Notre Dame to the B1G Conference?

[Irish#1]

Rivals board is saying SC boosters pissed that ND isn’t joining BIG10. That ND won’t joint a conference unless they were forced. I don’t follow this. Might not be meaningful. Just thought I’d throw some shit on the wall and see if it matters. Could be bs. But from a long time SC poster that isn’t known for posting garbage.

Sounds like they were expecting ND to join as soon as they did. They set themselves up for disappointment.

 

[Sea Turtle]

ACC rumors build as Pac-12 tries to save itself (and stick it to the Big Ten)

Raise your hand if you woke up on Tuesday morning before the crack of dawn and predicted the ACC would become part of the Pac-12's survival plan. While nothing has been confirmed, and though we are still living in a world dominated by rumors and speculation, there is heavy…

trojanswire.usatoday.com

 

[irishfan]

I would imagine a potential big sticking point is around losing control of our home broadcast partner. Unsure if B1G would guarantee us games on NBC (or whoever we would want to partner with) even if there was still revenue shared across the conference. A ND home game on the Big Ten Network would be a hard pill to swallow.

 

[Irish#1]

ACC rumors build as Pac-12 tries to save itself (and stick it to the Big Ten)

Raise your hand if you woke up on Tuesday morning before the crack of dawn and predicted the ACC would become part of the Pac-12's survival plan. While nothing has been confirmed, and though we are still living in a world dominated by rumors and speculation, there is heavy…

trojanswire.usatoday.com

PAC 12 scrambling

 

[du Lac]

I would imagine a potential big sticking point is around losing control of our home broadcast partner. Unsure if B1G would guarantee us games on NBC (or whoever we would want to partner with) even if there was still revenue shared across the conference. A ND home game on the Big Ten Network would be a hard pill to swallow.

Oh hell no. That would be horrible. That network is trash for football. It's great for lesser followed sports.

 

[irishfan]

Oh hell no. That would be horrible. That network is trash for football. It's great for lesser followed sports.

FWIW, Ohio State and Michigan each played two games on the BTN last year. So it’s not just the bottom and mid tier that get stuck there. Now FOX shelling out more cash (and less emphasis on Big 12) would help mitigate that along with whatever interest NBC/CBS have with being part of a new B1G media deal, but still having home games where we don’t know the kickoff time or broadcast partner until a week or two ahead of time would be an odd new thing to deal with.

 

[B1G20]

PAC 12 scrambling

The ACC is the bigger surprise there for me, they've got the GOR to protect their members.

The ACC wanting to reach for something like that is indicative of the vulnerable position they think they're in currently.

 

[IrishBoognish]

PAC 12 scrambling

I live in Eugene. Theres so little talk about it.

Theres a couple old dudes here that understand the significance, buy seriously. Nobody cares.


Its very weird.

 

[stlnd01]

The ACC is the bigger surprise there for me, they've got the GOR to protect their members.

The ACC wanting to reach for something like that is indicative of the vulnerable position they think they're in currently.

That Grant of Rights Agreement offers less protection every year. Only a matter of time before Clemson and FSU decide the math looks better in the SEC, and then what, exactly, is the ACC in football?

Most striking thing in that article to me was the notion that Oregon, at $30M/year in media rights, may not be worth it for the Big Ten to add. I realize they're not a big TV market but they're a top-tier program with a unique brand, and you'd think whatever financial worries, say, Purdue, had about making one more slice of the TV pie could be papered over with a little Nike money. But maybe not. Which doesn't bode well for anyone else looking to join the party. If Oregon doesn't make sense, not very many other programs do either.

 

[B1G20]

I would imagine a potential big sticking point is around losing control of our home broadcast partner. Unsure if B1G would guarantee us games on NBC (or whoever we would want to partner with) even if there was still revenue shared across the conference. A ND home game on the Big Ten Network would be a hard pill to swallow.

The flip side of this argument is, the fact that ND can't sell any of their away games is why they've historically been underpaid on their TV deal - the network is only guaranteed the home games. A network bidding on a conference with ND in it knows they've got a guarantee of probably 10-11 ND games per year that will be available, subject to the agreed upon rotation. Say NBC wanted to remain the primary partner with ND - working with the B1G (and Fox/CBS) they could buy 10-11 games instead of only 6-7.

ESPN is surely trying their hardest to keep ND independent because with it's scheduling agreement with the ACC, ESPN gets to air some ND inventory while paying a very low cost for all the ACC inventory overall, so that's a sweet deal for them and they don't want anything to compete with the SEC, which they've now gone all in on.

My best case scenario would be ND joining the B1G, and then the B1G completely cutting out ESPN/ABC and working exclusively with Fox/CBS/NBC.

 

[B1G20]

That Grant of Rights Agreement offers less protection every year. Only a matter of time before Clemson and FSU decide the math looks better in the SEC, and then what, exactly, is the ACC in football?

