All Things SCOTUS

Irish YJ

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I'd argue Trump is better off leaving the seat open and holding over his constituents heads. Might help turnout if people know a SC seat is also on the line.

Mitch will want it filled though. I doubt he actually cares about Trumps reelection, and would much rather trade it for control of the SC for 30 years.

Not sure I agree. I think his base would actually be upset if he left it open. A good fight over this is probably good to wake some of the base up.

And IMO, the next 30 years is far more important than the next 4.
 

TorontoGold

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this whole "start playing McConnell's chess game" is pretty LOL.

Harry Reid/Dems changed the rules in 2013. Mitch gave them an FU back with Garland, and then the Dems tried to tank Gorsuch so Mitch pulled a Harry Reid back on them. Then the Dems put on a shit show with Kav.

Let's quit acting like the Dems have always played fair in this space, and are the "victim" here. We all know the faux outrage will be turned up to 11.

I'm not saying their the "victim", quite the contrary. I'm saying they're getting routinely dunked on by McConnell. Relax.
 

Legacy

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I'd bet Susan Collins would want a woman to replace RBG.

“Justice Ruth Bader Ginsburg was a trailblazer for women’s rights, a fierce champion for equality, and an extremely accomplished American who broke countless barriers in the field of law. Throughout her life, Justice Ginsburg surmounted discrimination and sexism through her brilliance, tenacity, and wit, becoming one of the most prominent legal luminaries of our time.

“I had the great honor of getting to know Justice Ginsburg personally when the women Senators twice had dinner with her and former Justice Sandra Day O’Connor. She has been a role model to generations of women, and her legacy will live on in the countless people she inspired.”

Isn't it an unwritten rule to have a Jew on SCOTUS? When was the last time there wasn't one?
 

Sea Turtle

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I'd bet Susan Collins would want a woman to replace RBG.



Isn't it an unwritten rule to have a Jew on SCOTUS? When was the last time there wasn't one?

I think we will get one. Trump reportedly told Barrett supporters that he was saving her for Ginsberg
 

Irish YJ

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I'm not saying their the "victim", quite the contrary. I'm saying they're getting routinely dunked on by McConnell. Relax.

You're acting like the dems need to change the rules (pack the court) because they were unfairly treated by McConnell. McConnel didn't start the shit, it was Reid. And McConnell didn't try to tank Gorsuch or create a shit show for Kav. McConnell hasn't change any rules, or done anything the Dems didn't do first, he's just beat them within the system of existing rules. Now you guys want to pack the court, make more states, etc.. lol. It's the same BS as trying to kill the electoral college after losing by the rules.
 

IrishLax

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What's leaking out this morning seems to be that there are two divergent strategies:

1. Delaying outright until after election day, which will be either a lame duck period or affirmation that Trump has a second term. Even if Mark Kelly wins in Arizona and is seated on November 30th, you still have the 52-48 edge until January that you need to get someone pushed through. By not making any movement, it helps shield vulnerable senators as well as provide a "carrot" for conservative voters even if it doesn't actually matter who wins on election day because you're targeting the lame duck period.

2. Push a name forward now, maybe or maybe not get a vote before election day. You see where the momentum and debates take you. You go for a vote before election day you do it if and only if you know you're going to win, and if you think the positive momentum of that outweighs the negative momentum. If you don't think that's the case, you run on the idea that a vote for Trump is a vote for whichever justice you've tabbed. There seems to be a lot more inherent risk to this plan, but also potentially higher upside and you can shift focus away from COVID, etc. -- where Trump polls terribly -- to something forward looking where he could poll better.

Methinks they will float the name(s) right before the first debate, but not actually push for a floor vote until after November 3rd.
 

TorontoGold

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You're acting like the dems need to change the rules (pack the court) because they were unfairly treated by McConnell. McConnel didn't start the shit, it was Reid. And McConnell didn't try to tank Gorsuch or create a shit show for Kav. McConnell hasn't change any rules, or done anything the Dems didn't do first, he's just beat them within the system of existing rules. Now you guys want to pack the court, make more states, etc.. lol. It's the same BS as trying to kill the electoral college after losing by the rules.

