All things general college basketball
- Thread starter Irish YJ
- Start date
Irish YJ
Southsida
- Messages
- 25,888
- Reaction score
- 1,444
Yup. Lander is big. All the kids from last year's class are back in the fold now.
I think having TJD, Stewart (I think he'll be big next season), and Lander is huge.
Will be interesting to see what Franklin and Brunk do. Really need at least Brunk back IMO.
I think Thompson ends up closer to home (MN), but would love to see him return.
Overall, would really like to see them get 2-3 quality transfers in to IU.
It's a great year, probably the best ever, to fill holes via the portal.
Dale
Well-known member
- Messages
- 16,119
- Reaction score
- 27,373
Ehh not really. It’d say athletically maybe Thamba/Tchatchou > Timme and Butler > Nembard but probably give the edge to Gonzaga elsewhere. Timme looked hurt or out of it or just shocked by the physicality on him for sure. Timme getting rooted out on O means less space for the guards. Timme abused on Pick/Roll on D means open 3s and they had a unreal day from there. Not to put it on just him because Baylor would’ve beaten anyone tonight but he’s the key cog for Gonzaga and just got exposed by Baylor on this night
Irish YJ
Southsida
- Messages
- 25,888
- Reaction score
- 1,444
Offense - Zags and Baylor were both top 10. One team played in a tougher conference.
Defense - Zags aren't top 100.... and play in a weak conference. Baylor can play D...
I was starting to believe in the Zags until the UCLA game. I went full Baylor after that.
Defense - Zags aren't top 100.... and play in a weak conference. Baylor can play D...
I was starting to believe in the Zags until the UCLA game. I went full Baylor after that.
- Messages
- 44,608
- Reaction score
- 20,086
Not sure what game you were watching, but overall Baylor was much quicker at most positions IMO. You're right about Timme. Zags go as he goes. Reminded me a lot of the '79 championship game with Bird and Johnson. ISU goes as Bird goes. For clarification, I'm not saying Timme is on Bird's level. lol
Dale
Well-known member
- Messages
- 16,119
- Reaction score
- 27,373
Quickness and athleticism are not the exact same thing. Baylor plays 3 PGs so yes I completely agree they are quicker. But I would not agree Macio Teague is more athletic than Joel Ayayi. Heck Mark Vital was the least athletic guy to touch the court last night, still dominated the offensive boards.
Timme I think it was shocking to see him struggle so much because if he was ever going to struggle you’d think it would’ve been versus USC in the Elite 8 with Mobley. We learned Mobley being “better” than Timme was not the key as much as you kinda had to just bully him. 2 Cs for Baylor got 4 fouls each, I’m sure Scott Drew would say well worth it.
NDdomer2
Local Sports vBookie
- Messages
- 17,050
- Reaction score
- 3,875
Turnovers and 3pt shooting.
The zags looked like they had never seen that kind of defensive pressure the way they were handling the ball even when they weren't turning it over it seemed like they were having weird dribbles and dropped passes.
The zags looked like they had never seen that kind of defensive pressure the way they were handling the ball even when they weren't turning it over it seemed like they were having weird dribbles and dropped passes.
Rogue219
Well-known member
- Messages
- 5,430
- Reaction score
- 1,080
I think Mike Golic Jr. had a tweet last night that was something to the effect of "Gonzaga: we have a great offense. Baylor: we lift with the football team."
Amazed that Scott Drew took that job all those years ago after the disgusting scandal that took place there with the coach before him. Amazed he's stayed this long. Seems like not that long ago they blew up my bracket by losing to Yale.
Big 12 hoops looks like it's going to be pretty competitive in the coming years. Texas and OU go get good hires. BU, KU and WVU will be solid. Curious to see what Texas Tech does to replace Beard and can't wait for the first Horns vs Red Raiders hoops game, hopefully in front of a full gym.
I like Gonzaga's program. They're no a middie anymore and they'll continue to land top recruits. Key for them will be playing blue bloods early in November and December.
Amazed that Scott Drew took that job all those years ago after the disgusting scandal that took place there with the coach before him. Amazed he's stayed this long. Seems like not that long ago they blew up my bracket by losing to Yale.
Big 12 hoops looks like it's going to be pretty competitive in the coming years. Texas and OU go get good hires. BU, KU and WVU will be solid. Curious to see what Texas Tech does to replace Beard and can't wait for the first Horns vs Red Raiders hoops game, hopefully in front of a full gym.
