UFOs, Paranormal, Pseudoscience Thread

[Irishdrunk]

You guys really believe in this?? Too funny.

 

[BleedBlueGold]

You guys really believe in this?? Too funny.

What is "this?" Which part?

And if the topic isn't for you, then why post in the thread?

 

[arahop]

What is "this?" Which part?

And if the topic isn't for you, then why post in the thread?

Exactly!

The " no way' crowd is my favorite. It's a religion all in itself.

It's the intrinsic ego that we are the master species in the Universe that has me bewildered.

We know so little about about science and physics but the ego thinks we know everything...... Untill that changes and becomes consensus.

Here's my favorite thing for people to chew on as far as science and quantum mechanics.

For the interdimensional or Time Altering/travel crowd.

"For those of us who believe in physics, the distinction between past, present and future is only a stubbornly persistent illusion"
Einstein

For the Simulation theory crowd
I consider people who can't even phathom that UAP/UFO a NPC ( non player character)



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[Giddyup]

 

[NDRock]

Always interesting to read the pushback on this topic. Usually devolves into, "Show me the little green man with a probe or else." Those views always willfully neglect actual data and evidence that proves UAPs are real, we just don't know WTF they are or who's behind the technology. Speculating on the latter is fine and good, but it's where the naysayers tend to live out their days because it's easier to debunk the little green man narrative, than to accept that something is happening in our skies that we can't explain.

So lets assume it's human. Perhaps adversarial. How is that any better? In fact, it should be more terrifying if China has this technology...something our top physicists can't explain or comprehend. What does that mean for our freedoms and the life we know as Americans? Or lets assume it's Skunkworks/Lockheed and they succeeded in creating a flying craft that defies the logic and physics that the rest of the world understands. That kind of victory in a "UAP Arms Race" changes everything as we know it, militarily. Why aren't we seeing this tested/used in any war or conflict? Why are we still spending billions on new fighter jets when we possess this technology? And why aren't we seeing this technology leak into other sectors? This kind of "limitless energy" source is a game changer. Why suppress it if we own it? If anything, boasting about our ownership of that kind of resource or weapon creates leverage. China can say it's theirs, or the U.S. can say it's ours to deter the other, but if either did own it, they'd be using it. Why isn't anyone at least trying to falsely claim it?

Bottom line, there's enough proof that "something" mechanically exists. We just don't have a clue what or who it is.

Note: Do I believe our government uses the topic as a smokescreen for diversion? Yes. But I also believe that UAPs are real, we don't know what they are and it's, in the very least, a matter of national security. Our government should take it seriously. What that means for declassifying information for us everyday folk, idk.

I don’t know, I feel like I’m more open minded than you. I’m open to any possibility, including man made answers. You seem to discount the answer that it’s human origin of some kind. And yes, I would like to see a little more proof before I believe there are aliens flying around. To each their own.

 

[arahop]

I don’t know, I feel like I’m more open minded than you. I’m open to any possibility, including man made answers. You seem to discount the answer that it’s human origin of some kind. And yes, I would like to see a little more proof before I believe there are aliens flying around. To each their own.

Ok so if I'm a skeptic of it and want to see proof( we all know I'm 99.9 certain there is absolutely something to it)

You know of one of one 1/1 species that can travel in space
Humans.
If we can do it why can't others not from our solar system.

We've sent missions passed our solar system

At that ratio there is a high probability that civilizations from other planets are traveling into space.

Like thousands if not millions of other space faring civilizations.

Now imagine us hundreds of thousands if not millions of years in the future ( humans will almost certainly self destruct IMO or be wiped out by a cataclysm IMO)

You honestly don't think we could figure out a way to advance and travel way out in the Cosmos.

Here's an exercise, Imagine you pre 1869 before the trans continental railroad. You would traverse the country over several months to get from the Midwest to the West in a wagon powered by horses.

I come to tell you in 1868
That I'm 100 years time or less
that not only could you fly in a machine that would take you from NYC to LA in 6 hours....

And we would develop a machine to get to the moon in just 3 days

How many people would said that was a possibility in 1868? The answer is probably zero and the ones that dreamt it would have been looney

What will we be capable in the next 100 years???

What will we be capable in 10,000

What will we be capable of 100k, 1million years??? Etc.

I'm not picking on you. I just think the consensus of humans isn't capable of thinking that far off because of ego and the fact that hardly anyone will still be alive in 100 years. Egotistical and short sighted are the consensus.

The general consensus nowadays is that we are not alone in the Universe.