1. I asked "Couldn't the Dems expand the court if Biden wins to account for Garland and RBG?" There is no "acting" in there, simply asking a question.
2. FFS that's my point. Not a fiber in your body allows you to agree with me. That's ok.
3. "You guys", you know, if I was going to be a member of any political party it would likely be the Liberal Party of Canada/Ontario. So you can miss me with the "you guys" stuff.
4. Cool the faux outrage, I've seen the idea of expanding the court floated and wondering if that's something that's reasonably feasible. I'm not looking for GOP vs Dem argument.
 

tussin

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What's leaking out this morning seems to be that there are two divergent strategies:

1. Delaying outright until after election day, which will be either a lame duck period or affirmation that Trump has a second term. Even if Mark Kelly wins in Arizona and is seated on November 30th, you still have the 52-48 edge until January that you need to get someone pushed through. By not making any movement, it helps shield vulnerable senators as well as provide a "carrot" for conservative voters even if it doesn't actually matter who wins on election day because you're targeting the lame duck period.

2. Push a name forward now, maybe or maybe not get a vote before election day. You see where the momentum and debates take you. You go for a vote before election day you do it if and only if you know you're going to win, and if you think the positive momentum of that outweighs the negative momentum. If you don't think that's the case, you run on the idea that a vote for Trump is a vote for whichever justice you've tabbed. There seems to be a lot more inherent risk to this plan, but also potentially higher upside and you can shift focus away from COVID, etc. -- where Trump polls terribly -- to something forward looking where he could poll better.

Methinks they will float the name(s) right before the first debate, but not actually push for a floor vote until after November 3rd.

I think I like the second strategy more. They need to push a name that is likable with no baggage. You’ll see a lot of: “I’m not voting for Trump, I’m voting for (INSERT NAME HERE).”
 

Irish YJ

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What's leaking out this morning seems to be that there are two divergent strategies:

1. Delaying outright until after election day, which will be either a lame duck period or affirmation that Trump has a second term. Even if Mark Kelly wins in Arizona and is seated on November 30th, you still have the 52-48 edge until January that you need to get someone pushed through. By not making any movement, it helps shield vulnerable senators as well as provide a "carrot" for conservative voters even if it doesn't actually matter who wins on election day because you're targeting the lame duck period.

2. Push a name forward now, maybe or maybe not get a vote before election day. You see where the momentum and debates take you. You go for a vote before election day you do it if and only if you know you're going to win, and if you think the positive momentum of that outweighs the negative momentum. If you don't think that's the case, you run on the idea that a vote for Trump is a vote for whichever justice you've tabbed. There seems to be a lot more inherent risk to this plan, but also potentially higher upside and you can shift focus away from COVID, etc. -- where Trump polls terribly -- to something forward looking where he could poll better.

Methinks they will float the name(s) right before the first debate, but not actually push for a floor vote until after November 3rd.

IDK. I just don't see a lot of advantage for anyone in waiting. And Trump looks to be pressing, and McConnell looks to be ready to roll.

Trump is behind in the polls, the GOP could lose the Senate, etc.. I think it would piss the GOP base off more if they waited. And like you said, this battle could detract from the Covid stuff.

Right now it's 53 vs 45+2. The GOP could lose 3 votes and still confirm (with a tie breaker by Pence) even if those 3 voted against (it's more likely some, or at least one would abstain than vote against).

And you have Collins with her seat up. She's already polling under 50% and can't afford to lose any base votes. Now she could also roll over assuming she's going to lose and send a FU message to Trump, but I'd predict she at worst abstains. A wildcard is Jones (Dem Bama) who is up too, and he relies on a lot of conservative folks. He barely won in 2017 special election and this would absolutely be an issue for him. He already is considered the most moderate Dem in terms of voting patterns, and is a close to the line, or closer than Collins.

If I were McConnell, I'd float the following names next weekend. All are good candidates, and pretty sure all mentioned before by Trump.

1) Amy Coney Barrett - this would create a lot of Catholic bashing by the left, likely tilting some Catholics riding the fence over to Trump regardless if she's the nomination or not.

2) Britt Grant - Southern white female, but went to Stanford, clerked for Kav, and currently sits in the 11th (Bama) which would likely require Jones to comment (adding more pressure to his seat being up).

3) Allison H. Eid - another white female, but from the West. From Seattle but resides in CO.

