Sell me on a bright future for the program.

[ThePiombino]

I got 3 posts in this thread (4 if you count the DP) have a ball if you feel the need to.

Pretty sure he was referencing your OP:

Ive been away for a few days but I have said that with the way this season has gone so far that I think the future of this program is that we are a 6-8 win team with maybe a few BCS season sprinkled in every 6 years or so. This comment has gotten me more red reps than any of the other crazy **** I have said over the last 4 years of posting here.

 

[gkIrish]

Pitt was only a 4.5 point underdog. Your entire post from the second paragraph downward is invalid as it's based upon a false supposition.

When is the last time we lost when favored before the pitt game? USF opening game in 11'? Maybe we were favored by a half a point or so vs FSU in the bowl game? Seriously I'm pissed and disappointed too by the loss but people are acting like the program needs to be disbanded or something. We beat 3 really good teams this year in Mich State, Arizona and USC (Maybe SC isn't really good but every win against them should be cherished after a decade of non-competitive *ss beatings to them).

This program is at the very minimum a far better place then it was under the previous 3.0001 adminstrations ( I guess O'leary counts as .0001, right?) And you know what? I say that even thinking we might take a step back next year. Defense has numerous questions and though we get a far more physically gifted QB back he will be a year removed from any competition and very rusty. Plus we face a daunting schedule on top of it all.

Ok, sure not really reassuring but at least our defense doesn't play like a high school scout team anymore, even if it has been very average this year.

Not really disagreeing with you guys but being favored by a small amount of points may indicate that the teams are evenly matched but it DOESN"T mean that they should be evenly matched. In other words, we should expect to field a team that is favored by 7+ (home or away) against Pitt. The fact that we were only favored by 4.5 just means that we didn't field a great team.

 

[IrishLax]

Not really disagreeing with you guys but being favored by a small amount of points may indicate that the teams are evenly matched but it DOESN"T mean that they should be evenly matched. In other words, we should expect to field a team that is favored by 7+ (home or away) against Pitt. The fact that we were only favored by 4.5 just means that we didn't field a great team.

Right... Because of 20+ injuries this year. That's why this team is down. And that's not even including the dismissal of Golson.

 

[gkIrish]

Right... Because of 20+ injuries this year. That's why this team is down. And that's not even including the dismissal of Golson.

I understand. Next year will be better (crossing fingers)

 

[Brooklyn]

With Everett Golson, we had a high probability of being undefeated until this point. Not a knock on Tommy since he helped us win games, but in the losses Tommy played poorly and we needed someone who can extend plays/throw on the run.

Everett Golson + one of our best oline classes getting an year under their belt, + two studs out of Florida at RB getting an year under their belt, + our wide receivers being one year smarter (young guys played pretty well this year), + Senior year Niklas and Koyack = probably the best complete offense we've had in a while.

On defense the front 7 picture is a little unclear with Tuitt possibly entering the draft but we still have Councell, Ishaq, Day, Jaylon and Grace plus a lot of good young players. Also we should have an improved DB group with Luke taking over for Jackson and Farley playing a lot less.

Oh and Brindza being a senior and we look like we are shopping for a dangerous kick returner (McKenzie, etc.). So we should maintain on defense and be better on offense and special teams.

Future is bright.

 

[Domina Nostra]

College football is about QBs. Rees is not a good one. Golson, Zaire, Kizer have promise...

 

[anarin]

Is the woman hot? if so sign me up.

When you drink you play Russian roulette. Its possible she could be...

You know the consequences

 

[Irishfan33]

Alot of people need to pump the brakes, the sky is not falling.

I know it isnt pretty but Coach Kelly is getting it done.
Our wins have been ugly but remember,not to long ago we would have lost those games.
I have been were Kelly is right now, trying to run your system and your missing the most important piece, it can so damn frustraiting.

Rememeber this is ND, we dont take short cuts,we don't bring in Juco's,we dont buy pops a tractor or buy mama a Lexus. You can't turn around 20+ years of stink in 3-4 years. What we did last year was a miracle,helped out by irish Luck, It was a Christmas gift just to let us know he hasnt forgoten about us.