I like Gonzaga's program. They're no a middie anymore and they'll continue to land top recruits. Key for them will be playing blue bloods early in November and December.
- Messages
- 20,894
- Reaction score
- 8,126
Some of that may have been flatness after the UCLA victory, but I think most of those errors were forced by Baylor. Their defense and offensive rebounding were unreal. No way for Gonzaga to compete with Timme getting bullied like that.
- Messages
- 33,950
- Reaction score
- 9,294
The reason the Zags acted like they'd never seen defensive pressure like that is because they hadn't. Davion Mitchell is the greatest on ball defender I've ever seen in college. Period.
I don't want to get into the who's a better athlete argument but Baylor punched Gonzaga in the mouth. Gonazaga who runs their offense with great speed and continuity got shell shocked by Baylor's speed on D and ownership of the boards combined with Baylor's efficiency from 3 to start the game. The Zags cut the lead in half but Baylor turned it up to 11 in spurts and ended it early.
And who ever said Mark Vital was the least athletic guy on the court is judging the book by the cover. At 6-5/250... he's a freak. Go look up his highlights.
I don't want to get into the who's a better athlete argument but Baylor punched Gonzaga in the mouth. Gonazaga who runs their offense with great speed and continuity got shell shocked by Baylor's speed on D and ownership of the boards combined with Baylor's efficiency from 3 to start the game. The Zags cut the lead in half but Baylor turned it up to 11 in spurts and ended it early.
And who ever said Mark Vital was the least athletic guy on the court is judging the book by the cover. At 6-5/250... he's a freak. Go look up his highlights.
Dale
Well-known member
- Messages
- 16,119
- Reaction score
- 27,373
Being the least athletic guy on a national championship court full of NBA guys wasn’t a slight on Vital, as I said he dominated the offensive boards. Like the “slowest” guy at the 100m at the Olympics lol
- Messages
- 33,950
- Reaction score
- 9,294
Dale
Well-known member
- Messages
- 16,119
- Reaction score
- 27,373
we can disagree without acting like I’m a novice and must have only turned on one CBB game all year. Thanks for the link bud you’re right as always
- Messages
- 44,608
- Reaction score
- 20,086
I’ve watched a few games in my day and understand the difference between athleticism, quickness and speed. Lol
Mark Vital is a great role player on this Baylor team, but in the context of what was out on that court, he's not one of the first 6 guys picked in a pick-up game, and per NBA guys, he's not in the top 8 or 9.
Always love revisionist history after a tournament. Gonzaga was a historically good team going into this final game. Jesus, they STILL finished first in Kenpom. If they played again tomorrow against Baylor, it would probably be a pick'um, probably Baylor +1.5 or so. Gonzaga was #1 in the country in 2pt Percentage. Baylor was #1 in 3pt percentage. Baylor jumped on them, and hit a 3 every time they got it to near single digits. They played great.
"But Gonzaga hasn't played any good defensive teams...." - Did no one watch the USC game (Hint: They are better adj Defensive Efficiency than Baylor)? No, not the ball pressure, and Gonzaga's guards did not handle it well (though the first foul on Suggs was a block, and that would make two on Mitchell early if things go the same). If you want to say we learned anything, it's that Timme is great against a true 5. But guys with small guys with mass and speed give him headaches.
But, let's not forget that if you watched any Baylor for the last month and a half (after the second COVID break), sans the Houston game (and they played the same type of game as Baylor, but Baylor just does it much better) you wouldn't have taken Baylor -4.5 if I pleaded you to. They were not a Final Four looking team.
Always love revisionist history after a tournament. Gonzaga was a historically good team going into this final game. Jesus, they STILL finished first in Kenpom. If they played again tomorrow against Baylor, it would probably be a pick'um, probably Baylor +1.5 or so. Gonzaga was #1 in the country in 2pt Percentage. Baylor was #1 in 3pt percentage. Baylor jumped on them, and hit a 3 every time they got it to near single digits. They played great.
"But Gonzaga hasn't played any good defensive teams...." - Did no one watch the USC game (Hint: They are better adj Defensive Efficiency than Baylor)? No, not the ball pressure, and Gonzaga's guards did not handle it well (though the first foul on Suggs was a block, and that would make two on Mitchell early if things go the same). If you want to say we learned anything, it's that Timme is great against a true 5. But guys with small guys with mass and speed give him headaches.
