'24 IL DL Justin Scott (Miami [FL] Verbal)

[stlnd01]

SIAP, Washington is gonna be at his basketball game tomorrow night. According to Loy

Almost like Diaco in the driveway the morning Ishaq Williams was heading to Penn State. Go get him, Al.

 

[stlnd01]

I’d rather excoriate Kelly than exfoliate his backside with a loofah everytime you post about him.

Also, you keep repeating the same straw man fallacy about ND fans and their supposed delusions of grandeur. We’re well aware of all the things you keep repeating we aren’t aware of.

To be fair there are still some who think we should be able to just strike up the fight song, strap on the golden helmets, and claim our rightful nattys, and that anything less is because "the administration" (or previously BK) doesn't care about football as much as they do (despite rarely watching games that don't involve Notre Dame).
They don't tend to reside around here though. Maybe NDNation?

 

[Irishdrunk]

To be fair there are still some who think we should be able to just strike up the fight song, strap on the golden helmets, and claim our rightful nattys, and that anything less is because "the administration" (or previously BK) doesn't care about football as much as they do (despite rarely watching games that don't involve Notre Dame).
They don't tend to reside around here though. Maybe NDNation?

Agreed. Several ND Analysts still won't accept the issues ND has in terms of recruiting Top 3 type classes. Further, and therefore, they blame Kelly for leaving for reasons other than the limitations at ND that Kelly cited for leaving. They say Freeman will sell it as a positive - which while true - doesn't limit the effect on these limitations on landing truly Elite Classes. 2023 was a very good class but it wasn't elite. And now with NIL and ND's position on that - I think Top 10 classes is the ceiling for foreseeable future. Which is great unless you believe ND is destined to win a Natty.

 

[Irishjig78]

Agreed. Several ND Analysts still won't accept the issues ND has in terms of recruiting Top 3 type classes. Further, and therefore, they blame Kelly for leaving for reasons other than the limitations at ND that Kelly cited for leaving. They say Freeman will sell it as a positive - which while true - doesn't limit the effect on these limitations on landing truly Elite Classes. 2023 was a very good class but it wasn't elite. And now with NIL and ND's position on that - I think Top 10 classes is the ceiling for foreseeable future. Which is great unless you believe ND is destined to win a Natty.

If ND can land elite QB a top 10 class can absolutely win a natty!

 

[Jiggafini19Deux]

Almost like Diaco in the driveway the morning Ishaq Williams was heading to Penn State. Go get him, Al.

His NFL career ended one week before his 25th birthday when he failed a physical with the NY Giants.

 

[NDpendent]

If ND can land elite QB a top 10 class can absolutely win a natty!

Agree! Stacking classes is huge. On 247 we were 9th in 2021, 7th in 2022, and 8th in 2023. There are only 3 other teams during that period that finished with each class being in the top 10 and they are easy to guess. pOSU, Bama and that team whose fans will randomly start barking in public. And based on the 24 board there is a very good chance of a top 5 class this year. And again as mentioned QB room is becoming elite. We are close!

 

[BleedBlueGold]

Agreed. People who say ND can't win a natty are delusional. It may not be as easy as a Bama or Georgia run, but with an elite QB and stacked recruiting classes that hit and develop....ND can get there and can compete.

 

[stlnd01]

Given how you often only get three seasons now from your most talented players (Mayer, Hamilton), you need to stack classes to be able to reload/provide sufficient depth to compete year-in year-out. Especially in the portal era. And doubly so when inbound transfers are hard.

Now, you'd rather stack Top Three classes than Top Ten classes, of course. But I think Notre Dame is probably better off with four straight balanced classes ranked 8th than one five-star-studded class that ranks #3 mixed among three years at #10-#15 with holes at various positions. If that makes sense.

 

[IrishLax]

Agreed. People who say ND can't win a natty are delusional. It may not be as easy as a Bama or Georgia run, but with an elite QB and stacked recruiting classes that hit and develop....ND can get there and can compete.

Tbh if you simply swapped QBs from 2018 with Clemson then ND probably wins the natty that year.

Looking at 2020, you could almost make the same argument, but with wide receivers and Bama.

