Immigration

GoIrish41

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Im not a gambling man, but you sound like one of the people that actually want this to turn into revolution. What responsible adult calls people bootlicking? Is that supposed to be a negative to want to support order and law over chaos? Jesus, I stopped doing that puerile "the man is bad" crap in high school(ok maybe college...;)). Sure Rage against the machine makes sense if you haven't experience the real world.
Next you are gonna to say that it's ok to steal from corporations, right?
The type who won’t stand silent as lawlessness, cruelty and immorality are masqueraded as “common sense,” “order” and “patriotism”. Nothing is less patriotic than joining a paramilitary force aimed at terrorizing American cities.

I’m retired, served this country faithfully for four decades and wager have experienced more of the “real world” than you have or will. So spare my your condescension.

The majority of the world is frightfully disgusted with America. The majority of the people who live in this country are disgusted with the administration and its tactics. Even support in the otherwise cultish Republican party is evaporating over this dystopian bullshit. This is what the wrong side of history looks like. And Blazers and his mall cop militia signed up to be tools of oppression. So bootlicker seems generous.
 

IrishinSyria

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Only difference is the bottom one is far more premeditated and showed up armed. Both got caught up in some stupidity. Both probably didn't need to be shot. Neither did a good job of self-preservation.

One other difference is that Babbit's shooting was investigated by the US Attorney's Office and DOJ civil rights division and DOJ is not doing an investigation of Pretti's killing, but instead letting DHS (which is headed by someone who called Pretti a domestic terrorist) do an internal investigation.

I assume you disagree with the DOJ conclusion regarding Babbit, and fair enough, but at least there was at least a pretense of independent investigation. Here, high level admin officials immediately made claims about the shooting (which a number of credulous posters here repeated) that were simply not true. If you're not already fully inclined to trust this admin, there's absolutely no reason to think those people are going to oversee a credible investigation here. More to the point, standard protocol would be to kick it to DOJ. So there's got to be some reason not to do that.
 

drayer54

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The only difference lol. One person was in a swarm of people breaking into a federal building and overtaking a small number of officers. The other is being detained and disarmed by 8 officers.

The biggest difference is that you agreed with her cause and sympathized with her motivations.
I don't think either played their hand very smart. I've never advocated for rushing federal buildings, actually. You take certain risks when you do what they did. I think there's several situations like this. It's just these got politicized. You'll be hard pressed to find a post of me appealing on behalf of Babbit.
 

Blazers46

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The type who won’t stand silent as lawlessness, cruelty and immorality are masqueraded as “common sense,” “order” and “patriotism”. Nothing is less patriotic than joining a paramilitary force aimed at terrorizing American cities.

I’m retired, served this country faithfully for four decades and wager have experienced more of the “real world” than you have or will. So spare my your condescension.

The majority of the world is frightfully disgusted with America. The majority of the people who live in this country are disgusted with the administration and its tactics. Even support in the otherwise cultish Republican party is evaporating over this dystopian bullshit. This is what the wrong side of history looks like. And Blazers and his mall cop militia signed up to be tools of oppression. So bootlicker seems generous.
You’re passionate… what are you doing about it besides looking like a drug addict on a message board
 

TracyGraham

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The type who won’t stand silent as lawlessness, cruelty and immorality are masqueraded as “common sense,” “order” and “patriotism”. Nothing is less patriotic than joining a paramilitary force aimed at terrorizing American cities.

I’m retired, served this country faithfully for four decades and wager have experienced more of the “real world” than you have or will. So spare my your condescension.

The majority of the world is frightfully disgusted with America. The majority of the people who live in this country are disgusted with the administration and its tactics. Even support in the otherwise cultish Republican party is evaporating over this dystopian bullshit. This is what the wrong side of history looks like. And Blazers and his mall cop militia signed up to be tools of oppression. So bootlicker seems generous.
No, you don't know anything if you think the world is frightened of America. I'm sure you imagine it, but it is completely disconnected. Everyday workers in Asia tell me how much they appreciate Trump sticking it to China. Every country proudly waves their flag. They could never comprehend the entitled bullshit nonsense that the left spews out. Only in America are people ashamed. Its like we entered into some weird postmodern nightmare where the norm isnt good enough. We just manufacture outrage. The hippy boomers were spoiled children raised by the greatest generation and they can't just cut the bullshit whining masqueraded as freedom fighting. It's so tiresome and stale. People sweat toil put everything into building a society and the left just wants to tear it all down like children.
 

