[NFL] vBook: NFL Super Bowl: Tampa Bay Bucs vs Kansas City Chiefs

Dale

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NFL people who praise Brady (rightfully so) but say CFB is boring because of Alabama are the most bizarre sports fans

Incredible levels of greatness on both. Unless you are on the otherside of the field, hard not to be just impressed at this point
 

Irishbounty28

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He needs to retire! I want there to be a changing of the guard in the NFL so bad...but Brady won’t let that happen. He is the GOAT but needs to go...lol.
 

goldandblue

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I would like to add that Winfield jrs taunt to tyreek hill was epic. And will be memed for years to come. Lol.
 

IrishLax

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<blockquote class="twitter-tweet"><p lang="en" dir="ltr">Here are the path's that Patrick Mahomes (top) and Tom Brady (bottom) took before pass attempts in shotgun during tonight's <a href="https://twitter.com/hashtag/SuperBowl?src=hash&ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">#SuperBowl</a> <br><br>Red: complete<br>White: incomplete <a href="https://t.co/TLFEOxzwhr">pic.twitter.com/TLFEOxzwhr</a></p>— Michael Lopez (@StatsbyLopez) <a href="https://twitter.com/StatsbyLopez/status/1358620162904248320?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">February 8, 2021</a></blockquote> <script async src="https://platform.twitter.com/widgets.js" charset="utf-8"></script>

Insane.
 

Bishop2b5

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<blockquote class="twitter-tweet"><p lang="en" dir="ltr">Here are the path's that Patrick Mahomes (top) and Tom Brady (bottom) took before pass attempts in shotgun during tonight's <a href="https://twitter.com/hashtag/SuperBowl?src=hash&ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">#SuperBowl</a> <br><br>Red: complete<br>White: incomplete <a href="https://t.co/TLFEOxzwhr">pic.twitter.com/TLFEOxzwhr</a></p>— Michael Lopez (@StatsbyLopez) <a href="https://twitter.com/StatsbyLopez/status/1358620162904248320?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">February 8, 2021</a></blockquote> <script async src="https://platform.twitter.com/widgets.js" charset="utf-8"></script>

Insane.

Yikes! That's REALLY telling. That KC O-line wasn't up to the job and the Bucs' D was lights out.
 

Rogue219

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Pass Interference should be a stat outside of penalties. That pass in the end zone was halfway to Georgia and not catchable but it got called for PI?

Patrick Mahomes has worse protection than The Capitol. I assume Mike Pence can still save the Chiefs?

Bruce Arians is a genius. He has a staff full of black assistant coaches who will never be hired as head coaches and a QB that will never retire. DYNASTY.

Seriously, Bowles should get a second chance. We can only wonder when Leftwich will get his first. Hiring Patriot assistants was never a problem despite them going deep into the postseason all of the time. Alas, this latest round of openings was garbage and you saw the quality of the hires. Timing is everything.

Brady, Gronk, Antonio Brown all get a ring. Steelers fans puking blood this morning.
 
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Blazers46

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I still wont call Brady the GOAT. He is great but also probably the luckiest QB ever. 17 of his 20 seasons hes had a top 10 defense to support him. His last 2 superbowls his team has given up a total of 12 points. in his last 3 superbowl wins his team has given up 19 points in its last 11 quarters. dont forget Seattle throwing that pick at the goalline to win it that year and NE slowing the geatest show on turf for #1.

Bucs D or KC offensive line was the real MVP for the Bucs yesterday.
 

Rogue219

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The whole GOAT thing is column inches and podcast fodder. I don't really give a shit about these discussions anymore, to be honest. Today's game benefits offense more than ever before, and this guy actually had a rule created because of an injury he once sustained. I would still have Rodgers and Manning at the top of the list with him when it comes to individual greatness, as championships are a team accomplishment.