This isn't the 00s anymore where ND had virtually zero NFL talent and it was a legitimate question if they could consistently compete with USC, Texas, Ohio State, Bama, etc. For the past decade ND is player-for-player a top 10 talented team and is really just missing some transcendent playmakers on offense that other champions have had.

 

[NDFAN2008]

Tbh if you simply swapped QBs from 2018 with Clemson then ND probably wins the natty that year.

Looking at 2020, you could almost make the same argument, but with wide receivers and Bama.

This isn't the 00s anymore where ND had virtually zero NFL talent and it was a legitimate question if they could consistently compete with USC, Texas, Ohio State, Bama, etc. For the past decade ND is player-for-player a top 10 talented team and is really just missing some transcendent playmakers on offense that other champions have had.

I agree but it seems like every year ND has a great team it also has one major hurdle from keeping us from being an elite team. One year it was lack of speed and elite playmakers, one year it was lack of QB talent, one year it was a horrible defense BVG can thank to that. Bottom line is teams like Georgia and Bama are bringing in 4-5 high 4 star 5 star DL guys in every class. It's hard to compete with that.

 

[greyhammer90]

I agree but it seems like every year ND has a great team it also has one major hurdle from keeping us from being an elite team. One year it was lack of speed and elite playmakers, one year it was lack of QB talent, one year it was a horrible defense BVG can thank to that. Bottom line is teams like Georgia and Bama are bringing in 4-5 high 4 star 5 star DL guys in every class. It's hard to compete with that.

All this boils down to is that it's really hard to win a National Championship. As much as we bemoan how we never have all the pieces at the same time, it is not a unique phenomenon. Georgia just won the last 2 titles, has mountains of local talent, a rabid fanbase, and all the institutional support you can think of. But before 2021, their most recent NC was in 1980.

I really think Saban at Bama has ruined the perception of what success looks like, because runs like Bama's are not supposed to happen. Even really astounding success in this sport is supposed to look more like Clemson, where you have a magical 5-6 year window where you're team is humming, and then you *hope* that you can hold on by not becoming an embarrassment until your next run.

 

[Irish du Nord]

All this boils down to is that it's really hard to win a National Championship. As much as we bemoan how we never have all the pieces at the same time, it is not a unique phenomenon. Georgia just won the last 2 titles, has mountains of local talent, a rabid fanbase, and all the institutional support you can think of. But before 2021, their most recent NC was in 1980.

I really think Saban at Bama has ruined the perception of what success looks like, because runs like Bama's are not supposed to happen. Even really astounding success in this sport is supposed to look more like Clemson, where you have a magical 5-6 year window where you're team is humming, and then you *hope* that you can hold on by not becoming an embarrassment until your next run.

Not to mention, the landscape was perfectly contoured to fit their success:
1. Bama has two straight down years
2. Clemson’s momentum stopped
3. Weak Big 10

All credit to Georgia, but these teams would’ve had a much harder road in the 2010s.

 

[GATTACA!]

You also just need some random luck to go your way. OSUs kicker shanking the game winning field goal allowed Georgia to even play for the championship this year. Do they beat Alabama last year if Jameson Williams doesn’t get hurt early? 2012 we (pretty easily IMO) win it all if both KSU and Oregon don’t shit the bed on the last day of the season.

 

[Irishdrunk]

All good points against me. Fair enough. Hopefully it all gets pulled together. How Rees and Hartman scheme things out will be big.

Sometimes luck also plays a hand too.

 

[T-Boone]

Agreed. Several ND Analysts still won't accept the issues ND has in terms of recruiting Top 3 type classes. Further, and therefore, they blame Kelly for leaving for reasons other than the limitations at ND that Kelly cited for leaving. They say Freeman will sell it as a positive - which while true - doesn't limit the effect on these limitations on landing truly Elite Classes. 2023 was a very good class but it wasn't elite. And now with NIL and ND's position on that - I think Top 10 classes is the ceiling for foreseeable future. Which is great unless you believe ND is destined to win a Natty.