IrishinSyria

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The type who won’t stand silent as lawlessness, cruelty and immorality are masqueraded as “common sense,” “order” and “patriotism”. Nothing is less patriotic than joining a paramilitary force aimed at terrorizing American cities.

I’m retired, served this country faithfully for four decades and wager have experienced more of the “real world” than you have or will. So spare my your condescension.

The majority of the world is frightfully disgusted with America. The majority of the people who live in this country are disgusted with the administration and its tactics. Even support in the otherwise cultish Republican party is evaporating over this dystopian bullshit. This is what the wrong side of history looks like. And Blazers and his mall cop militia signed up to be tools of oppression. So bootlicker seems generous.
100%

I’m not so naive as to think that everyone I served with sees it this way, but I think at a bare minimum any self respecting veteran or law enforcement officer is looking at the way CBP/ICE has been operating and thinking that we were held to much higher standards than these chucklefucks.
 

Blazers46

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No, you don't know anything if you think the world is frightened of America. I'm sure you imagine it, but it is completely disconnected. Everyday workers in Asia tell me how much they appreciate Trump sticking it to China. Every country proudly waves their flag. They could never comprehend the entitled bullshit nonsense that the left spews out. Only in America are people ashamed. Its like we entered into some weird postmodern nightmare where the norm isnt good enough. We just manufacture outrage. The hippy boomers were spoiled children raised by the greatest generation and they can't just cut the bullshit whining masqueraded as freedom fighting. It's so tiresome and stale. People sweat toil put everything into building a society and the left just wants to tear it all down like children.
I’ve always been in the thought that the rise and fall of empires are cyclical and predictable.

A few things that can predict the fall of a nation is complacency and luxury and also the loss or the inability to have shared values within the nation.

This is why I am adamant that a heavily multicultural society is just just counting down the days before it’s impending doom.

People make the argument that we have always been a multi cultured society since it’s inception but up until the 1960s to 1970s our foreign population was around 2 to 3%, now we are hovering over 20%, if not more because we simply don’t know who’s here and who isn’t. Add to this formula that we have a number of foreign leaders in local and federal government trying to manipulate and twist things to appease their own customs and values.
 
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Blazers46

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I’m not so naive as to think that everyone I served with sees it this way, but I think at a bare minimum any self respecting veteran or law enforcement officer is looking at the way CBP/ICE has been operating and thinking that we were held to much higher standards than these chucklefucks.
I think this conversation is hilarious. 50% of those hired by the border patrol are Hispanic. 30% Hispanic with ICE.

Many polls show that Hispanics are between 50 to 70% depending on the immigration issue, but are in favor of tighter, immigration laws, tighter, border protection, and even on deportations.

Why were these Hispanic bootlickers be in favor of tighter immigration laws?
 

RDU Irish

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I’m not so naive as to think that everyone I served with sees it this way, but I think at a bare minimum any self respecting veteran or law enforcement officer is looking at the way CBP/ICE has been operating and thinking that we were held to much higher standards than these chucklefucks.

I think this is a fair criticism. One reason I don't FAFO with LEOs is b/c I expect Johnny Macho's with Napoleon complexes are going to be happy to flex on me, rights be damned. I don't have the luxury of an army of "observers" in my wake. Demonizing these jobs is only going to give you shittier pools of applicants. I would actively advocate against my children joining any three letter agency.
 

Blazers46

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I think this is a fair criticism. One reason I don't FAFO with LEOs is b/c I expect Johnny Macho's with Napoleon complexes are going to be happy to flex on me, rights be damned. I don't have the luxury of an army of "observers" in my wake. Demonizing these jobs is only going to give you shittier pools of applicants. I would actively advocate against my children joining any three letter agency.
I’m a contractor and I work for multiple 3 letter agencies. Technically, I am considered law enforcement, but I have never arrested anyone personally if I need to I call someone else because I’m kind of a pussy. I would never in my life want that as a full time job. I have a friend that left a good job to be come a cop and I think he’s an idiot.
 

