'12 TX ATH Nick Baratti (Notre Dame Signed LOI)

[Bogtrotter07]

And I agree with your point about Baratti. By the way, "saying not as much", would have been good.

 

[gkautz10]

Look above. Cam already has his freshman year behind him and he burnt a potential red-shirt year, meaning Kelly needed him for special teams but not for RB, which is what he was. We needed a RB desperately when Jonas went down, and Kelly didn't turn to either Cam or Atkinson (not questioning Atkinson here, I think he's proved he's going to be a difference maker). So what warrants the 'underrated' tag for Cam?

This is apples to brazilian nuts. Baratti's in high school and allegedly is 6'3", 220, and runs a laser 4.45 40-yard dash and is a 3/4-star. Ratings in high-school are very dependent on the measurables above, especially since there's little parity in competition in high-school as opposed to college, where you can judge a player against his real peers. With Baratti's measurables, he rivals any player, at any position in the entire country. I mean, look at Shaq Thompson! He's listed at 6'1", 210, and 4.5 and everyone's drooling over him. That's why I think Baratti could be underrated.

You missed my point. I am not arguing saying Cam is underrated or overrated I was just simply saying you jumped down somebody's throat for saying the exact same thing you just said about and even less proven recruit. Again I am not saying Cam is "proven" himself by any means, but he has seen live game action as a freshman so in my book is a little higher up than Baratti at this point in their careers. I agree with you, Cam is neither underrated or overrated at this point.

 

[koonja]

Okay, now back to it:

I think whenever a three star can make an impact at ND it is a great thing. First of all Coach Kelly specifically acknowledged all the members of the class for their contributions.
Second, every time I hear someone heap criticism on a player, making such a narrow value judgement I want to ask what that person ever did, that they can evaluate and judge with such certainty. Third, people on this site often talk out of their a$ses, without checking their facts. Or from a completly emotional perspective, without making sense. (I have been guilty of the last two.)

1) Agreed.

2) I didn't, I was just asking how you could say Cam is possibly underrated.

3) All of this is getting deleted anyways, so let's get back to Baratti.

 

[gkautz10]

1) Agreed.

2) I didn't, I was just asking how you could say Cam is possibly underrated.

3) All of this is getting deleted anyways, so let's get back to Baratti.

+1

 

[koonja]

You missed my point. I am not arguing saying Cam is underrated or overrated I was just simply saying you jumped down somebody's throat for saying the exact same thing you just said about and even less proven recruit. Again I am not saying Cam is "proven" himself by any means, but he has seen live game action as a freshman so in my book is a little higher up than Baratti at this point in their careers. I agree with you, Cam is neither underrated or overrated at this point.

My point is that Baratti is being judge against other high-schoolers. And because there's no parity in high-school football, 'ratings' are primarily based on measurables (Baratti), not production. In college, it's about production (Cam). You can't judge high-schoolers on production because it can be so skewed, whereas in college it's a better tell of the player. If high-schoolers were rated based on production, Golson would have been a hands down, 5-star QB.

So, it's easy for me to say that Baratti is underrated based on his freakish measurables. Cam will be judged on his production in college (as will Baratti and all other high-schoolers when they hit the college level). So based on Cam's production up to now, we can't say he's been underrated.

We''re on the same page, or at least close. No hard feelings.

 

[gkautz10]

My point is that Baratti is being judge against other high-schoolers. And because there's no parity in high-school football, 'ratings' are primarily based on measurables (Baratti), not production. In college, it's about production (Cam).

So, it's easy for me to say that Baratti is underrated based on his freakish measurables. Cam will be judged on his production in college (as will Baratti and all other high-schoolers when they hit the college level). So based on Cam's production up to now, we can't say he's been underrated.

We''re on the same page, or at least close. No hard feelings.

Agree now that I understand your point

 

[ThePiombino]

What has Cam done to show he was underrated?

Besides ridiculous numbers in one of the most competitive high school leagues in the most competitive high school states (1900+ yards, 32 touchdowns) and being named Texas 5A Player of the Year and still only be rated at 3 stars coming into college? TEXAS, man!!! Come on, how can you say that's not underrated?