4) Barbara Lagoa - one of my dark horses. Hispanic/Cuban, female, and from FL. Getting votes from Hispanic in general, and also helping in FL with a large Cuban and Hispanic community.

5) Allison Jones Rushing - White female, but her name floated might help in the Carolinas.

6) Bridget Bade - Another white female, but from AZ where votes are needed.

7) Amul Thapar - could pull some Asian votes.

Anyway, those would be my 7 names floated. Mostly women. After a few days I'd cut it to two, Barrett and Lagoa to keep the Catholic and Hispanic buzz going. Lastly, picking whoever polls best.
 

Sea Turtle

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IDK. I just don't see a lot of advantage for anyone in waiting. And Trump looks to be pressing, and McConnell looks to be ready to roll.

Trump is behind in the polls, the GOP could lose the Senate, etc.. I think it would piss the GOP base off more if they waited. And like you said, this battle could detract from the Covid stuff.

Right now it's 53 vs 45+2. The GOP could lose 3 votes and still confirm (with a tie breaker by Pence) even if those 3 voted against (it's more likely some, or at least one would abstain than vote against).

And you have Collins with her seat up. She's already polling under 50% and can't afford to lose any base votes. Now she could also roll over assuming she's going to lose and send a FU message to Trump, but I'd predict she at worst abstains. A wildcard is Jones (Dem Bama) who is up too, and he relies on a lot of conservative folks. He barely won in 2017 special election and this would absolutely be an issue for him. He already is considered the most moderate Dem in terms of voting patterns, and is a close to the line, or closer than Collins.

If I were McConnell, I'd float the following names next weekend. All are good candidates, and pretty sure all mentioned before by Trump.

1) Amy Coney Barrett - this would create a lot of Catholic bashing by the left, likely tilting some Catholics riding the fence over to Trump regardless if she's the nomination or not.

2) Britt Grant - Southern white female, but went to Stanford, clerked for Kav, and currently sits in the 11th (Bama) which would likely require Jones to comment (adding more pressure to his seat being up).

3) Allison H. Eid - another white female, but from the West. From Seattle but resides in CO.

4) Barbara Lagoa - one of my dark horses. Hispanic/Cuban, female, and from FL. Getting votes from Hispanic in general, and also helping in FL with a large Cuban and Hispanic community.

5) Allison Jones Rushing - White female, but her name floated might help in the Carolinas.

6) Bridget Bade - Another white female, but from AZ where votes are needed.

7) Amul Thapar - could pull some Asian votes.

Anyway, those would be my 7 names floated. Mostly women. After a few days I'd cut it to two, Barrett and Lagoa to keep the Catholic and Hispanic buzz going. Lastly, picking whoever polls best.

Solid choices. Barrett is my gal.
 

Irish YJ

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1. I asked "Couldn't the Dems expand the court if Biden wins to account for Garland and RBG?" There is no "acting" in there, simply asking a question.
2. FFS that's my point. Not a fiber in your body allows you to agree with me. That's ok.
3. "You guys", you know, if I was going to be a member of any political party it would likely be the Liberal Party of Canada/Ontario. So you can miss me with the "you guys" stuff.
4. Cool the faux outrage, I've seen the idea of expanding the court floated and wondering if that's something that's reasonably feasible. I'm not looking for GOP vs Dem argument.

1) Expanding the court is changing the rules. There have been 9 since the 1800s.
2) "to account for Garland and RBG" implies the Dems were done wrong

1+2 = we need to change the rules because we've been done wrong.

3) You guys = you're consistently pro-US dem, and anti-Trump

4. I'm sure you know, because you read, that packing the court is a Dem backed idea floated to change the rules to regain the majority. It's intrinsically a GOP vs Dem topic.


In short, you love to say/ask things, know exactly what you're saying/asking, and then dance the dance when called out.
 

NorthDakota

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Trump hasn’t tweeted since learning the news. He has so many power moves he can make here, I imagine every person on his campaign is trying to keep a tight lid on things until at minimum they’ve done a straw poll of GOP senators and probably until they’ve done internal polls of Republican voters.

I really think his best move to try to get his base to turn out strong by delaying it until at least after Election Day (could still push it through before inauguration if he loses).

Gonna be Barrett or Jones-Rushing.

We will finally have a hot woman on the court...love or hate Ginsberg, she was objectively an ugly woman.
 

