2013 Running Back Discussion

[Jebediah Springfield]

is really not though. Both positions have great deal of responsibility. If a rb can't identify blitzes and pick it up he's not seeing the field. The defense will automatically know its a run or they won't care and just blitz the house because he can't do it... Just identifying it its only half the battle. An 18yr old will regularly have pick up 20+ yr old developed players.

Having freshman play their first year is rarely a good thing. Usually means you have no depth or no talent. Few occasions a player is just ready. Bryant has a good chance at st, most of these freshman will see quality time there because as BK said, we have no depth. That being said with GA3 having two years and AC 3 BK may feel staggering his backs will give more balance to future classes.

This was the same conversation we had last year with Mahone. With Jonas gone, wwe needed that big powerful bowling ball back and this kid was going to be a combo of Hughes and Gray. Obviously he RS despite us having the prototypical power back. Thankfully Theo filled that and more for us.

Qbs have way more responsibility and pressure. Every down they are involved in the play.

Rb can be taken out on obvious pass downs or helped.

Just off the top of my head I know of Duke Johnson, Todd Gurley, TJ Yeldon all having good years as true Fr RB's.

 

[BleedBlueGold]

Kelly didn't change it up to fit a "blueprint" to win at Notre Dame. He switched the offense because the WRs and QBs are as green as a team can get and the RBs/OLs were the strength of the team.

I would be shocked if the 2014 offense resembled the 2012 offense at all. Hell I don't even think the 2013 will if Wood leaves as expected.

You're misunderstanding my post. I didn't say he changed it to fit a blueprint. I said what he has done this year has been so successful that it may become the blueprint. Like Whiskey said: ball control, limit turnovers, kill the clock, killer defense. It works and it highly resembles what Saban does.

 

[Irish8248]

Qbs have way more responsibility and pressure. Every down they are involved in the play.

Rb can be taken out on obvious pass downs or helped.

Just off the top of my head I know of Duke Johnson, Todd Gurley, TJ Yeldon all having good years as true Fr RB's.

both Miami and Bama have depth issues... I believe in Bama there are 2jr 1sr with lacey being the only one who has seen any real action over his career... Johnson "split" carries with Mike James who was projected starter in fall camp but over last 3 years he had a total around 50 carries or so...

We don't have that issue at ND

 

[Jebediah Springfield]

both Miami and Bama have depth issues... I believe in Bama there are 2jr 1sr with lacey being the only one who has seen any real action over his career... Johnson "split" carries with Mike James who was projected starter in fall camp but over last 3 years he had a total around 50 carries or so...

We don't have that issue at ND

Any Freshman Qbs come to mind?

And yes ND has a Rb opening...

GA3 is learning how to be an Rb
Amir hasn't had a carry at ND
Cam has only got carries in a blowout vs 2/3rd stringers

 

[Irish8248]

I don't know what more you want lol.. We have three guys with experience and we really only use two. GA3 and AC will be the starter. AC was on the verge of a starting spot at SC. GA has significant carries and experience. Of course he's still learning. But you don't think Bryant will have to learn? His hs system is completely different too. There's no need to rush a player into the lineup unless its necessary. Its not necessary

Manziel just won the Heisman as a freshman. I know a RS freshman but new system, play book, had to start all over. So a green/raw qb if talented enough can start when there's a wide open competition and lack of depth.

 

[chicago51]

Anyone think George Atkinson can be a starter? or is his lack of pass protection skills and most importantly lack of ball security make him too risky of a road to go down?

 

[FightingIrishLover7]

Anyone think George Atkinson can be a starter? or is his lack of pass protection skills and most importantly lack of ball security make him too risky of a road to go down?

I don't see him being an every down back, ever. I think that role will go to Carlise, Mahone, and Bryant. GA3 will always be a change of pace back imo.

 

[arrowryan]

Anyone think George Atkinson can be a starter? or is his lack of pass protection skills and most importantly lack of ball security make him too risky of a road to go down?

Well i think it's safe to say he starts next year against Temple. He will get A LOT of work in in th off season and in spring ball to get stronger and work on his reads/cuts.

