Chris "Belt To" Ash - Defensive Coordinator

[PutuporShutup]

I don't know how any fan or media member can actually call out play calling because, you know, none of them actually know what the play call is. I mean, sure, you can make an educated guess when watching the film what it looks like is supposed to happen, but that assumes what you're seeing is executed correctly by the players. According to MMFF, that's not happening.

I think people are too often to jump to: bad play result = bad play call. That's not always the case.

That said, the defense is a mess and there's plenty of experience and talent out there for that not to be the case. So, something is clearly wrong.

I think at times the coverage (especially with ash) is obvious to fans and the opposing teams. Take the TD play with 13 seconds on the clock. That was pretty clearly Cover 1 with 2 lbs ready to help underneath crossers. With 13 seconds left (really one play), why would you run cover 1 with stroman in center field and tae closer to the LOS. IF you play Dime cover 2 and give up 5-10 yards it just shortens the FG attempt. It was like in that moment ash said, ok, they're getting nothing here, after you just played soft coverage the 3-4 plays prior.

You're asking our DBs (Zackery) to hold up with a four man rush, cover 1, no help, and your edge rushers are junior and logan thomas (not good rushers). Now, zackery does a good job of pushing him to the safety help at first but he gets burned allowing the WR to cut back to the open area, that can't happen with that call in that scenario.

Bad call, personnel usage and execution. If freeman only believes it's the execution portion of that, then the D will NOT be improving that much.

 

[Rizzophil]

I think Freeman is right insofar as the overall cover 4 system Ash is teaching is fairly sound. These are 2 safety concepts NFL defenses are using to slowdown the most potent passing attacks in the game. This isn't a BVG or Tenuta situation where he's calling a fundamentally unsound defense (which BVG got away with thanks to the AA level play of Day and Smith). And the "playcalls" within the context of that scheme are reasonable.

The issues with ND running the cover 4 as of now are 1) it doesn't have the horses on the DL to win pass rushing snaps in the "rush 4" setup and 2) there's a lot of passing plays where the linebackers contribute nothing. Rewatch the last TD of the 1H and focus on Bowen. He's standing about 6 yards deep and has no effect on the play whatsoever. Contrast that to somebody like Tremaine Edmunds who plays great in zone and makes it challenging for pro QBs to make the layered throw between the LBs and DBs. You end up having to make the choice whether you let your LBs play aggressively and blitz heavy or swapping from Bowen to a guy like Faraimo who looked a lot more natural in coverage.

Our front four was awesome last year. This year with Traore and Jordan B, we are average at best

 

[PutuporShutup]

I think Freeman is right insofar as the overall cover 4 system Ash is teaching is fairly sound. These are 2 safety concepts NFL defenses are using to slowdown the most potent passing attacks in the game. This isn't a BVG or Tenuta situation where he's calling a fundamentally unsound defense (which BVG got away with thanks to the AA level play of Day and Smith). And the "playcalls" within the context of that scheme are reasonable.

The issues with ND running the cover 4 as of now are 1) it doesn't have the horses on the DL to win pass rushing snaps in the "rush 4" setup and 2) there's a lot of passing plays where the linebackers contribute nothing. Rewatch the last TD of the 1H and focus on Bowen. He's standing about 6 yards deep and has no effect on the play whatsoever. Contrast that to somebody like Tremaine Edmunds who plays great in zone and makes it challenging for pro QBs to make the layered throw between the LBs and DBs. You end up having to make the choice whether you let your LBs play aggressively and blitz heavy or swapping from Bowen to a guy like Faraimo who looked a lot more natural in coverage.

Good stuff. Like you said and also how he's utilizing our personnel in his scheme is bad.

Why is bowen ever in during a clear passing situation?

How or why he's not playing young 60+% of the time is a head scratcher. He's getting around 30% of the reps. Botelho isn't healthy, junior isn't a pass rusher.

It feels like because our ends were able to bull rush knapp and wagner into the QB all fall they expect them to do that vs real tackles not 290lb tackles. If you watch what our ends are doing move wise, it's typically a bull rush.