 

[Old Man Mike]

Testosterone and wanting to fight.

 

[koonja]

Besides ridiculous numbers in one of the most competitive high school leagues in the most competitive high school states (1900+ yards, 32 touchdowns) and being named Texas 5A Player of the Year and still only be rated at 3 stars coming into college? TEXAS, man!!! Come on, how can you say that's not underrated?

I just think if he was so underrated he would have seen some time at RB this year because A) we were extremely thin at RB to begin the year B) We were even thinner when our starter, Jonas went down and C) Kelly had no reason not to play him because he had already burnt his red shirt. Could he prove to be underrated down the road? Absolutely and he'll get his chance this year, but it's premature to call him underrated.

I'm saying the same things over and over, lol. I'm out, this is just my opinion.

 

[Bogtrotter07]

I love you guys!

 

[Old Man Mike]

Kumbaya

 

[ThePiombino]

I just think if he was so underrated he would have seen some time at RB this year because A) we were extremely thin at RB to begin the year B) We were even thinner when our starter, Jonas went down and C) Kelly had no reason not to play him because he had already burnt his red shirt. Could he prove to be underrated down the road? Absolutely and he'll get his chance this year, but it's premature to call him underrated.

I'm saying the same things over and over, lol. I'm out, this is just my opinion.

I'm talking about while he was at the same stage as Baratti - a college recruit. Can you argue that AT THIS STAGE Cam was not underrated? We can't evaluate Nick based on what he hasn't done yet, so I'm not including college. High school resume only, was Cam McDaniels underrated or no?

 

[gkautz10]

I just think if he was so underrated he would have seen some time at RB this year because A) we were extremely thin at RB to begin the year B) We were even thinner when our starter, Jonas went down and C) Kelly had no reason not to play him because he had already burnt his red shirt. Could he prove to be underrated down the road? Absolutely and he'll get his chance this year, but it's premature to call him underrated.

I'm saying the same things over and over, lol. I'm out, this is just my opinion.

When people are thick skulled it is all you can do sometimes lol

 

[Bogtrotter07]

Which is worse thick skulled or dim whited?

 

[gkautz10]

Which is worse thick skulled or dim whited?

about even in my book. Whichever tickles your fancy

 

[koonja]

]I'm talking about while he was at the same stage as Baratti - a college recruit. Can you argue that AT THIS STAGE Cam was not underrated?[/B] We can't evaluate Nick based on what he hasn't done yet, so I'm not including college. High school resume only, was Cam McDaniels underrated or no?

Cam was listed at 5'10", 190 Lbs, and a 4.55 40-yard dash at RB.

Baratti is listed at 6'2", 218 lbs, and 4.45 yard-dash at SAFETY.

I don't see how Cam was underrated. There's probably a number of high-school RBs that are 190 and run 4.55, no?

How many 6'2", 218lb safeties do you see running a 4.45 that are 3/4 star.

Remember, my premise is based on MEASURABLES, which makes up a large part of HIGH SCHOOL ratings. Production definately plays a part in high school ratings, but it's more on potential. If you don't keep that in mind, there's no sense in reading the above.

 

[IlovethehireofCoachKelly]

Cam was listed at 5'10", 190 Lbs, and a 4.55 40-yard dash at RB.

Baratti is listed at 6'2", 218 lbs, and 4.45 yard-dash at SAFETY.

I don't see how Cam was underrated. There's probably a number of high-school RBs that are 190 and run 4.55, no?

How many 6'2", 218lb safeties do you see running a 4.45 that are 3/4 star.

Remember, my premise is based on MEASURABLES, which makes up a large part of HIGH SCHOOL ratings. Production definately plays a part in high school ratings, but it's more on potential. If you don't keep that in mind, there's no sense in reading the above.

He is a white athlete. Why do we keep asking why are they underrated? This is the same reason why everyone thinks black qb's can't throw.

 

[ThePiombino]

Cam was listed at 5'10", 190 Lbs, and a 4.55 40-yard dash at RB.

Baratti is listed at 6'2", 218 lbs, and 4.45 yard-dash at SAFETY.

