Andrew Hendrix/Everett Golson

[JayRock]

LOL...so you and he are talking crap about this site and/or its users on another site? Or is it just him? So we are you here, and why doesn't he just delete his account here then? Why bash a place but yet still come to it? Shoot me the next time I complain about something but then still use its services even when there are a plethora of competitors to choose from.

Overreact much?

 

[NDinL.A.]

Overreact much?

Not at all. Just laughing at the fact that you would go running to another site with yourself, errrrrrrrrrr, your friend "Timer" to talk crap about this site, and then 10 seconds later you're back here posting away. Again, shoot me if I ever continually go somewhere that I supposedly hate, when there are several other options.

 

[Whiskeyjack]

Not at all. Just laughing at the fact that you would go running to another site with yourself, errrrrrrrrrr, your friend "Timer" to talk crap about this site, and then 10 seconds later you're back here posting away. Again, shoot me if I ever continually go somewhere that I supposedly hate, when there are several other options.

Can we shoot JayRock/ Irish Timer instead?

 

[Kingbish01]

I missed all the fun...By the way, who is this Andrew Hendix/Everett Golson person??

 

[JayRock]

Not at all. Just laughing at the fact that you would go running to another site with yourself, errrrrrrrrrr, your friend "Timer" to talk crap about this site, and then 10 seconds later you're back here posting away. Again, shoot me if I ever continually go somewhere that I supposedly hate, when there are several other options.

I'm just wondering where you found that I hate the site? We both frequent another forum that has nothing to do with Notre Dame other than a Notre Dame Football thread. There, he linked me to IE almost a year ago. How do you even know we were talking crap about IE there?

Shoot me if you want, but you are making **** up.

 

[Kingbish01]

Is he a WR or a TE??

 

[kmoose]

Yes. A very sizable chunk, at least. I know you ascribe that to the whole "the backup QB is always the fan favorite" thing, but I think it is based on the players' respective pedigrees and skill sets and having seen Tommy play. To wit: if Golson and/or Hendrix were ahead of Rees right now, I don't think everyone would be saying about Tommy what they are saying about Golson and Hendrix.

I give Tommy a lot of credit for the way he played last year, but he does not appear to possess the physical tools of a BCS quarterback. He is a valuable asset - a backup QB that the coaches, players and fans can be confident in because we have seen him handle emergency duties before. But I do not believe Notre Dame can get where they want to be with Tommy Rees quarterbacking the team. I hate to say it about the kid, because I like him. But its the truth.

So your contention is that Golson and Hendrix will continue to improve, while Rees will stay the same?

What pedigree and skill set does Hendrix possess, that Rees does not?

 

[Whiskeyjack]

So your contention is that Golson and Hendrix will continue to improve, while Rees will stay the same?

What pedigree and skill set does Hendrix possess, that Rees does not?

The mobility to run the Option Read, QB Draw, extend plays with his feet, etc.

There's a large chunk of Kelly's offense that Rees simply doesn't have the athleticism to execute. That factor alone is a big reason why Hendrix and/or Golson is likely to close the gap on him sooner than later.

 

[BeauBenken]

The mobility to run the Option Read, QB Draw, extend plays with his feet, etc.

There's a large chunk of Kelly's offense that Rees simply doesn't have the athleticism to execute. That factor alone is a big reason why Hendrix and/or Golson is likely to close the gap on him sooner than later.

Not to mention a stronger arm.

 

[kmoose]

The mobility to run the Option Read, QB Draw, extend plays with his feet, etc.

There's a large chunk of Kelly's offense that Rees simply doesn't have the athleticism to execute. That factor alone is a big reason why Hendrix and/or Golson is likely to close the gap on him sooner than later.

Well, I think everyone is overstating the importance of a running QB in Kelly's system. Dayne Crist only ran the ball 4 times a game, when he was healthy. If you look at Cincy's offensive numbers, from the Kelly years, Cincy's run/pass ration was almost exactly 50/50, every year. Again, while Rees is certainly no Tony Rice, he's not Bernie Kosar either. Being able to move around a bit, and extend plays, IS important. But that can be developed. I'm not saying that Golson or Hendrix WON'T overtake Rees. But I am saying that it's not a GIVEN, like a bunch of people seem to think.

 

[kmoose]

Not to mention a stronger arm.

So Longo is going to make everyone on the team stronger, but Rees' arm strength is going to stay the same?

 

[Rocket89]

So your contention is that Golson and Hendrix will continue to improve, while Rees will stay the same?

What pedigree and skill set does Hendrix possess, that Rees does not?

Analogy time.

Rees is like a running back who is solid in pass protection, is decent catching out of the backfield, and is smart and hits the hole and takes what the defense give him running the rock.

He runs a 4.8 40-time and he's likely never going to be the kind of guy you want as your feature back because he's not explosive enough.

Will he improve? Most likely...but at some point he will hit a wall because of his lack of physical gifts.