Bantry19

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No, you don't know anything if you think the world is frightened of America. I'm sure you imagine it, but it is completely disconnected. Everyday workers in Asia tell me how much they appreciate Trump sticking it to China. Every country proudly waves their flag. They could never comprehend the entitled bullshit nonsense that the left spews out. Only in America are people ashamed. It’s like we entered into some weird postmodern nightmare where the norm isnt good enough. We just manufacture outrage. The hippy boomers were spoiled children raised by the greatest generation and they can't just cut the bullshit whining masqueraded as freedom fighting. It's so tiresome and stale. People sweat toil put everything into building a society and the left just wants to tear it all down like children.
Buddy, this cannot be serious. How is Trump sticking it to China?

China’s global influence has already grown significantly in the last year. Trump alienating allies and sowing unpredictability with dumbass tariffs and trade barriers has led to more opportunities for China, including in the Western Hemisphere. China is filling the vacuum.

This is so ass backwards. Manufacture outrage? Dude, MAGA 101.

The norm isn’t good enough? This is without a doubt, the most radical Administration in modern American history.

Funny enough, Trump doesn’t come close to being elected without whiny ass spoiled baby boomers. He is a whiny ass spoiled baby boomer!
 
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IrishinSyria

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I think this is a fair criticism. One reason I don't FAFO with LEOs is b/c I expect Johnny Macho's with Napoleon complexes are going to be happy to flex on me, rights be damned. I don't have the luxury of an army of "observers" in my wake. Demonizing these jobs is only going to give you shittier pools of applicants. I would actively advocate against my children joining any three letter agency.
I mostly agree with this. I don’t think the mindset that they’re dangerous, rights be damned, is consistent with the oath they took, and I’m not sure when I start having affirmative obligations under the oath I took, but for now I have a young daughter to raise so I’ll stick to being angry online.
 

IrishinSyria

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Yeah Trump’s sticking it to China is very 2016 coded. Consensus is we’re in full TACO mode with China now, which is why Chinese stocks ripped in 2025 (MSCI China, for example, was up 30% on the year).
 

GATTACA!

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I think this is a fair criticism. One reason I don't FAFO with LEOs is b/c I expect Johnny Macho's with Napoleon complexes are going to be happy to flex on me, rights be damned. I don't have the luxury of an army of "observers" in my wake. Demonizing these jobs is only going to give you shittier pools of applicants. I would actively advocate against my children joining any three letter agency.
Here’s a crazy thought, maybe we hold the ones that fuck up and do terrible jobs accountable? Maybe you’ll get better applicants when applicants know they aren’t hated because the worst of the worst are being protected.
 

NDWarrior

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Immigration, like a lot of societal issues that warrant debate, is a politically-charged topic.

Why don't we look at another societal issue that warrants debate and compare it to immigration - Drug use/misuse


We have an undocumented immigration challenge in this country.

- According to Pew Research in July 2023, there are an estimated 14 million undocumented immigrants (4.1% of the total U.S. population) and probably grew more through the end of 2024
- According to the Heritage Foundation, previous admins including the Biden admin have not done a good job locking up criminal illegal aliens where ICE estimates that before Trump began his 2nd term, 95% of criminal illegal aliens were allowed to roam free in the U.S. which they calculate to be 662,566 criminal illegal aliens
- Yet, per the Cato Institute in a late 2025 study, only 5% of People Detained By ICE Have Violent Convictions, 73% No Convictions, so it doesn't appear that ICE is focusing it efforts on "the worst of the worst," despite a near doubling of detention centers and ICE/CBP forces.

We also have a drug misuse challenge in the U.S.; technically people with drug dependence or misuse are breaking the law as the possession or use of most drugs is illegal in every state.
The U.S. does a decent job of locking up those caught with drugs or drug abusers who commit crimes, but there is still a majority of drug users/abusers that is not locked up that presumably is committing crimes, causing a lot of damage, and bringing chaos to families and communities.

- It's estimated that roughly 5% of the U.S. general adult population (about $265 mill.) or about 13.25 mill. people meet the criteria for drug dependence or abuse
- It's also estimated that roughly 3 million people with substance use disorders are "locked up" (arrested or incarcerated) in any given year

So we have about 10.25 million people with drug dependency in the U.S., a population that has a much higher potential to cause familial and societal damage in this country compared to 13.35 mill. undocumented immigrants (the ones who do not have major criminal records) who are much less likely to commit crimes and cause societal damage; yet, we're sending aggressive armed forces into major cities (not all cities equally btw) to canvas neighborhoods, break windows, and unleash brutality on these cities to find the illegals.

