Quarterback research

PJWhitfield

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Of Notre Dame's 11 national championships, 10 had a talented quarterback who was a junior or senior -- leaders such as Joe Montana, Johnny Lujack, Tom Clements and Tony Rice. One had a talented sophomore -- Terry Hanratty in 1966. It seems like Coach Kelly has a tough choice. Crist has thrown 314 passes. Reese has thrown 164. Both are kind of thin in the experience department. Any thoughts on Kelly's choice?
 

ACamp1900

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and each quarter back named had absolutely FLITHY defenses...
 

jason_h537

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QB's often get too much credit for wins and losses. If we win it is going to be because of our D.
 

GreatGolson

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ya its all about the D, BK is capable of running an efficient offense but ppl will be afraid of our defense
 

BGIF

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Of Notre Dame's 11 national championships, 10 had a talented quarterback who was a junior or senior -- leaders such as Joe Montana, Johnny Lujack, Tom Clements and Tony Rice. One had a talented sophomore -- Terry Hanratty in 1966. It seems like Coach Kelly has a tough choice. Crist has thrown 314 passes. Reese has thrown 164. Both are kind of thin in the experience department. Any thoughts on Kelly's choice?

It always help to have veteran QBs but it helps more when you have a talented, veteran QB surrounded by talented veteran team. ACamp hit on defense but these teams were very good on both sides of the ball and had very good coaches.

The '24 team had the 4 Horsemen, a strong supporting cast and a coach named Rockne. The recruiting class of '46 was undefeated and won 3 National Championships. Their coach Frank Leahy had already won an NC in '43 before he went to war in the Pacific. Experience, Johnny Lujack was 23 or 24 when he QB's ND to an ND and a Heisman. Most of those teams were older, experienced guys.

Most of the players on the '66 squad in "The Game of the Century" went on to play in the NFL. But Hanratty wasn't the QB in that game against #2 MSU nor against #10 USC who ND routed 51-0 the next week. Soph Hanratty was the #1 QB and started the MSU but was knocked out in the 1st Quarter. Sophomore Coley O'Brien QB'd the rest of the game and USC the next week. Neither Hanratty nor O'Brien played as freshman. Freshman were ineligible back then. O'Brien was also newly diagnosed diabetic. The trainers fed him candy bars during the MSU game to regulate his blood sugar. Hanratty wasn't the only one knocked out the game. All-American RB didn't play due to an injured shoulder sustained in a fall getting off the train in East Lansing. All-American George Goeddecke like Hanratty went down early in the game and sat it out. Their backups were more than capable. Defensively the Irish D held the #2 team in the nation to 1 yd rushing in the second half. The shutout the next week of USC was ND's 6th in a 10 game season. Beat 4 Top 10 teams shutting out 2 of them. Experience? 16 of ND's guys made somebody's All-American team including 7 that were 1st Team selections.

The '77 team only had 7 AA's with 3 First Team selections. The team included legends Ross Browner, Ken MacAfee, Willie Fry, and Bob Golic. Montana never got AA honors he was only a 50% passer.

The '88 team was also deep on both sides of the ball. Heck, Stonebreaker, Rice, Lyght, Ismail, Bolcar, Alm, Stams. Most of the AA's were on the Defense. 21 of the 22 starters played in the NFL. Rice never did.


Concerned about experience and Crist's 314 attempts and Reese's 164?.

Lujack was out of college in '44 and '45 fighting a war. He was a backup on the '43 NC team.

Hanratty and O'Brien has zero attempts when the '66 season started. Hanratty had a 53% completion rate.

Clements had 162 attempts when the '73 season started.He completed 51% of them.

Montana had 66 attempts before the '77 season completing less than 43% of his passes.

Rice had attempted 35 passes before the '88 season, completing less than 43%.

In the '88 season, Rice only threw 138 times with 50% completion.

For his career Rice threw about 50 more balls than Crist has in, what, one full season of PT. He had less completions in 3 years than Crist has now.

Great talent, great depth, great execution, and great coaching is the formula for ND chamionships.
 

Veer option

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and each quarter back named had absolutely FLITHY defenses...

QB's often get too much credit for wins and losses. If we win it is going to be because of our D.

Thank you for reading my mind.

You can have an average QB and win championships, as long as the defense is wickedly good. Take for instance the 2009 Alabama team. Their defense was ridiculously good, and McElroy their QB who is often described by the en vogue term of "game manager" did enough with the offense namely giving the ball to Ingram and Richardson to win the NC.
 

Rocket89

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It always help to have veteran QBs but it helps more when you have a talented, veteran QB surrounded by talented veteran team. ACamp hit on defense but these teams were very good on both sides of the ball and had very good coaches.

The '24 team had the 4 Horsemen, a strong supporting cast and a coach named Rockne. The recruiting class of '46 was undefeated and won 3 National Championships. Their coach Frank Leahy had already won an NC in '43 before he went to war in the Pacific. Experience, Johnny Lujack was 23 or 24 when he QB's ND to an ND and a Heisman. Most of those teams were older, experienced guys.

