How many more chances does Golson get?

IRISH in MT

New member
Messages
402
Reaction score
11
I'm pretty convinced that Golson' shoulder was still bothering him in the USC game.

I'm also pretty convinced that there's not a QB in the country who could have won at USC given how our line, receivers, and defense played.


You could be right. BK says it didn't affect his play but maybe his confidence took more of a hit not feeling 100%.

The only way our defense was slowing down U$C on Saturday was if Jarron, Sheldon, Russell, Riggs, Redfield, Schmidt were all 100%. Obviously we weren't even close.

I don't blame that loss on EG nor am I calling for the end of his regime. BUT, from his performance and body language, he needs a break. He will shine again before his career at ND is over but I think Malik needs to get a some starts to motivate EG.
 

Nick Setta

Banned
Messages
521
Reaction score
24
Golson has Dayne Crist syndrome and looks like his puppy died. You cannot play QB here with that mental fragility. While Zaire wasn't great on Saturday, he looked mentally strong and I would like to see him get a shot in a meaningless game. I don't understand why we don't run the ball downhill more when we have Bryant and Folston. Folston is a STUD and is the best RB we've had since the Holtz days and will kill it in the NFL. His vision is too good to be wasted. Bryant is talented but needs more reps.
 

irishandy

Well-known member
Messages
4,340
Reaction score
1,962
The legitimate gripe with Golson is that mentally he hasn't progressed seemingly at all, and has maybe even regressed.

He's late getting the ball out. Has been all year. He holds it until the receiver "wins" and then makes the throw. He also misses wide open guys far too often. The number of times Will Fuller has beaten coverage and Golson has completely missed him is sad, but even more sad are the number of times guys get wide open in the middle of the field and he misses them. I'm guessing height/sight lines are a large component.

Pre-snap, he's mentally inferior to where you'd expect a senior to be. He's only in his second year as a starter but he's had 3 springs and 3 regular seasons of learning the position. He has shown little or no ability to take "control" pre-snap... but this might also be on the coaches, as the whole "check with me" thing is almost surely by design.

Worst of all though, his leadership is terrible. Leadership is very hard to quantify and measure, but in short his body language is poor and he does almost nothing to take ownership/command of the offense. You don't see him demanding accountability from anyone, but that seems reasonable when you see the way he shrugs off accountability and tunes out Kelly on the sideline.

Your QB has to be a leader and cannot be timid or act shell-shocked. The only time I've seen Golson get animated and demand more from the team was against Purdue. Malik Zaire, by contrast, took vocal charge in the USC game the minute he was tapped to go in. He tried to get guys fired up and to give maximum effort.

I still think Golson is the starter next year and that he can be a great QB, but from Northwestern onward I have been really disappointed with how he exudes a "don't want to be here" type of attitude on the sideline... and how he still can't get the ball out on time to wide open guys.

Maybe regressed...try definitely regressed.

Zaire showed more leadership than Golson did all year. Golson reminds me of this year's Cam Newton.

Do you seriously think Golson can lead ND to the playoffs? I don't.

ND started out 6-0 and could've easily lost the last 6 the way Navy played us.

I think Zaire gave BK something to think about moving forward with the QB position.

If Golson has the guts to stick around next year and he is given a 5th year, the competition from 2012 with Rees, Hendrix, and Kiel doesn't compare to next year's competition.
 

IRISH in MT

New member
Messages
402
Reaction score
11
After BK's comments on the QB battle, do you think he is serious it is a competition? I would be happy if he just held accountability. In other words, a short leash for whoever the QB is. Time to bring back his Cincinatti philosophy and be willing to give the hook if the starter doesn't show up on Saturdays.
 

Crazy Balki

Site Assigned Optimist
Messages
7,868
Reaction score
4,477
After BK's comments on the QB battle, do you think he is serious it is a competition? I would be happy if he just held accountability. In other words, a short leash for whoever the QB is. Time to bring back his Cincinatti philosophy and be willing to give the hook if the starter doesn't show up on Saturdays.

I don't think his QB carousal at Cincy had anything to do with under-performing. Didn't Pike get hurt and that's what got Calaros the starting job and then eventually began the 2-QB system?

Either way, I think it's legitimate. It doesn't really make much sense to call for a QB competition and not mean it this late in the year.
 

