Chicago White Sox... The thread.

[Southside Sully]

Melky doesn't suck. His $15M contract sucks. Anyone who bats .286 (both this year and over a 13 year career) doesn't suck, regardless of their defensive shortcomings. He's just too expensive at full price for those that need a proven stick. If the Sox said they'd pick up $5M or the $7.5M he's owed for the second half, he'd be a target... same as Frazier. Hahn's waiting to see if injuries or circumstance change the market but don't be surprised if the Sox pay them to leave and play some prospects on the fight for the #2-#5 pick.

This... he is a career .286 hitter, a world series champion, so he gives that experience to a contender. He is 22nd in RBI's. A contending team that could use a veteran bat, and rbi producer will take a look at him, like crusader said, if sox help with the price tag.

 

[Rogue219]

Melky doesn't suck.

Yes he does.

A good portion of the baseball community has moved on from batting average, and for good reason.

I can't think of a single contender he'd make better right now. If ANYONE called Rick Hahn about a rental here, he'd probably fly at the chance of moving this guy out the door if he could.

 

[Rogue219]

This... he is a career .286 hitter, a world series champion, so he gives that experience to a contender. He is 22nd in RBI's. A contending team that could use a veteran bat, and rbi producer will take a look at him, like crusader said, if sox help with the price tag.

If a general manager is looking at his batting average and RBIs, I weep for that team.

What contending team can use him? He's horrible defensively, even for a left fielder, and doesn't give you anywhere near the OBP and SLG to make up for being bad at a corner outfield position.

Among qualified MLB LF who are regulars, he's horrendous. Nobody is going to want him, and if you get a phone call from one that does, you don't hang up until you've agreed on a deal. Rick Hahn would bust a nut to get him out the door today if he could.

 

[BobbyMac]

Rogue,

Those baseball guys who have moved on from batting averages aren't sitting in the ALCS or the World Series down a run, a runner on second with two outs in the 11th and looking down the bench for a guy who's been there to pinch hit. Top that off, he's a switch batting .283/R & .295/L.

I don't need to look at the contender's rosters to know, everyone trying to win a WS needs a guy like that because those situations come up every year.

 

[Rogue219]

Rogue,

Those baseball guys who have moved on from batting averages aren't sitting in the ALCS or the World Series down a run, a runner on second with two outs in the 11th and looking down the bench for a guy who's been there to pinch hit. Top that off, he's a switch batting .283/R & .295/L.

I don't need to look at the contender's rosters to know, everyone trying to win a WS needs a guy like that because those situations come up every year.

I'd want someone good in that random, hypothetical scenario you described. If I'm in that situation, I don't want Melky Cabrera near it by choice or by chance. He's garbage.

Melky has had 80 PA in the postseason and he's been worse than his career averages during that time, and his slash line isn't anything special overall for his career. Small sample size, but he generally sucks is the moral of the story. Zero defense value (negative, in fact) and he should thank his lucky stars he won a World Series because if you look at his numbers that year, he wasn't exactly a reason the Yankees won anything.

Again, if I'm Rick Hahn and I get this phone call, I try to contain my excitement by hitting the mute button on my phone as I'm laughing to myself. Whatever I get in return is a bonus.

 

[Irish2155]

BoSox fans certainly don't want to see Melky go to another contender. He's always hit Boston pitching well. The White Sox game I went to this year he hit a bomb off of Price. Freaking been a thorn in our side over the years.

 

[BobbyMac]

I'd want someone good in that random, hypothetical scenario you described. If I'm in that situation, I don't want Melky Cabrera near it by choice or by chance. He's garbage.

he should thank his lucky stars he won a World Series because if you look at his numbers that year, he wasn't exactly a reason the Yankees won anything.

He was the ALCS MVP in 2009, that series you have to play before the World Series.

Ask ACamp


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.

 

[Rogue219]

BoSox fans certainly don't want to see Melky go to another contender. He's always hit Boston pitching well. The White Sox game I went to this year he hit a bomb off of Price. Freaking been a thorn in our side over the years.

I seriously doubt he's going to beat them all by himself in a pennant race or a playoff series.

He has more plate appearances against Boston than any other team he's faced in his career, since you mentioned it.

 

[Rogue219]

He was the ALCS MVP in 2009, that series you have to play before the World Series.

Ask ACamp


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.

What can ACamp tell us about sample size? That a bad player was good for six games once. I assume he's a smart chap in addition to an Angels fan?

