'13 FL CB MacKensie Alexander (Clemson Verbal)

[Riddickulous]

Really hope that we can recruit our '14 class along the same lines as USC did their '13 cycle.

Hopefully we can avoid an 8-4 season like Michigan is going to end up with this year.

 

[NDhoosier]

You really think that Kelly wouldn't want to bring back one of the starters on possibly the best defense in the nation? I think fox is a lock to come back.

If there is a logjam with 5* recruits, then yes... If not, I say ask one back (I prefer Fox)

 

[jerboski]

Really hope that we can recruit our '14 class along the same lines as USC did their '13 cycle.

Agree with this, they killed it this year, hope we do the same with a small class but all top talent

 

[Irish To The Core]

You really think that Kelly wouldn't want to bring back one of the starters on possibly the best defense in the nation? I think fox is a lock to come back.

I don't think he is a "lock". It all depends on which recruit we would have to pass on in order to bring Fox back. It also depends on how guys like Grace, Moore (even Rabassa/Okwara) project on the inside.

I think it would have to be a Hell of a player to leave Fox on the outside looking in, but he is behind Watt, Martin and Wood for sure. If Fox is not offered a fifth year, it is because the staff has landed some very big fish.

 

[Golden Glory]

The other part of the equation is the player has to want to come back for the fifth year see Sean Cwynar. They may just want to take their ND degree and move on with thier lives. We would have trouble with that but it's their choice if they get offered a fifth.

 

[Whiskeyjack]

The other part of the equation is the player has to want to come back for the fifth year see Sean Cwynar. They may just want to take their ND degree and move on with thier lives. We would have trouble with that but it's their choice if they get offered a fifth.

Ha. Sean managed to get his MBA in just 4 years. Unprecedented. Returning for his 5Y would actually have been a bad financial decision (opportunity cost) since he knew he had no chance of getting drafted. Not really relevant to the average ND football player.

 

[Fbolt]

Hopefully we can avoid an 8-4 season like Michigan is going to end up with this year.

I hear ya, but the way this team is winning with pure power, self-confidence, discipline, athletic ability and technique, we are seeing a dynasty in the making.

My opinion.

 

[ndfi78]

Ha. Sean managed to get his MBA in just 4 years. Unprecedented. Returning for his 5Y would actually have been a bad financial decision (opportunity cost) since he knew he had no chance of getting drafted. Not really relevant to the average ND football player.

That is amazing. Seriously amazing.

 

[dublinirish]

you gotta bring back foxy and carlo if you are BK IMO, you cant risk hurting the chemistry of the Defense

 

[RDU Irish]

This fifth year talk is facinating but I hear MacKensie Alexander is a 4 to 5 star recruit and one of the top five players in the country in a position of need.

 

[koonja]

Fox/Calabrese will not be back if it means taking on Alexander/Treadwell/Redfield.


3-4 year starters and potential all-Americans for ONE year of Fox/Calabrese? Lol, please.

 

[NoJusticeNoPeace]

You know what kind of coaches pass on Mackenzie Alexander? Stupid ones. You know what Brian Kelly isn't? Stupid. Save a spot for him. Find a way to fit him on the team. Are we seriously going to keep an underachiever for an extra year instead of getting a borderline 5 star cornerback? Carlo shouldn't come back. First, he's not good. Second, he's had problems with penalties and then the off the field incident (which wasn't a big deal but still not going to help anything). Carlo being a backup next year would have less of an impact than a 5 star corner would in 3 or 4 years. It's an easy decision.

 

[rtrn2glory]

carlo isn't elite, but calling him not good and un-important to the defense is pretty un-intelligent.

i'm not the biggest carlo fan, but he's had moments where he's shown he can play

imo Fox >Carlo, so if you don't keep fox you don't keep carlo

 

[koonja]

You know what kind of coaches pass on Mackenzie Alexander? Stupid ones. You know what Brian Kelly isn't? Stupid. Save a spot for him. Find a way to fit him on the team. Are we seriously going to keep an underachiever for an extra year instead of getting a borderline 5 star cornerback? Carlo shouldn't come back. First, he's not good. Second, he's had problems with penalties and then the off the field incident (which wasn't a big deal but still not going to help anything). Carlo being a backup next year would have less of an impact than a 5 star corner would in 3 or 4 years. It's an easy decision.

