'12 IN QB Gunner Kiel (Cincinnati Transfer)

[woolybug25]

Call me crazy but ND is not missing out on anything here.

#1 rated QB in the nation who you gonna take?

Kiel or Clausen?

This is a weak QB class in general. Nothing against the kid, but when he is the #1 prospect, its sayign something.

No offense to Clausen, but I would pick Kiel. He is a more physical player with a larger skill set. I would bet that Kiel has a much better career than Clausen as well, even if its at IU. Clausen had great stats (and again, I will always root for the kid and appreciate him coming to ND), but what did he ever do? His biggest game ever was the Hawaii Bowl. Rees has more signature wins than Clausen, and that's a fact. Even at IU, I am willing to bet that Kiel has a better signature win than Clausen. Kiel will never get to play with the supporting cast that Clausen had, but I don't think that it will even matter.

Mark it, IF Kiel signs with IU, he will have them playing big boy football very quickly.

This is the first thing I have ever disagreed with you on... I must be high.

 

[GBdomer]

No offense to Clausen, but I would pick Kiel. He is a more physical player with a larger skill set. I would bet that Kiel has a much better career than Clausen as well, even if its at IU. Clausen had great stats (and again, I will always root for the kid and appreciate him coming to ND), but what did he ever do? His biggest game ever was the Hawaii Bowl. Rees has more signature wins than Clausen, and that's a fact. Even at IU, I am willing to bet that Kiel has a better signature win than Clausen. Kiel will never get to play with the supporting cast that Clausen had, but I don't think that it will even matter.

Mark it, IF Kiel signs with IU, he will have them playing big boy football very quickly.

This is the first thing I have ever disagreed with you on... I must be high.

dude your high. Clausen was the man coming out of high school. His last year at ND he was unreal. Clausen would of had some big time "Tommy Rees" wins if he had a defense. You just have a major man crush on Gunner Kiel.

 

[GBdomer]

He was put in a terrible sitatuion his first year. No offense line, all freshman play makers. I felt bad for him his freshman year for as many times he was on his back. His sophomore year he was good not great. But honestly name a qb who was is great his sophomore year? His junior was as good as anyone in the country's. Ya he might not have won the big game but you can't put those 6-6 seasons on Jimmy Clausen. So for you to say you would take Gunner or Jimmy out of high school just is mind boggling to me.

 

[MacIrish75]

This is good for IU beyond what Gunner can do on the field. The Indy Star and all the Indy TV affiliates were buzzing with this news. All my Bloomington friends and other random people throughout the interwebs are hyped for GK to step on campus. IU is going to draw more fans (probably) in the next 2-5 years than in any other time in the program's history.

 

[pkt77242]

This is good for IU beyond what Gunner can do on the field. The Indy Star and all the Indy TV affiliates were buzzing with this news. All my Bloomington friends and other random people throughout the interwebs are hyped for GK to step on campus. IU is going to draw more fans (probably) in the next 2-5 years than in any other time in the program's history.

I will believe that when I see it. If they don't win they won't come to the games. And QB's without a good line and good skill positions don't do well. Gunner is talented but it is hard to win on your own.

 

[pkt77242]

dude your high. Clausen was the man coming out of high school. His last year at ND he was unreal. Clausen would of had some big time "Tommy Rees" wins if he had a defense. You just have a major man crush on Gunner Kiel.

^This

 

[koonja]

I watched clausen, in person throw for 404 yards, going 27-29 with 5 TDs and zero picks in a loss... that's unheard of. I'd take him over Kiel. The coaching was bad when he was there. He didn't get a lot of help especially from the defense.

 

[DANsanity15]

This a freaking coup. A freaking. COUP.

Best IU recruit since Finch.. who technically didn't sign... with them...

Again... A COUUUUUUUUUUUUPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPP!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Finch was only there a year when he left anyway. I think i read that he's at Marian now

 

[DANsanity15]

I honestly can see him switching on signing day, I just can't possibly see him passing on Bama Michigan ND among others who have a way better supporting cast.

 

[GBdomer]

I honestly can see him switching on signing day, I just can't possibly see him passing on Bama Michigan ND among others who have a way better supporting cast.

he is going to IU end of story.

 

[military_irish]

I honestly can see him switching on signing day, I just can't possibly see him passing on Bama Michigan ND among others who have a way better supporting cast.

Some kids care more about paving their own way than just adding to an existing powerhouse. I personally admire that.

