NBA Thread

[Jiggafini19Deux]

IMO, the NBA is less about the product on the court present day and more about "Mount Rushmores" and GOAT debates. These debates revolve around the same 3 players (more times than not 2 players) who played in different times in the league's history. Turn on ESPN and take a drink for every time this occurs on the talk shows. Your stomach will need pumped at the ER.

There is a current product there but the constant comparisons to the 80s and 90s keep the game in the washing machine. The current NBA media beat and old raggedy ass fans make it so.

Listening to Charles Barkley and Shaq constantly belittle everything doesn't help matters any.

 

[Jiggafini19Deux]

The NBA is the worst sport for this at any level. People talk about the death of baseball but at least there are still bad feelings between fanbases. There are greater rivalries in HS Track and Field than in the NBA.

The rivalry is hating LeBron.

 

[irishnd31]

There is a current product there but the constant comparisons to the 80s and 90s keep the game in the washing machine. The current NBA media beat and old raggedy ass fans make it so.

Listening to Charles Barkley and Shaq constantly belittle everything doesn't help matters any.

Spot on post my friend.

 

[NDRock]

There is a current product there but the constant comparisons to the 80s and 90s keep the game in the washing machine. The current NBA media beat and old raggedy ass fans make it so.

Listening to Charles Barkley and Shaq constantly belittle everything doesn't help matters any.

There is truth to that but there is also some truth to the fact that it's not a great time for the league. No real great team rivalries, biggest stars are getting old, no young American superstars stepping up and frankly, the style of play isn't great. You may disagree but basketball becoming a 3 point shooting contest isn't a positive, IMO. I see this down to my son's high school team. 4 and 5 out and tons of 3s. Every 3 on 1 turns into a 3 point shot. It's maddening sometimes. Yes the shooting ability of players today is amazing but it become monotonous.

I just think it's a lull in the league. They've gone through it plenty of times. New guys, new teams will step up. 10 years from now you can hear KD and others from this era talk about how tough it was when they played. The cycle will continue.

 

[greyhammer90]

There is a current product there but the constant comparisons to the 80s and 90s keep the game in the washing machine. The current NBA media beat and old raggedy ass fans make it so.

Listening to Charles Barkley and Shaq constantly belittle everything doesn't help matters any.

Yep. The NFL media is constantly hyping up their product and talking about how amazing everyone is today. The NBA media is full of old players who say that the kids who play today suck. Detroit had a great year in the NFL and the NFL media spent all year talking them up and about how awesome it is that this franchise is having a great year. Meanwhile the Cleveland Cavaliers had an amazing start to the season and you have Chuck telling everyone on TNT that nobody cares about Cleveland and you'd be dumb to watch.

And yes, the GOAT debate is more relevant in basketball than other sports but it's been a played out discussion for a decade now.

 

[Blazers46]

There is a current product there but the constant comparisons to the 80s and 90s keep the game in the washing machine. The current NBA media beat and old raggedy ass fans make it so.

Listening to Charles Barkley and Shaq constantly belittle everything doesn't help matters any.

It’s an awful product and I appreciate their honesty. This year I’ve been to a handful of nuggets games, bulls games, pacers games and even bit the bullet and went to a Washington whatever they are called now game. It feels lazy. Dribble dribble 3pt shot. The skill has faded and you just need to be a good 3 and D guy now to get a paycheck and I feel like that’s what players are after. Fill the stat line and see a payday. The days off, yuk. Everyone likes each other. It’s professional rec league ball but I’ve seen more competitive rec league ball.

 

[NDRock]

It’s an awful product and I appreciate their honesty. This year I’ve been to a handful of nuggets games, bulls games, pacers games and even bit the bullet and went to a Washington whatever they are called now game. It feels lazy. Dribble dribble 3pt shot. The skill has faded and you just need to be a good 3 and D guy now to get a paycheck and I feel like that’s what players are after. Fill the stat line and see a payday. The days off, yuk. Everyone likes each other. It’s professional rec league ball but I’ve seen more competitive rec league ball.

I think the gap between the regular season and playoffs has never been bigger. Probably the worst of any of the major sports.

 

[GrangerIrish24]

I stopped watching the NBA when Kobe retired. The talent in the league is immense, but the overall game is unwatchable. There is a reason why the league is still being carried globally by Lebron, Steph and KD, which is not a great place to be.

 

[Jiggafini19Deux]

There is truth to that but there is also some truth to the fact that it's not a great time for the league. No real great team rivalries, biggest stars are getting old, no young American superstars stepping up and frankly, the style of play isn't great. You may disagree but basketball becoming a 3 point shooting contest isn't a positive, IMO. I see this down to my son's high school team. 4 and 5 out and tons of 3s. Every 3 on 1 turns into a 3 point shot. It's maddening sometimes. Yes the shooting ability of players today is amazing but it become monotonous.