^The gospel.

 

[dublinirish]

You know what kind of coaches pass on Mackenzie Alexander? Stupid ones. You know what Brian Kelly isn't? Stupid. Save a spot for him. Find a way to fit him on the team. Are we seriously going to keep an underachiever for an extra year instead of getting a borderline 5 star cornerback? Carlo shouldn't come back. First, he's not good. Second, he's had problems with penalties and then the off the field incident (which wasn't a big deal but still not going to help anything). Carlo being a backup next year would have less of an impact than a 5 star corner would in 3 or 4 years. It's an easy decision.

if thats how you think then cut Heggie, Luke Massa etc right now and save on their scholly's for 2 years!

 

[koonja]

if thats how you think then cut Heggie, Luke Massa etc right now and save on their scholly's for 2 years!

That'd make our team a hell of a lot better, but we're ND not the SEC and we don't do that. BTW, you're comparing apples to brazilian nuts. Carlo has had his 4-years whereas Heggie has not. It's completely different. Carlo is owed nothing past his 4-years.

 

[Domina Nostra]

That's what the SEC does and that's why they're so great. Are you suggesting that cutting Massa and Heggie for Alexander/Redfield WOULDN'T improve the football team's future production?? Because it would. But we're ND and we don't do that. BTW, you're comparing apples to brazilian nuts. Carlo has had his 4-years whereas Heggie has not. It's completely different. Carlo is owed nothing past his 4-years.

Agree with your second point. However, chemistry is a huge factor in team success. If Heggie is working his butt off and got cut for a big-time recruit, who knows what would happen to the team's morale. People don't like to see it, but FSU and USC are great examples of too much of a good thing. Role players and hustle guys are a necessary part of the Championship mix, IMHO.

 

[Whiskeyjack]

You know what kind of coaches pass on Mackenzie Alexander? Stupid ones. You know what Brian Kelly isn't? Stupid. Save a spot for him. Find a way to fit him on the team. Are we seriously going to keep an underachiever for an extra year instead of getting a borderline 5 star cornerback? Carlo shouldn't come back. First, he's not good. Second, he's had problems with penalties and then the off the field incident (which wasn't a big deal but still not going to help anything). Carlo being a backup next year would have less of an impact than a 5 star corner would in 3 or 4 years. It's an easy decision.

Carlo comes back if Kelly wants him at MILB to "quarterback" the front-7. Regardless of how he's performed v. expectations, the kid has a ton of snaps under this belt. It's hard to let that kind of veteran leadership walk in exchange for potential.

That said, if Diaco thinks Grace is ready to fill in for Manti, then there's little reason to bring him back. Either way, I don't see him playing as a backup next year.

 

[felkey72]

Man sometimes i just wish we would lock recruiting profiles untill there was actually news. I hate coming here and hoping to read some news about Mac and get this garbage.

 

[BMT]

Unless you are talking a sure fire 5 star Nd would be well served bringing back Fox and possibly Calabrese. ILB is pretty tough to play at that level for any true frosh if any injuries which USUALLY do happen on some level. Also, they would be excellent for team leadership all "my people" kidding aside. They are playing pretty well this year and probably only get better and stronger in Kelllys system.

 

[woolybug25]

Man sometimes i just wish we would lock recruiting profiles untill there was actually news. I hate coming here and hoping to read some news about Mac and get this garbage.

What are you talking about? Everyone in this thread is specifically talking about Alexander and how we would get him in numbers wise. There is no new news on him, so the thread will be filled with discussion on his status. That's recruiting, homeboy. If you don't like how that works, then you should use google for your recruiting news, not an internet forum.

Sheesh.

 

[Whiskeyjack]

Man sometimes i just wish we would lock recruiting profiles untill there was actually news. I hate coming here and hoping to read some news about Mac and get this garbage.

Off-topic posts complaining about off-topic posts are both hypocritical and obnoxious.

Mack is very unlikely to commit anywhere before 2013, so if this sort of discussion pisses you off, stop clicking on this thread for a while.

 

[TheSunIsRising]

This 4 years of a 4 or 5 star versus 1 year of a 5th year like Carlo or Fox is past ridiculous.