 

[MacIrish75]

IU has the quad-fecta for him. It's close to home, lots of his friends and brother attend IU, he wants to be coached by Kevin Wilson, and he'll get early playing time.

True, Indiana is always going to be a basketball first school, but right now in this state he's like the Steve Alford of the football program. The savior. I mean people are going absolutely nuggin futs over this. That's going to be pretty tough to pull him away from that, and IMO nobody will, regardless of what IU does or doesn't do this fall.

 

[NDinL.A.]

No offense to Clausen, but I would pick Kiel. He is a more physical player with a larger skill set. I would bet that Kiel has a much better career than Clausen as well, even if its at IU. Clausen had great stats (and again, I will always root for the kid and appreciate him coming to ND), but what did he ever do? His biggest game ever was the Hawaii Bowl. Rees has more signature wins than Clausen, and that's a fact. Even at IU, I am willing to bet that Kiel has a better signature win than Clausen. Kiel will never get to play with the supporting cast that Clausen had, but I don't think that it will even matter.

Mark it, IF Kiel signs with IU, he will have them playing big boy football very quickly.

This is the first thing I have ever disagreed with you on... I must be high.

TEAM TEAM TEAM TEAM TEAM.

It's a team game. It's not Clausen's fault his defense sucked royal balls every year and he was provided with a sh!tty line and a sh!tty running game. You give him Bama's running backs (Ingram and Trent) and their line, along with their defense, and yeah, safe to say he'd have some signature wins. What he did ONE ONE WHEEL his jr year, especially in those 4th quarter comebacks, was unreal. 28 TDs and 4 picks, most of which weren't his fault. Siiiick.

COACH COACH COACH COACH

Not Clausen's fault CW turned out to be a horrible head coach. While I get why many didn't like his attitude, I see no way how you could take a high school junior who hasn't proven jack sh!t over a guy who broke records at ND and got drafted in the 2nd round int he NFL draft. I know you love Kiel, but seriously, what has he proven that Clausen hasn't? (And remember, Clausen coming out of HS was a waaaaaaayyyyyy bigger star than Kiel.) Just explain that to me...

 

[HereComeTheIrish]

TEAM TEAM TEAM TEAM TEAM.

It's a team game. It's not Clausen's fault his defense sucked royal balls every year and he was provided with a sh!tty line and a sh!tty running game. You give him Bama's running backs (Ingram and Trent) and their line, along with their defense, and yeah, safe to say he'd have some signature wins. What he did ONE ONE WHEEL his jr year, especially in those 4th quarter comebacks, was unreal. 28 TDs and 4 picks, most of which weren't his fault. Siiiick.

COACH COACH COACH COACH

Not Clausen's fault CW turned out to be a horrible head coach. While I get why many didn't like his attitude, I see no way how you could take a high school junior who hasn't proven jack sh!t over a guy who broke records at ND and got drafted in the 2nd round int he NFL draft. I know you love Kiel, but seriously, what has he proven that Clausen hasn't? (And remember, Clausen coming out of HS was a waaaaaaayyyyyy bigger star than Kiel.) Just explain that to me...

Wonder if that's where his trim is going and he's just following her.... Enquiring minds wanna know.

 

[calvegas04]

cool, can this thread finally be deleted or locked

 

[irishff1014]

If you are a 5 star QB why would you go to Indiana?

 

[NoJusticeNoPeace]

I don't understand why people think he won't go there. Maybe it's just where he wants to go to school. Maybe he chose IU for the same reasons we chose our schools. He's going to Indiana period.

 

[Sherm Sticky]

If you are a 5 star QB why would you go to Indiana?

Why did Tim Couch go to Kentucky?

 

[woolybug25]

TEAM TEAM TEAM TEAM TEAM.

It's a team game. It's not Clausen's fault his defense sucked royal balls every year and he was provided with a sh!tty line and a sh!tty running game. You give him Bama's running backs (Ingram and Trent) and their line, along with their defense, and yeah, safe to say he'd have some signature wins. What he did ONE ONE WHEEL his jr year, especially in those 4th quarter comebacks, was unreal. 28 TDs and 4 picks, most of which weren't his fault. Siiiick.

COACH COACH COACH COACH

Not Clausen's fault CW turned out to be a horrible head coach. While I get why many didn't like his attitude, I see no way how you could take a high school junior who hasn't proven jack sh!t over a guy who broke records at ND and got drafted in the 2nd round int he NFL draft. I know you love Kiel, but seriously, what has he proven that Clausen hasn't? (And remember, Clausen coming out of HS was a waaaaaaayyyyyy bigger star than Kiel.) Just explain that to me...