Brady seems to have a lot of Michael Jordan type of qualities. He demands a lot of those around him to the point that he comes off as an asshole. I can't get past the Michigan thing, either, if I'm being honest. Not to mention I'm a Steeler fan in addition to an ND fan. I've never had a reason to like him on the field, and off of it I don't consider him someone I like either.

I will never forget the Super Bowls that were gifted to him from Poodle and the Falcons. Then you have the spying stuff and deflated footballs surrounding his career. He carries water for Antonio Brown, and AB went out of his way last week to make himself a victim when the reality is his "haters" have nothing to do with all of the things he brought on himself.

He is going to be remembered as the guy who won 7 Super Bowls (and counting) until someone can equal that or do better. Mahomes has a great shot at being that guy, but he needs serious help on the OL to get that done, something Brady seemed to always have.
 

Dale

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I still wont call Brady the GOAT. He is great but also probably the luckiest QB ever. 17 of his 20 seasons hes had a top 10 defense to support him. His last 2 superbowls his team has given up a total of 12 points. in his last 3 superbowl wins his team has given up 19 points in its last 11 quarters. dont forget Seattle throwing that pick at the goalline to win it that year and NE slowing the geatest show on turf for #1.

Bucs D or KC offensive line was the real MVP for the Bucs yesterday.

Easy to critique someone with a huge sample size. He had one of the statistical best 1Hs in super bowl history last night. He is the GOAT and it’s not particularly close
 

NDRock

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I still wont call Brady the GOAT. He is great but also probably the luckiest QB ever. 17 of his 20 seasons hes had a top 10 defense to support him. His last 2 superbowls his team has given up a total of 12 points. in his last 3 superbowl wins his team has given up 19 points in its last 11 quarters. dont forget Seattle throwing that pick at the goalline to win it that year and NE slowing the geatest show on turf for #1.

Bucs D or KC offensive line was the real MVP for the Bucs yesterday.

Who is the GOAT at the quarterback position, just curious.
 

NDRock

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Trent Dilfer

Ha. As a Bucs fan, I will always appreciate the way he acted after being benched for Shaun King. Was the consummate professional and seemed to really try to help King. Never talked bad about the staff or organization. Was glad when he won with the Ravens.
 

irishtrooper

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What Brady has done is ridiculous. It’s foolish to minimize that due to having a good defense too. I’m not a fan of his, but to deny his greatness is intellectually dishonest. I didn’t want to put him over Montana for a long time, but he’s accomplished so much more. He’s almost singularly responsible for turning one team from a SB favorite year in year out into a middle of the road team. Then he takes a young, skilled team that underperforms and makes them a SB champion. I realize there are other factors, but he is the main reason.

He’s easily the best ever at the most important position in team sports. I get that some won’t like him because of who he may support politically or personally. Also, some don’t like his past or whatever (deflate gate, Michigan alum, straw man chip on shoulder nonsense), but come on. He’s soooo good.

I think it’s pretty early to say Mahomes is “on his way” or “has a really good chance” to catch him is a reach right now. He’s 1-1 at this point, but he has an aging HC that isn’t a picture of health. He has a lot of very good skill talent right now to play with. Let’s see how he does if Kelce or Tyreek sign elsewhere or miss a year with an injury. The Chiefs are amazing, but they’ve been pretty lucky with health (not including the OL stuff recently, but we see what happened there last night). Their best players miss a game here or there, but no sustained absence from the better players. Mahomes has tons of talent and is very easy to like, but I’m not ready to say he’ll challenge Brady (at least in terms of SB appearances/wins). No QB ever has come close and I’d bet none ever will.
 

dublinirish

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<blockquote class="twitter-tweet"><p lang="en" dir="ltr">This is one of the worst stories I’ve ever read. Based on public details seems likely Andy’s son goes (back) to jail? Saddest detail is the child wasn’t even in the car that broke down, but in the second car with family that came to help. Britt Reid crashed into both parked cars <a href="https://t.co/r9MpkPi0rb">https://t.co/r9MpkPi0rb</a></p>— Chris B. Brown (@smartfootball) <a href="https://twitter.com/smartfootball/status/1358892712808824833?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">February 8, 2021</a></blockquote> <script async src="https://platform.twitter.com/widgets.js" charset="utf-8"></script>
 

Blazers46

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Easy to critique someone with a huge sample size. He had one of the statistical best 1Hs in super bowl history last night. He is the GOAT and it’s not particularly close

Who is the GOAT at the quarterback position, just curious.