I don’t think you can put the final verdict in on whether a class is good, bad or elite until after they are seniors. It’s got to be retrospective. I thought the 18 class was very good but it turned out bad. This one turns on what Minchey turns out to be.

 

[CanadalovesND]

I don’t think you can put the final verdict in on whether a class is good, bad or elite until after they are seniors. It’s got to be retrospective. I thought the 18 class was very good but it turned out bad. This one turns on what Minchey turns out to be.

To add, on paper, the 2016 class didn't look great, but they were one of the winningest classes in school history and produced 9 NFL draft picks.

 

[SeekNDestroy]

To add, on paper, the 2016 class didn't look great, but they were the one winningest groups in school history and produced 9 NFL draft picks.

15 guys in that class picked up an NFL paycheck and that doesn’t even include the best player (Stepherson.)

 

[KPENN]

15 guys in that class picked up an NFL paycheck and that doesn’t even include the best player (Stepherson.)

Losing him was a huge blow.

 

[SeekNDestroy]

Losing him was a huge blow.

Imagine him on the 2018 team.

 

[Irish du Nord]

15 guys in that class picked up an NFL paycheck and that doesn’t even include the best player (Stepherson.)

Bold take. Stepherson was great but was he better than:
Eichenberg
Love
Okwara
Claypool
Kareem?

Those guys were significant contributors on playoff teams and Love and Eichenberg were consensus all Americans. Heck Ian Book was pretty impactful

 

[SeekNDestroy]

Bold take. Stepherson was great but was he better than:
Eichenberg
Love
Okwara
Claypool
Kareem?

Those guys were significant contributors on playoff teams and Love and Eichenberg were consensus all Americans. Heck Ian Book was pretty impactful

Stepherson was the most dynamic player on the team. Outside of Fuller, he was the best wr of the Kelly era. And, yes, he was the best player in his class.

 

[Jiggafini19Deux]

SIAP, Washington is gonna be at his basketball game tomorrow night. According to Loy

They play tonight away against Christ the King, a school I did not know even existed until I looked up the Ignatius basketball schedule.

Washington making the jump over on The Skyway should have his Twitter HR handlers happy seeing as how he's putting in the effort to watch HS hoops on a Friday night over in Chicago in an effort to close Justin Scott.

 

[Irish du Nord]

Stepherson was the most dynamic player on the team. Outside of Fuller, he was the best wr of the Kelly era. And, yes, he was the best player in his class.

Idk man, I don’t even think Fuller had a better career than J Love at ND but agree to disagree.

 

[NDRock]

They play tonight away against Christ the King, a school I did not know even existed until I looked up the Ignatius basketball schedule.

Washington making the jump over on The Skyway should have his Twitter HR handlers happy seeing as how he's putting in the effort to watch HS hoops on a Friday night over in Chicago in an effort to close Justin Scott.

Christ the King has produced some great players (both men and women) through the years.

 

[Domina Nostra]

Idk man, I don’t even think Fuller had a better career than J Love at ND but agree to disagree.

Stepherson was the most dynamic player on the team. Outside of Fuller, he was the best wr of the Kelly era. And, yes, he was the best player in his class.

IMO:
1) Fuller
2) TJ Jones
3) Claypool

 

[SeekNDestroy]

IMO:
1) Fuller
2) TJ Jones
3) Claypool

Go back and watch highlights of Stepherson.

 

[irishtrooper]

Go back and watch highlights of Stepherson.

He was good but not Claypool Or Fuller.

 

[Crazy Balki]

15 guys in that class picked up an NFL paycheck and that doesn’t even include the best player (Stepherson.)

What's also interesting is that prior to 2018, there were very few gamebreakers or even major contributors:

I think only Love, Claypool and I think Elliott started in 2017, and Love was the only real stud at the time. Elliott started but that was more so out of necessity. Same with Claypool. Had his moments but still lacked consistency.

 

[SeekNDestroy]

He was good but not Claypool Or Fuller.

Just watch him against Miami and USC. Also remember he only played freshman year and half sophomore year.

 

[Bluto]

Go back and watch highlights of Stepherson.

Stephenson was terrible in that he couldn’t pull his head out his ass long enough to actually make a big impact outside of a couple games.