Kelly is bringing in the right players, the guys you need to win in today's game.
If we give Kelly time and what he needs we would be back to being a program that is always gonna be in the top 10.

Next years team is going to be fun to watch, we have speed,speed,and more speed on offense. Kelly will be truly able to run his real offense (the cincinnati offense) next year.

IMO the defense will be fine next year with or without Tuitt moving to the 4-3 and hard headed Diaco must "Grow" as a DC or his days here are numbered.

I truly the wind is going to be at our backs from next season on.

you want to jump ship, do it now. I'm not letting you back on if you do though.

 

[Irish YJ]

Strictly my opinion. I've tried not to join in the far right and far left conversations.....

The sky isn't falling, but it is very cloudy right now. Realistically speaking, folks are just not realistic... LOL. We are going in the right direction, but last year was a perfect storm, and made too many folks overly optimistic about the current state of the program. Is BK doing the right things, yes. Is the program improving year over year, yes. Was losing EG, Manti, and others a big hit, yes but elite teams reload. Do we have an elite team this year, no. Did we have an elite team last year, no. Would we have an elite team with EG this year, no. Would we have been undefeated at this point, decent chance. Would we be able to beat the likes of Bama, FSU, etc., with EG, no IMO. We are getting closer each year, but being ND means doing the right things. Doing the right things means taking the longer road to attain success. Can we get there (NCs), absolutely. Will it happen next year, probably not. Will it happen in the next five years, there's a pretty darn good chance.

For those of you who think we are an elite team, and the object of bad luck, check yourselves. Put down the Kool-Aid. We do not have the talent level of the elite schools yet even with EG, but getting closer every year. For those of you who think the sky is falling, and BK should be on the hot seat, check yourself too. We are in much better shape structurally, talent-wise, mentally, and conditioning than we have been since the Holtz years.

Passion is great, and we are a passionate fan base. But passion can blind while winning, and crush when losing. Either way, just remember we all love ND, and sometimes we need to take a deep breath and look at things for what they are. Not how we want them to be, or how we fear they might be. This probably will be an unpopular view for the extremist on both sides, but mostly just to the ones who enjoy the conflict...

GO ND.

 

[irisheyes]

If someone has to sell you on a bright future, you clearly are a fan for all the wrong reasons. The fact that youve already given up on this season is sad. We get 12/13 days a year where we get to watch Notre Dame football ,and im looking forward to every game, because afterwards itll be another year before we get to see our irish take the the field. Its almost comical that after 1 bad season you dont think we will make another championship.

 

[kmoose]

College football is about QBs.

Is that why the Buckeyes won a National Championship with Craig Krenzel?

A great quarterback can carry a college team, yes. But you don't have to have a great quarterback, to win in college.

 

[Pachuco]

Because football is fun entertainment to temporarily distract from life's more serious daily world matters. It's a chance to keep things in perspective, eat and drink, enjoy time with friends and family, and appreciate our institutional traditions. It's an opportunity to witness the cycle of young people upholding and enhancing the games that we've grown to value as a society, but more importantly allowing the game to inspire individual development through symbolic mental and physical trials/adversities. Plus, there's always a chance to witness something great happening, be part of a process that can lift up a school, and a world-following of fans. Doomsday football is the antithesis of what sports is all about. Doomsday can certainly be found all around us, but it's not in football... at least it shouldn't be. As long as the spirit of what makes Notre Dame great continues, the relationships that it builds, there will always be something bright to look forward to every season that the game exists.

 

[frankygoes69]

+1^

 

[eNDzone]

College football is about QBs. Rees is not a good one. Golson, Zaire, Kizer have promise...

Well said. No more reasons need to be given for a better future.

 

[frankygoes69]

TR is a good QB. If you have the best QB in the world but nothing else, what happens?

 

[kmoose]

TR is a good QB. If you have the best QB in the world but nothing else, what happens?