People have a hard enough time believing in Aliens, let alone Interdimensional beings or entities, I believe there is something to both theories.






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[Giddyup]

There is almost certainly other life out there due to the trillions and trillions of galaxies present in space. But I have a greater respect for just the vast size that space is. We have figured out how to move a cm in the vast ocean. Assuming the travel to the next life is like going from America to Europe across the ocean.

 

[Irish#1]

‘Nothing like it’: Loeb on interstellar meteor found in ocean

Loeb, the head of the Galileo Project, says that the team is “very confident” the materials found aren’t from our solar system.

www.newsnationnow.com

 

[arahop]

‘Nothing like it’: Loeb on interstellar meteor found in ocean

Loeb, the head of the Galileo Project, says that the team is “very confident” the materials found aren’t from our solar system.

www.newsnationnow.com

Loeb is one of my favorite thinkers. He lives outside of the box and pisses on others boxes intellectually,. doesn't give a flip about what his peers think of him. Whatever a Patriot is to America, Loeb is to science. He will be a major player in the UAP field. He's trying to get tracking and video footage in space to collect data on the phenomenon outside of the Government/ Special Access Programs. It's going to take people like him to shed light on the subject

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[Irishdrunk]

What is "this?" Which part?

And if the topic isn't for you, then why post in the thread?

And the Easter Bunny???

 

[Irishdrunk]

‘Nothing like it’: Loeb on interstellar meteor found in ocean

Loeb, the head of the Galileo Project, says that the team is “very confident” the materials found aren’t from our solar system.

www.newsnationnow.com

Loeb is silly. Now he is playing with his space balls. Lol. People fall for his schtick! I had Israeli professors like this guy in Business School. They thought they were so smart with that Israeli accent they’re all bullshitters.

 

[Lberry]

Loeb is one of my favorite thinkers. He lives outside of the box and pisses on others boxes intellectually,. doesn't give a flip about what his peers think of him. Whatever a Patriot is to America, Loeb is to science. He will be a major player in the UAP field. He's trying to get tracking and video footage in space to collect data on the phenomenon outside of the Government/ Special Access Programs. It's going to take people like him to shed light on the subject

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His Last line is gold: "It's easier to find your own answers at the bottom of the ocean than it is from politicians in Washington".

 

[BleedBlueGold]

I don’t know, I feel like I’m more open minded than you. I’m open to any possibility, including man made answers. You seem to discount the answer that it’s human origin of some kind. And yes, I would like to see a little more proof before I believe there are aliens flying around. To each their own.

Not sure I follow...

My bottom line point is that I don't have a clue what it is or where it's from. My hypothetical paragraph was simply making a point that if present day humans (Governments) were in possession of this technology, I'm not so sure the status quo would just continue on as is (referring to fossil fuels/energy, war, etc). Whoever wins that arms race, wins the global game, imo. That all isn't to say that I don't believe it could be humans of a different time, etc. I honestly don't know what it is or where it's from. So I'm actually very open minded and I'm taking the path of "lets wait and see."

Could this all be a giant smoke screen? Maybe.
Could Lockheed actually develop something that is beyond revolutionary that changes the course of this civilization as we know it? Maybe.
Could this be something entirely otherworldly? Maybe.

I'll wait and see.

 

[Old Man Mike]

In honor of Clashmore Mike, who was always the very kindest to me, I thought I'd post something in the "new" Clashmore Commons. Unfortunately, I found I had nothing to say. But coincidentally I was cleaning up some pictures on my desktop which concerned my life with UFOs, so, with apologies for the egocentrism, I thought I'd place a few of them here in a couple of posts. This first set shows my research room, plus a set of my case drawings of a few distant object (>500 feet away) incidents. These demonstrate the extreme difficulty in getting science involved as it seems that the objects are deliberately diddled so as to never quite present the same outer appearance.

 

[Old Man Mike]

Here's a second (mercifully last) set of three pictures. The first shows a few of the two dozen North American researchers who meet at my old residence twice a year for a relaxed weekend of talk. I put this one in here because it shows my great friend, Robert Powell, an elite Austin engineer, who led the civilian analysis of the USN Nimitz radar film. This analysis is in the hands of both Congress and NASA now courtesy of our community. The second just shows me and a few researchers from across the years. Papagiannis was chair of astronomy at Boston U and a big SETI contributor. Zeidman was Allen Hynek's main colleague. Schmitt is the leading Roswell researcher, Velasco the former head of the French government UFO project. And i assume you know Sagan. The last is a photo from our attendance at the Rockefeller UFO Research Workshop, sometimes called the Sturrock workshop at Kykuit (Rockefeller estate.) Strand is the head of the Norway Hessdalen Lights project, Rodeghier the successor of Hynek at CUFOS, Haines the NASA engineer, and Velasco again. Many others such as Vallee, Puthoff, Pritchard (MIT), and several European experts were there. All this has been fun and intensely interesting.