Most of the players on the '66 squad in "The Game of the Century" went on to play in the NFL. But Hanratty wasn't the QB in that game against #2 MSU nor against #10 USC who ND routed 51-0 the next week. Soph Hanratty was the #1 QB and started the MSU but was knocked out in the 1st Quarter. Sophomore Coley O'Brien QB'd the rest of the game and USC the next week. Neither Hanratty nor O'Brien played as freshman. Freshman were ineligible back then. O'Brien was also newly diagnosed diabetic. The trainers fed him candy bars during the MSU game to regulate his blood sugar. Hanratty wasn't the only one knocked out the game. All-American RB didn't play due to an injured shoulder sustained in a fall getting off the train in East Lansing. All-American George Goeddecke like Hanratty went down early in the game and sat it out. Their backups were more than capable. Defensively the Irish D held the #2 team in the nation to 1 yd rushing in the second half. The shutout the next week of USC was ND's 6th in a 10 game season. Beat 4 Top 10 teams shutting out 2 of them. Experience? 16 of ND's guys made somebody's All-American team including 7 that were 1st Team selections.

The '77 team only had 7 AA's with 3 First Team selections. The team included legends Ross Browner, Ken MacAfee, Willie Fry, and Bob Golic. Montana never got AA honors he was only a 50% passer.

The '88 team was also deep on both sides of the ball. Heck, Stonebreaker, Rice, Lyght, Ismail, Bolcar, Alm, Stams. Most of the AA's were on the Defense. 21 of the 22 starters played in the NFL. Rice never did.


Concerned about experience and Crist's 314 attempts and Reese's 164?.

Lujack was out of college in '44 and '45 fighting a war. He was a backup on the '43 NC team.

Hanratty and O'Brien has zero attempts when the '66 season started. Hanratty had a 53% completion rate.

Clements had 162 attempts when the '73 season started.He completed 51% of them.

Montana had 66 attempts before the '77 season completing less than 43% of his passes.

Rice had attempted 35 passes before the '88 season, completing less than 43%.

In the '88 season, Rice only threw 138 times with 50% completion.

For his career Rice threw about 50 more balls than Crist has in, what, one full season of PT. He had less completions in 3 years than Crist has now.

Great talent, great depth, great execution, and great coaching is the formula for ND chamionships.

That was some good stuff, thanks for that!
 

rtrn2glory

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Thank you for reading my mind.

You can have an average QB and win championships, as long as the defense is wickedly good. Take for instance the 2009 Alabama team. Their defense was ridiculously good, and McElroy their QB who is often described by the en vogue term of "game manager" did enough with the offense namely giving the ball to Ingram and Richardson to win the NC.

Regardless, teams do not win championships without good qb's either. Admit, they both piggy back off of each other. Steelers are the perfect example. they didn't win anything till they got Big Ben and they had dominating defenses throughout the 90s, but couldn't get it done till they got Ben.
 

Butchie

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As long as health is not a concern - Crist returns to lead us further. If his health delays him too long in the spring or is still a problem in the fall . . . . the voodoo child will emerge - HENDRIX!
 

rtrn2glory

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Hendrix is going to have to be a complete stud (i'm talking all american stud) to come in and overtake the guy who started half the year and the guy who led us to four wins at the end of the year...i'm not on the bandwagon yet, i think experience is a very valuable asset in big time college football.
 

GreatGolson

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I'm on the Hendrix wagon as well. I know I'll get slammed for saying this, but I think Golson ends up at WR....

for the last time, people who havent seen enough of him just assume hes a running qb, that is incorrect, he is a very talented passer who, IF NEED BE, can run effectively. In his position at MB he was forced to run often, however very few of his plays were designed runs, he is not a "run first QB" like Tebow or others, he is a skilled QB and i guarantee he is one of the first offensive players BK talks about on signing day.
 

rtrn2glory

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I'll agree...i watched his video and really there is not a lot of him running on the film. Ball does explode out of his hand and gets down the field in a hurry. i don't foresee a move to wr, he would transfer before that happens imo.
 

jason_h537

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for the last time, people who havent seen enough of him just assume hes a running qb, that is incorrect, he is a very talented passer who, IF NEED BE, can run effectively. In his position at MB he was forced to run often, however very few of his plays were designed runs, he is not a "run first QB" like Tebow or others, he is a skilled QB and i guarantee he is one of the first offensive players BK talks about on signing day.

Completely agree. Watching Golson he is a QB with athleticism. I feel people do this a lot. On II people kept asking if Massa or Hendrix could play TE or OLB, and if Deion Walker could play safety. Everyone was shot down because it is easy to look at their measurables and daydream but in watching them they are clearly not suited for a position change.

Golson is not switching and the staff certainly does not want him to
 

Rocket89

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hendrix%202.jpg


His interviews won't make much sense, but he'll perform like a star on the stage.
 

Riddickulous

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Here's how I think it's gonna go down...

Scenario #1: Dayne Crist is healthy.
Result: Dayne Crist starts.

Scenario #2: Dayne Crist is not healthy.
Result: Tommy Rees starts.

Scenario #3: Andrew Hendrix leapfrogs everyone.
Result: Broken hands in the receiving corps due to Hendrix's incredible arm.

Ranked in order of how likely I think they are.
 

SLCIRISH

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Lets be honest they won those NC in a different era, football is different with kids going pro early and coaching changes, young QBs can win.
 

TDHeysus

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Scenario #1: Dayne Crist is healthy.
Result: Dayne Crist starts.

Scenario #2: Dayne Crist is not healthy.
Result: Tommy Rees starts.

I think it will most likely go down like this as well. IF Rees does get in there, I have confidence that he'll do the job.
 
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