This:

<iframe width="420" height="315" src="//www.youtube.com/embed/s8zZRBTOcnY" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>

 

[frankygoes69]

So, did Vince Young make to the NCG by himself? No, he was just a mobile QB. That year they had Jamal Charles who ran for over 1,000 yards and is a leader in YPG in the NFL. Get your stuff straight.

Young isn't even playing anymore. There were many questionable calls during that game and he had did the best he could with what he had. Just like TR.

 

[kmoose]

So, did Vince Young make to the NCG by himself? No, he was just a mobile QB. That year they had Jamal Charles who ran for over 1,000 yards and is a leader in YPG in the NFL. Get your stuff straight.

Young isn't even playing anymore. There were many questionable calls during that game and he had did the best he could with what he had. Just like TR.

<iframe width="420" height="315" src="//www.youtube.com/embed/C6cxNR9ML8k" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>

I guess I should have used the italics, when I said, "This:"?

 

[ACamp1900]

Yeah, that one man team thing with that Texas team always kind of bothered me too... That team was loaded with talent.

 

[Rocket89]

So, did Vince Young make to the NCG by himself? No, he was just a mobile QB. That year they had Jamal Charles who ran for over 1,000 yards and is a leader in YPG in the NFL. Get your stuff straight.

Young isn't even playing anymore. There were many questionable calls during that game and he had did the best he could with what he had. Just like TR.

Vince Young Career Stats:

6,040 passing yards
61.8 accuracy
44 TD
28 INT
457 carries
3,127 yards
6.8 yards per carry
37 TD

2006 Rose Bowl:

30 for 40
267 yards
19 carries
200 yards
3 TD

Maybe the best performance by any player in a national title game. Charles had 34 yards in the game. Oh, and Young out-rushed Charles on the season by 172 yards too.

Young was dominant in college, and ranked as the top player in college football during the BCS era by Athlon. I have no idea what your point was.

 

[frankygoes69]

My point is that Vince Young was not the best player on that team. You should know that stats are what they are. That's what I'm talking about. Plus, I am talking about the whole season not just one game. For the love of FVck you amaze me!!!!!!!!!!!

 

[Crazy Balki]

College football is about QBs. Rees is not a good one. Golson, Zaire, Kizer have promise...

Story of the half-decade. ND + Bad QB = Mediocre Season

ND + Good QB = Great season


ND got it's best QB play in 2012 and it resulted in a 12-0 regular season. Yes, it wasn't great, but Golson improved as the season wore on and Rees did well when he had to.

Rees as a permanent starter is just...blaghhh. Nothing about his play is appealing. He is throwing for just over 50% completion wise. His TD to INT ratio, while not as bad 2011, is still not good. In addition, it's his play against the upper tier opponents that is very troubling. Here are the numbers:

@ Michigan (29/51 57%, 2 TD/2 INT, 314 yards)
vs. Michigan St (14/34 41%, 1 TD, 142 yards)
vs. Oklahoma (9/24 37%, 2 TD, 3 INT, 104 yards...Really Tommy?)
vs. Arizona St (17/38 45%, 3 TD, 1 INT, 279 yards)
@ Pittsburgh (18/38 47% 2 TD, 2 INT, 318 yards)

Looking at the stats so far this season, Rees ranks in at 105th out of 120 eligible players in completion percentage. QB "Sniper" Logan Thomas is more accurate than Rees. The fact that ND is 7-3 with a QB this bad is a freakin' miracle.

To put this in layman's terms: In 2011, Rees only had 2 games where he completed less than 60% of his passes (@ Pitt and @ Stanford). This year, he has thrown for less than 60% in 5 of 10 games. His turnovers are down, but at the expense of his completion percentage. And don't say it's receivers. Even though there's no Floyd in the corp this year, this is by far the best WR unit ND has had since Kelly arrived.

So let's recap. Below average athleticism, borderline poor pocket presence, terrible accuracy and still throwing costly interceptions. I can only assume that Tommy has gotten worse since his Sophomore year and not improve like we'd hoped. God, 2014 can't come soon enough. Can't wait to see a competent QB run this offense.