 

[chicago51]

2013 ND Running Backs needed to be its own thread. Good job who started this.

 

[GoldenIsThyFame]

2013 ND Running Backs needs to be its own thread.

Done

 

[arrowryan]

1a. Atkinson
1b. Carlisle
3a. Bryant
3b. Mahone
4. McDaniel (sadly)

We will be pretty deep next year at running back

 

[Jebediah Springfield]

I don't know what more you want lol.. We have three guys with experience and we really only use two. GA3 and AC will be the starter. AC was on the verge of a starting spot at SC. GA has significant carries and experience. Of course he's still learning. But you don't think Bryant will have to learn? His hs system is completely different too. There's no need to rush a player into the lineup unless its necessary. Its not necessary

Manziel just won the Heisman as a freshman. I know a RS freshman but new system, play book, had to start all over. So a green/raw qb if talented enough can start when there's a wide open competition and lack of depth.

I just think we have different interpretations of "experience"... we have no player who has consistently ran the ball.

GA3 is literally learning how to be a RB, Mahone, Bryant, etc are RB's.

AC has 19 carries in his career.

Cam has one game against 2/3 stringers in a blowout.

And Manziel is a freak case, Golson's experience is much more likely. And even with that they both had one year under the belt at college. A successful Fr Rb is far more likely than a Fr Qb. The positions just can't be compared.

 

[Emcee77]

I don't see him being an every down back, ever. I think that role will go to Carlise, Mahone, and Bryant. GA3 will always be a change of pace back imo.

I tend to agree. An mgoblog post I read before the scUM game called Atkinson "a fast guy without a position." I think that's pretty accurate. Great speed as a ball carrier, and occasionally he'll make a great move in the open field, but for every play like his TD run against BYU (if he hadn't juked that tackler out of his shorts on 3rd down we would have had to kick a field goal on that possession and maybe lose 14-13) there are two where he slows to a stop trying to make a cut, just in time to get crushed. Right now I just don't see the agility, shiftiness or toughness to be a between-the-tackles runner. When you consider that he also doesn't have the hands/ball skills to be a WR, you've got a fast guy without a true position.

Now, I know Kelly will increase his role in the offense to take advantage of his speed. He has frequently said at press conferences that GAIII is an under-utilized player, and I do think we'll get some big plays out of him here and there, but I'm not sure I see an every-down back. I see a guy who needs to have a play designed for him, like the counters and things that we run.

EDIT: thanks for bringing this over, GITF. Did not see this thread at first.

 

[Irish8248]

Starting rb will go to whoever is most consistent between AC GA3... the other will play a role that suits their respective talent.. GA3 needs to get stronger. Wood had this same problem going from soph to jr yr... Amir needs to stay healthy and focus on using his size to his advantage like Theo. I think Cam its the most well rounded. Just solid but a jack of all trades is a master of none

 

[gkautz10]

Thanks to whoever put this in it's own thread. I was going to start it but felt the discussion was sort of dwindling. My question to you guys is why do you think Cam will stick at RB? I take my point that he will move to defense because he probably would be a defensive player right now had it not been for Amir's injury.

 

[Irish8248]

I just think we have different interpretations of "experience"... we have no player who has consistently ran the ball.

GA3 is literally learning how to be a RB, Mahone, Bryant, etc are RB's.

AC has 19 carries in his career.

Cam has one game against 2/3 stringers in a blowout.

And Manziel is a freak case, Golson's experience is much more likely. And even with that they both had one year under the belt at college. A successful Fr Rb is far more likely than a Fr Qb. The positions just can't be compared.

I get your criticism but these are guys are not only experienced but have been in the system, undergone team activities, know the playbook, etc... That's a big deal... As for comparing positions, then we can go back to jimmymacs point about Neal. Wr is a much easier position to see time at than rb.

 

[ND101]

They will all be a factor in some way or another. However I believe GA3 is going to the bull by the horns next year. The kid has everything you need to be a top flight back. He will have fresh legs and will explode onto the national scene next year.

 

[Irish8248]

Thanks to whoever put this in it's own thread. I was going to start it but felt the discussion was sort of dwindling. My question to you guys is why do you think Cam will stick at RB? I take my point that he will move to defense because he probably would be a defensive player right now had it not been for Amir's injury.

Because lo wood is coming back and Cam only went to defense due to that injury if i recall correctly... Plus we have depth now with this incoming class

 

[gkautz10]

Because lo wood is coming back and Cam only went to defense due to that injury if i recall correctly... Plus we have depth now with this incoming class

Agreed. I think he will have a similar role next year as he did this year. It will be interesting to see where he lands come spring and more importantly fall ball next year.