I just think it's a lull in the league. They've gone through it plenty of times. New guys, new teams will step up. 10 years from now you can hear KD and others from this era talk about how tough it was when they played. The cycle will continue.

Absolutely.

Europeans and South Americans play the game differently. The game went crazy global because of Jordan and the Dream Team. Enter the new millennium and you have kids from soccer countries all grown up playing the game in a way that's similar to soccer.

They'll start changing rules to try and win back the audience they lost. Baseball actually did both.

I do think you are right about the lull. Guys come in as teens, some of them foreign, and it takes time for them to develop into All Stars let alone superstars. The game is coached on the floor very different and analyzed in front offices very different. I am one of the few I know who enjoy it still, but honestly, the Bulls suck and I'd be way more interested if they were good and contending for things. It probably doesn't hurt that markets like Chicago, New York, Houston, etc. have been down.

 

[Blazers46]

Absolutely.

Europeans and South Americans play the game differently. The game went crazy global because of Jordan and the Dream Team. Enter the new millennium and you have kids from soccer countries all grown up playing the game in a way that's similar to soccer.

They'll start changing rules to try and win back the audience they lost. Baseball actually did both.

I do think you are right about the lull. Guys come in as teens, some of them foreign, and it takes time for them to develop into All Stars let alone superstars. The game is coached on the floor very different and analyzed in front offices very different. I am one of the few I know who enjoy it still, but honestly, the Bulls suck and I'd be way more interested if they were good and contending for things. It probably doesn't hurt that markets like Chicago, New York, Houston, etc. have been down.

Baseball and basketball are interesting because I feel like they fail for the same reasons. Basketball with the 3 is baseball with the homerun. Both leagues and their players essentially swing for the fences and go big or go home. I played college baseball and and still have all my childhood baseball cards. But I haven’t watched a game in TV, playoffs included for a very long time and couldn’t even name 5 players on the Cubs.

 

[Jiggafini19Deux]

I stopped watching the NBA when Kobe retired. The talent in the league is immense, but the overall game is unwatchable. There is a reason why the league is still being carried globally by Lebron, Steph and KD, which is not a great place to be.

The next group is coming, but it's probably going to be another couple of years. There is a lot of dynamic talent under the age of 25. Most of them are named Jalen (LOL...Green, Johnson and Williams).

Victor, SGA and Ant would probably be three leading the charge. Luka, Haliburton and Maxey are right there. I like watching Scottie Barnes play.

Cade Cunningham seems like he's for real.

The Cavs and Thunder are both pretty loaded.

 

[greyhammer90]

Alright I'll be the asshole and point out that the majority of people on here talking about how bad the product is are the same people saying that they don't watch it. There was a good video put out by Thinking Basketball today about the exact argument being made in here (that the game is just an unimaginative chuckfest compared to the good old days) and how that doesn't really reflect reality. A lot of that narrative comes from the media guys (who are former players with axes to grind) who speak these falsehoods which are parroted by fans who don't know ball well enough to watch anything but the guy who's dribbling the ball.

 

[irishnd31]

The next group is coming, but it's probably going to be another couple of years. There is a lot of dynamic talent under the age of 25. Most of them are named Jalen (LOL...Green, Johnson and Williams).

Victor, SGA and Ant would probably be three leading the charge. Luka, Haliburton and Maxey are right there. I like watching Scottie Barnes play.

Cade Cunningham seems like he's for real.

The Cavs and Thunder are both pretty loaded.

Just got better with the signing of De'Andre Hunter from the Hawks.

 

[Jiggafini19Deux]

Alright I'll be the asshole and point out that the majority of people on here talking about how bad the product is are the same people saying that they don't watch it. There was a good video put out by Thinking Basketball today about the exact argument being made in here (that the game is just an unimaginative chuckfest compared to the good old days) and how that doesn't really reflect reality. A lot of that narrative comes from the media guys (who are former players with axes to grind) who speak these falsehoods which are parroted by fans who don't know ball well enough to watch anything but the guy who's dribbling the ball.

Very correct.

 

[Irish#1]

Passing has become a lost art in the NBA. That's what makes the Pacers a fun team to watch. Haliburton is a throwback to the Magic Johnson, Stockton, etc. PG's. He can pass outside, in a crowd, during a drive off the dribble. The rest feed off that. There's still one on one plays, but not as much as other teams. After a poor start, they have been playing as well as anyone.

