Politics

[tadman95]

We are currently at ~16 trillion in debt.

Why is there so much strife caused over this?

https://sphotos-b.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ash4/408259_478109905540157_656090198_n.jpg

Curious as to why you don't seem to be as offended by George II, or George I, or Reagan who all left office with record deficits?

Is there any indication that either party has a high road on financial responsibility?

 

[IrishMoore1]

It was tweeted out by his admin and later deleted. Mentioned "offending Muslims and their religion." Isn't it cute that when they happily slit our throats and put it on Al Jazeera, it's our fault? And when some whack job makes fun of Mohammed

Why won't our pres. utter the words "muslim terrorist" and why does he support a mosque at the world trade center?

don't give me that religious freedom BS, either. there's 120 mosques in NYC to worship. muslims don't have a 1000 year history of building towers on their conquers, do they???

Obama gave the order to kill ***** bin ***** who is now dead as a result. I don't see anything apologetic about that. You should also stop generalizing about Muslims because it makes you look ignorant and bigoted. You surely have a lot of growing up to do if that's how you view people who are culturally/religiously different from you.

 

[Ultimate Penn St. Hater]

Any fans of Ryan Harris here? He's a practicing Muslim and a great ND guy.

 

[Polish Leppy 22]

So there is no apology. You are just mad that I asked you to prove something that doesn't exist. Then you change the subject because you know you are wrong. I will play along, the Mosque is not a Mosque, it is a community center. And it is not at ground zero, its is a few blocks away from ground zero. You see there is already a mosque there. Also, religious freedom isn't BS, it is a protected right in this country.

US Embassy in Cairo quietly deletes its ‘we stand by our condemnation’ tweet; Update: More deleted tweets! | Twitchy

1. there is your apology, not from the president, but from the embassy who takes orders from the pres.

2. I added to the subject, didn't change it.

3. i love religious freedom, but find it grossly inappropriate to build another "community center" where 3000 innocent Americans died.

if someone blew up your family on 41st street, how would you feel if they built their new "community center" on 43rd??

This guy and his "fundamental transformation of America" sucks and isn't going to get better. I pray for you, for all of us, that he gets the boot. Because if he gets re-elected and he doesn't have another re-election to worry about, God help us all. He will be completely unhinged.

 

[Polish Leppy 22]

In any case, it's your vote not mine. If you're happy with $5 trillion in debt in 4 years, 8% unemployment for 43 months, record number on food stamps, household incomes declined 5% in 4 years...hey by all means, he's your guy.

And don't forget business owners..."You didn't build that."

 

[Polish Leppy 22]

How about Ryan saying he didn't have time to explain the Romney/Ryan tax plan and the numbers? If any aplogies are to be made, Romney and Ryan should apologize to America for running the most awful campaign in history.

When did that happen? And if their campaign bothers you so much, you can vote for Mr. Social Justice and Redistribution.

The only people they owe apologies to (if they lose) are the 23 million currently unemployed Americans who will continue to struggle because our president has no clue about private sector growth and job creation, only government growth. Only government can do good.

 

[IrishJayhawk]

3. i love religious freedom, but find it grossly inappropriate to build another "community center" where 3000 innocent Americans died.

if someone blew up your family on 41st street, how would you feel if they built their new "community center" on 43rd??

I disagree with much of your post, but I'm going to focus here.

Who, may I ask, is "they."

You've made an assumption that the people who are building the community center are the same as those who flew the planes into the trade center (or gave the order, etc). That's just untrue. To quote Bogtrotter...it's a massive "conflation." You assume that ALL Muslims are terrorists. Simply not true.

 

[IrishJayhawk]

When did that happen? And if their campaign bothers you so much, you can vote for Mr. Social Justice and Redistribution.

The only people they owe apologies to (if they lose) are the 23 million currently unemployed Americans who will continue to struggle because our president has no clue about private sector growth and job creation, only government growth. Only government can do good.

In the last few days.

Ryan: 'I Don't Have Time' to Explain Tax Plan - Chris Wallace says, 'You haven't given me the math'

Thank you for your permission. I will vote for Mr. Social Justice (as if that's some sort of pejorative term).

 

[Polish Leppy 22]

I'm not running the campaign, but my guess is they're going to have to address everything during the debates.

 

[Irish Houstonian]

...I will vote for Mr. Social Justice (as if that's some sort of pejorative term).

If he continues our Debt Spiral, there will be no Social Justice for anyone.