0.6 WAR average in the last five years, and in two of those years, he was one of the worst players in baseball.

You like him, and I guess that's okay.

 

[Rogue219]

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/League_Championship_Series_Most_Valuable_Player_Award

Here is a list of ALCS MVP winners. In 2009 CC Sabathia won it for the Yankees. It isn't so much that as it is the list of players who have won this award, which is based on performance in as many as 7 games and as little as 4; but the names on this list. A few stand out, but mostly, a lot of trivia question type people.

Delmon Young won it a few years later. Delmon Young. That was in a four game sweep, mind you, but Delmon Young. I'd venture to guess that Melky Cabrera is better at baseball than Delmon Young.

 

[Irish2155]

He was the ALCS MVP in 2009, that series you have to play before the World Series.

Ask ACamp


.


.

He was also on the juice...

 

[Irish2155]

I seriously doubt he's going to beat them all by himself in a pennant race or a playoff series.

He has more plate appearances against Boston than any other team he's faced in his career, since you mentioned it.

No shit...you think? Do you think Babe Ruth could beat the Rockford Peaches all by himself?

I didn't say that nor do I think he is all that great of a ball player. He is however a thorn in the Redsox side and continues to be. Fucker always hits well against Boston...

 

[Crazy Balki]

I think you can get some decent depth bodies in your farm system for Melky. Nothing special, but the Sox could some depth especially when the top guys move up.

Having a guy who can drive in runs pays, especially one on an expiring contract. I'm pretty sure some competitors will be more than willing to deal some inconsequential pieces to bolster their offense a shade. All cards on the table.

 

[MacIrish75]

I think you can get some decent depth bodies in your farm system for Melky. Nothing special, but the Sox could some depth especially when the top guys move up.

Having a guy who can drive in runs pays, especially one on an expiring contract. I'm pretty sure some competitors will be more than willing to deal some inconsequential pieces to bolster their offense a shade. All cards on the table.

According to SoxTalk forums, a deal sending Frazier to the BoSox is imminent. Return probably centers around a 8-10 prospect in their system plus 1-2 others.

 

[BobbyMac]

According to SoxTalk forums, a deal sending Frazier to the BoSox is imminent. Return probably centers around a 8-10 prospect in their system plus 1-2 others.

Wish there was some way to get Sam Travis in the deal. Be nice to have a Southside Sox fan on the roster. He's probably their starting first basemen next year though.

 

[Southside Sully]

Frazier lives in my friends building and was telling the door guys this is his last weekend in Chicago. I was at last nights game, and again watching him with the fans and in the dugout he is a great person to have around a club. It's too bad he didn't work out and also too old for the rebuild.

Melky will 100% add value to a team. Went 4-5 last night with his league leading 8th put out for left fielders. Over his last 32 games he has been on fire. Mind you he went 4-5 batting lead off against King Felix and hit a leadoff HR. But no he sucks.

 

[BobbyMac]

Frazier lives in my friends building and was telling the door guys this is his last weekend in Chicago. I was at last nights game, and again watching him with the fans and in the dugout he is a great person to have around a club. It's too bad he didn't work out and also too old for the rebuild.

Melky will 100% add value to a team. Went 4-5 last night with his league leading 8th put out for left fielders. Over his last 32 games he has been on fire. Mind you he went 4-5 batting lead off against King Felix and hit a leadoff HR. But no he sucks.

If Joey Votto was traded to the Sox tomorrow, would he bat .215 with 40 HR's his first year and then .199 / 199 SO's from there on out? The Sox really know how to pick up guys with Early Onset Dave Kingman Syndrome ...right before they go full blown.

As for Melky... he's garbage.

 

[Southside Sully]

Melky...
https://www.facebook.com/WhiteSox/posts/10156537086263298

 

[BobbyMac]

Melky...
https://www.facebook.com/WhiteSox/posts/10156537086263298

Melky Cabrera now has the major-league lead with eight outfield assists and is hitting .346 with five HR, 22 RBI and 22 runs scored over his last 32 games.

You and your facts.

Of the active guys in MLB (20 total) with 1700 hits, only him and Robinson Cano have had 170+ hits over the last three years and are on pace to do it again this year.

Utter garbage.