 

[GrangerIrish24]

Alright I'll be the asshole and point out that the majority of people on here talking about how bad the product is are the same people saying that they don't watch it. There was a good video put out by Thinking Basketball today about the exact argument being made in here (that the game is just an unimaginative chuckfest compared to the good old days) and how that doesn't really reflect reality. A lot of that narrative comes from the media guys (who are former players with axes to grind) who speak these falsehoods which are parroted by fans who don't know ball well enough to watch anything but the guy who's dribbling the ball.

orrrrrr I stopped watching because I didn't like the product. That can also be true.

 

[Jiggafini19Deux]

Passing has become a lost art in the NBA. That's what makes the Pacers a fun team to watch. Haliburton is a throwback to the Magic Johnson, Stockton, etc. PG's. He can pass outside, in a crowd, during a drive off the dribble. The rest feed of that. There's still one on one plays, but not as much as other teams. After a poor start, they have been playing as well as anyone.

There are actually excellent passers in the league today. Most of them are named Lebron and foreign guys, though, so there's that. We're back to square one.

 

[Blazers46]

Alright I'll be the asshole and point out that the majority of people on here talking about how bad the product is are the same people saying that they don't watch it. There was a good video put out by Thinking Basketball today about the exact argument being made in here (that the game is just an unimaginative chuckfest compared to the good old days) and how that doesn't really reflect reality. A lot of that narrative comes from the media guys (who are former players with axes to grind) who speak these falsehoods which are parroted by fans who don't know ball well enough to watch anything but the guy who's dribbling the ball.

People that don’t like to watch basketball are the people that don’t watch it? Ummm yeah… seems to be spot on. That’s like saying the only reason Kamala Harris lost the election was because she didn’t get enough votes… nope just both awful products

 

[Bane]

The rivalry is hating LeBron.

This is it. I feel like people don't really follow teams in the NBA as much as they follow their favorite players. I'm sure there are fans of particular teams of course, but it seems like the national discourse surrounding the NBA is more individual player driven.

Yep. The NFL media is constantly hyping up their product and talking about how amazing everyone is today. The NBA media is full of old players who say that the kids who play today suck. Detroit had a great year in the NFL and the NFL media spent all year talking them up and about how awesome it is that this franchise is having a great year. Meanwhile the Cleveland Cavaliers had an amazing start to the season and you have Chuck telling everyone on TNT that nobody cares about Cleveland and you'd be dumb to watch.

And yes, the GOAT debate is more relevant in basketball than other sports but it's been a played out discussion for a decade now.

Feels like there has to be a middle ground between Tony Romo and Chris Collinsworth gurgling Mahomes and Allen for 3-4 hours in the NFL, and the haters that cover the NBA.

 

[Bane]

Alright I'll be the asshole and point out that the majority of people on here talking about how bad the product is are the same people saying that they don't watch it. There was a good video put out by Thinking Basketball today about the exact argument being made in here (that the game is just an unimaginative chuckfest compared to the good old days) and how that doesn't really reflect reality. A lot of that narrative comes from the media guys (who are former players with axes to grind) who speak these falsehoods which are parroted by fans who don't know ball well enough to watch anything but the guy who's dribbling the ball.

I admit I do not watch the NBA and haven't since around 05, 06 with any regularity. I'm not saying the quality of play is any better or worse, I really don't know, but there are meta issues the NBA faces and the perception is the style of play (whether efficient or not) is boring. Baseball is trending this way with the game probably objectively being played "better" but "better" and "enjoyable" are not necessarily the same.

 

[Bane]

The NFL media is constantly hyping up their product and talking about how amazing everyone is today. T

There is an element of gaslighting here I don't appreciate from the NFL media. They can scream at me until they're blue in the face that we're in a "golden age of QB play" but I've been watching football at the college and pro level for almost 30 years now, don't tell me not to trust my lying eyes. This batch of QBs on the whole is not as impressive as the generation that just preceded it. QB play as a whole is down in both the college and pro ranks. Mahomes has put up pretty pedestrian numbers for about 3 seasons now, KC is clearly a defense first, run the ball team now, but there's this uneasy agreement in football media to pretend he's still throwing for 5K yards and 40 TDs.

 

[Blazers46]

The rivalry is hating LeBron.

I hate LeBron… but because he optimizes why people have stopped watching basketball. Front runner buying rings, taking days off, and wants to be friends with everyone while being one of the biggest on court cry babies but being applauded for his physical health and longevity and toughness. It’s a joke.

 

[greyhammer90]

orrrrrr I stopped watching because I didn't like the product. That can also be true.