 

[Giddyup]

What’s up with crop circles? These aliens are wasting a lot of valuable corn with no regard.

 

[arahop]

Here's a second (mercifully last) set of three pictures. The first shows a few of the two dozen North American researchers who meet at my old residence twice a year for a relaxed weekend of talk. I put this one in here because it shows my great friend, Robert Powell, an elite Austin engineer, who led the civilian analysis of the USN Nimitz radar film. This analysis is in the hands of both Congress and NASA now courtesy of our community. The second just shows me and a few researchers from across the years. Papagiannis was chair of astronomy at Boston U and a big SETI contributor. Zeidman was Allen Hynek's main colleague. Schmitt is the leading Roswell researcher, Velasco the former head of the French government UFO project. And i assume you know Sagan. The last is a photo from our attendance at the Rockefeller UFO Research Workshop, sometimes called the Sturrock workshop at Kykuit (Rockefeller estate.) Strand is the head of the Norway Hessdalen Lights project, Rodeghier the successor of Hynek at CUFOS, Haines the NASA engineer, and Velasco again. Many others such as Vallee, Puthoff, Pritchard (MIT), and several European experts were there. All this has been fun and intensely interesting. View attachment 3054265View attachment 3054266View attachment 3054267

Awesome stuff OMM! I probably wouldn't come out of that room for a very long time if I had the much material to read on the subject.

Sagan used to study the phenomenon but went to the dark side once he was ridiculed if I remember correctly. And that's where the Zeitgeist of science is paradoxical to the subject. Glad there are guys like Loeb and Gary Nolan that actually stick to scientific advancement where as egocentric knuckleheads like Neil Tyson just give opinions and off zero scientific research on the the subject.

Did you study the Varginha Brazil case?

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[arahop]

I read Hal's thesis on Ultra-terrestrial Models.

Semi related-Robert Bigelow who has put more private money into the investigation of the phenomenon, once did an interview where he said.

"They walk among us"

He also mentioned a study about the effects on mankind, and from his findings, regarding the subject, he said take every scandal in the history of mankind and times it by a million.



I just don't think people will really ever be ready to hear it. Especially in a day and age where 50 percent of people are presented with known facts and the other half will look at them and believe something entirely different.

In my research/obsession with the subject over the years, I think Aliens from another Star system is probably the least likely explanation, although I do believe that is a possibility, even a strong one. I personally feel it's something closer to Interdimensional/ Simulation, with the way these things react with our atmosphere.. I don't think any of us will live to see that proved or disproved

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[arahop]

Here is more insight from behind the scenes regarding the the Congressional hearings. This will help people understand the clearances and the "why" behind why Grush can't just release all the info. The bureaucracy behind the scenes.



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[LOVEMYIRISH]

You guys really believe in this?? Too funny.

It's interesting really.
I never believed in other civilizations visiting us, but I know its possible.
The idea that some or many have crashed here, that's silliness. Anyone who can travel between stars is using tech that we can't even begin to fathom. They would be shielded like we can't imagine.

Unless we've turned out to be the Cancun of the Milky Way and we are only seeing 1 of 1 million visitors crashing...then I struggle with believing it

 

[GATTACA!]

It's interesting really.
I never believed in other civilizations visiting us, but I know its possible.
The idea that some or many have crashed here, that's silliness. Anyone who can travel between stars is using tech that we can't even begin to fathom. They would be shielded like we can't imagine.

Unless we've turned out to be the Cancun of the Milky Way and we are only seeing 1 of 1 million visitors crashing...then I struggle with believing it

Or some of the aliens sending ships here are from the Russia of their planet and they just suck at it lol.

 

[LOVEMYIRISH]

Or some of the aliens sending ships here are from the Russia of their planet and they just suck at it lol.

THAT would make sense actually.
"Hey comrade we are gonna send you across the Galaxy to go meet some backward bi-peds..."

*drinks local hooch"

"LOVE IT!!! HOLD MY DRINK!!!"