Irish YJ

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Solid choices. Barrett is my gal.

She's my fav too. I think Lagoa might be more strategic though. Both are Catholic, but honestly I think Catholics are pretty much already entrenched one way or another. Hispanics on the other hand could be more likely to sway. I'm not sure on the Catholic entrenchment though. Do you recall any of the conversation or polling around Kav relative to being Catholic?

Lagoa has an interesting background. Didn't know this before reading up on her, but she was one of the pro bono lawyers for Elián González which was big news in the day.
 

TorontoGold

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1) Expanding the court is changing the rules. There have been 9 since the 1800s.
2) "to account for Garland and RBG" implies the Dems were done wrong

1+2 = we need to change the rules because we've been done wrong.

3) You guys = you're consistently pro-US dem, and anti-Trump

4. I'm sure you know, because you read, that packing the court is a Dem backed idea floated to change the rules to regain the majority. It's intrinsically a GOP vs Dem topic.


In short, you love to say/ask things, know exactly what you're saying/asking, and then dance the dance when called out.

I know it's a Dem floated idea. I was asking because I have a limited knowledge of the SCOTUS and don't really have opinion either way about the SCOTUS. From an extremely layman's view of adding more justices to the SOCTUS seems like a dangerous move because it could backfire in the future ie. Harry Reid in 2013.

No need to constantly be combative 24/7.
 

Sea Turtle

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Gonna be Barrett or Jones-Rushing.

We will finally have a hot woman on the court...love or hate Ginsberg, she was objectively an ugly woman.

That fire red hair and those green eyes will look nice on the court.
 

Sea Turtle

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She's my fav too. I think Lagoa might be more strategic though. Both are Catholic, but honestly I think Catholics are pretty much already entrenched one way or another. Hispanics on the other hand could be more likely to sway. I'm not sure on the Catholic entrenchment though. Do you recall any of the conversation or polling around Kav relative to being Catholic?

Lagoa has an interesting background. Didn't know this before reading up on her, but she was one of the pro bono lawyers for Elián González which was big news in the day.

I don't recall. I do remember that Barrett had momentum and there was pressure for a woman. Trump allegedly said that he was saving her for Ginsberg.
 

Irish YJ

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I know it's a Dem floated idea. I was asking because I have a limited knowledge of the SCOTUS and don't really have opinion either way about the SCOTUS. From an extremely layman's view of adding more justices to the SOCTUS seems like a dangerous move because it could backfire in the future ie. Harry Reid in 2013.

No need to constantly be combative 24/7.

Sorry man. So you know it's a Dem strategy. You know enough about the history to call it McConnell's chess game. The whole "limited knowledge" and "honest question" routine just seems contrived given what you obviously know. It's pretty SOP for you.

Sincere apologies for being combative. I flunked my courses in passivity and passive aggressiveness.
 

Irish YJ

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I don't recall. I do remember that Barrett had momentum and there was pressure for a woman. Trump allegedly said that he was saving her for Ginsberg.

I would have preferred ACB to Kav to be honest. And would have went Lagoa on this one.

Either way, bashing either candidate would have consequence. If both are equal in terms of qualification, just not sure which is most strategic. I think it would be easier for Dems to go after ACB given the current environment. Lagoa, not so much.
 

TorontoGold

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Sorry man. So you know it's a Dem strategy. You know enough about the history to call it McConnell's chess game. The whole "limited knowledge" and "honest question" routine just seems contrived given what you obviously know. It's pretty SOP for you.

Sincere apologies for being combative. I flunked my courses in passivity and passive aggressiveness.

I know it's Dem strategy because a lot of the Liberal's and some progressives I follow have written about it. Asked here to get a more moderate/conservative view of it because (believe it or not) I wanted to see what people think outside my communist echo chamber.

Anyways, is it a smooth process as some write to just go "Yeah load it baby, add a couple more"? Seems like something that shouldn't be allowed.
 

Irish YJ

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You are right. The wiki update block was green, making them appear that way. Optical illusion. They are blue.

Green, blue, doesn't matter lol. Crazy talented, smart, and hot. Sign me up.

I know it's Dem strategy because a lot of the Liberal's and some progressives I follow have written about it. Asked here to get a more moderate/conservative view of it because (believe it or not) I wanted to see what people think outside my communist echo chamber.