 

[PutuporShutup]

Our front four was awesome last year. This year with Traore and Jordan B, we are average at best

Not when we didn't have a healthy Mills and Cross. Our dline got abused by PSU and OSU. Traore is doing well, botelho is not close to back to normal. Need young to start taking junior and botelho snaps.

 

[Free Manera]

I think Freeman is right insofar as the overall cover 4 system Ash is teaching is fairly sound. These are 2 safety concepts NFL defenses are using to slowdown the most potent passing attacks in the game. This isn't a BVG or Tenuta situation where he's calling a fundamentally unsound defense (which BVG got away with thanks to the AA level play of Day and Smith). And the "playcalls" within the context of that scheme are reasonable.

The issues with ND running the cover 4 as of now are 1) it doesn't have the horses on the DL to win pass rushing snaps in the "rush 4" setup and 2) there's a lot of passing plays where the linebackers contribute nothing. Rewatch the last TD of the 1H and focus on Bowen. He's standing about 6 yards deep and has no effect on the play whatsoever. Contrast that to somebody like Tremaine Edmunds who plays great in zone and makes it challenging for pro QBs to make the layered throw between the LBs and DBs. You end up having to make the choice whether you let your LBs play aggressively and blitz heavy or swapping from Bowen to a guy like Faraimo who looked a lot more natural in coverage.

Have you watched the D line specifically at all? Ash/Freeman seem dedicated to getting pressure with 4 but clearly it's not happening and the question is why? Every time I focused on the line, I saw no pre-snap movement and no stunting or twisting. I don't know if they think ND has 4 Reggie Whites out there or what but it seems like you gotta try to give them some advantages.

Jamie U. mentioned this on a pod at some point too, that Golden's defense involved lots of stemming and that seems to be totally absent now.

 

[BoredIrish]

Have you watched the D line specifically at all? Ash/Freeman seem dedicated to getting pressure with 4 but clearly it's not happening and the question is why? Every time I focused on the line, I saw no pre-snap movement and no stunting or twisting. I don't know if they think ND has 4 Reggie Whites out there or what but it seems like you gotta try to give them some advantages.

Jamie U. mentioned this on a pod at some point too, that Golden's defense involved lots of stemming and that seems to be totally absent now.

I just dont understand how the narrative on this defense is that there is a need to simplify things, when it looks like last years defense was much more intricate?

 

[NDFAN2008]

Have you watched the D line specifically at all? Ash/Freeman seem dedicated to getting pressure with 4 but clearly it's not happening and the question is why? Every time I focused on the line, I saw no pre-snap movement and no stunting or twisting. I don't know if they think ND has 4 Reggie Whites out there or what but it seems like you gotta try to give them some advantages.

Jamie U. mentioned this on a pod at some point too, that Golden's defense involved lots of stemming and that seems to be totally absent now.

The reason why they aren't getting pressure is because they don't have to double team anyone one of our DT's. We need to start getting some size in the middle 6'4-6'5 320'330

 

[bobbyok1]

MF says that he's not taking play-calling away from Ash. So, we better hope he figures something out. Quickly.

One of Freeman's greatest strengths seems to be his belief in people, seeing the best in them.

It is also one of his weaknesses in my view. He seems to be prone to sticking with them too long when they are not producing.

Let's hope Ash changes something dramatically and speedily, or Freeman goes against his instincts and takes the reins away from Ash sooner than later

 

[Free Manera]

The reason why they aren't getting pressure is because they don't have to double team anyone one of our DT's. We need to start getting some size in the middle 6'4-6'5 320'330

There are lots of ways to get pressure without demanding double teams. Causing a missed blocking assignment is just as good or better.

I just dont understand how the narrative on this defense is that there is a need to simplify things, when it looks like last years defense was much more intricate?

I think that is almost exclusively referring to the coverage scheme. Can't be referring to the front because they were constantly trying to confuse the line calls and QB last year and they are definitely not this year. But with the coverages something has to be off with how its being taught or communicated. Freeman said something today, that was basically like when they are in zone, the players are not attacking because they are unsure of themselves.

 

[irishff1014]

MF says that he's not taking play-calling away from Ash. So, we better hope he figures something out. Quickly.