But, let's not forget that if you watched any Baylor for the last month and a half (after the second COVID break), sans the Houston game (and they played the same type of game as Baylor, but Baylor just does it much better) you wouldn't have taken Baylor -4.5 if I pleaded you to. They were not a Final Four looking team.
Last edited:
NDdomer2
Local Sports vBookie
- Messages
- 17,050
- Reaction score
- 3,875
There's already over 1,000 that have entered at one point or another.
It's certainly the free agency era in recruiting.
Rogue219
Well-known member
- Messages
- 5,430
- Reaction score
- 1,080
TV ratings for the Men's tournament dipped, but revenue was up from 2019. Go figure.
I like Loyola replacing Porter Moser with Valentine. Solid transitional hire there. He should keep the beat rolling. Moser cashing in at OU is the right choice. Get paid now while you can. The Big 12 is going to be fun for a while with these coaches settling in.
The Cincinnati job opening up is also very interesting. Dennis Gates would be a great hire, or they can buy low on Archie Miller. Tod Kowalczykfrom Toledo is another possibility. I think Gates would be a fantastic hire for UC both on and off the court.
I like Loyola replacing Porter Moser with Valentine. Solid transitional hire there. He should keep the beat rolling. Moser cashing in at OU is the right choice. Get paid now while you can. The Big 12 is going to be fun for a while with these coaches settling in.
The Cincinnati job opening up is also very interesting. Dennis Gates would be a great hire, or they can buy low on Archie Miller. Tod Kowalczykfrom Toledo is another possibility. I think Gates would be a fantastic hire for UC both on and off the court.
- Messages
- 19,128
- Reaction score
- 11,077
I may just be down on the situation as a UC fan, but the way UC's piss-poor AD handled the whole Brannen fiasco has me doubting that one of the hot names recognized as up-and-comers would even be interested in accepting a job offer, regardless of how big a step up it is.
They probably have to hope that Erik Martin from WVU interviews well. He's a UC alumn that played for Bob Huggins, and has been Huggs' assistant for the past 10+ years. If he seems like a quality candidate, they may luck into salvaging the mess they created for themselves.
I'd be fine with Archie Miller or even (gasp) Rick Pitino, but I don't know if Archie would reciprocate interest, and I KNOW they wouldn't actually call Pitino.
Irish YJ
Southsida
- Messages
- 25,888
- Reaction score
- 1,444
As an IU BB fan, I'd steer clear of Archie. I don't hate the guy or anything, but after seeing player comments, I'm really happy IU moved on to Woodson. That, and I simply hate his O.
- Messages
- 44,608
- Reaction score
- 20,086
Miller’s failing is puzzling given his success at Dayton, but he had everyone scratching their heads trying to figure out what he was doing.
Irish YJ
Southsida
- Messages
- 25,888
- Reaction score
- 1,444
I was definitely scratching my head. TJD's comments about not having any excitement in the program really made me think.
NDdomer2
Local Sports vBookie
- Messages
- 17,050
- Reaction score
- 3,875
losing isnt exciting. archies down fall at IU was the inability to identify/develop shooters. made them too one dimensional as an offense.
Irish YJ
Southsida
- Messages
- 25,888
- Reaction score
- 1,444
I agree in general that shooting was a large part of his problem. I think there was a bit more too it though. One thing I always thought might be an issue, was simply his style and personality. He always seemed like stale crackers, and the kids rarely looked like they were having fun, even when they were winning. TJD's comments, while they could be interpreted in different ways, at minimum tells me the kids weren't buying in, and weren't having fun. They looked unnatural and almost afraid to shoot at times. The personnel usage was head scratching (especially around shooters).
FightingIrishLover7
All troll, no substance
- Messages
- 12,704
- Reaction score
- 7,516
Did Archie fail at IU?
Or did IU fail Archie?
A dumpster fire is still a dumpster fire.... #boilerup
Or did IU fail Archie?
A dumpster fire is still a dumpster fire.... #boilerup
- Messages
- 44,608
- Reaction score
- 20,086
Both are probably complicit, but Archie never established an identity.
Irish YJ
Southsida
- Messages
- 25,888
- Reaction score
- 1,444
Boiler fans were likely hoping Archie would get a lifetime contract...
Rogue219
Well-known member
- Messages
- 5,430
- Reaction score
- 1,080
I saw Martin's name mentioned in there, too.
i think Gates can be somewhat selective right now and can steer clear of certain situations. For me he's one of the top candidates out there for a number of reasons. As a Chicago native, you have to figure DePaul is going to give him a call for their opening as well.