 

[frankygoes69]

No, you are a MOOSE and that speaks for itself.

Richie's Song 2/3 - YouTube

 

[frankygoes69]

Get it straight mOOSe!

 

[Crazy Balki]

Is that why the Buckeyes won a National Championship with Craig Krenzel?

A great quarterback can carry a college team, yes. But you don't have to have a great quarterback, to win in college.

True, but a bad one will single-handedly bring a team down.

Krenzel wasn't the focal point of the offense. It was a downhill rushing attack, with Clarett leading the pack with over 1200 yards rushing. ND doesn't have that type of offense, nor do they have a running game of that caliber (yet...). In addition, OSU had a dominant defense that held all 13 regular season opponents to 21 points or fewer. They were ND of last year with a better rushing attack.

That doesn't work for ND however. They run an offense that requires a playmaker at QB. If not, it severely limits the offense and it's capability to exploit mismatches. ND has unparalleled talent at the skill positions, but QB is well below average.

 

[frankygoes69]

Unfortunately these people don't get it. Like the dark side, the hatred runs deep within them. And most are smarter than me and you, you or I, us, or however IE says its supposed to be.

 

[pkt77242]

Story of the half-decade. ND + Bad QB = Mediocre Season

ND + Good QB = Great season


ND got it's best QB play in 2012 and it resulted in a 12-0 regular season. Yes, it wasn't great, but Golson improved as the season wore on and Rees did well when he had to.

Rees as a permanent starter is just...blaghhh. Nothing about his play is appealing. He is throwing for just over 50% completion wise. His TD to INT ratio, while not as bad 2011, is still not good. In addition, it's his play against the upper tier opponents that is very troubling. Here are the numbers:

@ Michigan (29/51 57%, 2 TD/2 INT, 314 yards)
vs. Michigan St (14/34 41%, 1 TD, 142 yards)
vs. Oklahoma (9/24 37%, 2 TD, 3 INT, 104 yards...Really Tommy?)
vs. Arizona St (17/38 45%, 3 TD, 1 INT, 279 yards)
@ Pittsburgh (18/38 47% 2 TD, 2 INT, 318 yards)

Looking at the stats so far this season, Rees ranks in at 105th out of 120 eligible players in completion percentage. QB "Sniper" Logan Thomas is more accurate than Rees. The fact that ND is 7-3 with a QB this bad is a freakin' miracle.

To put this in layman's terms: In 2011, Rees only had 2 games where he completed less than 60% of his passes (@ Pitt and @ Stanford). This year, he has thrown for less than 60% in 5 of 10 games. His turnovers are down, but at the expense of his completion percentage. And don't say it's receivers. Even though there's no Floyd in the corp this year, this is by far the best WR unit ND has had since Kelly arrived.

So let's recap. Below average athleticism, borderline poor pocket presence, terrible accuracy and still throwing costly interceptions. I can only assume that Tommy has gotten worse since his Sophomore year and not improve like we'd hoped. God, 2014 can't come soon enough. Can't wait to see a competent QB run this offense.

What? Clausen had an amazing Junior year but we went 6-6. I would actually say ND does better when it has a great D than a great QB.

 

[frankygoes69]

Great point!

 

[Who'saWildManNow]

Sell me on a bright future for the program

ND beat USC, then Stanford beat Oregon, then USC beat Stanford, therefore?


Come on Rudy. Nobody needs to sell you anything. You come back to the television set every saturday because you believe.

The slightest of changes can derail or propel a program. I shouldn't have to get into the intricacies of why and who and how come. You watch the games, you follow recruiting.

Maybe broaden your scope and look at the nature of college football and you'll see the chaos it really is. Then you might realize what some of us are completely comfortable with.

The potential is there, because Kelly set a foundation. A foundation he continually works to solidify under the MOST strenuous conditions in the country. At any moment, in any year we may run the table, the potential is there.

But the slightest of changes will determine our future.

 

[frankygoes69]

Bro,

That's what I've been arguing with my brother about. The slightest of changes can alter the outcome of everything.