Most striking thing in that article to me was the notion that Oregon, at $30M/year in media rights, may not be worth it for the Big Ten to add. I realize they're not a big TV market but they're a top-tier program with a unique brand, and you'd think whatever financial worries, say, Purdue, had about making one more slice of the TV pie could be papered over with a little Nike money. But maybe not. Which doesn't bode well for anyone else looking to join the party. If Oregon doesn't make sense, not very many other programs do either.

I agree, at some point create the best product/conference, even if it costs you $10M per school per year or whatever.

I'd put all of Oregon/Washington/Stanford/UNC/UVA/GT in that category.

 

[Irish#1]

The ACC is the bigger surprise there for me, they've got the GOR to protect their members.

The ACC wanting to reach for something like that is indicative of the vulnerable position they think they're in currently.

ACC's contract is hot garbage and they're signed up through around 2034. They have to do something before they lose a good chunk of their membership.

 

[Irish#1]

I live in Eugene. Theres so little talk about it.

Theres a couple old dudes here that understand the significance, buy seriously. Nobody cares.


Its very weird.

You have my sympathies.

 

[Irish#1]

That Grant of Rights Agreement offers less protection every year. Only a matter of time before Clemson and FSU decide the math looks better in the SEC, and then what, exactly, is the ACC in football?

Most striking thing in that article to me was the notion that Oregon, at $30M/year in media rights, may not be worth it for the Big Ten to add. I realize they're not a big TV market but they're a top-tier program with a unique brand, and you'd think whatever financial worries, say, Purdue, had about making one more slice of the TV pie could be papered over with a little Nike money. But maybe not. Which doesn't bode well for anyone else looking to join the party. If Oregon doesn't make sense, not very many other programs do either.

Not being argumentative, but what is unique about them outside of their unis? They had a run from 2008-2014 that was top tier, but since 2015 their record is 9-4, 4-8, 7-6, 9-4, 12-2, 4-3 & 10-4. Prior to Chip Kelly, they averaged 7 or 8 wins a year. They're too inconsistent to be considered a top tier program, but that's strictly my opinion.

 

[stlnd01]

Not being argumentative, but what is unique about them outside of their unis? They had a run from 2008-2014 that was top tier, but since 2015 their record is 9-4, 4-8, 7-6, 9-4, 12-2, 4-3 & 10-4. Prior to Chip Kelly, they averaged 7 or 8 wins a year. They're too inconsistent to be considered a top tier program, but that's strictly my opinion.

Not for nothing that’s probably the best, most consistent, record of any team in the PAC-12 over that time.

But, no, their uniforms, their Nike partnership, to some degree their style of play at least under Chip Kelly, that’s what makes them unique. They have a great stadium too. Oregon’s brand resonates beyond Oregon in a way you wouldn’t say about most mid-sized state school programs that have never won a title or a Heisman. When was the last time anyone talked about Arizona State? Who watches Utah?

 

[Irish#1]

Not for nothing that’s probably the best, most consistent, record of any team in the PAC-12 over that time.

But, no, their uniforms, their Nike partnership, to some degree their style of play at least under Chip Kelly, that’s what makes them unique. They have a great stadium too. Oregon’s brand resonates beyond Oregon in a way you wouldn’t say about most mid-sized state school programs that have never won a title or a Heisman. When was the last time anyone talked about Arizona State? Who watches Utah?

The unis and Nike partnership aren't going to bring in the TV revenue. Agree they have a great stadium and their home games seem like a great atmosphere, but I don't see that translating to revenue for the B1G. Here's the TV audience for last years bowl games. Oregon playing a perennial power in Oklahoma came in 11th. Purdue/Tenn came in 9th. MSU/Pitt was 7th.

 

[Polish Leppy 22]

I live in Eugene. Theres so little talk about it.

Theres a couple old dudes here that understand the significance, buy seriously. Nobody cares.


Its very weird.

That seems like the case for all of college football west of Texas. No one cares, or not nearly enough. I laugh when media or fans cry about college football being too regional or the southern schools dominate too much. That's entirely self inflicted (USC, Texas, UCLA, Oregon).

 

[IrishLax]

SIAP but Dennis Dodd also reporting that ND will stay independent “for now.” Have to wonder how much the $150M penalty, etc. factor in to the calculus.

 

[StPaul_Irish]

If true, this is a big mistake IMO.

 

[AvesEvo]

The unis and Nike partnership aren't going to bring in the TV revenue. Agree they have a great stadium and their home games seem like a great atmosphere, but I don't see that translating to revenue for the B1G. Here's the TV audience for last years bowl games. Oregon playing a perennial power in Oklahoma came in 11th. Purdue/Tenn came in 9th. MSU/Pitt was 7th.


View attachment 3050966

Well, shoot. I thought there was a lot of excitement for the fiesta bowl and it barely beat mich st and pitt.

 

[AvesEvo]

If true, this is a big mistake IMO.

It certainly doesn't seem like the safe decision.