 

[chicago51]

As far as stud freshman RBs go we have with Alabama stud freshman can come in and contribute right away. That being said with Bama Mark Ingram, Trent Richardson, now this year with TJ Yeldon they have all been back ups and usually didn't get the ball in crutch time.

 

[Jebediah Springfield]

I get your criticism but these are guys are not only experienced but have been in the system, undergone team activities, know the playbook, etc... That's a big deal... As for comparing positions, then we can go back to jimmymacs point about Neal. Wr is a much easier position to see time at than rb.

Yeah the current rb's have that on Greg Bryant, but not Mahone. Amir just came from USC and this is Cam first year at Rb, so they all have 1 year in the system. And yeah on O I would say Wr easiest and then Rb.

 

[chicago51]

Also Cam going to defense doesn't make too much sense either. ND is going to be very deep at DB too in the future. I love the kid but I don't se him every being a significant contributer for ND

 

[Emcee77]

Thanks to whoever put this in it's own thread. I was going to start it but felt the discussion was sort of dwindling. My question to you guys is why do you think Cam will stick at RB? I take my point that he will move to defense because he probably would be a defensive player right now had it not been for Amir's injury.

Because lo wood is coming back and Cam only went to defense due to that injury if i recall correctly... Plus we have depth now with this incoming class

Not sure either of these assertions is quite right ... Amir's injury happened before spring practice. Cam worked on defense in the spring, so I think it's safe to say that his move to defense had nothing to do with Amir crowding the RB depth chart. Similarly, Lo Wood got hurt in August. Cam had already begun to work at RB again by then, so his playing D had nothing to do with Lo's injury.

I think the reason Cam moved back to offense in the fall was the emergence of Shumate, Russell and Farley. Even with the injury to Lo Wood in August, the coaches could see that we had the athletes we needed in the defensive backfield, so they moved Cam back to offense. With all these young studs in the secondary, including the incoming frosh and guys currently sitting like Hardy, Badger and Prosise, I think Cam will stay on offense as a RB/slot WR.

 

[pkt77242]

Yeah the current rb's have that on Greg Bryant, but not Mahone. Amir just came from USC and this is Cam first year at Rb, so they all have 1 year in the system. And yeah on O I would say Wr easiest and then Rb.

Cam has 2 years at RB.

3 carries for 9 yards his Freshmen year and played on special teams as well.
23 carries 125 yards 1 TD this year.

He has the same experience level as Atkinson as far as time in the system at RB (well besides the fact that he spent the spring at CB).

 

[Jebediah Springfield]

Cam has 2 years at RB.

Didn't he play on D last year?

 

[Emcee77]

Cam played RB last year -- and we needed him, with only Jonas, Cierre and GAIII at that position. The only time he played primarily D was this spring.

 

[Irish8248]

Yeah the current rb's have that on Greg Bryant, but not Mahone. Amir just came from USC and this is Cam first year at Rb, so they all have 1 year in the system. And yeah on O I would say Wr easiest and then Rb.

And Mahone will have a fall, an extra winter (ncg), a winter, spring, and summer on GB. Which is why i don't see a need to insert GB into the rotation.

It comes down to is there more value to play him year 1 or save him and play him at a more developed player in year 2

 

[Jebediah Springfield]

That's right he moved from O to D this season.

 

[Jebediah Springfield]

And Mahone will have a fall, an extra winter (ncg), a winter, spring, and summer on GB. Which is why i don't see a need to insert GB into the rotation.

It comes down to is there more value to play him year 1 or save him and play him at a more developed player in year 2

As far Bryant I think ppl see that he is going to be a big time player for us... not if but when.

If he can play at a high level next year I think they will play him, because ND is going after the big boys again in "14. And the backfield will not be any less crowded in 14 since no RB will graduate.

 

[Whiskeyjack]

As far Bryant I think ppl see that he is going to be a big time player for us... not if but when.

You never know. James Aldredge was a 5 bust for us at RB not too long ago.

If he can play at a high level next year I think they will play him, because ND is going after the big boys again in "14. And the backfield will not be any less crowded in 14 since no RB will graduate.

Assuming all of our current commits stick, we'll be at 8/8 for RB/ Z WR in 2013. We might even get to 9/8 if Folston jumps on board. I don't expect the staff to take more RBs next year unless a truly elite athlete wants in. Overloading at any one position creates problems.