Yeah, that's sort of my point. You stopped watching the NBA about 10 years ago. Coming to a thread about the NBA acting like the NBA is playing worse basketball since 2016 without watching it gives you cool guy points from the many haters but it really seems weird to me. Not to come after Irish#1 in particular but some of the best passers to ever play the game are playing right now. Saying that passing is a bygone thing ignores all elements of spacing and pace that is being played with right now (which are both at historic all time highs). I mean, Joker alone is a human highlight reel from a passing perspective.

There's always going to be people who say that the NBA sucks, and its probably always going to be a popular take online. It's an unfortunate part of the culture surrounding the association and has been a normal thing for me to hear about over the last 3 decades. I just think most of the people who claim that the product "sucks" are 1) not really fans of pro basketball who want to justify their disinterest, 2) overly nostalgic for the player they bandwagoned for back in the 90s, or 3) dislike the association for other non-basketball reasons. If you are none of those, then no worries. I'm sure there are very complex statistical reasons the product is trash that I don't understand.

 

[NDRock]

Personally, I thought a lot of the 90's basketball was trash. Riley and the Knicks and their desire to win 74-72 games was not very pleasing on the eyes. Looking back, most of the 2000's weren't great. I do think the 2008-2018 was really good. Celts/Laker were great. Those Heat teams were very good but watching them go down to the Mavs and Spurs (2014 team one of my all time favorites) and then the Golden State run was fantastic. Does seem like after the 73 win Warriors failed to win the championship, teams really got more invested in resting guys. Not sure if that's true but I do think all the load management and just be ready for the playoff thing has lessened the regular season. Why even watch? Just check the standings periodically, check the injuries and trades, and just wait for the playoffs.

 

[GrangerIrish24]

Yeah, that's sort of my point. You stopped watching the NBA about 10 years ago. Coming to a thread about the NBA acting like the NBA is playing worse basketball since 2016 without watching it gives you cool guy points from the many haters but it really seems weird to me. Not to come after Irish#1 in particular but some of the best passers to ever play the game are playing right now. Saying that passing is a bygone thing ignores all elements of spacing and pace that is being played with right now (which are both at historic all time highs). I mean, Joker alone is a human highlight reel from a passing perspective.

There's always going to be people who say that the NBA sucks, and it’s probably always going to be a popular take online. It's an unfortunate part of the culture surrounding the association and has been a normal thing for me to hear about over the last 3 decades. I just think most of the people who claim that the product "sucks" are 1) not really fans of pro basketball who want to justify their disinterest, 2) overly nostalgic for the player they bandwagoned for back in the 90s, or 3) dislike the association for other non-basketball reasons. If you are none of those, then no worries. I'm sure there are very complex statistical reasons the product is trash that I don't understand.

I gave my opinion on a thread about the NBA yet you disagree so I’m looking for “cool guy points”? The game became unwatchable TO ME. It’s that simple. I never said it “sucked”. I personally don’t enjoy the product the NBA puts out anymore, on and off the court.

 

[greyhammer90]

I gave my opinion on a thread about the NBA yet you disagree so I’m looking for “cool guy points”? The game became unwatchable TO ME. It’s that simple. I never said it “sucked”. I personally don’t enjoy the product the NBA puts out anymore, on and off the court.

Since you're playing the "what was literally said" game, I never said you were "looking for" cool guy points. I said hating on the NBA is a good way to earn them on the internet.

Beyond that, you have established that you have an opinion about the NBA. Do you want to talk about it or?

 

[Deirishpisser]

I hate LeBron… but because he optimizes why people have stopped watching basketball. Front runner buying rings, taking days off, and wants to be friends with everyone while being one of the biggest on court cry babies but being applauded for his physical health and longevity and toughness. It’s a joke.

optimizes...lol...your adjectives are self admittedly great, but your verbs are awful

 

[Tejas]

Do guys still do the mid-range jumper like the Microwave Vinnie Johnson?

 

[NorthDakota]

My hot take on how to fix the NBA is make the 3 point line a straight line.

Would eliminate a ton of the threes, make it easier to defend against threes and get the guys to run a real offense.

 

[Sea Turtle]

I'm tired of the league constantly feeding the Lakers generational players.

Wilt
Kareem
Magic
Kobe
LeBron
Davis
And now this.

How would you guys like it if the Cowboys were constantly getting Mahomes, Rodgers, Moss, etc. because other teams couldn't afford them, they refused to sign with them and only wanted to be a Cowboy or nudging behind the scenes with the league because they need LA to be good.

It's BS and I'm sick of it. And I even liked them in the eighties but I see what's going on and it's BS.