On the other hand, Hendrix/Golson run 4.5 40's and are bigger and stronger. They're quicker and more dangerous out in the open field. It's just they haven't had enough time to understand the whole system. We see their physical gifts, but they try to find holes that aren't there, miss some blocks in pass protection, and don't understand the nuances of catching the ball out of the backfield.

Sometimes those more gifted players just don't "get it" and they never live up to their potential. But more often, they pass the less gifted player on the depth chart once they gain more experience in the system.

 

[Rocket89]

Again, while Rees is certainly no Tony Rice, he's not Bernie Kosar either.

If Rice is a 8 or 9 on the running QB scale, and Kosar is a 1 or 2...Rees is about a 3.

It's not just that Rees can't run the option reads, but he's limited in his escapability and quickness to avoid big pass rushers too.

 

[Whiskeyjack]

Well, I think everyone is overstating the importance of a running QB in Kelly's system. Dayne Crist only ran the ball 4 times a game, when he was healthy. If you look at Cincy's offensive numbers, from the Kelly years, Cincy's run/pass ration was almost exactly 50/50, every year.

Cinci's run/pass split was only 50/50 under Kelly if you factor in QB runs as well. Taking those out, it was closer to 40/60.

Again, while Rees is certainly no Tony Rice, he's not Bernie Kosar either. Being able to move around a bit, and extend plays, IS important. But that can be developed.

I think this is where you're in the minority. Most of us believe that acceleration, foot speed, etc. are not things that can be easily improved, and even then not improved upon significantly for most people. Rees is the least mobile QB on our roster by a pretty large margin, which prevents our offense from running a lot of very effective spread option plays which would make us far more dangerous in the red zone.

Rees is a lot closer to Kosar than Rice, and in Kelly's offense that's a significant limitation.

I'm not saying that Golson or Hendrix WON'T overtake Rees. But I am saying that it's not a GIVEN, like a bunch of people seem to think.

I don't think it's a given, but I think it's more likely than not. Rees could turn into the next Major Applewhite and hold off the more athletic QBs with outstanding accuracy and ball security, but assuming that doesn't happen, Hendrix and Golson are bound to sneak up on him. The advantages he enjoyed last year-- (1) having run the spread in high school, (2) early entry, and (3) lots of game time snaps-- will become less pronounced as his competitors get more time in the system.

In other words, Hendrix and Golson can learn Rees' quick release, poise, and knowledge of the offense, but Rees can't learn to be a mobile QB. It's his physical limitations that will make it difficult for him to hang onto the #2.

So Longo is going to make everyone on the team stronger, but Rees' arm strength is going to stay the same?

If we can take Molnar at his word, Crist can only throw the ball a few more yards than Rees; I suspect the arm strength knock on Tommy is probably overblown.

 

[PANDFAN]

while i agree that Hendrix looked pretty decent in the spring game...what i fail to understand is how a lot of people think he is the starter next year or for that fact even ahead of Golsen...if hendrix was the talent a lot of people on here seem to think, why hasn't he progressed up the depth chart or for the record really distance himself from Golsen at least?? say what you want about Tommy being an EE and that is how...i would have to believe the thing keeping him off the field seems to be him mentally not there...decision making, understanding the complexity of the offense w/ reads and different check downs etc...so while he has all the physical tools in the world if he can't mentally get things to slow down then he will forever be what could have been....and will be deion walker part deux...

 

[kmoose]

If Rice is a 8 or 9 on the running QB scale, and Kosar is a 1 or 2...Rees is about a 3.

It's not just that Rees can't run the option reads, but he's limited in his escapability and quickness to avoid big pass rushers too.

And yet, Kelly chose him over Hendrix, to play last year(and has him in front of Hendrix, this year). Don't any of you believe that Kelly might be a better evaluator of who is best suited to run his offense than you are?

 

[Rocket89]

And yet, Kelly chose him over Hendrix, to play last year(and has him in front of Hendrix, this year). Don't any of you believe that Kelly might be a better evaluator of who is best suited to run his offense than you are?

Oh, I didn't know the story was over with Hendrix having 4 years of eligibility left.

 

[Blaise]

I don't see how Rees keeps the back up job.... The upside on the other two is so great, the more they understand the offense, the better they will be

 

[Whiskeyjack]

while i agree that Hendrix looked pretty decent in the spring game...what i fail to understand is how a lot of people think he is the starter next year or for that fact even ahead of Golsen...if hendrix was the talent a lot of people on here seem to think, why hasn't he progressed up the depth chart or for the record really distance himself from Golsen at least?? say what you want about Tommy being an EE and that is how...i would have to believe the thing keeping him off the field seems to be him mentally not there...decision making, understanding the complexity of the offense w/ reads and different check downs etc...so while he has all the physical tools in the world if he can't mentally get things to slow down then he will forever be what could have been....and will be deion walker part deux

We don't know how far Hendrix is ahead of Golson. The staff has simply refused to comment on it. Hendrix is clearly ahead of Golson from a physical standpoint, and having had an extra year in the system, it's probably a safe bet that he's the #1 change-of-pace QB by a healthy margin.