Why aren't we rapidly building up DEA/other forces to go after illegal drug users, who from a societal perspective are already causing damage to this country and who are much more likely to commit crimes from break-ins to robberies, and even murders. Why aren't we combing through residences and workplaces, breaking down their doors, smashing their car windows, and looking for drugs and abusers? Why aren't we grabbing and detaining suspected drug users by the way they look / are dressed and bringing them to detention centers and giving them drug tests to determine if they're clean or not?
 
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Blazers46

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My first boss once ranted to me that back in his day, diversity training meant being told to accept the Catholics. Boy that was fun. 😆

Speaking of hilarious

I remember my dad telling me that his diversity trainings mostly involved incorporating women into the workspace.
 

drayer54

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Immigration, like a lot of societal issues that warrant debate, is a politically-charged topic.

Why don't we look at another societal issue that warrants debate and compare it to immigration - Drug use/misuse
There is no debate. I have seen no argument from the left on the economic and societal value of importing the third world. No explanation to taxpayers as to why the welfare for these bums is a net gain for the US. Reminder that moderate democrats do not exist. Much like Virginia dems, Joe Biden did not campaign on a radical agenda. He was supposed to be return to “norms”, not 3+ million people flooding our country every year and the “most progressive administration in history.” He never campaigned on his immigration agenda. They just did it because they could. They were Sinema and Manchin away from a partisan overhaul of elections and more.
Democrats never debated that we are a better country with people like below, they just decided that they like these people more than their political opposition, so they imported them as fast as they possibly could. Show me where we have had an honest debate on open borders? We are just now getting Newsom to acknowledge taxpayer funded healthcare for illegals. He will be made to defend that when he runs for POTUS.



Protesting to protect this
 

NDVirginia19

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Wait - so ICE deported this guy before justice could be served and he could be held accountable for killing someone.

And, you think this supports your argument?
Considering the jurisdiction he’s in and the kinds of District Attorneys these liberal cities have, he wouldn’t have faced any real justice.
 

Fbolt

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I’m not so naive as to think that everyone I served with sees it this way, but I think at a bare minimum any self respecting veteran or law enforcement officer is looking at the way CBP/ICE has been operating and thinking that we were held to much higher standards than these chucklefucks.
There you go thinking again.
 

TorontoGold

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Man it is fucking wild to read people claiming multiculturalism is a dead ideology on a fucking Notre Dame FIGHTING FUCKING IRISH forum knowing that my ancestors dealt with the same shit when they came over.

Some people just want to live in little communes like Jim Jones under strict authoritarian rule.

They don’t have any fucking clue the benefits they get from the hegemonic power the US has. Imagine going back to post WW1 and telling US leadership that taking steps to become the dominant super power was bad because of race and culture mixing cuz some random neckbeards in rural Midwest say so.

The entitlement is crazy. I’m not sure if Tracey is going to call me a paid socialist agitator, but if she does so be it. When you rape the resources around the world and force yourself into every nation there are going to be side effects. But double wide in Methville aint lieking it cuz shawarma is too dang spicy and ethnic!
 

Polish Leppy 22

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So when you called the Dems fascist, which fascists would you compare them to? We’ve established Nazi’s are a no go, so which did you mean? Just want to make sure that we all understand the ground rules of calling something fascist. We speaking USSR Stalin, Mussolini? Which is appropriate.

Fuck man, the Dunkin in Minneapolis has a broken window? Fuck, that’s horrible. I hope they have insurance so they can get the costs covered! Anyways, really glad ICE is struggling to hit Obama numbers. Remember the race baiting communist that he’s known as around here.
It doesn't matter who I would compare them to. That's irrelevant. 2026 ICE isn't anything near Nazi Germany.

Way to admit you're cool with property damage so long as it's done by people with whom you agree.
 

Polish Leppy 22

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Nazi’s didn’t start with concentration camps.

First came the Office for Jewish Emigration.
While that is accurate, the comparison is so far off it doesn't deserve dialogue.

Nazis rounded up legal German citizens they didn't like, took away their rights, and shipped them off to death camps.

ICE is trying to remove illegal aliens who broke our laws, laws that have been on the books for years.
 
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