*crash*

 

[arahop]

It's interesting really.
I never believed in other civilizations visiting us, but I know its possible.
The idea that some or many have crashed here, that's silliness. Anyone who can travel between stars is using tech that we can't even begin to fathom. They would be shielded like we can't imagine.

Unless we've turned out to be the Cancun of the Milky Way and we are only seeing 1 of 1 million visitors crashing...then I struggle with believing it

Here's the thing that people need to understand. And you will most likely have a hard time wrapping your head around this.

It might not be Aliens. But other Intelligent civilizations out in the the Universe certainly are far more advanced then we are.

Your take is a predetermined soundbyte and an opinion that you adopted without research, study, or much thought at all.

A Russian space craft just crashed on the moon last week. To prove your opinion wrong


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[Old Man Mike]

This will be a boring comment, but I think still a little important:
A. I don't think that much of anything that Arahop seems to believe about the causal agencies behind the UFO phenomenon is supported by evidence of any substantial kind, but the actual research hypothesis (that "advanced aerotech of which we cannot match its flight characteristics is observed operating in our air spaces") IS overwhelmingly supported;
B. The statement that Arahop often makes "That just because 'you' cannot conceive of a reason or way that something can happen is NO reason to deny the data observed" IS EXACTLY SCIENTIFIC, and that anyone disagreeing with him on THAT statement is a violator of the philosophy of science ... and by the way hugely arrogant about their own restricted view of the universe. He is on the side of the angels here.

Our friend Arahop is precisely in line with scientific method when he reminds us not to jump to a lot of assumptions about what is and is not possible. At the same time, he is very "enthusiastic" in wanting to arrive at basic answers himself, and, as with every speculator I have ever met, allows that enthusiasm to soften his critical analysis of claims made by persons with less clear scientific philosophies than himself. This is a VERY difficult subject not to give in to and allow oneself the luxury of some "deeper answers" to quiet the restlessness of the soul. I have seen long time UFO researchers go every way, both selling-the-ranch for fantasyland and becoming nasty scared skeptics. Patience is hard. Jumping beyond the data is the Devil's work here. The only grounded position here is, paradoxically, child-like open-eyed wonder at a true mystery. ........... all of us may speculate as one will ..... just don't talk too loud about one's "conclusions", since there shouldn't be any.

 

[arahop]

This will be a boring comment, but I think still a little important:
A. I don't think that much of anything that Arahop seems to believe about the causal agencies behind the UFO phenomenon is supported by evidence of any substantial kind, but the actual research hypothesis (that "advanced aerotech of which we cannot match its flight characteristics is observed operating in our air spaces") IS overwhelmingly supported;
B. The statement that Arahop often makes "That just because 'you' cannot conceive of a reason or way that something can happen is NO reason to deny the data observed" IS EXACTLY SCIENTIFIC, and that anyone disagreeing with him on THAT statement is a violator of the philosophy of science ... and by the way hugely arrogant about their own restricted view of the universe. He is on the side of the angels here.

Our friend Arahop is precisely in line with scientific method when he reminds us not to jump to a lot of assumptions about what is and is not possible. At the same time, he is very "enthusiastic" in wanting to arrive at basic answers himself, and, as with every speculator I have ever met, allows that enthusiasm to soften his critical analysis of claims made by persons with less clear scientific philosophies than himself. This is a VERY difficult subject not to give in to and allow oneself the luxury of some "deeper answers" to quiet the restlessness of the soul. I have seen long time UFO researchers go every way, both selling-the-ranch for fantasyland and becoming nasty scared skeptics. Patience is hard. Jumping beyond the data is the Devil's work here. The only grounded position here is, paradoxically, child-like open-eyed wonder at a true mystery. ........... all of us may speculate as one will ..... just don't talk too loud about one's "conclusions", since there shouldn't be any.

So I've been very clear that I'm open to almost any speculative theory on what the phenomenon could consist of. Extraterrestrial, Time Travel, Interdimensional, A simulation ( they have access to programs that we don't,) crypto terrestrial, our creators, etc.

So the data points to something is conclusively going on, that defies and absolutely bewilders us, like ants on a hill.
Our scientific aptitude, understanding, material science, is so far behind.
OMM it would take hundreds of thousands of years, if ever, to just stand behind the scientific method without hypothesizing.

I know I don't need to educate you about why or what it could be. In all your years of research I'm semi amazed that you don't seem to have much of a hypothesi at all, or at some that you believe enough to share.

I don't think it's Angels or Demons. The "Devils" work was convincing billions of people that religion and their Gods are the ones to be worshipped and believed

I can't think of something that has been more dividing in the history of mankind as religion.