I don't see how Cam was underrated. There's probably a number of high-school RBs that are 190 and run 4.55, no?

How many 6'2", 218lb safeties do you see running a 4.45 that are 3/4 star.

Remember, my premise is based on MEASURABLES, which makes up a large part of HIGH SCHOOL ratings. Production definately plays a part in high school ratings, but it's more on potential. If you don't keep that in mind, there's no sense in reading the above.

Randy Johnson - Yahoo! Sports

5'9"
180 lbs
2000+ yards
29 TDs
4.47 40

Are you telling me that 0.06 seconds and +100 yards is worth 2 extra stars?

 

[JDAtlanta]

Cam was listed at 5'10", 190 Lbs, and a 4.55 40-yard dash at RB.

Baratti is listed at 6'2", 218 lbs, and 4.45 yard-dash at SAFETY.

I don't see how Cam was underrated. There's probably a number of high-school RBs that are 190 and run 4.55, no?

How many 6'2", 218lb safeties do you see running a 4.45 that are 3/4 star.

Remember, my premise is based on MEASURABLES, which makes up a large part of HIGH SCHOOL ratings. Production definately plays a part in high school ratings, but it's more on potential. If you don't keep that in mind, there's no sense in reading the above.

Scout has Baratti as a ILB. No wonder he is under rated. He might gain enough weight to be an OLB, but ILB???

 

[pkt77242]

Scout has Baratti as a ILB. No wonder he is under rated. He might gain enough weight to be an OLB, but ILB???

He very easily could gain the weight. I could see him adding 20 pounds and being a 6-2 238 pound Will ILB.

 

[NYMIKE6]

Scout has Baratti as a ILB. No wonder he is under rated. He might gain enough weight to be an OLB, but ILB???

I can see it, look how much muscle mass is put on some of these young guys. 20lbs. of "good" weight or muscle is easy when your in a real regiment. That would put him 6'2" 240lbs. with high 4.4 to 4.5 speed..... Manti was around 230lbs. coming out of high school.

 

[NDinFL]

I can see it, look how much muscle mass is put on some of these young guys. 20lbs. of "good" weight or muscle is easy when your in a real regiment. That would put him 6'2" 240lbs. with high 4.4 to 4.5 speed..... Manti was around 230lbs. coming out of high school.

Basically a RB seeking missile

 

[NYMIKE6]

Basically a RB seeking missile

and a head hunting QB killer......

 

[woolybug25]

and a head hunting QB killer......

and where a WR crossing pattern meets... well... death...

 

[NDinFL]

Just pretend the car is a USC WR

 

[TerryTate]

Can't wait to see Slaughter's role next year. I liked the look in the FSU game. Now that we have our base set up, we can be more aggressive on the edge.

 

[NYMIKE6]

Can't wait to see Slaughter's role next year. I liked the look in the FSU game. Now that we have our base set up, we can be more aggressive on the edge.

Agreed i think next year it's all about "Unleashing the Hounds" we are going to attack from every angle possible, mixing up personnel packages for mismatches then smacking people in the mouth.

 

[Whiskeyjack]

Can't wait to see Slaughter's role next year. I liked the look in the FSU game. Now that we have our base set up, we can be more aggressive on the edge.

I fear Slaughter's going to have to stay at FS for us next year because no else will be capable.

 

[IrishLax]

Why are people bringing up Cam? He's a small RB with good quickness and a serious lack of top end speed. Legit DI talent but nothing more.

Baratti is a kid who has beyond elite measureables for his position. So while he hasn't proven much as a safety, he should be a 4 ATH prospect at minimum... the problem is:

1) He's white.
2) He committed to ND early and not a Texas school.
3) He doesn't self promote like a lot of prospects and didn't play in an all-star showcase.

You just can't objectively look at his film and justify him being ranked behind the kids he is currently ranked behind.

 

[Old Man Mike]

One of the services has noticed him, despite the shifting playing positions which I think is the majority of the ratings "problem" [which is a non-problem since we have him in our uniform], and rates him #28 Athlete.

My guess is that non-of the other three have even looked, except to note that he's got an ND scholarship.