A Song of Ice and Fire (Spoilers! Only enter if you have read all books)

[Whiskeyjack]

Littlefinger is gay? And into little boys? What?

Meant pedophile. Apologies.

 

[Whiskeyjack]

HBO has strongly implied that the show will end at 7 seasons.

 

[mgriff]

That makes perfect sense. They are already blending from book five already. I like this timeline because as much as I'd love a ten season ode to ASoIaF, it's unrealistic to expect interest and profit to continue for a decade. I'd imagine once we get to Mereen people are going to get bored.

 

[Jimmy3Putt]

I really like the idea of a three hour movie to end the story.
The hiatus idea isn't bad either.
Hopefully we don't get half the ending before the books are out.

 

[phillyirish]

I really like the idea of a three hour movie to end the story.
The hiatus idea isn't bad either.
Hopefully we don't get half the ending before the books are out.

I world love a 3 hour movie to end it, that would be perfect but unlikely. Maybe if thy did that they would actually show a battle or two.

 

[Emcee77]

I really like the idea of a three hour movie to end the story.
The hiatus idea isn't bad either.
Hopefully we don't get half the ending before the books are out.

I was thinking this too, but then I was thinking that we probably already know half the ending anyway. I mean if you accept the R + L = J theory, you can imagine how the story will basically end. I kind of agree with the article that the show producers could tie the main storylines up rather quickly, and then you'd have to read the books to exactly why it went down that way or figure out what happens to your favorite minor characters.

 

[mgriff]

No way they let the series finish first. I mean, you've got to be shitting me. It will be a two decade book saga by then and you can't just end it on the show first! If that happens print will truly be dead.

I love the idea of a three hour movie to end the series. HBO does the series, leaves a cliffhanger and puts the last half or so of A Dream of Spring into a major motion picture. That would be sweet.

 

[Pops Freshenmeyer]

No way they let the series finish first. I mean, you've got to be shitting me. It will be a two decade book saga by then and you can't just end it on the show first! If that happens print will truly be dead.

I love the idea of a three hour movie to end the series. HBO does the series, leaves a cliffhanger and puts the last half or so of A Dream of Spring into a major motion picture. That would be sweet.

I second this idea.

Unfortunately, I don't see any way the books precede the television series in finishing out. Heck, I'm skeptical that book #6 is going to come before the HBO series wraps things up.

 

[ND NYC]

having "screen" (either hbo or movie) finish this up is probabaly what Martin actually wants.
He has been consumed by this "song" for sooo long now, probably burnt out on it.

if he get out of this having provided a good and satisfactory ending to his readers and viewers without another 3000 pages to write...my hunch is he will take it.

 

[NoJusticeNoPeace]

2013-ASOS pt 1
2014-ASOS pt 2, parts of AFFC/ADWD
2015-AFFC/ADWD pt 1
2016-AFFC/ADWD pt 2, probably one of the big impending battles
2017-TWOW pt 1
2018-TWOW pt 2

There's 8. They could make ADOS into a movie trilogy, but I'm not sure if that would even be enough time. Maybe it would be better to do a season of Robert's Rebellion or Aegon the Conqueror to wait until ADOS is done. I think GRRM will finish ADOS faster than the middle books. It's easier to write an ending than to write a middle.

 

[ACamp1900]

Someone needs to clue Eddie Vanderdoes into the series.... Interesting research on what happens to oath breakers.....

 

[NoJusticeNoPeace]

Someone needs to clue Eddie Vanderdoes into the series.... Interesting research on what happens to oath breakers.....

They get to be the Warden of the North?

 

[Emcee77]

So I've been reading the Dunk and Egg stories this week. Finished the first two, now about halfway through the third.

First of all, they're great! If you like ASOIAF you'll like these too, for sure. Just as ASIAF takes place about 15 years after the Baratheon/Stark civil war that brought down the Targaryens, the Dunk and Egg stories take place about 15 years after the Blackfyre Rebellion, and are about the simmering tensions among the war's survivors. So it's a similar setting to ASOIAF except that the royalists won the civil war instead of lost it.

The reason I bring it up is that these stories just by their existence make me virtually certain that the Blackfyres will come into ASOIAF in a major way, if anyone doubts it. It's clear that Martin has given the Blackfyre Rebellion a ton of thought, and I can't see it being just basically a footnote in ASOIAF.

 

[ND NYC]

does the dunk and egg stories lend more or less credibility to you for the "aegon being alive (griff)" in your opinion?

also do you consideer dunk and egg mandatory and required if weve already read all the books...or is it an unnrelated journey back to westeros with no bearing on the 5 books?

 

[Emcee77]

does the dunk and egg stories lend more or less credibility to you for the "aegon being alive (griff)" in your opinion?

Well, I've really just started the third one, and Whiskey suggested above that the third one is key evidence, so I don't know, but based on what I've read so far they lend somewhat more credibility to the theory that Aegon is actually a Blackfyre. The way Martin talks about the war, the Blackfyres have to get involved in ASOIAF somehow. They are just too interesting and too well-developed to be a mere side-story or back-story.

also do you consideer dunk and egg mandatory and required if weve already read all the books...or is it an unnrelated journey back to westeros with no bearing on the 5 books?

I do not consider them mandatory ... how closely related they are to the ASOIAF books remains to be seen. I'll put it this way: I recommend them to any fan of ASOIAF. They are short, enjoyable and they get you thinking about how ASOIAF might end.