Hendrix might have a mental block that prevents him from overtaking Rees, but it's too early to tell. Rees was the #2 last season because (1) he ran a spread in high school, and (2) he was an EE. If Rees manages to hold off Hendrix for the entire 2011 season, there may be cause to be concerned about Hendrix's development.

I don't think that's likely. Hendrix will be getting redzone reps as the mobile QB, so he'll have ample opportunity to close the gap with Rees.

And yet, Kelly chose him over Hendrix, to play last year(and has him in front of Hendrix, this year). Don't any of you believe that Kelly might be a better evaluator of who is best suited to run his offense than you are?

Rees was an EE; Hendrix wasn't. Rees ran the spread in high school; Hendrix came from a pro-style. In light of that, it's no surprise that Rees beat out Hendrix in 2010; he had a significant lead in understanding before Hendrix ever set foot on campus. But as I mentioned in my previous post, that advantage will disappear as Hendrix and Golson get more comfortable in the system.

 

[kmoose]

Oh, I didn't know the story was over with Hendrix having 4 years of eligibility left.

And Rees has 3........... what's your point?

 

[Rhode Irish]

And yet, Kelly chose him over Hendrix, to play last year(and has him in front of Hendrix, this year). Don't any of you believe that Kelly might be a better evaluator of who is best suited to run his offense than you are?

C'mon. This is either disingenuous or not very well considered. Rees played ahead of Hendrix last year because he enrolled early and went through the spring in the system and played in a spread offense in high school. Because he played last year, Rees came into camp ahead of the two guys that hadn't played yet. All we really know is that the "competition" for the starting job was between Crist and Rees (I'm not sure it was really a competition). If one of the purposes of staging a competition was to ensure that Crist worked his *** off like he was competing for a job, obviously the other person had to be Rees, since he was the only other QB with any experience at all.

 

[Rocket89]

And Rees has 3........... what's your point?

I've read a lot of your comments on this topic and it seems to me that you're just here to defend Rees at all costs.

I don't see what is so hard to understand about this. You're acting like everyone and their mother knows for certain that Hendrix or Golson will pass Rees.

A.) Many people think it is likely, certainly not set in stone.

B.) There are plenty of reasons why Hendrix/Golson might pass Rees.

C.) It's likely to happen later this season and more likely next spring and fall.

You're constantly complaining about A.

Refusing to believe any part of B.

And for C. you think Rees has "won" before Hendrix or Golson have burnt a single minute of eligibility.

What exactly are we supposed to argue about now?

 

[BeauBenken]

So Longo is going to make everyone on the team stronger, but Rees' arm strength is going to stay the same?

Just being stronger doesn't automatically mean you can add more zip to the ball or chuck farther. Throwing takes your whole body.

I like Rees. Especially considering Kelly has said that with Rees and Crist he has two championship ready QBs. That says a lot about Rees, but from a physical standpoint, I think it's obvious why someone would like Hendrix over Rees.

And I'm a Golson fan. lol

 

[kmoose]

I've read a lot of your comments on this topic and it seems to me that you're just here to defend Rees at all costs.

I don't see what is so hard to understand about this. You're acting like everyone and their mother knows for certain that Hendrix or Golson will pass Rees.

A.) Many people think it is likely, certainly not set in stone.

B.) There are plenty of reasons why Hendrix/Golson might pass Rees.

C.) It's likely to happen later this season and more likely next spring and fall.

You're constantly complaining about A.

Refusing to believe any part of B.

And for C. you think Rees has "won" before Hendrix or Golson have burnt a single minute of eligibility.

What exactly are we supposed to argue about now?

Then you will have seen that most of my comments on this subject are not so much about defending Rees, as they are about shooting holes in the logic that others are trying to use, to convince me that it's obvious that Rees will NOT be the starter after Crist leaves. I've said, more than once, that it's not that I don't think Golson or Hendrix can pass Rees up, it's that I don't think that it's a GIVEN. And, if you look back on my comments on the subject, they are mostly only made after someone has stated that Golson/Hendrix will pass up Rees, in a definitive manner.

 

[BeauBenken]

Then you will have seen that most of my comments on this subject are not so much about defending Rees, as they are about shooting holes in the logic that others are trying to use, to convince me that it's obvious that Rees will NOT be the starter after Crist leaves. I've said, more than once, that it's not that I don't think Golson or Hendrix can pass Rees up, it's that I don't think that it's a GIVEN. And, if you look back on my comments on the subject, they are mostly only made after someone has stated that Golson/Hendrix will pass up Rees, in a definitive manner.

Of course it's not a given. It still hasn't happened.

 

[pani_nasz]

Not being privy to what transpires in practice, BK's thought patterns, or how much of the play book has been opened up for each of the QBs at this point in their development, I do know that Kelly has said that he is splitting the reps 60 - 40 between Crist and Rees in their weekly preparation. I believe this has to giveTommy the edge regardless of whether the other two alternatives are more athletic. Whether it is an insurmountable advantage remains to be seen.