 

[Downinthebend]

Curious as to why you don't seem to be as offended by George II, or George I, or Reagan who all left office with record deficits?

Is there any indication that either party has a high road on financial responsibility?

I wasn't aware (or didn't care) of politics/wasn't alive respectively for those presidents. I agree with you that there is no indication that either party has a high road on financial responsibility, which is why I don't understand why Republicans and Democrats are quibbling over their fairly similar budgets.

 

[IrishJayhawk]

I'm not running the campaign, but my guess is they're going to have to address everything during the debates.

Will you reply to my comments about your assertions regarding all Muslims? Maybe you didn't see them.

 

[enrico514]

Both choices are good awful but Romney will at least get rid of Bernake and that alone would be reason enough to vote for him. Unfortunately, like Obama, he doesn't care about the middle class and the US will not get out of this mess as long as it's middle class is under attack.

 

[Irish Houstonian]

Both choices are good awful but Romney will at least get rid of Bernake and that alone would be reason enough to vote for him. Unfortunately, like Obama, he doesn't care about the middle class and the US will not get out of this mess as long as it's middle class is under attack.

Very true. Helicopter Ben's inflation will hit the poor and middle class more than anyone, but at least the stock market's happy...

 

[tadman95]

I wasn't aware (or didn't care) of politics/wasn't alive respectively for those presidents. I agree with you that there is no indication that either party has a high road on financial responsibility, which is why I don't understand why Republicans and Democrats are quibbling over their fairly similar budgets.

Fair enough, I shouldn't have assumed anything, my apologies. It's a peeve of mine that people who do remember the times have such selective memories about responsible financial management.

 

[Quinntastic]

In any case, it's your vote not mine. If you're happy with $5 trillion in debt in 4 years, 8% unemployment for 43 months, record number on food stamps, household incomes declined 5% in 4 years...hey by all means, he's your guy.

And don't forget business owners..."You didn't build that."

This quote is entirely out of context. Perhaps you only saw the video clip on FoxNews (a horrible excuse for a "news" organization), or perhaps you're just plain ignorant, but the President didn't merely say "You didn't build that". The whole point of that speech was to outline America as a community. People helping people achieve their goals. For example, I wouldn't have been able to graduate college without great professors. I wouldn't be a great Microbiologist without great mentors in my laboratory. I wouldn't have been able to graduate high school, middle school, or grade school without great teachers, school counselors and friends. I wouldn't be able to have compassion for my fellow man without great parents as role models. We are social creatures who learn from others.

Here's another example: Someone doesn't just start a business completely alone. You start with an idea. Where did you get the idea? Did you discuss it with anyone else? Did anyone give you encouragement or advice? Did you go to the government for a start up loan? Did you go to a private company for a start up loan? Did you do all the initial work yourself or did a couple of friends chip in to get you started? We don't do anything completely on our own without help from SOMEONE along the way. And that as a country we need to look out for and HELP each other succeed for the overall success of the country. That's what the President was talking about, and it's blatantly obvious that's what he meant when you take the entire topic IN CONTEXT.

He has always been very "community" based. Whereas the Republicans tend to be very "individual" based or as I call them the "it's all about me" party.

 

[enrico514]

We are currently at ~16 trillion in debt.

Why is there so much strife caused over this?

https://sphotos-b.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ash4/408259_478109905540157_656090198_n.jpg

16.16 trillion as of today...

 

[enrico514]

Very true. Helicopter Ben's inflation will hit the poor and middle class more than anyone, but at least the stock market's happy...

Unfortunately most americans do not have significant exposure to the stock market or commodities. The market has also been rising on ridiculously low volume and I wont even comment on earnings...

 

[Rhode Irish]

It was tweeted out by his admin and later deleted. Mentioned "offending Muslims and their religion." Isn't it cute that when they happily slit our throats and put it on Al Jazeera, it's our fault? And when some whack job makes fun of Mohammed

Why won't our pres. utter the words "muslim terrorist" and why does he support a mosque at the world trade center?

don't give me that religious freedom BS, either. there's 120 mosques in NYC to worship. muslims don't have a 1000 year history of building towers on their conquers, do they???

The "ground zero mosque" controversy was one of the most embarrassing things to have ever happened in this country. Ground zero isn't the site of a Muslim conquest. It is the site of an attack on Americans and New Yorkers by terrorists, not Muslims. There are obviously Muslims that are both Americans and New Yorkers, and they deserved better than that. Not to mention that the freaking thing wasn't on the ground zero site. It was just nearby.