I figured someone would take it wrong. I don't dislike Clausen or think that he was a bad player for ND. He just lacked accomplishments as well as that "moxy" that other stud QB's have. That's why he never lived up to his "Lebron James of College Football" hype.

Now as far as skill set, which was my actual point, Clausen was not the physical prospect that Gunner is. I'm at work, so I cant go to youtube, but look up both of their high school highlights. Clausen is no where near the runner that Gunner is at this stage, and its not even close. Clausen had better mechanics at that stage and was more advanced thrower, but it was not as drastic of a difference as their ability to use their legs (where Kiel is far better).Sure Jimmy had a bad coach (one of the best qb coaches in the game though), no line, and no running game. But what exactly do you see Kiel having at IU? He will have far less to work with than Jimmy had, and I still think that he will win probably just as much, win bigger games, and overall have a better career.

Also, how was Jimmy WAAaaaayyyy bigger than Kiel?

Jimmy's inflated Senior Measurables (Rivals)
Ht:6'3"
Wt:200 lbs

Gunner Kiel (Rivals)
Ht:6'4"
Wt:220 lbs

On that fact, you are just dead wrong. I do agree with you that Gunner hasn't proved anything yet, but that is not relevant to my point, which is that I believe that Gunner is just as good, if not better of a QB prospect as Clausen was. Furthermore, we have relevent evidence on Clausen, where we don't on Kiel. So while no one can guarantee what type of career Kiel will have, we know how the Jimmy Clausen story ended.

 

[NoJusticeNoPeace]

Was a way bigger star. Reading comprehension, dude.

 

[Ben E.]

good for him!!!! if he aint coming to ND thats right where i would want him!lol, better a low end program than oklahoma or another big time program.

 

[WabashFalcon]

COUP!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

 

[Mirer3Powlus]

Why did Tim Couch go to Kentucky?

Couch was from the boonies (and I mean legit boonies) of Kentucky and was in high school before the days of cut throat recruiting services. He was highly recruited and was a five star in every sense of the word, but he came from a very simple family and was a folk legend in the state, so he just decided to stay home. Things were different back then.

Gunner is the best quarterback in this class... but anyone who thinks he's a better high school prospect than Clausen was is clinically insane. Their hype isn't even comparable. Very few people can touch the scary efficiency of Jimmy's junior year.

 

[Rhode Irish]

Couch was from the boonies (and I mean legit boonies) of Kentucky and was in high school before the days of cut throat recruiting services. He was highly recruited and was a five star in every sense of the word, but he came from a very simple family and was a folk legend in the state, so he just decided to stay home. Things were different back then.

Gunner is the best quarterback in this class... but anyone who thinks he's a better high school prospect than Clausen was is clinically insane. Their hype isn't even comparable. Very few people can touch the scary efficiency of Jimmy's junior year.

And it isn't even about hype. Kiel is a nice little player, but the beneficiary of a very weak QB class. Crazy to me that people don't appreciate how good Clausen actually was. It is definitely because the teams he was on weren't good, but that was not in any way his fault. They were actually probably worse than their W-L records, but having a good QB can help mask that a little bit.

 

[woolybug25]

Was a way bigger star. Reading comprehension, dude.

It's ironic that you crack on reading comprehension, but then start a non-question sentence with "Was", but I digress.

Second of all, he was not a WAY bigger star according to rankings. Clausen was the #1 QB, as is Kiel. Most rankings had Clausen also in the top 10 players overall, as is Kiel. I would argue that Clausen was slightly higher ranked as a player (most sites do not have Kiel as the #1 player overall, but many of them had Clausen that way), but a slight difference in ranking does not lead to an opinion of him being a "way bigger star".... see what I did there... reading comprehension.

It's easy for you guys to dog on Kiel now that he isn't coming to Notre Dame. Is it coincidence that the comparisons to Clausen came after his decision? Finally, I wonder what your opinions of Clausen would have been if he would have went to USC.

edi* - I'm gonna leave it on this comment, because I don't want this to warp into people thinking that I dislike Clausen. I will root for him until the day his career ends. He was a great player at ND, i'm just being real... maybe I need to refill my green kool-aid.