You need two things to win a SuperBowl.

A top 10 Defense and a Great QB. Sometimes there are exceptions like Trent Dilfer or Nick Foles. There are exceptions to every rule but Tom Brady has never won a ring without a top10 defense.

2020 - Tampa Bay #7 Defense - Tom Brady
2019 - Kansas City #10 Defense - Pat Mahommes
2018 - Patriots #6 Defense - Brady
2017 - Philly #4 Defense - Wentz/Foles
2016 - Patriots #1 Defense - Brady
2015 - Denver #4 Defense - Manning
2014 - Patriots #7 Defense - Brady
2013 - Seattle #1 Defense - Wilson
2012 - Ravens #4 Defense - Flacco
2011 - Giants #21 Defense - EManning
2010 - Green Bay #1 Defense - Rodgers
2009 - Saints #18 Defense - Brees
2008 - Steelers #2 Def - Big Ben
2007 - Giants #14 Def - EManning
2006 - Colts #18 Defense - PManning
2005 - Steelers #3 Def - Big Ben
2004 - Patriots #2 Defense - Brady
2003 - Patriots Patriots #1 Defense - Brady
2002 - Tampa Bay #1 Defense - Johnson
2001 - Patriots #6 - Brady

Defensive Facts:
Tom Brady has played 20 seasons. 17 of those with a top 10 defense. 10 SuperBowls - 7 Wins.
Peyton Manning played 14 seasons. 6 of those with a top 10 defense. 4 SuperBowls - 2 Wins.
Tom Brady has had more Top 10 defenses in his 20 seasons than Manning, Brees, and Rodgers combined in 47 seasons combined seasons.


Tom Brady is great and is in the discussion but counting rings you have to account for what Tom has had that others have not.

In the last 3 superbowl wins for Tom Brady, his defense has allowed 19 points in their last 11 quarters.

Can we really sit here and say if Peyton had a top 10 defense 85% of the time he does not win 7? I say he does easily. Give Brees and Rodgers the same and they might.
 

Blazers46

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C’mon? Something that only one person has done would be done easily by someone else?

In those same conditions why not? I think people really under estimate what a Top10 defense does for a team that already has a great QB. 49ers and Cowboys of the 90s are a perfect example. The headline for both was the great offenses but they both had top10 defenses pretty much every year in the 90s.
 

NDRock

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You need two things to win a SuperBowl.

A top 10 Defense and a Great QB. Sometimes there are exceptions like Trent Dilfer or Nick Foles. There are exceptions to every rule but Tom Brady has never won a ring without a top10 defense.

2020 - Tampa Bay #7 Defense - Tom Brady
2019 - Kansas City #10 Defense - Pat Mahommes
2018 - Patriots #6 Defense - Brady
2017 - Philly #4 Defense - Wentz/Foles
2016 - Patriots #1 Defense - Brady
2015 - Denver #4 Defense - Manning
2014 - Patriots #7 Defense - Brady
2013 - Seattle #1 Defense - Wilson
2012 - Ravens #4 Defense - Flacco
2011 - Giants #21 Defense - EManning
2010 - Green Bay #1 Defense - Rodgers
2009 - Saints #18 Defense - Brees
2008 - Steelers #2 Def - Big Ben
2007 - Giants #14 Def - EManning
2006 - Colts #18 Defense - PManning
2005 - Steelers #3 Def - Big Ben
2004 - Patriots #2 Defense - Brady
2003 - Patriots Patriots #1 Defense - Brady
2002 - Tampa Bay #1 Defense - Johnson
2001 - Patriots #6 - Brady

Defensive Facts:
Tom Brady has played 20 seasons. 17 of those with a top 10 defense. 10 SuperBowls - 7 Wins.
Peyton Manning played 14 seasons. 6 of those with a top 10 defense. 4 SuperBowls - 2 Wins.
Tom Brady has had more Top 10 defenses in his 20 seasons than Manning, Brees, and Rodgers combined in 47 seasons combined seasons.


