Quarterback Controversy 2016

woolybug25

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Heard MZ was humble, down to earth, and driven. Heard that from Josh Dobbs who is incredibly humble and down to earth. You're probably right in that it just depends who you talk to. I'm sure MZ went through some ups and downs last year. It was pretty much a roller coaster for him (EG drama, starting and winning, getting hurt, seeing the success with DK). I'd have to think they both are busting ass, doing, and saying all the right things right now.

What's funny is that during the season, Kizer gave a lot of love for Malik and talked openly about how good of a guy and mentor he was. Malik seems to have mutual feeling for Kizer as well. Could it be possible... If I dare say... That they are both good dudes battling for one of the highest jobs in college football? One where fans pick sides and the eventual "whispers" they begin to hear are just echoes of their own voice?
 

Irish YJ

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What's funny is that during the season, Kizer gave a lot of love for Malik and talked openly about how good of a guy and mentor he was. Malik seems to have mutual feeling for Kizer as well. Could it be possible... If I dare say... That they are both good dudes battling for one of the highest jobs in college football? One where fans pick sides and the eventual "whispers" they begin to hear are just echoes of their own voice?

I'm putting my money on both being good dudes. They are human though, and both want to play. Tough situation for anyone.
 

stlnd01

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Could it be possible... If I dare say... That they are both good dudes battling for one of the highest jobs in college football? One where fans pick sides and the eventual "whispers" they begin to hear are just echoes of their own voice?

No. That could never be possible at all.
 

Irish2155

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I'm putting my money on both being good dudes. They are human though, and both want to play. Tough situation for anyone.

Haven't read through this but I'd put my money on Kiser winning the Heisman....
 

IrishLax

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I've stayed out of this thread for awhile because I think we can win with either recruit. Have to comment now that so many people are saying "I heard Kizer is viewed as a d-bag", etc. etc. I don't have a lot of connections but I talked with a couple of people from the team after reading this and they said it was the opposite. They said Malik became a prima donna once Golson left and that DeShone is very humble and respectful to everyone on the team. Basically it all depends on who you talk to.

Great post, really gets to the core of why I really hesitated to post what I did originally. It came up organically in the discussion of "who is a better leader?"... but I knew that what was a football question was pretty quickly going to get warped. So I'm going to opine for a bit on the general discussion we're all having.

We went really quickly from "heard Malik is a better leader, some get rubbed the wrong way by Kizer's leadership style" to "Kizer is a douche"... and that's just not fair, and it's not right. First of all, I'm pretty uncomfortable talking about a kid's personality like that from the anonymity of the internet. Second, someone phrased it perfectly earlier when they said "he's no Jimmy Clausen."

There's a really big difference between analyzing who has the best leadership traits (similar to how we might discuss "who has the better deep ball?") and trying to dissect the popularity of a guy we don't know in a non-homogeneous group of people we don't know. It's not about someone being "nice" or a "cool guy" when you see them around campus... it's about who -- in practice and in games -- best inspires the other 84 guys to give maximum effort and execute to the highest of their ability. And that's just one variable in a complex equation that ultimately yields the answer to who should be starting in Austin, TX in week one.

It doesn't matter if Tim Tebow is the greatest leader ever if he can't run the offense and doesn't have a competent arm. It doesn't matter if Cam Newton "rubs some people the wrong way" because he is "cocky" if he's able to be a dominant force of nature on the field. So we're probably dissecting the leadership aspect a bit too much given that both Kizer and Zaire are by all accounts perfectly fine human beings, and in vacuum each would probably be more than competent leaders of the offense. It's not like one of the options is a Jimmy Clausen type that will inspire weekly team mutinies.
 

dad4aa

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Great post, really gets to the core of why I really hesitated to post what I did originally. It came up organically in the discussion of "who is a better leader?"... but I knew that what was a football question was pretty quickly going to get warped. So I'm going to opine for a bit on the general discussion we're all having.

We went really quickly from "heard Malik is a better leader, some get rubbed the wrong way by Kizer's leadership style" to "Kizer is a douche"... and that's just not fair, and it's not right. First of all, I'm pretty uncomfortable talking about a kid's personality like that from the anonymity of the internet. Second, someone phrased it perfectly earlier when they said "he's no Jimmy Clausen."

There's a really big difference between analyzing who has the best leadership traits (similar to how we might discuss "who has the better deep ball?") and trying to dissect the popularity of a guy we don't know in a non-homogeneous group of people we don't know. It's not about someone being "nice" or a "cool guy" when you see them around campus... it's about who -- in practice and in games -- best inspires the other 84 guys to give maximum effort and execute to the highest of their ability. And that's just one variable in a complex equation that ultimately yields the answer to who should be starting in Austin, TX in week one.

It doesn't matter if Tim Tebow is the greatest leader ever if he can't run the offense and doesn't have a competent arm. It doesn't matter if Cam Newton "rubs some people the wrong way" because he is "cocky" if he's able to be a dominant force of nature on the field. So we're probably dissecting the leadership aspect a bit too much given that both Kizer and Zaire are by all accounts perfectly fine human beings, and in vacuum each would probably be more than competent leaders of the offense. It's not like one of the options is a Jimmy Clausen type that will inspire weekly team mutinies.

Great post Lax. I agree and feel we have a great shot to win no matter who is named starter. I also believe both the "non-starter" QB and the rest of the team will support the decision and there will not be a locker room issue. These guys want to win a NC and will do whatever it takes.
 

irishandy

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Concerning the leadership aspect of this thread, IMO you cannot coach leadership. Someone has to step up and take that role upon themselves.

I don't think ND has truly had a good leader since the 2012 team with defensive guys like Manti and KLM. They brought out the best of the whole defensive unit and played for each other.

Over the past few years I think the ND football team has become more of just a team, they are brothers, and they all play for each other (look at last year with all of the injuries).

Malik and DeShone can both be great leaders and the team would rally behind both of them.
 

ickythump1225

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Does Kizer "rub some people the wrong way?" Perhaps (I don't know, I have no 'connections') but sometimes leaders rub people the wrong way.

Putting that aside, I think we can win with either kid but I'm a Kizer backer. Kizer thoroughly impressed me last season and he is now the most experienced QB on the roster (in terms of playing time). I'm still not sold on MZ being able to run the whole offense as effectively because I'm not sold on his ability to throw accurately or "quarterback" effectively over the course of a 12 game season.

Kizer is bigger and is truer QB but he is still mobile. Is he as mobile as MZ? No, but I think he brings so many other things to the table.

That being said I won't lose faith or be pouty if MZ wins out, if he is better, he is better. What I don't want to see is a 2 QB rotation. Pick a horse and ride'em.
 
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