Irish#1

Livin' Your Dream!
Staff member
Messages
44,591
Reaction score
20,040
After BK's comments on the QB battle, do you think he is serious it is a competition? I would be happy if he just held accountability. In other words, a short leash for whoever the QB is. Time to bring back his Cincinatti philosophy and be willing to give the hook if the starter doesn't show up on Saturdays.

If he's not serious then I have questions about his coaching ability given EG's performance.
 

IRISH in MT

New member
Messages
402
Reaction score
11
If he's not serious then I have questions about his coaching ability given EG's performance.

Sh!t, I questioned him not giving EG the yank after the ASU debacle. Especially after we lost to NW.

I don't think his QB carousal at Cincy had anything to do with under-performing. Didn't Pike get hurt and that's what got Calaros the starting job and then eventually began the 2-QB system?

Either way, I think it's legitimate. It doesn't really make much sense to call for a QB competition and not mean it this late in the year.

I think it is stupid to start a competition this late in the year. I say spend all the time prepping your starter. I think Malik should get the nod to see if he can build off USC. I think Malik deserves a shot to be the starter. So get his @ss ready for the nasty LSU defense!
 

IRISH in MT

New member
Messages
402
Reaction score
11
Now that BK claims he is playing 2 QB's against LSU, do you think it will be 50/50 on possessions for each? I don't like QB controversies and playing 2 QB's but do think it is the best test. Play them both against the same defense and see who can rise and lead the best. Apples to Apples comparison that way.
 

Irish#1

Livin' Your Dream!
Staff member
Messages
44,591
Reaction score
20,040
Sh!t, I questioned him not giving EG the yank after the ASU debacle. Especially after we lost to NW.



I think it is stupid to start a competition this late in the year. I say spend all the time prepping your starter. I think Malik should get the nod to see if he can build off USC. I think Malik deserves a shot to be the starter. So get his @ss ready for the nasty LSU defense!

Now that BK claims he is playing 2 QB's against LSU, do you think it will be 50/50 on possessions for each? I don't like QB controversies and playing 2 QB's but do think it is the best test. Play them both against the same defense and see who can rise and lead the best. Apples to Apples comparison that way.

He's starting the competition for next year. I've posted several times, I think it will be 60-40 Golson, unless MZ shows he can move the team with regularity.
 

Irish Insanity

Well-known member
Messages
9,885
Reaction score
584
I think it'll be 75% or more Golson. When Kelly said the Offense needed to help the D out he mentioned Golson making plays. I didn't read anything about Zaire.
 

IRISH in MT

New member
Messages
402
Reaction score
11
He's starting the competition for next year. I've posted several times, I think it will be 60-40 Golson, unless MZ shows he can move the team with regularity.

I think it'll be 75% or more Golson. When Kelly said the Offense needed to help the D out he mentioned Golson making plays. I didn't read anything about Zaire.

I am hoping Malik gets a fair share or is able to produce when he is in. Then again, if the "competition" makes EG play lights out like he has shown he is capable of, then ultimately that was what I hoped for at the start of this thread. I just want better play at the QB position whoever it is.

All that said, as well as EG has shown he can play I have so many bad memories now that I don't have the same comfort with him starting as I did back in September.
 

EddytoNow

Vbuck Redistributor
Messages
1,481
Reaction score
235
Kelly's comments regarding his quarterbacks are very much like a politician's comments. The words sound good, but there is very little follow-through to indicate that he really believes what he has just said. Last spring we heard that the competition at quarterback was very close and that Zaire was doing some wonderful things and might even beat out Golson for the starting position. Flash forward to the start of the season and Golson is the starter, and when Golson fails to produce late in the season we still don't see Zaire on the field. Kelly's talk about a quarterback competition is really meant for Zaire and Kizer. He doesn't want either to transfer, so he constantly talks of a quarterback competition to encourage them to stay. In reality, he has no intention of starting anyone but Golson next season. There is no competition. Golson will get the majority of the snaps against LSU. Zaire will get a series or two. Zaire and Kizer will be told there is an open competition for the starting position next season, but the job is Golson's until he is injured or decides to leave. Hopefully, both Zaire and Kizer stay, but if they decide to take their talent elsewhere I, for one, wouldn't blame them.
 