Ugh I hope we don’t lose 5 games.

 

[emaugust]

Contrast that to somebody like Tremaine Edmunds who plays great in zone and makes it challenging for pro QBs to make the layered throw between the LBs and DBs.

It is tough when a defense needs a guy like Tremaine Edmunds or Brian Urlacher to work. Yes, it is amazing when you can have an athletically freakish, 6'4 lengthy linebacker to clog up throwing lanes in the middle. But guys like that are unicorns.

I think KVA may be the only player on our roster who can maybe perform that role, and right now it seems like he is lining up on the outside.

 

[Domina Nostra]

Have you watched the D line specifically at all? Ash/Freeman seem dedicated to getting pressure with 4 but clearly it's not happening and the question is why? Every time I focused on the line, I saw no pre-snap movement and no stunting or twisting. I don't know if they think ND has 4 Reggie Whites out there or what but it seems like you gotta try to give them some advantages.

Jamie U. mentioned this on a pod at some point too, that Golden's defense involved lots of stemming and that seems to be totally absent now.

I couldn't agree more. I think this, much more than the coverages, is the real issue.

I've felt this way at many points over the last decade with the running game. Why not just add in some wrinkles and make the LBs and the safeties think more. The wildcat formations last week were an attempt to do something like that.

 

[FWIrish4]

We should have all been skeptical when the best defense he coached was over 10 years ago as co-dc and the redeeming quality passed around was that they tackled well…

 

[MrNimbus]

Chris (tr)ash after the "uncomfortable meeting"...

 

[Jiggafini19Deux]

There was one drive where I swear they ran four different coverages. And none of them worked.

 

[FU BK]

Our front four was awesome last year. This year with Traore and Jordan B, we are average at best

As i sat watching IU curb stomp Illinois, I really was wishing half their d linemen were in South Bend. That Mario Landino has a motor that doesn't quit and was a disruption for Illinois all night. Was also wishing Freeman made a call to their defensive coordinator and d line coach about possible job opportunities

 

[ozzman]

 

[SeekNDestroy]

As i sat watching IU curb stomp Illinois, I really was wishing half their d linemen were in South Bend. That Mario Landino has a motor that doesn't quit and was a disruption for Illinois all night. Was also wishing Freeman made a call to their defensive coordinator and d line coach about possible job opportunities

Pat Kuntz is their DT coach.

 

[The Backer]

Have you watched the D line specifically at all? Ash/Freeman seem dedicated to getting pressure with 4 but clearly it's not happening and the question is why? Every time I focused on the line, I saw no pre-snap movement and no stunting or twisting. I don't know if they think ND has 4 Reggie Whites out there or what but it seems like you gotta try to give them some advantages.

Jamie U. mentioned this on a pod at some point too, that Golden's defense involved lots of stemming and that seems to be totally absent now.

Yup, they badly misjudged the talent level up front. The lack of stemming is intentional as specific pass rush lanes are in effect. In theory, the DL can get their hands up a particular way to obscure a throwing lane while the LBs are supposed to obscure it on the back end of the throw. None of that is actually happening.

I actually this scheme works pretty well when the younger players are ready but you're talking potentially early 26 at the soonest.

 

[SighWillingham]

Have you watched the D line specifically at all? Ash/Freeman seem dedicated to getting pressure with 4 but clearly it's not happening and the question is why? Every time I focused on the line, I saw no pre-snap movement and no stunting or twisting. I don't know if they think ND has 4 Reggie Whites out there or what but it seems like you gotta try to give them some advantages.

Jamie U. mentioned this on a pod at some point too, that Golden's defense involved lots of stemming and that seems to be totally absent now.

This exactly.

Seeing talented players like Traore being asked to just keep slamming themselves into the breach each time with the four man rush, just to load up and do the same thing on the next play is just insane. KVA, Botelho, Sneed are talented pass rushers, but like you said just not Reggie White style rushers. Use their atheleticisim as an advantage. I mean how is this not simple stuff? I know its easy to laugh at us on message boards and say things like "the coaches know more than we do," but come on. Bring the havoc and let our DB's build some momentum and confidence. You also have Leonard Moore basically shutting down an entire side of the field, you have less to do!