Rank Player (yrs, age) Hits Bats

1. Ichiro Suzuki (17, 43) 3054 L
2. Adrian Beltre (20, 38) 2980 R
3. Albert Pujols (17, 37) 2906 R
4. Carlos Beltran (20, 40) 2685 B
5. Miguel Cabrera (15, 34) 2594 R
6. Robinson Cano (13, 34) 2299 L
7. Matt Holliday (14, 37) 2057 R
8. Jose Reyes (15, 34) 2039 B
9. Victor Martinez (15, 38) 2003 B
10. Adrian Gonzalez (14, 35) 1996 L
11. Nick Markakis (12, 33) 1984 L
12. Brandon Phillips (16, 36) 1952 R
13. Joe Mauer (14, 34) 1906 L
14. Chase Utley (15, 38) 1822 L
15. David Wright (13, 34) 1777 R
16. Dustin Pedroia (12, 33) 1770 R
17. Ian Kinsler (12, 35) 1763 R
18. Jhonny Peralta (15, 35) 1761 R
19. Hanley Ramirez (13, 33) 1734 R
20. Melky Cabrera (13, 32) 1710 B

.

 

[Rogue219]

There appears to be a market for David Robertson and Todd Frazier for the White Sox.

Has there been any mention of interest in Melky Cabrera from anyone? If he continues to do well in a small sample sized window, maybe someone bites in the next two weeks, but there doesn't appear to be a market. You take his money and many shortcomings for two months while trying to win something?

The fact he has eight outfield assists is definitely staggering. That's an eye opener for sure. And it appears he could hit 20 HR for the first time in his career, albeit in the year the ball is flying out of the parks at record pace.

Whether it is before the trade deadline or at the end of the year, he's going to be gone and it's going to be good for the White Sox that he is. Be happy about it.

Speaking of which, they also made a quiet but smart move over the weekend:

White Sox acquire minor-league INF Yeyson Yrizarri from Rangers | Chicago Sun-Times

 

[Rogue219]

https://sports.yahoo.com/nationals-overhaul-bullpen-trade-sean-doolittle-ryan-madson-171647051.html

Does this soften the Robertson market?

 

[Rogue219]

Melky will 100% add value to a team. Went 4-5 last night with his league leading 8th put out for left fielders. Over his last 32 games he has been on fire. Mind you he went 4-5 batting lead off against King Felix and hit a leadoff HR. But no he sucks.

Isn't this pretty much what the guy does? He goes on a big streak once or twice a year and has done so for most of his career? This thread has actually made me dig deeper about Melky Cabrera than I ever would have wanted to if I lived to be 200 years old, but it would appear there isn't a great deal good that can be said versus bad. He's about to turn 33 years old and hasn't been mentioned in a single trade rumor. Robertson and Frazier can be moved, and likely will be. Melky is going to be around for a few more months, then gone, and when the Sox are good again he'll be nowhere to be found. It's a good thing.

102 hits this year. 11 HR and 14 doubles. He's a singles hitting left fielder that doesn't get on base or slug for power enough to make up for his dreadful defense. Zero value as a base runner.

There is no market for a guy like this. Frazier is okay with his glove and will hit you a home run every so often. You can get a fringe prospect for him and dump the remaining money he's owed. If Rick Hahn can do this with Melky Cabrera, consider him a genius. Slide in whatever replacement guy you've got for the remainder of the season and let it ride.

Bottom line, this is a team with an exciting future, and considering where they were just a short time ago you have to give credit to Rick Hahn for what he's done. He's flipped the assets he had and could still move a couple of more. The White Sox are going to be ready in a few years. 17, 18 and maybe even 19 could be painful but there is knowing what the end game is come 2020 and 2021.

It looks a lot like what the Cubs did. It's awesome.

 

[Rogue219]

Word is Boston is trying to get Robertson with Kahnle or Swarzak as part of the Frazier trade. Frazier straight up would be done by now. The White Sox have likely no other takers for Frazier.

Both teams may want to get this done in one stop. Frazier plays third at Boston for two months, Devers comes up next year. Chavis and Swihart could be involved to the White Sox along with some fringe guys.

 

[Southside Sully]

There appears to be a market for David Robertson and Todd Frazier for the White Sox.

Has there been any mention of interest in Melky Cabrera from anyone? If he continues to do well in a small sample sized window, maybe someone bites in the next two weeks, but there doesn't appear to be a market. You take his money and many shortcomings for two months while trying to win something?