EddytoNow

Vbuck Redistributor
Messages
1,481
Reaction score
235
There are two separate questions here:

1. How many more chances should Golson get?
2. How many more chances will Brian Kelly give him?

My answer to #1 is that we should have seen Malik by now. My answer to #2 is that I don't think he'll play a meaningful snap until 2016.

Wizard and I have had our differences in the political threads, but he is spot on regarding the so-called quarterback competition. I only hope Malik is still playing for Notre Dame in 2016 and not discouraged to the point of taking his talents elsewhere.
 

IRISH in MT

New member
Messages
402
Reaction score
11
Kelly's comments regarding his quarterbacks are very much like a politician's comments. The words sound good, but there is very little follow-through to indicate that he really believes what he has just said. Last spring we heard that the competition at quarterback was very close and that Zaire was doing some wonderful things and might even beat out Golson for the starting position. Flash forward to the start of the season and Golson is the starter, and when Golson fails to produce late in the season we still don't see Zaire on the field. Kelly's talk about a quarterback competition is really meant for Zaire and Kizer. He doesn't want either to transfer, so he constantly talks of a quarterback competition to encourage them to stay. In reality, he has no intention of starting anyone but Golson next season. There is no competition. Golson will get the majority of the snaps against LSU. Zaire will get a series or two. Zaire and Kizer will be told there is an open competition for the starting position next season, but the job is Golson's until he is injured or decides to leave. Hopefully, both Zaire and Kizer stay, but if they decide to take their talent elsewhere I, for one, wouldn't blame them.


I think you are spot on! Make it seem like everyone has a chance so no one transfers knowing full and well he has all his chips of EG. Malik, Kizer, and Wimbush were all ELITE 11 QB's so why is his trust and love so entrenched with EG?! I see Kizer being the odd man out with Wimbush coming in...
 

IRISH in MT

New member
Messages
402
Reaction score
11
The competition at QB did exactly what I had hoped for...put a focus on ball security. You could tell BOTH QB's were scared to make a mistake with the other pacing on the sidelines waiting to get into the game and make the next big play for the team. I thought Malik deserved the MVP award but want to applaud EG for his maturity and clutch play when he was needed. EG showed he was trying to protect the ball better. Malik is a true difference maker and a true "dual-threat" QB.

This offseason is going to be dramatic! I don't want a QB controversy but I like the fact BK has both QB's on a short leash now and willing to go with whoever has the hotter hand.
 

DonnieNarco

Banned
Messages
322
Reaction score
26
The competition at QB did exactly what I had hoped for...put a focus on ball security. You could tell BOTH QB's were scared to make a mistake with the other pacing on the sidelines waiting to get into the game and make the next big play for the team. I thought Malik deserved the MVP award but want to applaud EG for his maturity and clutch play when he was needed. EG showed he was trying to protect the ball better. Malik is a true difference maker and a true "dual-threat" QB.

This offseason is going to be dramatic! I don't want a QB controversy but I like the fact BK has both QB's on a short leash now and willing to go with whoever has the hotter hand.

This is why I want to see a 2 QB system next year. Both of them have the general skillset to play the same offense but both have special skills to stand out from each other. It will also keep them on their toes and more conscious of mistakes.
 

PANDFAN

Look Down
Messages
16,770
Reaction score
2,278
<blockquote class="twitter-tweet" lang="en"><p>RT <a href="https://twitter.com/MikeMonaco_">@MikeMonaco_</a>: Full comments from Brian Kelly on Everett Golson on <a href="https://twitter.com/SportsCenter">@SportsCenter</a>: <a href="http://t.co/b6f9wy9Rjw">pic.twitter.com/b6f9wy9Rjw</a></p>— Rachel Terlep (@eTruth_Irish) <a href="https://twitter.com/eTruth_Irish/status/553255507474251776">January 8, 2015</a></blockquote>
<script async src="//platform.twitter.com/widgets.js" charset="utf-8"></script>
 