It is:

4 years of an unproven but highly rated 4/5 star (who may or may not live up to his billing, and may or may not have character issues - not saying Mack does, but Lynch was a 'gotta take' prospect who turned into a locker-room 'distraction)

vs.

1 year of a proven, if not spectacular 5th year (who by all accounts is positive with his teammates) PLUS the first 3 years of an unknown 2014 recruit's career. Based on the way the recruiting momentum is going, that 2014 player could be as good as or even better than the 2013 4/5 star.

If Kelly does not take Alexander (or some other top prospect in 2013) and retains a 5th year player, it isn't like Kelly can't use that scholarship in the 2014 recruiting class. Now, he may not know specifically who that 'extra' player is in 2014, and it is entirely possible that the recruiting momentum dies after this year, but 2014 is already slated to be a low numbers class, and coaches like to get balance across the various years so that they can stay away from classes that are 13-15 players max.

If Kelly and Alford believe that the recruiting horizon is brightening for ND, they may well decide that it is the right thing to do to keep some of the defensive chemistry in 2013, and balance the class across the years. Both Te'o and KLM are gone after this year, as is Motta: the 3 guys most noted for 'leading' the defense. Kelly may decide he doesn't want to sacrifice some of the leadership/intangibles for pure talent, if he believes that he will be turning players away for 2014.

Classic 'bird in the hand' issue, but over multiple years, that Kelly is paid to balance

 

[koonja]

This 4 years of a 4 or 5 star versus 1 year of a 5th year like Carlo or Fox is past ridiculous.

It is:

4 years of an unproven but highly rated 4/5 star (who may or may not live up to his billing, and may or may not have character issues - not saying Mack does, but Lynch was a 'gotta take' prospect who turned into a locker-room 'distraction)

vs.

1 year of a proven, if not spectacular 5th year (who by all accounts is positive with his teammates) PLUS the first 3 years of an unknown 2014 recruit's career. Based on the way the recruiting momentum is going, that 2014 player could be as good as or even better than the 2013 4/5 star.

If Kelly does not take Alexander (or some other top prospect in 2013) and retains a 5th year player, it isn't like Kelly can't use that scholarship in the 2014 recruiting class. Now, he may not know specifically who that 'extra' player is in 2014, and it is entirely possible that the recruiting momentum dies after this year, but 2014 is already slated to be a low numbers class, and coaches like to get balance across the various years so that they can stay away from classes that are 13-15 players max.

If Kelly and Alford believe that the recruiting horizon is brightening for ND, they may well decide that it is the right thing to do to keep some of the defensive chemistry in 2013, and balance the class across the years. Both Te'o and KLM are gone after this year, as is Motta: the 3 guys most noted for 'leading' the defense. Kelly may decide he doesn't want to sacrifice some of the leadership/intangibles for pure talent, if he believes that he will be turning players away for 2014.

Classic 'bird in the hand' issue, but over multiple years, that Kelly is paid to balance

It's not even close how much more value there is in having Alexander/Redfield for FOUR years over Calabrese for ONE. It's not even debatable. Could these 4/5 star guys be a flop? I seriously doubt it. Have you seen their video????? While we're speculating 'what-if's', what if Carlo gets into another off-the field incident? What if he gets injured? It's not even a question.

You're very loyal to the players that are already here and I get that. But guess what? The violinists were loyal to the Titanic. They died. Loyalty has its limits.

 

[IrishLion]

What are you talking about? Everyone in this thread is specifically talking about Alexander and how we would get him in numbers wise. There is no new news on him, so the thread will be filled with discussion on his status. That's recruiting, homeboy. If you don't like how that works, then you should use google for your recruiting news, not an internet forum.

Sheesh.

Kind of like discussing Chris Brown and Davonte Neal's 40 times. No room for that junk in here.

 

[ab2cmiller]

This 4 years of a 4 or 5 star versus 1 year of a 5th year like Carlo or Fox is past ridiculous.

It is:

4 years of an unproven but highly rated 4/5 star (who may or may not live up to his billing, and may or may not have character issues - not saying Mack does, but Lynch was a 'gotta take' prospect who turned into a locker-room 'distraction)

vs.