 

[du Lac]

Nobody gets the BIG10 Network. I never see IU, MD, Rutgers, NU, Purdue, IL, Iowa play. Maybe once a season. Nobody cares either. ND is GOAT.

 

[TNUtoNotreDame]

SIAP but Dennis Dodd also reporting that ND will stay independent “for now.” Have to wonder how much the $150M penalty, etc. factor in to the calculus.

We maybe staying but Dodd pretty much shared no info on us. He is a tool. How many articles has he wrote the past 10 years declaring ND's independence is dead, ND is irrelevant etc.. The fact is no one know yet.

 

[IRISHDODGER]

I hated the idea of going to Big Ten until they added USC and look to be going national. If they go from a Midwestern conference into a truly national, high academics conference then I’m all in.

This is my opinion as well. What if Fielding Yost had never blackballed ND from the B1G? ND wouldn’t be the national power it is today IMO. It wouldn’t have 11 Nattys over that 100 years. ND also wouldn’t have that national fan base (w/ subway alums!) or national schedule w/ the greatest intersectional rivalry in college sports.

So I wouldn’t have wanted to revert back to regionality. Look at PSU now since they joined the B1G…regionalized. That would’ve been ND. But, now; the concept of a conference has drastically changed. With the addition of SC &UCLA, the B1G is now a national brand with the possibility of reaching further east by adding UNC &/or UVA. That’s all I needed to see.

 

[IRISHDODGER]

Where do Clemson, UNC, and FSU end up?

Also, what about Oregon and Washington?

Clemson & FSU will end up in the SEC. I’d bet that’s in the works now.

I’d like to see UNC in the B1G. But the question is how many teams will the B1G take? If they take Oregon & UW, they’re at 18 meaning ND + 1 (UNC, Stanford, ?) would put them at 20. To me, that’s the max. If the SEC caps their conference at 20, that will leave a lot of P5 schools out…incl basketball powers like Duke & Kansas.

 

[irishff1014]

 

[Pops Freshenmeyer]

SIAP but Dennis Dodd also reporting that ND will stay independent “for now.” Have to wonder how much the $150M penalty, etc. factor in to the calculus.

I would be surprised if it did.

I've looked at the old agreement. Assuming the new one is functionally identical (a big IF) then ND's football media rights are clearly excluded. Also potentially significant is that it's an assignment of the media rights themselves, not the revenues. So when you see reports of people talking about breaking out of the agreement, they're not talking about breaking away from financial liabilities, they're talking about forcing the ACC to give them back their media rights in exchange for a $ value determined by the court.

I have no idea what jurisdiction would apply here but in general, American legal systems favor efficient breaches of contract. Meaning, courts are extremely reluctant to force parties to maintain relationships. IMO, the most likely outcome is allowing schools to get back their rights in exchange for their monetary value to the ACC.

Don't buy the hype that the agreement can be dissolved by lawyers sprinkling magic lawyer dust.

HOWEVER, the ACC's value from media rights would be taken over the period of years of the agreement. So it's not going to be a lump sum judgment and if reports are accurate Notre Dame would be cash positive on the move starting from day 1.

 

[IRISHDODGER]

If we're forced to join this thing, I'd rather bring along UNC, UVA, VT, or Pitt than Oregon / Stanford. Rather watch the Trees sink.

I’m with you. Just b/c Stanford was relevant for a handful of years doesn’t make them a long time rival of ND. I think they’d go for UNC, Pitt or Oregon.

 

[Some Irish Bloke]

i hope Jack knows that this is bugging the sh#t out of irish and non irish fans all around the country that he and the admin are still being silent on these big ten rumors

Lol, I understand some fans are getting anxious but the USC/UCLA move was announced not even a week ago. Jack and other ADs may have had some inside knowledge of this pending move, but it's quite amazing how quiet this gigantic, landscape changing move actually was.

There are a lot of moving parts to this; we have a contract with the ACC for another decade-plus that will have financial damages if we break it. The ACC/ESPN are already stonewalling any potential rumors about teams leaving or breaking their contracts, saying they'll settle it in court. It will cost members tens of millions to leave early.

I'm sure Jack is mulling over his options; do we have to move now while we have maximum leverage? What will said leverage be like in 6, 12, 24 or 48 months? What are the financial ramifications (and would the B1G help foot that bill to break our ACC contract or are we all alone?) scheduling ramifications etc.

Not to mention the NBC contract expires in 2025 and I'm not sure if there is an exit clause or a financial penalty to leave that early. No way FOX would be cool with temporarily giving up it's B1G rights for ND, IMO. So, again, does Fox pony up to help us break that NBC contract? Maybe it makes more sense to wait a year or so from that contract expiring to make a smoother transition? Just spit balling.

It's not just a black and white "to join or not to join" situation.

Serenity now.

 

[Dale]

This guy was pretty plugged for the USC move. Not saying he’s right and Dodd is wrong but just that probably still nobody knows anything lol