My "one example" is their entire athletic system. Soccer is pretty much THE sport in the rest of the world, but cricket and tennis do the same things when it comes to signing youth to professional contracts.

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BleedBlueGold

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My "one example" is their entire athletic system. Soccer is pretty much THE sport in the rest of the world, but cricket and tennis do the same things when it comes to signing youth to professional contracts.

Sent from my Samsung Galaxy S III using Tapatalk 4

Ok but how are their educational systems? From what I've gathered, the US is far from elite in world rankings as it pertains to education. Seems to me people in this country should care more about that ranking than that of their favorite sports teams.

I'm not arguing that sports aren't prestigious anywhere else. Soccer players make bank. I believe they make more on average than any other sport in the world. But I'd bet the majority of them can read and write at a respectable level.
 

wizards8507

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Ok but how are their educational systems? From what I've gathered, the US is far from elite in world rankings as it pertains to education. Seems to me people in this country should care more about that ranking than that of their favorite sports teams.

I'm not arguing that sports aren't prestigious anywhere else. Soccer players make bank. I believe they make more on average than any other sport in the world. But I'd bet the majority of them can read and write at a respectable level.

I don't necessarily disagree that education is too low on people's priority lists, but I'm not sure that a negative correlation between education and athletics is particularly strong. There are plenty of stupid people in this country, the vast majority of whom never played college or pro ball.

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RammerJammer91

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Every school engages in academic fraud? Projecting your own flaws onto others to make yourself feel better is a bad look.



That's completely illogical. You'd be hard-pressed to find a greater concentration of status-obsessed sociopaths outside of Harvard. There are social pathologies present within the Ivy League that you won't find elsewhere. So "cheating at Harvard = cheating everywhere" doesn't fly.



Who in this thread stated this? Again, this comes off as insecurity on your part.



How are we supposed to prove a negative? ND voluntarily chooses to handicap the competitiveness of its sports teams in a ton of ways for purely moral reasons-- we don't oversign, we don't accept JuCos, our academic requirements are much more rigorous than the NCAA minimums, etc. It isn't an accident that ND regularly leads the nation in GSR and other similar metrics. So I have a hard time believing that our athletes are on the take or that we're engaged in academic fraud to keep players eligible when ND refuses to engage in many less morally questionable practices which would produce more tangible competitive benefits.



You know what I can't stand? When the fan of a football factory program tries to tell me that my program is just as dirty as his, and that I'm naive if I believe otherwise, while offering zero evidence to support that assertion other than some hand-waving generalizations about everyone being corrupt. I suppose it's basic human nature, though. A thief suspects that everyone is out to steal his stuff.



The NCAA is its member institutions. It's misleading to speak about it as meaningfully separate from the schools it "governs".

This wasn't a shot at ND. It was more of me expressing my opinion on schools whose fans act as if they're doing everything right and violating rules would never happen at their school. That is NOT ND fans. I'm pretty sure I directed at schools like Duke who can't get enough of seeing UNC in the headlines. Relax, bud. You're trying to pick a fight when nothing is there. Also, I never said ND was as dirty as Alabama's. I suggest you read my post again.
 
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wizards8507

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Back on topic, anyone else watching OTL? If there's any evidence this is death penalty type stuff.

I don't know anything about Rashad McCants but does he have an axe to grind?

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