The fact he has eight outfield assists is definitely staggering. That's an eye opener for sure. And it appears he could hit 20 HR for the first time in his career, albeit in the year the ball is flying out of the parks at record pace.

Whether it is before the trade deadline or at the end of the year, he's going to be gone and it's going to be good for the White Sox that he is. Be happy about it.

Speaking of which, they also made a quiet but smart move over the weekend:

White Sox acquire minor-league INF Yeyson Yrizarri from Rangers | Chicago Sun-Times

Ya this was a nice pick up that went under the radar at least i think so. I don't know if he can play 3B but give him a shot to do so.

Regarding Melky if the money is right he will be gone. .286 Career BA isn't a small sample size. And as Crusader mentioned he has sustained career numbers over the last 3 years. We can agree to disagree but him being garbage or sucks, just isn't accurate.

I don't know if that trade softens Robertson but there is still a market for him too. Yankees I have heard have inquired about him as well. If he goes with Frazier to the Red Sox, maybe we can grab one of their 3, 3B prospects.

 

[Rogue219]

Ya this was a nice pick up that went under the radar at least i think so. I don't know if he can play 3B but give him a shot to do so.

Regarding Melky if the money is right he will be gone. .286 Career BA isn't a small sample size. And as Crusader mentioned he has sustained career numbers over the last 3 years. We can agree to disagree but him being garbage or sucks, just isn't accurate.

I don't know if that trade softens Robertson but there is still a market for him too. Yankees I have heard have inquired about him as well. If he goes with Frazier to the Red Sox, maybe we can grab one of their 3, 3B prospects.

It's very accurate. It's a question of value, and right now, where is his value? Don't tell me about his batting average or RBIs because there is diminished value in those counting baseball card stats. He's virtually no better than a Triple A replacement player. He doesn't hit well enough to make up for being horrible in the field and on the bases. Yes, he's been doing well recently, perhaps knowing he's in a walk year. That's not likely to sway anyone into taking a chance on getting him for a stretch run. He's owed too much money in the next two months to come in and maybe hit a few singles while being a liability on base (when he gets on) and in the field.

If Boston wants Robertson with Kahnle or Swarzak, they would be far more willing to take Frazier since they need a third baseman holdover versus a guy like Melky Cabrera. Frazier is worse on the bases than Cabrera is, but his power and better defense at third gives him more value. If anyone calls the White Sox about him, Rick Hahn needs to contain his excitement and get him out if at all possible. Why wait?

MLB front offices are looking at much more than batting averages and RBIs. A corner outfielder with no OBP, no SLG and tremendously bad defense along with zero value on the base paths. Cabrera's bad, which is why it is likely no one wants him for a two month rental right now.

 

[GowerND11]

Nice sweep by my Mariners over the weekend...

Carry on.

 

[Southside Sully]

Nice sweep by my Mariners over the weekend...

Carry on.

Nothing like 1 below 500 turd beating another below 500 turd who is in complete rebuild mode. 16.5 back on the Astros looks about in arms reach.

 

[Rogue219]

Yeah, every loss the White Sox sustain is golden right now. There is zero reason to be wanting this team to get hot if you're a White Sox fan. Rick Hahn has committed to all deck chairs going over the side. So congratulations to the Mariners.

 

[IrishSteelhead]

Chicago White Sox... The thread.

Yeah, every loss the White Sox sustain is golden right now. There is zero reason to be wanting this team to get hot if you're a White Sox fan. Rick Hahn has committed to all deck chairs going over the side. So congratulations to the Mariners.

When home attendance dips below 15,000, and they rank last, it won't be a good look though. Gotta give people a reason to go for the present. They are bad enough to lose plenty of games without a full steam ahead tank job, no need to exacerbate it IMO.

*Keep the Crosstown Cup to at least give the SS something to feel good about for a week

 

[Southside Sully]

When home attendance dips below 15,000, and they rank last, it won't be a good look though. Gotta give people a reason to go for the present. They are bad enough to lose plenty of games without a full steam ahead tank job, no need to exacerbate it IMO.

*Keep the Crosstown Cup to at least give the SS something to feel good about for a week

I don't know if I agree with this. Most Sox fans know what they are doing, and tickets are so cheap they are doing better in attendance than one might think. They are averaging about 21,736 a game right now, and last years World Series runner up, Cleveland is averaging 23,229. Yes that isn't a huge number but I don't think you are going to see a drop off especially when they start bringing up some of these young guys, people will want to go see them.