Whiskeyjack

Mittens Margaritas Ante Porcos
Staff member
Messages
20,894
Reaction score
8,126
<blockquote class="twitter-tweet" lang="en"><p>RT <a href="https://twitter.com/MikeMonaco_">@MikeMonaco_</a>: Full comments from Brian Kelly on Everett Golson on <a href="https://twitter.com/SportsCenter">@SportsCenter</a>: <a href="http://t.co/b6f9wy9Rjw">pic.twitter.com/b6f9wy9Rjw</a></p>— Rachel Terlep (@eTruth_Irish) <a href="https://twitter.com/eTruth_Irish/status/553255507474251776">January 8, 2015</a></blockquote>
<script async src="//platform.twitter.com/widgets.js" charset="utf-8"></script>

For those too lazy to click through:

B62NKo9CMAA--LH.png
 

PANDFAN

Look Down
Messages
16,770
Reaction score
2,278
<blockquote class="twitter-tweet" lang="en"><p>24 schools (6 SEC) have expressed interested in ND’s Everett Golson, if he decides to transfer, source told <a href="https://twitter.com/espn">@ESPN</a></p>— Brett McMurphy (@McMurphyESPN) <a href="https://twitter.com/McMurphyESPN/status/554665345936396288">January 12, 2015</a></blockquote>
<script async src="//platform.twitter.com/widgets.js" charset="utf-8"></script>
 

kmoose

Banned
Messages
10,298
Reaction score
1,181
Coachspeak translator... calculating..

Result:

Everett told me that he is not interested in a graduate degree, and will only apply to graduate school if he is going to be the starting QB next year. I told him to win the job in Spring practice.
 

SoDakDomer

New member
Messages
403
Reaction score
21
Only true way to evaluate these two guys in the spring is to leave the red jerseys in the locker room.
 

IRISH in MT

New member
Messages
402
Reaction score
11
Only true way to evaluate these two guys in the spring is to leave the red jerseys in the locker room.



YUP! I think we have enough talent at the position to do a lot more live evaluation.

Does EG seriously think he is going to be a QB in the NFL?! That is the only reason for him to transfer...so he could be a true starter and take 90% of the snaps at another school in hopes to get his stats back in line to impress the scouts.

IF he truly wants to win a National Championship over his own personal aspirations, then he will stay at ND with all the ridiculous talent and experience coming back.
 

IrishinSyria

In truth lies victory
Messages
6,043
Reaction score
1,920
YUP! I think we have enough talent at the position to do a lot more live evaluation.

Does EG seriously think he is going to be a QB in the NFL?! That is the only reason for him to transfer...so he could be a true starter and take 90% of the snaps at another school in hopes to get his stats back in line to impress the scouts.

IF he truly wants to win a National Championship over his own personal aspirations, then he will stay at ND with all the ridiculous talent and experience coming back.

Average practice squad compensation is over $100,000 a year. Rookie minimum is $420,000. There's a lot of incentive to prioritize NFL first, even if your highest aspiration is to sneak into a back-up role after a year or two on a practice squad. At best, ND has about a 10-15% chance of winning a NC next year. How much would you be willing to give up for that shot?
 

Luckylucci

Administrator
Staff member
Messages
27,769
Reaction score
10,146
Wiltfong posted on the Irish247 board that he thinks Golson should be the QB for 2015
 

wizards8507

Well-known member
Messages
20,660
Reaction score
2,661
Wiltfong posted on the Irish247 board that he thinks Golson should be the QB for 2015
Can you clarify "should"? "Should" like he thinks that will be the case? Or "should" like if it were up to him, that would be the case?
 

Luckylucci

Administrator
Staff member
Messages
27,769
Reaction score
10,146
Here what he said. "He's the guy in my mind for 2015." I take that as him saying that he thinks Golson should be the QB next year.
 

Irish#1

Livin' Your Dream!
Staff member
Messages
44,591
Reaction score
20,040
Average practice squad compensation is over $100,000 a year. Rookie minimum is $420,000. There's a lot of incentive to prioritize NFL first, even if your highest aspiration is to sneak into a back-up role after a year or two on a practice squad. At best, ND has about a 10-15% chance of winning a NC next year. How much would you be willing to give up for that shot?

At best EG has a 3% chance of making an NFL roster given his height, slowness working through progressions (when he does), late release, fumbling, etc.. NFL teams will take guys taller with the same characteristics as Golson's before they take him. Because of his arm strength he should get a UFA invite somewhere, just don't see him making even a practice squad.
 
Top