This is the stuff that makes it so easy to pin this on Ash. Are you that inept to look at the talent on your roster and tailor a plan to these strengths? Is this vanilla 2000's NFL style defensive bullshit the best you can dial-up? If so, MFMF jump in and kick him down the stairs.

 

[stlnd01]

This exactly.

Seeing talented players like Traore being asked to just keep slamming themselves into the breach each time with the four man rush, just to load up and do the same thing on the next play is just insane. KVA, Botelho, Sneed are talented pass rushers, but like you said just not Reggie White style rushers. Use their atheleticisim as an advantage. I mean how is this not simple stuff? I know its easy to laugh at us on message boards and say things like "the coaches know more than we do," but come on. Bring the havoc and let our DB's build some momentum and confidence. You also have Leonard Moore basically shutting down an entire side of the field, you have less to do!

This is the stuff that makes it so easy to pin this on Ash. Are you that inept to look at the talent on your roster and tailor a plan to these strengths? Is this vanilla 2000's NFL style defensive bullshit the best you can dial-up? If so, MFMF jump in and kick him down the stairs.

The one Golden-style play from Saturday that's been making the rounds on twitter, where Young and Sneed and Ausberry are stunting and just coming in waves. Just do that. Their OL was confused, their QB never had a chance, and three different guys could have had that sack.

 

[FU BK]

Pat Kuntz is their DT coach.

Time for ole Pat to come home

 

[NDWarrior]

My apologies if this already has been discussed, but are there any buyout implications for Ash (ok, Ass!)?

 

[Bane]

Beyond me thinking Ash just sucks at designing and calling defense, it feels like no one wants to play for him. Whereas it felt like players would die for Golden, I don't think Ash inspires any sort of love. He feels like an odd man out and doesn't seem like he meshes with the vibe of the team. Of course, that's just my outsider perspective.

 

[stlnd01]

My apologies if this already has been discussed, but are there any buyout implications for Ash (ok, Ass!)?

Presumably we'd have to pay him out for the season but I can not imagine we offered a multiyear contract with any meaningful buyout to an assistant coach we hired off the scrap heap. This was not like hiring Jim Knowles away from Ohio State.
Again, another reason there's little downside to cutting him loose. Easy come, easy go.

 

[ulukinatme]

Driskell calling out Freeman saying play calling is the issue.

Wow. What an observation

I'm shocked that the washed up D3 coach came away with the same assessment the rest of us knew a month ago.

 

[PolishDomer]

He is so bad even little kids know...

 

[SportsingHard]

I'm shocked that the washed up D3 coach came away with the same assessment the rest of us knew a month ago.

1) How anybody looks at ND's pass coverage (in man or zone) and pass rush (when sending 4, 5, or 6 guys) and decides playcalling is the issue is beyond me. We can debate the many possible reasons why we look like the Keystone Cops, but we do know the D looks like garbage regardless of playcalling.

2) Nothing says trenchant Irish Envy analysis like declaring, nine days before the season starts, that the biggest problems with the first three games is playcalling.

 

[ulukinatme]

1) How anybody looks at ND's pass coverage (in man or zone) and pass rush (when sending 4, 5, or 6 guys) and decides playcalling is the issue is beyond me. We can debate the many possible reasons why we look like the Keystone Cops, but we do know the D looks like garbage regardless of playcalling.

2) Nothing says trenchant Irish Envy analysis like declaring, nine days before the season starts, that the biggest problems with the first three games is playcalling.

So it's your assessment that losing Watts, Kiser, and Mills somehow turned out Top 10 defense into a bottom feeder and the coaching had nothing to do with it? That sounds like a serious development issue then, like fire the entire defensive staff. Guess Ash is gone either way.

 

[ColoradoIrish]

The players look absolutely lost on the field, the body language is terrible as well. They look slow as well. All of that is because of coaching. It's a combination of teaching and installation, play calling, player rotations, not putting players in situations to play to their strengths, and forcing them to think too much instead of flying around and just play like we saw for the last two years. That's definitely on Ass, not sure how you can see it any other way.