1 year of a proven, if not spectacular 5th year (who by all accounts is positive with his teammates) PLUS the first 3 years of an unknown 2014 recruit's career. Based on the way the recruiting momentum is going, that 2014 player could be as good as or even better than the 2013 4/5 star.

Excellent point. It's not as simple as comparing 1 yr of a fifth yr senior vs 4 yrs of a 5 star. If recruiting is going good. It may mean simply delaying filling that slot with another top recruit the following year. Of course 5 stars don't grow on trees either. But keeping that 5th year senior could result in a win or two that you wouldn't have had otherwise, which keeps the momentum of the recruiting train going.

 

[koonja]

Excellent point. It's not as simple as comparing 1 yr of a fifth yr senior vs 4 yrs of a 5 star. If recruiting is going good. It may mean simply delaying filling that slot with another top recruit the following year. Of course 5 stars don't grow on trees either. But keeping that 5th year senior could result in a win or two that you wouldn't have had otherwise, which keeps the momentum of the recruiting train going.

A 'win or two' vs. 8-10 over the course of 4-years. That's how talented Alexander/Redfield are.

 

[Emcee77]

A 'win or two' vs. 8-10 over the course of 4-years. That's how talented Alexander/Redfield are.

Ugh this is incredibly frustrating to read. How do you still not see that you are looking at the question too narrowly.

The question isn't whether you'd rather have Carlo for one year or Mack for four, two wins next year or 8 over four years; we unquestionably have room for Mack right now. It's whether we have room in this class for Mack AND another elite DB, when we've already got two CBs committed. It depends on who will play ILB next year, and who will play CB in the coming years, and how you want to allocate your limited 2013 roster spots based on the answers to those questions. If another top 100 DB (Redfield, Luke, etc.) commits to ND tomorrow, maybe you decide having a seasoned veteran to lead your defense next year is more important than getting a second top 100 DB in this class when you've already got one, plus a freshman CB who is playing outstanding football.

Look at it this way: we have Zaire, a great QB for our system. Do you want another QB? No; we are full at QB. If we NEED Carlo at ILB next season, then we only have one more spot for a DB. How the staff handles this is a complex decision that depends on a lot of factors, some of which are still in play.

This isn't Alabama. We don't ride recruits out of town just because someone better came along. We aren't telling Butler and Kinlaw to take a hike if Mack wants in. If Mack wants in, he can jump in. If he dawdles, and we decide that Grace isn't ready to carry a starter's load next season, he may lose his spot to Luke or Redfield.

 

[ab2cmiller]

To me it boils down to who gives us a better chance of winning the national championship next year. Just like a baseball team chasing a World Series ring gives up a 5 star prospect in return for that player, that may not be an all-star, but could be the missing piece. I'm not saying Carlo or Fox are the missing piece, but it's not out of the realm of possibility. If we win the national championship next year after our great season this year, we would have 5 stars beating down our door.

 

[NewBrunswickIrish]

Ugh this is incredibly frustrating to read. How do you still not see that you are looking at the question too narrowly.

The question isn't whether you'd rather have Carlo for one year or Mack for four, two wins next year or 8 over four years; we unquestionably have room for Mack right now. It's whether we have room for Mack AND another elite DB. It depends on who will play ILB next year, and who will play CB in the coming years, and how you want to allocate your limited 2013 roster spots based on the answers to those questions. If another top 100 DB (Redfield, Luke, etc.) commits to ND tomorrow, maybe you decide having a seasoned veteran to lead your defense next year is more important than getting a second top 100 DB in this class when you've already got one, plus a freshman CB who is playing outstanding football.

Look at it this way: we have Zaire, a great QB for our system. Do you want another QB? No; we are full at QB. If we NEED Carlo at ILB next season, then we only have one more spot for a DB. How the staff handles this is a complex decision that depends on a lot of factors, some of which are still in play.

This isn't Alabama. We don't ride recruits out of town just because someone better came along. If Mack wants in, he can jump in. If he dawdles, and we decide that Grace isn't ready to carry a starter's load next season, he may lose his spot to Luke or Redfield.

Your comparison to qbs is way off. You only ever play one qb at a time (next ND will likely have 5 next year) but you play 4 DBs at once and sometimes up to six depending on the team. That means that you need atleast 4 starting calibre DBs on your roster but its usually a luxury to have two good starting calibre QBs.