 

[Whiskeyjack]

The reason I bring it up is that these stories just by their existence make me virtually certain that the Blackfyres will come into ASOIAF in a major way, if anyone doubts it. It's clear that Martin has given the Blackfyre Rebellion a ton of thought, and I can't see it being just basically a footnote in ASOIAF.

Absolutely. I wasn't totally sold on the Blackfyre connections between Varys, Illyrio, Griff, Aegon, the Golden Company, etc. until I read Mystery Knight. Now I'd put money on it.

does the dunk and egg stories lend more or less credibility to you for the "aegon being alive (griff)" in your opinion?

AFAIK, there's virtually no evidence to support the Aegon Baby Swap theory (i.e. that Griff's Aegon is actually Rhaegar's son). But there are mountains of circumstantial evidence that he's a descendant of Blackfyre.

also do you consideer dunk and egg mandatory and required if weve already read all the books...or is it an unnrelated journey back to westeros with no bearing on the 5 books?

Mandatory? No. But they shed light on a lot of things mentioned in passing in the series, and they help to validate several fan theories about where the series is going.

They're very good, though. If you like the series, you should seriously consider reading them. They're all short stories as well, so they don't require much of a time investment. Oh, and you can find them for free online:

Part I: The Hedge Knight
Part II: The Sworn Sword
Part III: The Mystery Knight

Edit: The Mystery Knight includes an appearance by Bloodraven, who is easily one of the coolest characters in the series.

 

[ND NYC]

so I'm clear:
re: This "Griff" who is saying he is actually Aegon
he is either:
1) Aegon Targearyn himself and did get switched
2) he is a Blackfyre posing as Aegom Targaryen
3) some other dude...

 

[Whiskeyjack]

so I'm clear:
re: This "Griff" who is saying he is actually Aegon
he is either:
1) Aegon Targearyn himself and did get switched
2) he is a Blackfyre posing as Aegom Targaryen
3) some other dude...

Griff, Varys, Illyrio, etc. are all claiming he's (1). For all we know, he may very well believe it, too. Though that would require an implausible baby switch before Gregore Clegane arrived at Dragonstone, and thus far we have zero evidence that such happened.

The Blackfyre connections for all the people surrounding and supporting "Aegon" are overwhelming. See mgriff's posts on the subject earlier in the thread. My money's on (2).

I suppose (3) is possible, but that's even less likely than (1).

 

[ND NYC]

if hes a blackfyre who would his parents/brothers/sisters be?

and does he have kings blood in him?

 

[Whiskeyjack]

if hes a blackfyre who would his parents/brothers/sisters be?

Daemon Blackfyre had 7 sons. Two died with him at the Battle of the Redgrass Field. Another returned to Westeros later and was captured by Bloodraven. That leaves 4 unaccounted for in exile to start families of their own. "Aegon" is presumably one of their descendants.

and does he have kings blood in him?

Yes. Blackfyre, though a bastard, was a full-blooded Targaryen. "Aegon" would be several generations removed from him, but assuming he's a Blackfyre descendant, he has plenty of dragon's blood in him.

 

[ND NYC]

sooo many damn bastards in Westeros. hard to keep up with all of them.

if their was a morning after pill they'd probabaly all be living in peace

 

[Emcee77]

Haha I know. Martin is seriously obsessed with the concept of illegitimate children. Especially sons. Have you guys noticed how few illegitimate daughters seem to be born in Westeros? Illegitimate children are always boys, apparently.

Well, maybe not always. I can think of at least one off the top of my head ... wasn't there an illegitimate daughter of Robert's who helped Catelyn climb up to the Eyrie in the Vale? There may be others I'm forgetting.

 

[Whiskeyjack]

Haha I know. Martin is seriously obsessed with the concept of illegitimate children. Especially sons. Have you guys noticed how few illegitimate daughters seem to be born in Westeros? Illegitimate children are always boys, apparently.

Because illegitimate daughters don't mean much in the line of succession. Though Shiera Seastar was a pretty big deal.

 

[IrishLax]

Haha I know. Martin is seriously obsessed with the concept of illegitimate children. Especially sons. Have you guys noticed how few illegitimate daughters seem to be born in Westeros? Illegitimate children are always boys, apparently.

Haha you're right... except for that one in Game of Thrones that Cat runs into in the Vale... can't really think of any other girls.

 

[Whiskeyjack]

Haha you're right... except for that one in Game of Thrones that Cat runs into in the Vale... can't really think of any other girls.

Mya Stone. Just one of Robert's 16 bastards.

 

[mgriff]

How about the ****ing Sand Snakes for bastard daughters?

 

[Emcee77]

Haha you're right... except for that one in Game of Thrones that Cat runs into in the Vale... can't really think of any other girls.

Ha, I thought of her right after I hit the Submit button. Good call.

 

[Emcee77]

How about the ****ing Sand Snakes for bastard daughters?

Ahh, now there's a really good call. I can't believe I forgot about them. I owe you reps for that one.

 

[ND NYC]

these female bastards, would they be called bastardettes? or maybe bastelles?

or does bastard apply to both sexes?

ps good call on the sand snakes...odd lot them.

 

[Whiskeyjack]

How about the ****ing Sand Snakes for bastard daughters?

Because Dorne is the only one of the Seven Kingdoms that doesn't utilize Agnatic Succession. Thanks, Nymeria.