Anyways, is it a smooth process as some write to just go "Yeah load it baby, add a couple more"? Seems like something that shouldn't be allowed.

giphy.gif
 

NorthDakota

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I know it's a Dem floated idea. I was asking because I have a limited knowledge of the SCOTUS and don't really have opinion either way about the SCOTUS. From an extremely layman's view of adding more justices to the SOCTUS seems like a dangerous move because it could backfire in the future ie. Harry Reid in 2013.

No need to constantly be combative 24/7.

9 is the number. Libs sure do love coming up with radical rule changes whenever the Cons obtain the upper hand. Lol it is like clockwork.
 

GATTACA!

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IDK. I just don't see a lot of advantage for anyone in waiting. And Trump looks to be pressing, and McConnell looks to be ready to roll.

Trump is behind in the polls, the GOP could lose the Senate, etc.. I think it would piss the GOP base off more if they waited. And like you said, this battle could detract from the Covid stuff.

Right now it's 53 vs 45+2. The GOP could lose 3 votes and still confirm (with a tie breaker by Pence) even if those 3 voted against (it's more likely some, or at least one would abstain than vote against).

And you have Collins with her seat up. She's already polling under 50% and can't afford to lose any base votes. Now she could also roll over assuming she's going to lose and send a FU message to Trump, but I'd predict she at worst abstains. A wildcard is Jones (Dem Bama) who is up too, and he relies on a lot of conservative folks. He barely won in 2017 special election and this would absolutely be an issue for him. He already is considered the most moderate Dem in terms of voting patterns, and is a close to the line, or closer than Collins.

If I were McConnell, I'd float the following names next weekend. All are good candidates, and pretty sure all mentioned before by Trump.

1) Amy Coney Barrett - this would create a lot of Catholic bashing by the left, likely tilting some Catholics riding the fence over to Trump regardless if she's the nomination or not.

2) Britt Grant - Southern white female, but went to Stanford, clerked for Kav, and currently sits in the 11th (Bama) which would likely require Jones to comment (adding more pressure to his seat being up).

3) Allison H. Eid - another white female, but from the West. From Seattle but resides in CO.

4) Barbara Lagoa - one of my dark horses. Hispanic/Cuban, female, and from FL. Getting votes from Hispanic in general, and also helping in FL with a large Cuban and Hispanic community.

5) Allison Jones Rushing - White female, but her name floated might help in the Carolinas.

6) Bridget Bade - Another white female, but from AZ where votes are needed.

7) Amul Thapar - could pull some Asian votes.

Anyway, those would be my 7 names floated. Mostly women. After a few days I'd cut it to two, Barrett and Lagoa to keep the Catholic and Hispanic buzz going. Lastly, picking whoever polls best.


AJR is so hot right now. Could they be hearing cases and on tour at the same time?

Make the Supreme Court hot again.
 

Irish YJ

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AJR is so hot right now. Could they be hearing cases and on tour at the same time?

Make the Supreme Court hot again.

Absolutely on the bolded.

I like AJR, but I'll take ACB every day, and three times Saturday night.
 

NorthDakota

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I feel bad for the lady's family, but seeing how my classmates are responding on social media is absolutely AMAZING. Completely broken people.

For how often folks refer to super Trump fans as a cult, they blatantly ignore how culty the entire "RBG" movement was.

I want a nomination by the end of the week. Lets get the ball rolling.
 

Irish YJ

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I feel bad for the lady's family, but seeing how my classmates are responding on social media is absolutely AMAZING. Completely broken people.

For how often folks refer to super Trump fans as a cult, they blatantly ignore how culty the entire "RBG" movement was.

I want a nomination by the end of the week. Lets get the ball rolling.

Libs calling Trumpers cultish is rich. I can understand the true RGBers to an extent, if you're a women that's followed her career. She is impressive if you look past the politics. But I think a lot of the folks you are seeing are simply jumping on the bandwagon to share in the communal faux progressive grief. They have to do that prior to their planned collective faux outrage for when a replacement is named.

I picture Legacy's living room looking something like this right about now.

giphy.gif
 

drayer54

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There's only one strategy I care to see. Nominate ACB today and tell Lindsay Graham he has one job in life and that is to expedite this confirmation, ignore the circus the dems will create, and get to the finish line.
 
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