Tom Brady is great and is in the discussion but counting rings you have to account for what Tom has had that others have not.

In the last 3 superbowl wins for Tom Brady, his defense has allowed 19 points in their last 11 quarters.

Can we really sit here and say if Peyton had a top 10 defense 85% of the time he does not win 7? I say he does easily. Give Brees and Rodgers the same and they might.

Maybe if Manning didn’t take a huge salary every year there would have been extra cap space for more players. Brady consistently taking less has always been a factor in his success.
 

Blazers46

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Maybe if Manning didn’t take a huge salary every year there would have been extra cap space for more players. Brady consistently taking less has always been a factor in his success.

Sure. I agree.
 

Irish2155

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<blockquote class="twitter-tweet"><p lang="en" dir="ltr">This is one of the worst stories I’ve ever read. Based on public details seems likely Andy’s son goes (back) to jail? Saddest detail is the child wasn’t even in the car that broke down, but in the second car with family that came to help. Britt Reid crashed into both parked cars <a href="https://t.co/r9MpkPi0rb">https://t.co/r9MpkPi0rb</a></p>— Chris B. Brown (@smartfootball) <a href="https://twitter.com/smartfootball/status/1358892712808824833?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">February 8, 2021</a></blockquote> <script async src="https://platform.twitter.com/widgets.js" charset="utf-8"></script>

This is horrible. Reid’s son could be in some serious trouble. I don’t remember hearing about this before the game.
 

Rogue219

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This Chiefs defense, from my point of view, looks like it was built to play with the lead. When you don't have the lead and the script gets flipped, you need to have something to allow your offense to be able to come back. Useless if you're juiceless and that defense got behind early. No juice.

I think they were flagged a few times in the second quarter on very questionable calls. I also think a couple guys played without discipline and got frustrated. That's coaching as well as being a professional. Honey Badger lost his shit a few times. He got rattled.

The knock on Montana was he had all that tremendous skill talent around him and Young stepped right in. I don't care what you think, Montana won some huge games home and away that most guys just don't, Jerry Rice or not. Brady has been consistently great for twenty years in addition to having very good timing and some luck. Luck plays a huge part in winning championships, as does timing, and nobody seems to want to believe in that randomness because it takes away from greatness and the idea of preordained "destiny." Take your lucky bounces and roll with them. I don't give a damn who you are. Plenty of champions have been lucky in addition to good. That's how Trent Dilfer wins a Super Bowl and Dan Marino doesn't.

I like Mahomes' long term future. I think he can win multiple Super Bowls. Bienemy might be waiting for Reid to step down and take the reigns, but even if he moves on to be an HC elsewhere, how do you not chomp at the bit to be an HC and OC with the Chiefs as long as Mahomes is there? He had his worst game since his freshman year vs TCU and had a piecemeal offensive line in front of him. I think he'll be okay and I think he's the next face of the league.

Or Brady plays for another 15 years and totally fucks him out of trophies.
 

Rogue219

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Maybe if Manning didn’t take a huge salary every year there would have been extra cap space for more players. Brady consistently taking less has always been a factor in his success.

This is an EXCELLENT point.

They should have gotten him WR help and maybe he'd still be in New England. I didn't understand why they kept dumpster diving for WR when they had him at QB.
 

Blazers46

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This is an EXCELLENT point.

They should have gotten him WR help and maybe he'd still be in New England. I didn't understand why they kept dumpster diving for WR when they had him at QB.

Because it works. The recipe for Championships is a Top10 defense and a Good/Great QB.
 
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