 

[enrico514]

[/B]

Buster, with all due respect, that's the second time you've said this in the thread. Bush II was a disaster. I frankly wondered why McCain or Obama or anyone would want to follow that mess. No one was going to look good. I'm not defending Obama, I'm not a big fan of him or Romney to be truthful. I think 20, 30, 40 years from now the historians are not going to be very kind to Bush II.

Bush II was a disaster but I agree with Buster and I would add that historians will most likely not be kind to Obama either. The US employment figure dipped to as low as 139.27 million. Today it stands at 142.1 million. Even if this is considered recovery, to ‘rescue’ those 2.8 million jobs, it took the federal government an additional $6.421 trillion worth of debt ($2.3 million per job), and a $1.9 trillion (203%) expansion of the Federal Reserve balance sheet.

 

[IrishJayhawk]

Bush II was a disaster but I agree with Buster and I would add that historians will most likely not be kind to Obama either. The US employment figure dipped to as low as 139.27 million. Today it stands at 142.1 million. Even if this is considered recovery, to ‘rescue’ those 2.8 million jobs, it took the federal government an additional $6.421 trillion worth of debt ($2.3 million per job), and a $1.9 trillion (203%) expansion of the Federal Reserve balance sheet.

I've pointed it out before, but I think people are totally underestimating the free fall we were in when Obama took office. We were losing more than 750,000 at the time. Banks were closing and people were stuffing money under their mattresses.

This has been a slow recovery because it was the worst downturn since the depression.

The debt has increased largely because of reduced tax revenues due to the Bush collapse. That's not blaming Bush. It's just what happened.

 

[Irish Houstonian]

...The debt has increased largely because of reduced tax revenues due to the Bush collapse. That's not blaming Bush. It's just what happened.

Well that, and Obama spending more than any president ever.

 

[IrishJayhawk]

The "ground zero mosque" controversy was one of the most embarrassing things to have ever happened in this country. Ground zero isn't the site of a Muslim conquest. It is the site of an attack on Americans and New Yorkers by terrorists, not Muslims. There are obviously Muslims that are both Americans and New Yorkers, and they deserved better than that. Not to mention that the freaking thing wasn't on the ground zero site. It was just nearby.

I think you're underestimating how tricky "they" can be.

 

[IrishJayhawk]

Well that, and Obama spending more than any president ever.

Austerity in a recession will simply cause a depression.

 

[Rhode Irish]

Well that, and Obama spending more than any president ever.

All that spending definitely had nothing to do with staving off the worst financial crisis maybe ever, but at least since the Great Depression. And that financial crisis was definitely his fault, too.

 

[Irish Houstonian]

Austerity in a recession will simply cause a depression.

So in two posts you went from blaming the debt on Bush to justifying it for Obama.

 

[Irish Houstonian]

All that spending definitely had nothing to do with staving off the worst financial crisis maybe ever, but at least since the Great Depression. And that financial crisis was definitely his fault, too.

At least we're admitting that Obama in part "caused" the current debt level. That's a step in the right direction.

 

[enrico514]

I've pointed it out before, but I think people are totally underestimating the free fall we were in when Obama took office. We were losing more than 750,000 at the time. Banks were closing and people were stuffing money under their mattresses.

This has been a slow recovery because it was the worst downturn since the depression.

The debt has increased largely because of reduced tax revenues due to the Bush collapse. That's not blaming Bush. It's just what happened.

Obama most definitely inherited a bad situation that was a result of bad decisions of many prior administrations (not just Bush II). However Obama made awful decisions that will most likely have nasty consequences sooner rather than later.

As for the debt issue... It seems to me that Obama has a major spending problem!!!

but the issue isn't Obama (or democrats) Vs. Romney (or Republicans)...

 

[IrishJayhawk]

So in two posts you went from blaming the debt on Bush to justifying it for Obama.

Ha! Sure, that's exactly what I did.

 

[ND NYC]

we can debate all the issues here (and we do a good job of it! haha)...but all that really matters in terms of pure politics, and who will be the next president, (orginal thread question) in my opinion, is that romney has yet to define who he is, why he wants to be prez, what he will do and how he will do it. sounds simple but for whatever (i have no idea why) reason he has been unable to do it.
at all.
he literally is at the 11th hour. it can be done, but if i was a betting man, when all is said and done its obama for 4 more yrs