 

[Ironman8]

It's ironic that you crack on reading comprehension, but then start a non-question sentence with "Was", but I digress.

Second of all, he was not a WAY bigger star according to rankings. Clausen was the #1 QB, as is Kiel. Most rankings had Clausen also in the top 10 players overall, as is Kiel. I would argue that Clausen was slightly higher ranked as a player (most sites do not have Kiel as the #1 player overall, but many of them had Clausen that way), but a slight difference in ranking does not lead to an opinion of him being a "way bigger star".... see what I did there... reading comprehension.

It's easy for you guys to dog on Kiel now that he isn't coming to Notre Dame. Is it coincidence that the comparisons to Clausen came after his decision? Finally, I wonder what your opinions of Clausen would have been if he would have went to USC.

edi* - I'm gonna leave it on this comment, because I don't want this to warp into people thinking that I dislike Clausen. I will root for him until the day his career ends. He was a great player at ND, i'm just being real... maybe I need to refill my green kool-aid.

I just want to point out the innate contradiction you created in this whole "way bigger star argument", and hopefully it will help to "see the light". In an earlier post you reference Clausen being called the "Lebron James of high school football", obviously acknowledging the extraordinary amount of hype that surrounding Jimmy from really 8th grade through senior year of high school. Regardless of whether or not he lived up to this great hype in his ND career, it is irrefutable that he was a major star way before he ever put on the Blue and Gold. I hope you can agree that no one is throwing around the Lebron James moniker with Gunner Kiel, or other transcendent praise. He is a great prospect, and will probably be a very good player for IU, but by acknowledging the excessive hype around Jimmy in one post and then turning around in another and refusing to accept that he was a bigger recruiting star is simply a case of blindly defending an argument despite facts (or as I like to call it now, zsteeling). I personally like you wooly, and look forward to your posts (sans Kiel related ones lol), but I just think you are wrong here.

 

[IrishRugger2013]

He was put in a terrible sitatuion his first year. No offense line, all freshman play makers. I felt bad for him his freshman year for as many times he was on his back. His sophomore year he was good not great. But honestly name a qb who was is great his sophomore year? His junior was as good as anyone in the country's. Ya he might not have won the big game but you can't put those 6-6 seasons on Jimmy Clausen. So for you to say you would take Gunner or Jimmy out of high school just is mind boggling to me.

Dude, come on Bradford and Tebow won the Heisman as sophomore quarterbacks in back to back years. That was only like 3 years ago.

 

[woolybug25]

I just want to point out the innate contradiction you created in this whole "way bigger star argument", and hopefully it will help to "see the light". In an earlier post you reference Clausen being called the "Lebron James of high school football", obviously acknowledging the extraordinary amount of hype that surrounding Jimmy from really 8th grade through senior year of high school. Regardless of whether or not he lived up to this great hype in his ND career, it is irrefutable that he was a major star way before he ever put on the Blue and Gold. I hope you can agree that no one is throwing around the Lebron James moniker with Gunner Kiel, or other transcendent praise. He is a great prospect, and will probably be a very good player for IU, but by acknowledging the excessive hype around Jimmy in one post and then turning around in another and refusing to accept that he was a bigger recruiting star is simply a case of blindly defending an argument despite facts (or as I like to call it now, zsteeling). I personally like you wooly, and look forward to your posts (sans Kiel related ones lol), but I just think you are wrong here.

I am not trying to say that the hype is anywhere similar between Kiel and Clausen. No where have I said that. The argument was about who was a better prospect. I made the point that recruiting sites compare them favorably and that I personally thought that Kiel was is the better prospect out of high school. I think that he is physically better and has a bigger upside.

I am not arguing that Kiel has more "star power". I cannot think of a recruit with more pub than Clausen had. He also reveled in it, which only grew his persona. None of this stuff has anything to do with who I personally think is/was a better prospect or how recruiting sites compare their skill sets.

As far as the physical size argument, I have no idea how someone can say i'm wrong on that. Both of their measurables are well documented and Kiel is currently bigger than Clausen was at his age (In fact, I think he is bigger than Clausen currently as well).

 

[NDFANnSouthWest]

It’s like Groundhog day.....haven’t we been here already?

<iframe width="425" height="349" src="http://www.youtube.com/embed/eZbtAFq7dP8" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>

 

[Whiskeyjack]

a case of blindly defending an argument despite facts (or as I like to call it now, zsteeling)

So nice, I repped you twice.