Maybe the devil created it, but that would be a hypothesis. This isn't about theology though.

It's about the fact that the most important information/ to humans in the history of mankind is behind a curtain because of bullshit like religion and conventional science.


This very topic, which by the way, has way more evidence as being real than any religion, or our conventional science can account for.

I apologize if I get sick of the same ole "if aliens could make it here from light years away, they would never crash".

People need to be open to the fact a lot of data, that I'm sure you have come by,
Points to things way more mind blowing than the Alien Hypothesis.

The stigmas of science and religion has been beyond detrimental to the subject. Frankly, I don't hide behind those curtains. But I understand why you do. I'm not afraid or sensitive to the ridicule.

I believe in my research that there is undoubtedly something unexplainable to us mere humans... something is going on.

BTW. I've never offered conclusions on the subject as to what they are or where they come from. I'm open minded and just pass a long some of the theories I think there could be something to. But not conclusions. So I would appreciate it you don't put me on the wrong side of that. I don't toe the line behind everything known science.

Science is proved 100 percent correct and then years later wrong all the time.

Our science behind the universe and space itself is 99 percent hypothesis taken as absolute fact. I'm surprised you haven't come to that conclusion yourself. I appreciate your scientific approach but it's funny to me that the people who have advanced awareness about the topic, you seem to have a hard time considering.

The ego involved that humans and whatever said religion are Masters of the Universe and all dimensions is something that I don't subscribe to.... But that is unpopular for people to hear. Ego is something else






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[arahop]

Correct me if I'm wrong, per the scientific method

After we find out that something is proven to exist, the next steps are to find out the What, How, why and where. See it all starts with hypotheticals


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[arahop]

Let Me ask you this OMM,

If we can now not scientifically prove things and accomplish ourselves things like; traveling vast distances at light speed or faster. Getting to another solar system and being able to transfer said scientific data.

Without better understanding of gravity, dark matter, physics, quantum physics, time travel, how many dimensions there are, how many dimensions are even detectable to us, how many do we have physical access to. Etc,

How would we substantially be able to prove it.. if our science and understanding doesn't have the aptitude or understand of the construction and everything thing that might make those ideas plausible or how to measure them on our limited scientific scope?

We wouldn't be able to define it unless we were capable of understanding it ourselves scientifically speaking. It doesn't make it any less true or possible

To me you're saying that if we can't hold it up to our current scientific method substantially. It therefore can't be proven. What if another cosmic or dimensional intelligence has.

How would one substantially prove those things right now if they are indeed possible? Now ask yourself if they were true, how could we prove it by our current model without the knowledge or calculations to do so?

We are missing lots of information.amd variables.

It seems that you came to the conclusion that the phenomenon has/is taking place.

But you dare not theorize the nature/how,what,where and why of the phenomenon.

I disagree with your interpretation of substantial.





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[arahop]

I don't feel emotional about it all. Since I don't believe in the same religion or worship the same God as you or, of dare question religion, we can't thinl about possible scenarios of the phenomenon? Something came along called the Internet. So I've most likely read and gone over just as much material as you. I haven't studied it in your same stage scientifically but you are no closer to answers than anyone else who's studied it. So don't throw around 50 years of study and be pompous about it. Personally, I think science has probably hindered you in that capacity.

And to say science hasn't had a detrimental stigma to the subject and religion for that matter, is complete nonsense whether you admit or not

Once you have the data that you need that it exists, the next step is the where, how, and why of it. Its the next step of the process. Thanks for all of your research and I mean that sincerely. I'm past the does it exist portion of the stage. And for the awareness of those around me who are willing to entertain that it happening.

For the record, I don't have a hatred of religion, although I do question the validity of it. And what religion is correct and what has been altered in the texts. I mean only one religion can be true if I take what the several religions have written. Academically one doesn't go to college to major in UFO studies last I checked.

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[LOVEMYIRISH]

So the data points to something is conclusively going on, that defies and absolutely bewilders us, like ants on a hill.
Our scientific aptitude, understanding, material science, is so far behind.



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Could well be. I am open to it, but if its extra-dimensional, then we wait...not much we can do beyond that.

not unlike Flatland

Flatland - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

 

[Henges24]

Reddit - Dive into anything

reddit.com

Reddit - Dive into anything

reddit.com

Old video from Ruzzia that was “debunked”. Creatures looks very similar.

Reddit - Dive into anything

reddit.com

Not saying any of this is legit. Only sharing interesting information stumbled upon on Reddit this AM.